Sentencing and beyond- Jodi Arias General Discussion #2

[Steve44]

Can't edit once the page is turned?

Wanted to clarify what I meant about pics taken or not taken that day being looked at first from the perspective of what her original intentions might have been, not solely from what actually happened.

She'd spent all May setting him up...fake MySpace posts, the sex tape, the video fantasy she sent to her herself. Wanting to plant fake photo evidence of sex at the murder scene is entirely consistent with what I believe was her plan not just to kill him but go destroy his reputation....as a means of hurting all those who loved Travis that she hated- Deanna, Sky, family, etc.

That she ended up deleting photos can mean no more than she checked and saw the accidental photos and had to delete those, was out of time because she'd already taken hours longer to kill and leave than her alibi could account for and the roommate was arriving any minute.

In other words, what might she have been planning with planted pics if things had gone according to plan, including more time and less blood everywhere.

That's the first argument about the pics I've heard that puts them in a different light than I've always seen them in before: as a simple record of events that day.

Killing him + destroying his reputation is thoroughly consistent with her character.

I still don't see any reason to believe they were planted or taken on a different day. It would explain why she left the camera and memory card, and perhaps by deleting them she thought the time stamps would be deleted too, but leaving the possibility the raw data (no pun intended) would be found by investigators.

It still seems unnecessarily risky when one of her prime objectives was to distance herself from the crime, and crime scene.

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

The sex call was on the Helio. The May text blowup was not. And she did get the Helio from Gus after she left Mesa, while driving her U-Haul and going very much out of way get it from Gus rather than driving straight to Yreka.

He could have just mailed it to her.....

She said that she stopped by her half sister Julie (who's baby she was to taken photo's of but never did) to pick up stuff and that the U Haul was full.

 

[Hope4More]

Travis tells Skye? or CL in a text ,when at the OKC trip ,that he and Jodi hadn't been an item for eight months. I think that was when they "broke up" in June 2007. She also tells the Alexanders, in her letter to them, that when she and Travis broke up in June 2007, she fled to Big Sur where MM lived and stayed with him. If that was the case she was only there what? thirty days before she moved to Mesa.

And Travis asks her to come over and grind. Why not actual sex? if they've done it before? Why just grind?

There is also a text exchange about Jodi doing an 4 hour work week while he, Travis, changes a tire and that was the first of February 2008. Then there is the text asking where he last bought tires because she was at Discount Tires and saw some wheels that would look good on his car. That was in March 2008 when he "palmed" his car off on her.

She also tells him in a text that you have to pump the brakes and to not burn them up. She had his car and he was driving her "ghetto" car as she called it.

Now I do remember Jodi writing in her journal that she was driving a new rental because her car was in the shop for repairs under warranty, but that was after the holidays IIRC.

IMO the new texts make it crystal clear that the bath & goddess night was the first time they had actual intercourse (which came after that let's grind text).

Have you seen the text from her to him where she lists, A thru E different possibilities, E being all of the above? Intercourse is not on her menu (nor is anything anal, FWIW) (can't believe I'm back to this topic).

 

[Hope4More]

That's the first argument about the pics I've heard that puts them in a different light than I've always seen them in before: as a simple record of events that day.

Killing him + destroying his reputation is thoroughly consistent with her character.

I still don't see any reason to believe they were planted or taken on a different day. It would explain why she left the camera and memory card, and perhaps by deleting them she thought the time stamps would be deleted too, but leaving the possibility the raw data (no pun intended) would be found by investigators.

It still seems unnecessarily risky when one of her prime objectives was to distance herself from the crime, and crime scene.

Theoretically.....The killer didn't lack in self confidence. She thought her plan so convincing that she was literally shocked when the jury found her guilty of premeditation.

She was consumed by her hatred of him. I'm not sure how risky she thought it would be to : plant the pics, take shower pics to lull then force him into defenselessness, delete the shower pics, then use a computer or whatever else was required to datestamp the planted pics to an earlier date in May.

 

[samspace070]

I took a picture of a picture of my kitten and then downloaded to the computer and printed the original and the copy and they are definitely different. The copies out of focus and darker but still viewable and you know what it is. They are fussier than the killers pics but that could be because I took them and I am no pro by any stretch of the imagination. Yet It could have happened like Wing said.

 

[Steve44]

Theoretically.....The killer didn't lack in self confidence. She thought her plan so convincing that she was literally shocked when the jury found her guilty of premeditation.

She was consumed by her hatred of him. I'm not sure how risky she thought it would be to : plant the pics, take shower pics to lull then force him into defenselessness, delete the shower pics, then use a computer or whatever else was required to datestamp the planted pics to an earlier date in May.

I usually don't like going this far out into the fog, but if the above is the case, and time pressed her to scrap her plans, wouldn't it have been more logical to then take the camera or memory stick with her and dispose of them with the knife and gun, rather than leave them in an 'unscrubbed' state to be found by investigators? Just leaving them there as is doesn't seem to be acting in her best interests.

 

[Steve44]

The sex call was on the Helio. The May text blowup was not. And she did get the Helio from Gus after she left Mesa, while driving her U-Haul and going very much out of way get it from Gus rather than driving straight to Yreka.

He could have just mailed it to her.....

Not Gus. He was gonna get a face to face out of the deal, and see what was up with her attitude towards (charming) older men.

 

[geevee]

That's the first argument about the pics I've heard that puts them in a different light than I've always seen them in before: as a simple record of events that day.

Killing him + destroying his reputation is thoroughly consistent with her character.

I still don't see any reason to believe they were planted or taken on a different day. It would explain why she left the camera and memory card, and perhaps by deleting them she thought the time stamps would be deleted too, but leaving the possibility the raw data (no pun intended) would be found by investigators.

It still seems unnecessarily risky when one of her prime objectives was to distance herself from the crime, and crime scene.

Yes, if she had the intention of killing him when she stole the gun and made her furtive plans to go to Mesa, why allow any pics (or video, as she stated they tried) to be taken of herself on that day? She went to great lengths to hide her presence in AZ, why would she have her pics/video on a memory stick, at the crime scene, under any circumstances? She let bits of truth escape during interrogation and when she told Flores 'those pics had been on my camera' I tend to believe they weren't taken on his, as the alternative makes less sense. Also given that Travis looks like he was asleep 50 seconds after her backside pic was snapped, and the Spybot activation at that same time, the odds of all those pics having been taken that afternoon grows less and less, imo.

 

[geevee]

And P.S. We still don't know why she killed him.

 

[Hope4More]

I usually don't like going this far out into the fog, but if the above is the case, and time pressed her to scrap her plans, wouldn't it have been more logical to then take the camera or memory stick with her and dispose of them with the knife and gun, rather than leave them in an 'unscrubbed' state to be found by investigators? Just leaving them there as is doesn't seem to be acting in her best interests.

You presume clear headness and rationality. I don't think she panicked that the murder hadn't gone as planned, or at how little time she had. I think she felt exhilarated (she even wrote in her journal how fantastic the trip had been), but rushed.


Maybe she thought it would draw suspicion to herself to take the camera and nothing else, and didn't have the time to clean herself up well enough AND stage a burglary.

Or maybe she thought the washing machine would clean up the incriminating evidence but still yield the planted pics.

Dunno. She isn't very intelligent about anything other then being a predator, vastly over estimates her own smarts, and she likely felt triumphant enough after killing him to not abandon any other plans she had to destroy him unless forced to.


BTW....the main reason I'm open to the possibility of planted pics is because that would be consistent with her month long efforts to plant and create evidence, and because her murder didn't go as planned, meaning what looks illogical might just be because she didn't have time to fully implement her plan.

 

[Steve44]

Yes, if she had the intention of killing him when she stole the gun and made her furtive plans to go to Mesa, why allow any pics (or video, as she stated they tried) to be taken of herself on that day? She went to great lengths to hide her presence in AZ, why would she have her pics/video on a memory stick, at the crime scene, under any circumstances? She let bits of truth escape during interrogation and when she told Flores 'those pics had been on my camera' I tend to believe they weren't taken on his, as the alternative makes less sense. Also given that Travis looks like he was asleep 50 seconds after her backside pic was snapped, and the Spybot activation at that same time, the odds of all those pics having been taken that afternoon grows less and less, imo.

Yet she caved during the interrogation that she was there that day on the strength of the pics. If the pics couldn't really prove that she was there, because they were actually taken at a different time, why would she own up to being there?

Thinking about it, there was actually much more evidence other than the pics that she was there. The hair follicle dna and the bloody hand print. Maybe she caved on the preponderance of evidence, and the pics became a side issue, neither fully central to the prosecutions case, nor fully serving her original purpose.

 

[neesaki]

I somewhat recall JA telling Flores that the camera/memory could be manipulated to retrieve photos or something. What if she planned everything and she wanted to kill Travis a second time when the photos were found. In her wee little mind I can see her thinking that everyone of his snooty friends would see with their own eyes that SHE was the one to take his virginity and send him to hell.
I never believed that she had sex with him that day. After looking at everything I believe that he only had some kind of sex with her once about a year before his death. That is what caused him to loose his Temple Recommend.
She stole his journals because they would have exposed her story as one big product of a fruitful imagination.

The bolded, that's what I've always thought too, and to shame, torment and torture him even more while he was dying. :cry: That biotch is satanically evil beyond words.

Something I've wondered about since I'm not too tech savy and find all this camera stuff confusing - If she uploaded the nudes from her camera onto his, would she have expected them to have the date she uploaded them or the date they were taken? I'm just wondering if she realized they would have the date of his murder, if so if she'd intended to change the date and ran out of time. Or maybe she wasn't thinking about the date? Or perhaps I'm even more confused than I thought ?

 

[Steve44]

The bolded, that's what I've always thought too, and to shame, torment and torture him even more while he was dying. :cry: That biotch is satanically evil beyond words.

Something I've wondered about since I'm not too tech savy and find all this camera stuff confusing - If she uploaded the nudes from her camera onto his, would she have expected them to have the date she uploaded them or the date they were taken? I'm just wondering if she realized they would have the date of his murder, if so if she'd intended to change the date and ran out of time. Or maybe she wasn't thinking about the date? Or perhaps I'm even more confused than I thought ?

I don't think there's any process for uploading pics from one camera to another; the pics are on a particular memory card, if that card is then moved to a different camera the pics remain on the card, and can be accessed by the new camera's playback feature, but there's no active 'uploading' required, the pics just sit on the memory card, and I'm pretty sure they maintain the timestamp given to them by whatever camera originally took them, unless they're manipulated, but that would have to be done on a computer and would be detectable because if it was manipulated on a date and time different than the new timestamp, it will show a file access time different from the new timestamp. A way around this may be to set the computers clock to the date and time you want the new timestamp to be, but, that's a lot of manipulation, and I don't think any of that happened here.

 

[geevee]

Yet she caved during the interrogation that she was there that day on the strength of the pics. If the pics couldn't really prove that she was there, because they were actually taken at a different time, why would she own up to being there?

Thinking about it, there was actually much more evidence other than the pics that she was there. The hair follicle dna and the bloody hand print. Maybe she caved on the preponderance of evidence, and the pics became a side issue, neither fully central to the prosecutions case, nor fully serving her original purpose.

It did take her overnight in jail before owning up to even being there and then giving the ninja story, she really couldn't seem to grasp how the nude pics were found on his camera, it just makes me believe she didn't know they were on that stick she brought (likely stolen from Zach's Sony camera). If we could see those 90+ pics that were undeleted on the stick it might shed a lot of light on whose camera that stick had originally been in. I wonder if David Lohr has filed a FOI on the pics and other sealed/unreleased items? I'd dearly love to see the metadata associated with all of the camera pics, as well as the digital images themselves.

 

[Steve44]

It did take her overnight in jail before owning up to even being there and then giving the ninja story, she really couldn't seem to grasp how the nude pics were found on his camera, it just makes me believe she didn't know they were on that stick she brought (likely stolen from Zach's Sony camera). If we could see those 90+ pics that were undeleted on the stick it might shed a lot of light on whose camera that stick had originally been in. I wonder if David Lohr has filed a FOI on the pics and other sealed/unreleased items? I'd dearly love to see the metadata associated with all of the camera pics, as well as the digital images themselves.

Whoa, I had no idea there were 90 undeleted pics on that card. If any of them predate when Travis bought the camera (I believe it was fairly new) then the card definitely didn't originate with his camera.

 

[samspace070]

It did take her overnight in jail before owning up to even being there and then giving the ninja story, she really couldn't seem to grasp how the nude pics were found on his camera, it just makes me believe she didn't know they were on that stick she brought (likely stolen from Zach's Sony camera). If we could see those 90+ pics that were undeleted on the stick it might shed a lot of light on whose camera that stick had originally been in. I wonder if David Lohr has filed a FOI on the pics and other sealed/unreleased items? I'd dearly love to see the metadata associated with all of the camera pics, as well as the digital images themselves.

Perhaps those 90 plus pics are underseal, I would love to know what all is under seal. We know it has to hurt her or it would not be under seal. Does the COA have access to all those sealed evidence files? There is tons of information under seal by this DT. All of it apparently too prejudicial to let into the trial.

 

[Hope4More]

Yet she caved during the interrogation that she was there that day on the strength of the pics. If the pics couldn't really prove that she was there, because they were actually taken at a different time, why would she own up to being there?

Thinking about it, there was actually much more evidence other than the pics that she was there. The hair follicle dna and the bloody hand print. Maybe she caved on the preponderance of evidence, and the pics became a side issue, neither fully central to the prosecutions case, nor fully serving her original purpose.

Remember during the Flores interregation how desperately she wanted to see what pics they had from June 4? Maybe she wanted to see them to get an idea of what was and was not recoverable from the camera. ( In addition to , or not, of getting enough clues from the crime scene to piece together another story).

 

[LinTX]

Not sure if it's been reported and I just missed seeing it, but there is another DENIAL on COA website today. This is the one about Juan's book:



It's dated 11/6, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't there during the day on Friday.

 

[samspace070]

Apparently, once Matt M got married he backed off testifying for the killer. He didn't want to hurt his family. Can you imagine his wife listening to that killer talk about her new husband?

Was Ann Campbell supposed to give those magazines or the messages in them to Matt M. ? That was the implication given by Juan at trial. Who is this woman? Was she Donavan's friend? Someone CMJA met in jail? Remember Matt had apparently talked to her attorneys earlier and told them some thing other than what CMJA told them. If he faked the letters what else could he have said? The abuse maybe?

 

[Steve44]

Remember how desperately she wanted to see what pics they had from that day? Maybe she wanted to see them to get an idea of what was and was not recoverable from the camera. ( In addition to , or not, of getting enough clues from the crime scene to piece together another story).

I do.

"There is a morbid curiosity."

One of her few honest statements.