SIDEBAR #9- Arias/Alexander forum

[shiloh42]

Agh,Jodi! As I speak,I am sitting on my back deck enjoying an alcoholic beverage,the sun is shining,there's a nice breeze.The birds are singing!My new puppy is here with me.I spent the day outside doing yard work,then visited my little nieces and nephew for a while.I have a nice homemade lasagna waiting in the oven for supper.And how was your day Jodi?Can you really say it was worth it?

You inspired me, Watson I'm out on my deck, under a shady tree, enjoying lovely weather. And enjoying imaging where JA is.

 

[katiecoolady]

Yay Abe is up .. he should have some groundbreaking insights .. NOT. This is ridiculous .. Dr Drew has 5 people on the panel + a co-host and they're just rehashing stuff and regurgitating the previous dim witted commentary they have had on this case. Absolutely pathetic.

Tell it Mrs. G! lol

 

[Tenaciousdae]

Yay Abe is up .. he should have some groundbreaking insights .. NOT. This is ridiculous .. Dr Drew has 5 people on the panel + a co-host and they're just rehashing stuff and regurgitating the previous dim witted commentary they have had on this case. Absolutely pathetic.

C'mon Mrs. G, we all know he's the one you are going to miss the most when this is all over!:floorlaugh:

 

[marlap]

Marlap...thank you for sharing your story, I'm so sorry you had to go through that...I will post mine as well...

Right before I met my husband I ended an emotionally abusive relationship. My ex was not happy and wouldn't take no for an answer. He would show up at my work (i work for the state so thank god there was good security), called relentlessly until I blocked his number from calling me (verizon has this feature for anyone who may need it), drove by my house, and left me messages in writing basically blackmailing me with things that never even happened. It really traumatized me. My best friend is a DA in the SVU and encouraged me to call the cops and get a restraining order...I never did because I thought this would just make it worse...long story short, he ended up in jail. This idiot was hiding an opiate addiction and I had no clue. He also had emotional issues that he refused to address which was part of the reason our relationship fell apart. I felt like the biggest idiot because normally I can spot drug abuse in anyone (at least I like to think I can).

We never used to email, I totally forgot he had my email address, but one day about 2 years ago, I got an email from him saying he was sorry for everything and never meant to hurt me. I didn't respond, I changed my email address as GMAIL doesn't have a "block" feature. It was terrifying.

Two months ago I received a phone call from an unknown number. I didn't answer but when I googled the number it came back to a hotel in our area. I immediately thought of him. I looked him up on our database and saw he has a bench warrant out for his arrest. I called the hotel back and asked the front desk if I could speak to "insert his name here." they said they had no one there by that name. I'm still convinced it was him.

I think this experience is part of the reason I am so drawn to this case and seeing justice for travis. My ex put his hands on me once, but it wasn't really a hit or anything, he threw me against a bed and held me down. We were camping at a campground and he knew i was thinking of breaking up with him. I screamed for help thinking someone in one of the other cabins would hear and call 9-11 but no one ever came. It was absolutely terrifying. I cannot imagine the pain and anguish travis experienced. It truly hurts my heart

Yikes....that sounds awful! I'm so glad you're okay but it's smart to continue to be vigilant.

What in the world is wrong with people that they think they own you or you are "theirs" and what not....?

 

[YESorNO]

Have you ever had Cooper's BBQ near Enchanted Rock?

We used to go to the Dabbs hotel there for the weekend and eat at Coopers and climb the rock and play poker in the Dabbs kitchen

It is an old railroad hotel with maybe ten rooms and is haunted by Nazis and an old Austin punk guy Gary ran it back when we went. He always made cowboy coffee at breakfast.

Plus, rumor had it the aliens would show up in the middle of the night for the local lannite...which they apparently used for fuel.

Good times, good times....

BBM

What? Nazis and aliens???? :scared:

 

[Maryann123]

From My Space, Travis Alexander:

Who I'd like to meet:
HMMM well Jesus for starters. People who like to give high 5's incessantly. I'd also like to meet Osama Bin Laden in all out no holds barr, winner take all cage fight. Christopher Walken would be fun to eat Lunch with. Really most people, well except for *advertiser censored*. They are a dime a dozen these days especially on myspace. So if your employment involves a webcam, I don't see it going anywhere. Outside of that I'm good to go.

What do you think the BBM means? Was this about Jodi? Was she making money doing something like this? I'd come closer to believing Travis caught Jodi pleasuring herself on his bed, (webcam catching the action) rather than the other way around. She claims he had pedo pics, and it was probably her all decked out like a school girl. We wondered where she got money, and I believe this could have been it. Isn't there a way to put *advertiser censored* on the computer from the comfort of your own home? She totally destroyed her own hard drive. This makes me go hmmmmmmm!

 

[Sleuth5]

It does say welcome....

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[GreenEyesBlue]

Must have something in common with them to want to spend your life working with them...

Yeah, I just think that is patently unfair. Every defendant deserves an attorney.

I hated nurmi, but that doesn't mean he should not represent, or have a practice specializing in sexual crime defendants. There are plenty of eighteen year olds charged as adults for having sex with a sixteen year old. Which negates, IMO, the whole purpose of the law.

That said, everyone hates sexual predators. But, they still get a defense, hate it as we will, and I do, most often.

 

[SmoothOperator]

In my attempts over the course of this past week to thoroughly digest and accept this non-verdict I believe that I have at least come to an understanding of what *could possibly* be why it happened..whereas before I could not at all even begin to fathom the how or why.. I am at least to a place of just accepting it for what it is and there for attempt to have some understanding of it in my moving on from it..

I think for me the first time that it really began to come into focus was in reading one of our fellow members, Rob's post regarding the dynamics between his parents as it played out over the course of this trial..It really was a lightbulb moment for me in understanding the mindset of some people of this particular generation that Rob's parents are in.. I believe his father's adamant beliefs wrt Jodi and the scenario he has firm in his mind are *possibly* similar to some of the jurors in what they may believe were the dynamics that led to the heinous murder.. Just as rob said his father was adamant that no young woman would ever favor or be the one to intiate the particular type of sex that Jodi and Travis regularly engaged in(ie. Anal)..in this mindset it immediately places Jodi in the role of at the very least being persuaded into sexual activities that she did not want or enjoy..and at most being somewhat forced, if even by manipulation on Travis' part to have engaged in such sexual intercourse..

IMO just having this particular mindset truly makes all the difference in the world when applying it to this case..it immediately places Jodi in the role of the victim of manipulation and places Travis in the role of the aggressive manipulator..this dynamic of just the aspect of their sexual relationship truly alters the entire dynamic of the roles of the two in every other aspect of this case.. This belief immediately places Jodi in a sympathetic position even regardless of the heinous brutal slaughter, if the belief is that she was a manipulated victim in the time leading up to the heinous murder it does indeed IMO give great weight to that as a mitigating factor in the penalty phase in deciding her life or death..

What I mean is that in speaking of having this mindset one could still clearly see this heinous murder as a first degree premeditated murder...they could also still be able to clearly see and there for decide that yes, that premeditated murder was proven to have met the aggravating factor of having been extremely or especially cruel..and yet in their firmly believing those two issues were proven they could find that the belief in their mind that Jodi was a passive victim in Travis at the very least having aggressively manipulated her into anal sex in the time leading up to the murder..IMO that belief could in fact be a strong enough factor in their opinion to spare her life in the penalty phase..

IMO just having that particular mindset about that one particular aspect is of huge importance in it not only just reversing the roles of each of them and thus placing Jodi in a sympathetic light..but IMO most importantly it ALSO gives an answer to that very question that so very many desperately want and need the answer to...why?..

In having this particular mindset is also POSSIBLY in their mind gives them an answer to WHAT COULD BE THE WHY this young woman committed this premeditated heinous murder of this young man..and IMO that question answered in their minds for them could actually only seem to solidify it as being true..the thoughts relayed of the foreman again says it all as well in his saying that his belief is that there was something that happened that led to Jodi feeling she had no choice but to murder this young man.. In his mind he believes that there is an action or behavior wrt Travis that is UNKNOWN TO HIM that gives reason to this WHY.. there for in simply applying the mindset that rob describes as that of his father's in adamant belief that no young woman would ever be initiating anal sex...thus leading to Travis being the initiator and manipulator in order for her to participate in anal sex..thus reversing the roles in putting Travis as the aggressive manipulator and Jodi as the passive victim..and in their looking at that dynamic as being what were the roles between the two in leading up to the heinous murder..this thereby could possibly be seen as the logical explanation of answering the all important question in their minds of what did he do to her that made her feel forced to have to heinously murder him.

In their minds it could possibly as easy as 1, 2, 3 in its order of how this murder came to be..it coincides with what is their mindset of a young woman never wanting or proposing anal sex..it coincides with what they visually see as the young female before them that does not "LOOK" like A monster killer like Manson or Dahmer..it coincides with their putting this innocent looking girl in the role of the passive victim with her being aggressively manipulated at the VERY least, and quite possibly even being seen or intpretated as being the victim of actual verbal, emotional/mental, or even physical abuse at the hands of the true "victim", Travis...and therefor this logical 1, 2, 3 thought process could possibly lead them to the all important answer for which they so desperately seek as to why?... Why did she do it?.. This thought process could lead them to the logical conclusion in their mind that it was due to her having been the victim of this man..and that it was the abuse that eventually led to the young woman "snapping" and committing this heinous murder against her "abuser"...

IMO I truly believe that it is honestly possible in having this particular mindset that rob so perfectly described as was his father's regarding just the specific aspect of Travis and Jodi's sexual relationship..and it is that mindset alone that could very much lead to their finding her guilty of the first degree premeditated murder, even finding it to have been proven especially cruel..yet with this particular mindset find that it was not deserving of the penalty of DEATH due to their seeing the dynamic they believe was at play between the two leading up to the murder is a mitigating factor whose amount of weight was substantial enough to spare her life from being given the death penalty..

Anyhoo as usual I'm uncertain if I was able to adequately relay the thoughts from my mind to words typed in and seen on the screen sufficiently enough to understand..lol..but I do believe that this particular mindset of some jurors could have possibly lead to our seeing the first two phases agreed upon unanimously in her being guilty of the first degree premeditated, especially cruel murder..yet believe there are indeed factors that would allow for her life to be spared from being sentenced to the penalty of death...

All Jmo, tho..and thanks to fellow WS member, *rob* for sharing the dynamics of his parents regarding this case as it truly was the lightbulb moment for me personally in attempting to understand possibly how this non-verdict came to be..

 

[shiloh42]

During these weeks when nothing is happening in this case, JVM and NG and DrD need to move on to something else. I've totally stopped watching (except for Tuesday when the ex jurors were on) out of sheer boredom. Yeah, yeah, we all agree, JA is crazy, JA is a stalker, JA is a murderer. Until there's new info, move on!

I think they're overestimating the public's attention span on this. I'd much rather hear Dr Drew's take on the Skylar Neese story.

And you're right, poster above whose name I can't find now, NG needs to stop playing that offensive tape. She's such a hypocrite to keep playing that.

 

[Sleuth5]

STOPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh:

:floorlaugh: :floorlaugh:
-you'll make me pee my pants :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh:

Close the door!

 

[ElleElle]

I turned it off. I was hoping for a program with a little more substance! However, I should have known better! After all this is HLN and Nancy Grace. I respect Nancy, but this is going too far, and it's all for ratings.

There are so many other interesting topics related to this case that she could have reported on tonight, but no....she chose to play the sex tapes over and over. I'm sick of hearing them. I'm sick of hearing CFJA fake her phone sex orgasms. It's disgusting. I'm so mad I'm getting ready to shoot off a nasty email to HLN. If I wanted to watch trash, I'd turn on Jerry Springer.

Yes, the sex tape is a little too much. Do they think that will keep people watching? And, ITA, it is disrespectful towards the Alexander family.

 

[marlap]

BBM

What? Nazis and aliens???? :scared:

Yes! The first time we stayed there we didn't sleep a wink!

It's got new owners and is all cleaned up now and gentrified. It was very bare bones when we used to go but we always had the best time.

http://dabbsrailroadhotel.com/

 

[Sleuth5]

In my attempts over the course of this past week to thoroughly digest and accept this non-verdict I believe that I have at least come to an understanding of what *could possibly* be why it happened..whereas before I could not at all even begin to fathom the how or why.. I am at least to a place of just accepting it for what it is and there for attempt to have some understanding of it in my moving on from it..

I think for me the first time that it really began to come into focus was in reading one of our fellow members, Rob's post regarding the dynamics between his parents as it played out over the course of this trial..It really was a lightbulb moment for me in understanding the mindset of some people of this particular generation that Rob's parents are in.. I believe his father's adamant beliefs wrt Jodi and the scenario he has firm in his mind are *possibly* similar to some of the jurors in what they may believe were the dynamics that led to the heinous murder.. Just as rob said his father was adamant that no young woman would ever favor or be the one to intiate the particular type of sex that Jodi and Travis regularly engaged in(ie. Anal)..in this mindset it immediately places Jodi in the role of at the very least being persuaded into sexual activities that she did not want or enjoy..and at most being somewhat forced, if even by manipulation on Travis' part to have engaged in such sexual intercourse..

IMO just having this particular mindset truly makes all the difference in the world when applying it to this case..it immediately places Jodi in the role of the victim of manipulation and places Travis in the role of the aggressive manipulator..this dynamic of just the aspect of their sexual relationship truly alters the entire dynamic of the roles of the two in every other aspect of this case.. This belief immediately places Jodi in a sympathetic position even regardless of the heinous brutal slaughter, if the belief is that she was a manipulated victim in the time leading up to the heinous murder it does indeed IMO give great weight to that as a mitigating factor in the penalty phase in deciding her life or death..

What I mean is that in speaking of having this mindset one could still clearly see this heinous murder as a first degree premeditated murder...they could also still be able to clearly see and there for decide that yes, that premeditated murder was proven to have met the aggravating factor of having been extremely or especially cruel..and yet in their firmly believing those two issues were proven they could find that the belief in their mind that Jodi was a passive victim in Travis at the very least having aggressively manipulated her into anal sex in the time leading up to the murder..IMO that belief could in fact be a strong enough factor in their opinion to spare her life in the penalty phase..

IMO just having that particular mindset about that one particular aspect is of huge importance in it not only just reversing the roles of each of them and thus placing Jodi in a sympathetic light..but IMO most importantly it ALSO gives an answer to that very question that so very many desperately want and need the answer to...why?..

In having this particular mindset is also POSSIBLY in their mind gives them an answer to WHAT COULD BE THE WHY this young woman committed this premeditated heinous murder of this young man..and IMO that question answered in their minds for them could actually only seem to solidify it as being true..the thoughts relayed of the foreman again says it all as well in his saying that his belief is that there was something that happened that led to Jodi feeling she had no choice but to murder this young man.. In his mind he believes that there is an action or behavior wrt Travis that is UNKNOWN TO HIM that gives reason to this WHY.. there for in simply applying the mindset that rob describes as that of his father's in adamant belief that no young woman would ever be initiating anal sex...thus leading to Travis being the initiator and manipulator in order for her to participate in anal sex..thus reversing the roles in putting Travis as the aggressive manipulator and Jodi as the passive victim..and in their looking at that dynamic as being what were the roles between the two in leading up to the heinous murder..this thereby could possibly be seen as the logical explanation of answering the all important question in their minds of what did he do to her that made her feel forced to have to heinously murder him.

In their minds it could possibly as easy as 1, 2, 3 in its order of how this murder came to be..it coincides with what is their mindset of a young woman never wanting or proposing anal sex..it coincides with what they visually see as the young female before them that does not "LOOK" like A monster killer like Manson or Dahmer..it coincides with their putting this innocent looking girl in the role of the passive victim with her being aggressively manipulated at the VERY least, and quite possibly even being seen or intpretated as being the victim of actual verbal, emotional/mental, or even physical abuse at the hands of the true "victim", Travis...and therefor this logical 1, 2, 3 thought process could possibly lead them to the all important answer for which they so desperately seek as to why?... Why did she do it?.. This thought process could lead them to the logical conclusion in their mind that it was due to her having been the victim of this man..and that it was the abuse that eventually led to the young woman "snapping" and committing this heinous murder against her "abuser"...

IMO I truly believe that it is honestly possible in having this particular mindset that rob so perfectly described as was his father's regarding just the specific aspect of Travis and Jodi's sexual relationship..and it is that mindset alone that could very much lead to their finding her guilty of the first degree premeditated murder, even finding it to have been proven especially cruel..yet with this particular mindset find that it was not deserving of the penalty of DEATH due to their seeing the dynamic they believe was at play between the two leading up to the murder is a mitigating factor whose amount of weight was substantial enough to spare her life from being given the death penalty..

Anyhoo as usual I'm uncertain if I was able to adequately relay the thoughts from my mind to words typed in and seen on the screen sufficiently enough to understand..lol..but I do believe that this particular mindset of some jurors could have possibly lead to our seeing the first two phases agreed upon unanimously in her being guilty of the first degree premeditated, especially cruel murder..yet believe there are indeed factors that would allow for her life to be spared from being sentenced to the penalty of death...

All Jmo, tho..and thanks to fellow WS member, *rob* for sharing the dynamics of his parents regarding this case as it truly was the lightbulb moment for me personally in attempting to understand possibly how this non-verdict came to be..

So youdefinitely do not agree with the verdict, then?

 

[shiloh42]

Yeah, I just think that is patently unfair. Every defendant deserves an attorney.

I hated nurmi, but that doesn't mean he should not represent, or have a practice specializing in sexual crime defendants. There are plenty of eighteen year olds charged as adults for having sex with a sixteen year old. Which negates, IMO, the whole purpose of the law.

That said, everyone hates sexual predators. But, they still get a defense, hate it as we will, and I do, most often.

Especially given the number of false accusations - wives accusing husbands to try to get a better deal in a divorce; students accusing strangers to cover up cutting classes (both of which happened in my area recently). Now, defending someone you know to be guilty of those crimes is a whole different matter. The most I can stomach in those cases is when the attorney makes sure the State or County hasn't overcharged the person just to be intimidating.

 

[YESorNO]

Is Dr. Drew in the Mafia tonight with that black shirt- LOL.
I don't like the tie.

 

[ElleElle]

Did anyone ever hear the doggie door story first hand, I heard Mimi refer to it, but she heard it from 'someone else' ..

No, I think it's hearsay.

 

[Sleuth5]

In my attempts over the course of this past week to thoroughly digest and accept this non-verdict I believe that I have at least come to an understanding of what *could possibly* be why it happened..whereas before I could not at all even begin to fathom the how or why.. I am at least to a place of just accepting it for what it is and there for attempt to have some understanding of it in my moving on from it..

I think for me the first time that it really began to come into focus was in reading one of our fellow members, Rob's post regarding the dynamics between his parents as it played out over the course of this trial..It really was a lightbulb moment for me in understanding the mindset of some people of this particular generation that Rob's parents are in.. I believe his father's adamant beliefs wrt Jodi and the scenario he has firm in his mind are *possibly* similar to some of the jurors in what they may believe were the dynamics that led to the heinous murder.. Just as rob said his father was adamant that no young woman would ever favor or be the one to intiate the particular type of sex that Jodi and Travis regularly engaged in(ie. Anal)..in this mindset it immediately places Jodi in the role of at the very least being persuaded into sexual activities that she did not want or enjoy..and at most being somewhat forced, if even by manipulation on Travis' part to have engaged in such sexual intercourse..

IMO just having this particular mindset truly makes all the difference in the world when applying it to this case..it immediately places Jodi in the role of the victim of manipulation and places Travis in the role of the aggressive manipulator..this dynamic of just the aspect of their sexual relationship truly alters the entire dynamic of the roles of the two in every other aspect of this case.. This belief immediately places Jodi in a sympathetic position even regardless of the heinous brutal slaughter, if the belief is that she was a manipulated victim in the time leading up to the heinous murder it does indeed IMO give great weight to that as a mitigating factor in the penalty phase in deciding her life or death..

What I mean is that in speaking of having this mindset one could still clearly see this heinous murder as a first degree premeditated murder...they could also still be able to clearly see and there for decide that yes, that premeditated murder was proven to have met the aggravating factor of having been extremely or especially cruel..and yet in their firmly believing those two issues were proven they could find that the belief in their mind that Jodi was a passive victim in Travis at the very least having aggressively manipulated her into anal sex in the time leading up to the murder..IMO that belief could in fact be a strong enough factor in their opinion to spare her life in the penalty phase..

IMO just having that particular mindset about that one particular aspect is of huge importance in it not only just reversing the roles of each of them and thus placing Jodi in a sympathetic light..but IMO most importantly it ALSO gives an answer to that very question that so very many desperately want and need the answer to...why?..

In having this particular mindset is also POSSIBLY in their mind gives them an answer to WHAT COULD BE THE WHY this young woman committed this premeditated heinous murder of this young man..and IMO that question answered in their minds for them could actually only seem to solidify it as being true..the thoughts relayed of the foreman again says it all as well in his saying that his belief is that there was something that happened that led to Jodi feeling she had no choice but to murder this young man.. In his mind he believes that there is an action or behavior wrt Travis that is UNKNOWN TO HIM that gives reason to this WHY.. there for in simply applying the mindset that rob describes as that of his father's in adamant belief that no young woman would ever be initiating anal sex...thus leading to Travis being the initiator and manipulator in order for her to participate in anal sex..thus reversing the roles in putting Travis as the aggressive manipulator and Jodi as the passive victim..and in their looking at that dynamic as being what were the roles between the two in leading up to the heinous murder..this thereby could possibly be seen as the logical explanation of answering the all important question in their minds of what did he do to her that made her feel forced to have to heinously murder him.

In their minds it could possibly as easy as 1, 2, 3 in its order of how this murder came to be..it coincides with what is their mindset of a young woman never wanting or proposing anal sex..it coincides with what they visually see as the young female before them that does not "LOOK" like A monster killer like Manson or Dahmer..it coincides with their putting this innocent looking girl in the role of the passive victim with her being aggressively manipulated at the VERY least, and quite possibly even being seen or intpretated as being the victim of actual verbal, emotional/mental, or even physical abuse at the hands of the true "victim", Travis...and therefor this logical 1, 2, 3 thought process could possibly lead them to the all important answer for which they so desperately seek as to why?... Why did she do it?.. This thought process could lead them to the logical conclusion in their mind that it was due to her having been the victim of this man..and that it was the abuse that eventually led to the young woman "snapping" and committing this heinous murder against her "abuser"...

IMO I truly believe that it is honestly possible in having this particular mindset that rob so perfectly described as was his father's regarding just the specific aspect of Travis and Jodi's sexual relationship..and it is that mindset alone that could very much lead to their finding her guilty of the first degree premeditated murder, even finding it to have been proven especially cruel..yet with this particular mindset find that it was not deserving of the penalty of DEATH due to their seeing the dynamic they believe was at play between the two leading up to the murder is a mitigating factor whose amount of weight was substantial enough to spare her life from being given the death penalty..

Anyhoo as usual I'm uncertain if I was able to adequately relay the thoughts from my mind to words typed in and seen on the screen sufficiently enough to understand..lol..but I do believe that this particular mindset of some jurors could have possibly lead to our seeing the first two phases agreed upon unanimously in her being guilty of the first degree premeditated, especially cruel murder..yet believe there are indeed factors that would allow for her life to be spared from being sentenced to the penalty of death...

All Jmo, tho..and thanks to fellow WS member, *rob* for sharing the dynamics of his parents regarding this case as it truly was the lightbulb moment for me personally in attempting to understand possibly how this non-verdict came to be..

BBM

I'm not really following you here -- I can follow what you're saying, but I'm wondering if you could clarify that. Thanks in advance.

 

[SusieD]

Yeah, I just think that is patently unfair. Every defendant deserves an attorney.

I hated nurmi, but that doesn't mean he should not represent, or have a practice specializing in sexual crime defendants. There are plenty of eighteen year olds charged as adults for having sex with a sixteen year old. Which negates, IMO, the whole purpose of the law.

That said, everyone hates sexual predators. But, they still get a defense, hate it as we will, and I do, most often.

Have you (or anyone here) seen the movie "The Woodsman?". It's a thought-provoking and memorable movie. I'm slightly uncomfortable reccommending a movie where a pedophile is the central character and the movie itself is uncomfortable at times. But it makes you think. And it may be Kevin Bacon's finest performance.

 

[shiloh42]

Having read above that NG again played that sex tape I just sent an email asking her to stop. I told her that I felt she was the one victimizing Travis and his family by playing that, and as long as she continued to abuse Travis I would not watch her show.

I doubt it will make her stop, but I feel better having sent that.