Sheila and Katherine Lyon-sisters missing since 1975 - #2

[steveP120]

No offense, stevep, but I hope you are wrong or he gave a dying declaration!

Even if Henry Parker gave a dying declaration, it would have two huge legal problems.
1) It's not a dying declaration about Henry Parker's Murder (and he was not murdered) and
2) It's not a dying declaration made in a "police emergency," such as when he was dying after being shot.

http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-supreme-court/09-150.html
is a fairly recent, 2011 Supreme Court Case, where it looks like they had to bend backwards to not call testimony "testimony" so it would not violate the Constitution, in my opinion.

Of course prosecutors often push the limits of using evidence, which is why so many cases are overturned.

 

[siriunsun]

Even if Henry Parker gave a dying declaration, it would have two huge legal problems.
1) It's not a dying declaration about Henry Parker's Murder (and he was not murdered) and
2) It's not a dying declaration made in a "police emergency," such as when he was dying after being shot.

http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-supreme-court/09-150.html
is a fairly recent, 2011 Supreme Court Case, where it looks like they had to bend backwards to not call testimony "testimony" so it would not violate the Constitution, in my opinion.

Of course prosecutors often push the limits of using evidence, which is why so many cases are overturned.

At this early date, we still have no idea if the prosecution had any intentions of using Parker's statements in court, or if the police were merely following up on leads. From what he is quoted to have said, his statements look more like justification for search warrants than testimony for court.

 

[Schipperke]

This is so true! Until the actual testimony in court, there is no way to know what any witness will say despite what information has been given previously, or how the questions at the trial may affect the viewing of the testimony in relation to the evidence. The evidence should stand alone, but testimony may or may not mitigate or explain the evidence and its relevance to the case.

At this point, IMO, this highly unlikely the LE is going to reveal anything more to the public about what evidence they have, and for good reason. I think we have even seen some non-public information on evidence disclosed here in WS in the past. I also believe that continued discussion of what has been disclosed may have opened up some other avenues for exploration and evaluation. Unfortunately, some of those avenues are no longer open for consideration on WS for whatever reason. (Bessie, that is a statement, not being argumentative.)

I believe it is still within acceptable limits to discuss this case in evaluation with what is alike and what is different in comparison to a lot of other cases already mentioned in past posts which have not been removed or newly discovered news reports such as the women abducted in PA and saved by a Wyoming State Police Officer. BTW that case had not received national publicity. It is surprising to me also that the UK (Great Britain) news article I posted here, does not seem to have so much as a mention anywhere in the US. Does that seem strange to anyone but me? Has anyone found that information in the news anywhere else?

Perhaps the most glaring "alike" is that the missing in many cases bear a very distinct physical description which may or may not be indicative of something or of many possible things.

I think there are avenues of discussion, if we choose to take them. Richard's past posts, along with those of other WS'ers have a great deal of information on "missing" victims in them. What they cannot tell us (no one can except someone intimately involved in the circumstances) is whether or not any of these cases are related or the work of the same person(s). If you are thinking, LE has probably done this analysis already, I would agree with you--but such analysis from LE is not available to the public. It could become an interesting discussion to see what people on WS find relevant. It is always possible that something which has remain unnoticed could be "aired."

WS is NOT GOING TO SOLVE THE CASE; that is the job of LE. I look at WS as an opportunity to test our own abilities at "sleuthing" using public information---not to accuse people, but to recognize relevant facts and/or evidence which may be "hiding in plain sight." It is realistic to believe that LE has eyes on everything, including WS, and sharing such information may offer LE some new insights not yet identified. WS'ers have no idea what LE has or does not have in their 4 hard drives of information which they have to share with defense.

I am still wondering the the Expert Investigator approved for appointment on 1/29/16 will have to share evidence with both sides. If the motion was for the DEFENSE to hire an investigator, there is a question in my mind about how open the information discovered will be treated when the case does finally come to court.

 

[Schipperke]

FYI - An amazing world in which we live.

Whoever said, "what you don't know can't hurt you." was wrong.

http://www.commdiginews.com/featured/the-dark-web-a-haven-for-pedophiles-beyond-the-internet-42843/

The Dark Web--A haven for pedophiles. Where did it come from? Technology designed for good but used for evil. How is it being fought?

Ii first heard about this on the TV show, CSI Cyber and wondered if it was real or made up for the show.

 

[Schipperke]

Found another recent article on a sad subject. This time an arrest in California with possible connections on the east coast and definitely to Louisiana. Anyone here hear this on their local news stations?

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...minal-Sexual-Conduct-Cold-Case-366624481.html

[h=1]Former TV Personality 'Mr. Wonder' Arrested After Nearly 4 Decades on Child Sex Abuse Charges: Officials[/h][h=2]Frank Selas, known by his television name, "Mr. Wonder," is accused of criminal sexual conduct with juveniles[/h]1/28/16

 

[bessie]

Found another recent article on a sad subject. This time an arrest in California with possible connections on the east coast and definitely to Louisiana. Anyone here hear this on their local news stations?

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...minal-Sexual-Conduct-Cold-Case-366624481.html

[h=1]Former TV Personality 'Mr. Wonder' Arrested After Nearly 4 Decades on Child Sex Abuse Charges: Officials[/h][h=2]Frank Selas, known by his television name, "Mr. Wonder," is accused of criminal sexual conduct with juveniles[/h]1/28/16

We have a thread on Mr. Wizard

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=12324349

 

[Ernest t]

EPIX channel ran a documentary on the subject. Its title was Deep Web.

 

[Fukiyama]

From Wikipedia:

• Dark web
• Deep web (search)
• Tor (anonymity network)

NB: Dark web and deep web are two different things.

 

[steveP120]

The Dark Web--A haven for pedophiles. Where did it come from? Technology designed for good but used for evil. How is it being fought?

People have different definitions for the dark web and deep web, but this Wikipedia definition covers it in my opinion:

"The dark web is the World Wide Web content that exists on darknets, overlay networks which use the public Internet but which require specific software, configurations or authorization to access.[2][3] The dark web forms a small part of the deep web, the part of the Web not indexed by search engines, although sometimes the term "deep web" is confusingly used to refer specifically to the dark web."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_web

The "deep web" would also include pass-word protected confidential sites such as medical or banking records, or just information in a database.

People who want to operate in the dark online are the same people who like to operate in the dark offline, which are
1) criminals, such as pedophiles (obviously evil),
2) people engaged in legal but embarrassing behaviors they don't want made public such as cyber sex., (hedonistic, but short of evil) and
3) bloggers and activists in totalitarian regimes, such as democracy bloggers in China (not evil)

The dark net is fought the same way unlawful activities have been fought for centuries - the authorities watch and infiltrate these groups as much as possible. I have heard that someone asking someone else if they know where to find underage girls is far more likely to be a police office than a man looking for an underage sex partner. Likewise, I have heard (but can't vouch for it) that someone asking someone else how to join ISIS is more likely a police officer than an ISIS recruit.

 

[zensiert]

FYI - An amazing world in which we live.

The Dark Web--A haven for pedophiles. Where did it come from? Technology designed for good but used for evil. How is it being fought?

Ii first heard about this on the TV show, CSI Cyber and wondered if it was real or made up for the show.

It is real. Remember all the news in the past few years about the Silk Road website that sold anything illegal, drugs, murder for hire...?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silk_Road_(marketplace)

http://www.wired.com/2015/04/silk-road-1/

 

[Schipperke]

Thanks for the infor--all. I am thinking that someone on the "dark" web would most likely be on the "deep" web as well. What I really don't understand is exactly what either of them are and how they relate to the "web" which is where we are right now? It is something we all have to consider, I suppose, that we don't really know what we may be messing with and future ramifications. What we see as a tool for education and/or recreation, could be someone else's weapon of destruction. We take chances in life; sometimes we win and sometimes we lose. But I am sensing that we all now recognize that the "dark" and "deep" exist beyond the grasp of most computer users. Does anyone know how long it is been in existence? Many of the cold cases we discuss on WS, like this one from 1975, are pretty old in comparison the computers becoming commonplace.

 

[Fukiyama]

What I really don't understand is exactly what either of them are and how they relate to the "web" which is where we are right now? It is something we all have to consider, I suppose, that we don't really know what we may be messing with and future ramifications. What we see as a tool for education and/or recreation, could be someone else's weapon of destruction. We take chances in life; sometimes we win and sometimes we lose. But I am sensing that we all now recognize that the "dark" and "deep" exist beyond the grasp of most computer users. Does anyone know how long it is been in existence? Many of the cold cases we discuss on WS, like this one from 1975, are pretty old in comparison the computers becoming commonplace.

Schipperke, don't overthink this.

The Internet is at its most basic level simply computers connected together by phone lines, fiber optic cables, satellite beams, etc. It includes things like the World Wide Web, email, etc. The Internet as it is today starting coming together during the 1980s as regional networks of computers were connected.

The World Wide Web is what we use on a day to day basis using browsers like Internet Explorer or Firefox or Safari. Type in the web address in the bar and boom, website shows up. The WWW started in 1991 and opened up from there.

The Deep Web refers to the parts of the WWW that don't get accessed by search engines like Google. The WWW is an ocean and search engines trawl along the surface. What search engines don't search, that's the deep web. It has existed all along; the entire WWW was "deep" until the first search engines were designed and built.

The Dark Web/Net is that area of the Internet (or the WWW if it is using webpages) that one accesses through special means. Obviously there is a tech explanation, but it's conceptually no more complicated than the fact that certain people have keys that allow them to enter into locked rooms that other people don't. I am the only one with the key to my safe deposit box; it is dark to everyone else. It's been around all along as well since people have always had places they wanted locked off from others.

If we look at an example, parts of WS itself can be considered to be deep and/or dark. Everything "downstairs" is not available to non-members and can't be searched by the search engines.

 

[Schipperke]

So it is like "secret or private" and/or uncatalogued rooms on the basic internet, like secret passages in the old horror films of yesteryear and related to the "Easter eggs" of earlier computer programming--"click (tap) the right spot and see what happens." It is always there in plain sight but you have to know what, how,and where to access it--"say the secret word and win (or lose)." It co-exists with the open internet which everyone can use.

 

[Fukiyama]

So it is like "secret or private" and/or uncatalogued rooms on the basic internet, like secret passages in the old horror films of yesteryear and related to the "Easter eggs" of earlier computer programming--"click (tap) the right spot and see what happens." It is always there in plain sight but you have to know what, how,and where to access it--"say the secret word and win (or lose)." It co-exists with the open internet which everyone can use.

There you go.

 

[Schipperke]

Has anyone here considered the case of Jennifer Kesse, from Orlando, FL as possibly being connected to this case? Jennifer was abducted January 24, 2006, now missing 10 years. She was a bit older than the Lyon girls, but the people involved in their abduction would be as well. She was 24 at the time, 34 now. I thought I would ask in light of the recent case in Wyoming where young women abducted in PA were rescued by a Wyoming state trooper. While she was older, she did fit the general blond hair, blue eyes profile, and would be along that east coast corridor of missing girls/young women. I did not find much on the WS thread I found on her. Thinking outside the box again, I am wondering if there are ongoing "missings" closer to the present time who fit the profile of the victims.

 

[Owutatangledweb]

Found another recent article on a sad subject. This time an arrest in California with possible connections on the east coast and definitely to Louisiana. Anyone here hear this on their local news stations?

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...minal-Sexual-Conduct-Cold-Case-366624481.html

[h=1]Former TV Personality 'Mr. Wonder' Arrested After Nearly 4 Decades on Child Sex Abuse Charges: Officials[/h][h=2]Frank Selas, known by his television name, "Mr. Wonder," is accused of criminal sexual conduct with juveniles[/h]1/28/16

Compare the taperecorder man sketch with the young Picture of Mr. Wizard in the article. Hairline, area under the lips, nose. Now I'm wondering where this guy was when the Lyon girls were taken. Puppy ruse, taperecorder ruse, what's the difference....any kind of ruse will do for a kid.

 

[Schipperke]

From the story, it looks like you can't be sure where the guy was. LE thought he had escaped to South America and he was back in California up to his old tricks. Doesn't seem like there is much effective interaction in LE on these cases. But then again, if they are not getting caught or reported, there is no way LE can know what is going on.

Looks like Szelas existed for so long because no one filed a complaint that was taken seriously, and that was probably because everyone is so afraid of getting sued if LE fails to make a case.

You would think that Boy Scouts of America would have "stepped up to the plate" when the "pitch looked good enough to swing." They put him out of their organization, but didn't pursue it through LE apparently.

 

[steveP120]

Compare the taperecorder man sketch with the young Picture of Mr. Wizard in the article. Hairline, area under the lips, nose. .

Not a bad match at my amateur first glance, but on WS over the years, people have proposed many "matching" men to tape recorder man, which sometimes looked good.

I think it's more that many men (sex criminals) fit the vague sketch of tape-recorder man, especially if one allows an error or two in the sketch made from memory. I was watching the presidential candidates on TV while reading this, and even one of them looked like he could have been tape-recorder man 40 years ago.

 

[Schipperke]

Vagueness seems to be an underlying characteristic of everything in the case--lots of possibilities with no real answers close enough to the surface to be identified. I am thinking that some interesting facts may lie in the public background information of people who have already been identified in the case. Unfortunately, with the current restriction of naming names, that is all I can say even though those names have already appeared in this and other threads. I never knew you could get so much connecting information from obituaries and other written material.

 

[siriunsun]

Vagueness seems to be an underlying characteristic of everything in the case--lots of possibilities with no real answers close enough to the surface to be identified. I am thinking that some interesting facts may lie in the public background information of people who have already been identified in the case. Unfortunately, with the current restriction of naming names, that is all I can say even though those names have already appeared in this and other threads. I never knew you could get so much connecting information from obituaries and other written material.

The most interesting facts will probably be revealed at trial, with information that is not, even slightly, vague.