Sentencing and beyond- Jodi Arias General Discussion #4

[RickshawFan]

Interesting list. I didn't know a silencer was found and confiscated.
Wonder if she brought it and used a silencer on the weapon to be more quiet.

And as some of us have considered the possibility that the gun may have jammed on her I did some research to see if silencers have a tendency to make an automatic jam more if a silencer is used, and answer is yes.

Everything I have read indicates that using a silencer on an automatic can result in more of a chance of a shell jamming.

Just something interesting that could give weight to the gun jamming theory.

Below is one example research about it.

"Reduced firearm reliability. All suppressors add to the back pressure of the gun: the gas pressure at the chamber end once the bullet has exited the barrel. Unless the firearm is single shot bolt action (you don't see a lot of those used by criminals, because they are slow to load), this can interfere with normal operation of the firearm. .................it's still going to be more likely to jam compare to without"


https://www.quora.com/Firearm-Supressors/Why-are-gun-silencers-not-used-extensively-among-criminals

I.e. It jammed because of a silencer when she reached for it first to kill him, she stabbed him etc., then she thought to remove the silencer and the gun worked?

So she tried to shoot him first? And ended up successfully shooting him last?

She wouldn't even necessarily have had to use the silencer found in her grandparents' house. Maybe that silencer was for the gun she bought? Some random silencer altogether?

She could have bought a silencer for the .25 not knowing the grandparents had a silencer? And then ditched it with the gun?

 

[Hatfield]

The discussion here has been over the sound quality in some of the tape, the abrupt changes of topic, the unlikely series of events, the chronology of the call as compared with TA's texts, the technical possibility that different conversations were spliced onto a tape recorder (or computer?) and recorded back onto the phone....

This is JMO
I tend to think she did edit and splice together a taped voice conversation with Travis for the sole reason that she was the one instigating a lot of the discussion to get him to say stuff. So I feel she had to cut out the parts where she was egging him on to talk.

I think if we had gotten to hear an un-edited version of the source of where she got all the recordings, we would end up hearing much more of her trying to coax him to say things and her being a much larger part of the sexual discussions.

That is why I feel she was forced to doctor the tape recording. She had to hide that she was the one doing a lot of the sex talking.

 

[Hope4More]

I meant to add that perhaps she sneaked into Travis' house early on the 4th, saw that video, surprised him, and he asked her to leave. She had a hissy fit and left. Slept at a mall. Came back later. He relented 'cos he didn't like to be mad or else she surprised him in the shower.

He didn't know she was coming. She didn't go through the garage door while he was awake because he would have heard her. She didn't go through the garage door unless she was positive he was sound asleep because his room was over the garage (and the front door), if then. She wouldn't have dared to go in the front door and risk being seen. A screen was found on the ground near his office window, which can't be seen from the front yard.

She didn't watch videos with him because she didn't know what was on the videos, therefore she didn't watch the videos after he'd gone to sleep either. It's unlikely that she went onto his computer only minutes after he went to bed after watching the videos, so it is most likely Travis was the only person on his computer that night/early morning.

The last site Travis accessed was his own, where he had his blog. We don't have the info to know how long he stayed on that site. It could have been for a long while. On at least one occasion- memorial day weekend, he stayed up all night working on his blog. By his own admission he was focusing on his blog almost to the exclusion of everything else.

The last call the killer made in CA was to Ryan Burns, sometime between 9-10pm. She's said it took her 6 hours to drive from Pasadena to Mesa. So she would have arrived sometime between 3-4am. Travis was still awake and yet she didn't try to go into his house. Why not? Because she knew he wouldn't let her in.

Then what? She had to have waited until he went to sleep. She could have gone in then and shot or knived him in his sleep. She didn't. Why not, since killing him ASAP would have best conformed to her Utah alibi?

Enrique left around 6am, which might have surprised her, unless she was outside TA's house watching for lights and morning activity. Enrique didn't see Travis, so presumably Travis had gone to bed before 6, and most likely by 5:45am, as that's when Brooke texted him and he didn't respond.

The house was empty of roommates by 6am and Travis was asleep. A text was sent at 12:13pm, a text by default she says Travis didn't send. TA's computer was not accessed again until Spybot activated at 1:44pm, precisely the time she and he were supposedly taking naked photos.

What happened in between those times?

 

[b_lab7410]

Ummm. What's a tab? . What's awesome is having a screen that's larger than 2" high and only several more longer sideways, and being able to cut and paste and to type longer than 3 sentences without what've typed disappearing up screen.

It's swell! Thanks for asking.

Oh good, feel the loove someone sent you, lol

Tabs: I use Chrome, I'd say it's like multiple windows except it's one window, multiple pages scattered across the top as 'tabs.' I've got weather, an old Farscape/syfy stream, the corrections guidelines oddly enough for Perryville previously linked to in a post (and noticed they supply two blankets for the winter; that was interesting, I wonder what temp they keep those cells at...), and websleuths open at the moment.

 

[RickshawFan]

He didn't know she was coming. She didn't go through the garage door while he was awake because he would have heard her. She didn't go through the garage door unless she was positive he was sound asleep because his room was over the garage (and the front door), if then.

She didn't watch videos with him because she didn't know what was on the videos, therefore she didn't watch the videos after he'd gone to sleep either. It's unlikely that she went onto his computer only minutes after he went to bed after watching the videos, so it is most likely Travis was the only person on his computer that night/early morning.

The last site Travis accessed was his own, where he had his blog. We don't have the info to know how long he stayed on that site. It could have been for a long while. On at least one occasion- memorial day weekend, he stayed up all night working on his blog. By his own admission he was focusing on his blog almost to the exclusion of everything else.

The last call the killer made in CA was to Ryan Burns, sometime between 9-10pm. She's said it took her 6 hours to drive from Pasadena to Mesa. So she would have arrived sometime between 3-4am. Travis was still awake and yet she didn't go into his house. Why not? Because she knew he wouldn't let her in.

Then what? She had to have waited until he went to sleep. She could have gone in then and shot or knived him in his sleep. She didn't. Why not, since killing him ASAP would have best conformed to her Utah alibi?

Enrique left around 6am, which might have surprised her, unless she was outside TA's house watching for lights and morning activity. Enrique didn't see Travis, so presumably Travis had gone to bed before 6, and most likely by 5:45am, as that's when Brooke texted him and he didn't respond.

The house was empty of roommates by 6am and Travis was asleep. A text was sent at 12:13pm, a text by default she says Travis didn't send. A's computer was not accessed again until Spybot activated at 1:44pm, precisely the time she and he were supposedly taking naked photos.

What happened in between those times?

I was thinking at 3-4ish she went around the back and through a window or Naps started barking when she was in the back yard. She sneaked back to her car. In the meantime, Travis, who was watching videos, checked out what Naps could be barking at, didn't see anything, and asked the dog to calm down. That's why there's time space between the videos.

How did JA get even close to the right video name? Daft punk? She must have had Travis' history on her computer?

 

[RickshawFan]

Ok, that's really creepy...

We have an anniversary killing? June 4 2007 (romance, thinks Jodi) vs. June 4 2008 (murder, thinks Jodi)?

 

[Hope4More]

I was thinking at 3-4ish she went around the back and through a window or Naps started barking when she was in the back yard. She sneaked back to her car. In the meantime, Travis, who was watching videos, checked out what Naps could be barking at, didn't see anything, and asked the dog to calm down. That's why there's time space between the videos.

How did JA get even close to the right video name? Daft punk? She must have had Travis' history on her computer?

Backspacing to snoop was one of the killer's favorite hobbies.

BTW, TA's computer (he had XP for OS ) could not run Spybot while in sleep mode, UNLESS he went through steps to have it wake up at a set time every day and to run Spybot at another set time daily after being woken up.

1:44pm seems an odd time to choose to run a daily program, IMO.

 

[Hope4More]

We have an anniversary killing? June 4 2007 (romance, thinks Jodi) vs. June 4 2008 (murder, thinks Jodi)?

That's what I thought when I saw the dates.

 

[geevee]

Backspacing to snoop was one of the killer's favorite hobbies.

BTW, TA's computer (he had XP for OS ) could not run Spybot while in sleep mode, UNLESS he went through steps to have it wake up at a set time every day and to run Spybot at another set time daily after being woken up.

1:44pm seems an odd time to choose to run a daily program, IMO.

Yes, I don't believe that he had Spybot set to automatically run, esp. not in the middle of the afternoon when he'd be likely working on something like his blog or PPL stuff, someone started it and likely for a reason (doing something online, virus redirects browser, start Spybot so it kills the process and he can use the laptop again?).

 

[Hope4More]

She insisted on a timeline in which Travis woke up at 1pm, despite irrefutable evidence that contradicted her story (text message sent at 12:13pm), unless she confessed to sending that text herself. For whatever reason JM didn't challenge her story on this point.

They couldn't have been taking pics in his bedroom and have been on his computer at the same time, 1:44pm. The set time on his computer was never challenged (time for computer activity on tbe morning of the 4th was accepted as is) so the time on his computer was accurate. Therefore the time on the camera wasn't accurate.

She could have reset the time and date on his camera, but for what purpose, unless she intended for the camera to be found intact?

 

[RickshawFan]

He didn't know she was coming. She didn't go through the garage door while he was awake because he would have heard her. She didn't go through the garage door unless she was positive he was sound asleep because his room was over the garage (and the front door), if then. She wouldn't have dared to go in the front door and risk being seen. A screen was found on the ground near his office window, which can't be seen from the front yard.

She didn't watch videos with him because she didn't know what was on the videos, therefore she didn't watch the videos after he'd gone to sleep either. It's unlikely that she went onto his computer only minutes after he went to bed after watching the videos, so it is most likely Travis was the only person on his computer that night/early morning.

JA did have to know TA was watching videos at that time in the morning.... How could she have guessed that part right?

 

[Hope4More]

JA did have to know TA was watching videos at that time in the morning.... How could she have guessed that part right?

Backspacing on his computer. Without being able to click and view, which would have been recorded as activity.

 

[MistyM]

Maybe Travis was watching the Daft video because he wanted to do a parody for his next speech. Apprarently that song was popular. His Eddie Snell skit was successful so Daft' was next?

'Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger' fits his theme for his motivational speech, right?

Maybe he was even practicing/following the dance move in front of his desk facing his laptop turned around.
And JA was peeping through the window.

writing all those words on yourself would be funny. the girls might be a more likely reason? lol, who knows. i remember this video from 2007/8

[video=youtube;lLYD_-A_X5E]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLYD_-A_X5E[/video]

eta: no wonder she called the video silly or stupid. she was probably jealous he was looking at other girls!

 

[geevee]

She insisted on a timeline in which Travis woke up at 1pm, despite irrefutable evidence that contradicted her story (text message sent at 12:13pm), unless she confessed to sending that text herself. For whatever reason JM didn't challenge her story on this point.

They couldn't have been taking pics in his bedroom and have been on his computer at the same time, 1:44pm. The set time on his computer was never challenged (time for computer activity on tbe morning of the 4th was accepted as is) so the time on his computer was accurate. Therefore the time on the camera wasn't accurate.

She could have reset the time and date on his camera, but for what purpose, unless she intended for the camera to be found intact?

I couldn't recall the wording and it's too late to rewatch the hard drive hearings but I found this:

----
Juan- Right and you showed us this before. When was SpyBot downloaded

Juan- When did Travis download Spy Bot for the first time-tell me this

Bryan- I see 2005

Juan- Highlight it

Juan- It says changed on 12/2007. What's the date of the access time 6/4/2008 at 2:44. But it's actually at 1:44pm not 2:44pm. So this means Travis was accessing Spy Bot on this date and time
Bryan- Yes
Juan- Was this installed at June 3, 2008?
Bryan- It could be installed and re-installed

Juan- When was it installed on June 3, 2008?


Recess
-----

From here:

http://morbitbuzz.blogspot.com/2014/12/12414-no-jury-dead-men-do-watch-*advertiser censored*.html

His laptop was set on Mountain time, not the AZ timezone so it didn't reset to Daylight Savings Time (Pseudo also mentions this, iirc), so the 1:44 p.m. is accurate for the Spybot file's activation, I too don't believe the camera's time was correct, either Travis never reset it from default or she changed it..why she would I haven't figured out yet. lol

 

[Hope4More]

They had sex that day version.


She surprised him after 12:15pm or so that day, after texting to Chris so he didn't keep trying to reach Travis and raise alarms.

Travis woke up to find in his bedroom a person he now considered evil and out to destroy him. He had done everything he could possibly do to tell her to leave him alone, and yet here she was, fully clothed and awake, while he was in bed, vulnerable, with his laptop downstairs and his cellphone not where he set it down before he went to sleep.

He isn't going to do anything to set her off. He's going to do whatever it takes to get her out of the house. If that's sex, then it's sex. If she insists on taking photos, then that's what he'll do. He deliberately takes the most unflattering photos of her he can, he can't manage to even pretend he's enjoying himself when she takes pics of him.

He deletes them at the very first opportunity, maybe when she goes to the bathroom. She says she wants to show him pics on his computer. Whatever she does, he has to run spybot because she's infected the computer with her disc. It's now 1:44.

She says she's leaving, he goes to take a shower......

 

[MistyM]

She insisted on a timeline in which Travis woke up at 1pm, despite irrefutable evidence that contradicted her story (text message sent at 12:13pm), unless she confessed to sending that text herself. For whatever reason JM didn't challenge her story on this point.

They couldn't have been taking pics in his bedroom and have been on his computer at the same time, 1:44pm. The set time on his computer was never challenged (time for computer activity on tbe morning of the 4th was accepted as is) so the time on his computer was accurate. Therefore the time on the camera wasn't accurate.

She could have reset the time and date on his camera, but for what purpose, unless she intended for the camera to be found intact?

maybe she thought she set the date to jan 01 so they wouldn't know when the nude photos were taken/deposited on the camera? but the internal clock caught her?

 

[Val1]

Posted this in wrong thread- journals. Sorry. Reposting here.


(Got side-tracked from March timeline, lol).

June 4 story on direct. (David Lohr video, Day 19)



He guilted me about going there during June 2 AM call. I decided to go, was leaving Pasadena and driving onto the freeway when I called Travis between 8-10pm. It takes 6 hours to drive Mesa. He told me he would wait up.

It was still dark when I arrived. (Looks worried when he asks- did you go to his house?) Parked in middle of driveway. Didn’t pay attention to know if other cars were parked there.

It was that time of night so I did like I always did, went through side gate into the backyard, through the garage into the laundry room into the house. Why the side? At night I always went that way because he kept the door locked at night. (Enrique: it was weird to come home and find the front door locked because he never locked it. Killer to Flores- he never locked his door because of the law of attraction).

I had a key, but after moving back to Yreka I took it off my keyring. Didn’t knock on front door because I never did, it especially when I was expected. It was easier to just go inside.

Luggage. I had- a backpack, carry on size luggage, my laptop (it reappears, I guess) my purse. And did you bring these items with you or leave them in car?

I think….he came outside to get them for me, or I just went inside. (1:43)

Nurmi- WHAT WAS THAT???

She says very quickly- I just went inside. (wouldn’t match timeline about watching videos?)

I went to his office, the light was on, assumed he was in there. Peeked inside. He was on his laptop with his back to me. Watching music videos -or something -on YouTube (Lohr, day 19, 1:45).

Did he see you initially? No. With Naps. I thought he looked cute sitting there watching really dumb videos so I just stood in the doorway for a minute. Naps was laying down so didn’t notice for me for about a minute.

To the best of my recollection the video he was watching had people with boxes on their heads or tin foil on their bodies or just on their heads.

Travis came over to doorway where I was. What did he say? “Maybe he greets me.”

After a prompt from Nurmi: I remember more what he did. A smile and a kiss. Definitely a romantic kiss. Maybe sexual, definitely sensual and warm, his body language…pulling me in.

He wanted to show me a few more videos, so we watched those, then went into his living room because he wanted to show me his brand new punching bag.

Nurmi says let’s go back a minute, these videos you watched, were they similar or something different? Answer- Similar I guess, I don’t really remember.

Nurmi goes back to the punching bag, which was “It was on the tile floor, in living room, near kitchen.”

(Start the clock for 12-13 minutes between finishing watching the last video and the next activity on his computer).

Travis punches it, repeatedly, showing off. Something in back of her mind…but he was being very nice. Was apprehensive, but he was in a good mood so I brushed it off.

We went into kitchen. Got a glass of water. Wanted to get some sleep. He was disappointed, but not in a bad mood. Implied he wanted to have sex. I just wanted to go to sleep. He got my luggage before I went to sleep. We slept together in his room.
(To Flores- usually I hung around on the couch downstairs, but he had furniture up on it because he was going to/had cleaned downstairs tile floor).

What time did you go to sleep? 5-5:30, it was just starting to get light out. (Incoming text from Brooke-5:53am)

Roommates- I asked when we were up in his bedroom if they were home, an indication of how loud we could be. Someone else was there, but I don’t think all his roommates were home. (Thought she just wanted to go to sleep? Guessing she asked, but not at this point and not for that reason).

She woke up first. Around 12-12:30. I laid there awake, maybe I went to the bathroom. I waited for 20-30 minutes before he got up, around 1pm. (text from Maria 6:55am, text from Chris Hughes 10:51am).

Ongoing text sent to Chris Hughes, 12:13pm. Not by Travis, according to this account, as he was still asleep.
We both got up at that point.

We had sex when he woke up. Well, not right away. First he brushed his teeth, that kind of thing. Yes, I expected to have sex. It was our thing at the time. I wasn’t sleeping with anyone else, hadn’t been with anyone else in the past 2 years. It was just something I was used to. (Day 19, 1:60)


Questions---AFTER she changed her story and said she was there, etc., why would she lie about whether or not he was expecting her? Welcome guest versus obsessed stalker? OK.

But- why as a welcomed guest would she need to keep changing her story about when she arrived? From 3, to 4, to 4:30, to sometime between 4-4:30? To fit into the computer activity timeline? Why? Especially since she says they didn’t actually go to bed until 5-5:30AM?(BBM1)

She started to lie about when her luggage was brought in, but Nurmi caught that one in time and she moved the time until later on. Because of the video timeline or for another reason?

IMO no luggage of hers was ever brought in, except for her laptop. Why would she need a backpack and a suitcase if she was supposed to be there for just a few hours? Why was it important to the DT that the luggage be in the house, in his bedroom? (BBM2)

The 12-13 minute gap between end of videos and the next computer activity. They walk out of his office, go to the living room, he shows off on his punching bag- she says he hits it repeatedly, they go into the kitchen, he gets her a glass of water, talk long enough for him to say he wants sex and for her to say she just wants to go to sleep. All in 12-13 minutes? Before he goes back to his computer?

But, she also says they go to sleep together, between 5-5:30, after he’s brought her luggage in. So, she goes upstairs to his bedroom, he returns to his computer to look into how to surf the web by proxy, checks his gmail, looks at his website, goes out to get her luggage for her, takes it upstairs and she’s waited up for him so they can not have sex but just go to sleep together by 5-5:30?


Why in their timeline does Travis always wake up around 1pm, when the text record shows an outgoing text message to Chris Hughes at 12:13pm? What specific lie or part of their lie-story was important enough to insist on that 1pm wakeup, even in the face of conflicting evidence?

BBM1 - Imo JM confused her with the time zone differences so she tried to keep it vague.

BBM2 - Imo it has to do with what she said in her initial contact with Det.F. when "she asked how she would go about getting some of her belongings she left at Travis' house. She apparently left some of her clothing behind."
http://murderpedia.org/female.A/images/arias-jodi/flores-investigation-report.pdf


I have a question too, what ever happened with the whole thing about JA having initially been booked for Cancun until sometime in April after she'd finally left Mesa, when TA gave the ticket to MH, but had apparently told JA it was to pay back the Hughes' and was giving it to their nanny? http://www.hlntv.com/video/2013/03/22/was-jodi-booked-cancun-trip-travis

Did the source not pan out, or was this yet another bit of evidence that JM felt wasn't necessary to get a conviction?

 

[Val1]

"Why in their timeline does Travis always wake up around 1pm, when the text record shows an outgoing text message to Chris Hughes at 12:13pm? What specific lie or part of their lie-story was important enough to insist on that 1pm wakeup, even in the face of conflicting evidence?" ~ Hope4More

I have been wondering this for a very long time. In her timeline, where are they supposed to be when Zach comes in around 3:00 p.m.? How does she and Nurm get around him not seeing either of them? Sex and pics (according to her) were done before 2:00 p.m.

P.S. If Travis is sitting at his desk looking at his laptop, his back will not be facing the door, no? And if he'd put it on the library behind his desk, how could she see the laptop screen over his big chair?:

View attachment 87674

Perhaps murder had been done before 3pm... really, the only thing that "proves" what time it happened was the pics from a camera which could not be checked for the accuracy of it's time or date because the battery was dead before it was tested.

 

[Val1]

Anyone know what evidence item #32 is (on the library behind the chair)? It looks like a landline phone with an answering machine but I can't get it clearer enlarging the pic, and in the media thread the evidence numbers begin in the 100 range.

ETA pic

View attachment 87676

From looking at the whole pic of the office, I would say it's a bundle of things labeled with #32, I can see a laptop on the bottom and what looks like a landline/answering machine on top of that with one of the cordless receivers and possibly a wired mouse with the wire wrapped around it on the right with the exhibit number to the right of the bundle and what looks like the other phone cordless receiver on the other side next to the speaker and what's likely the laptop power cord. The desktop cpu is down beside the desk, not sure where or what kind of monitor TA would have used... or where the keyboard for the cpu is, though I suppose it could be hidden on the slide out on the desk.

 

[Hatfield]

She insisted on a timeline in which Travis woke up at 1pm, despite irrefutable evidence that contradicted her story (text message sent at 12:13pm), unless she confessed to sending that text herself. For whatever reason JM didn't challenge her story on this point.

They couldn't have been taking pics in his bedroom and have been on his computer at the same time, 1:44pm. The set time on his computer was never challenged (time for computer activity on tbe morning of the 4th was accepted as is) so the time on his computer was accurate. Therefore the time on the camera wasn't accurate.

She could have reset the time and date on his camera, but for what purpose, unless she intended for the camera to be found intact?

Re BBM

Yes, I think maybe the purpose of resetting the dates on the pics was twofold.

1-to get Travis in trouble with his girlfriends and ruin his reputation forever. This was the main reason as she was very vindictive and it wasn't good enough just to kill him.

2-to leave the pictures on the camera as proof of Travis liking her so she would not be a suspect in his murder. She would have to make the dates old enough to be back when she was known to last be there.

I think what happened is she had too much trouble with the dates and it was taking too long messing with it and so she then tried just deleting them all but the thumbnails remained.
I think she may have gotten some blood drops or stains on it too in the nooks and crannies and I think she intended on taking the camera with her OR tried to wash the camera and was going to put it back after the wash cycle but just plain forgot about the camera in washer.

I do think the time was getting late and she began rushing towards the end and she started to panic to leave.

Watching the interview with detective when he tells her about the pics is hilarious seeing her reaction. She never expected any photos to be on the camera. She thought she had deleted them all. And if I remember right she seemed to be hinting that the dates could be manipulated on the pics which is a sign she had fooled with the dates.