Found Deceased Spain - Esther Dingley, from UK, missing in the Pyrenees, November 2020 #4

[miekei]

On the subject of ED asking for fruit as a way of engaging with people she met, and in light of much recent analysis here of her mental well being, I just remembered today something I read a while ago in an email newsletter, about talking to strangers being mood enhancing. Did some searching this evening and I was surprised how much there was out there. I can imagine ED would have seen some of this as well and incorporated it into her routine.

Want To Feel Happier Today? Try Talking To A Stranger

Does talking to strangers help your mood? Moodscope blog.

The surprising benefits of talking to strangers

I agree wholeheartedly. I‘ve coped with general anxiety since childhood, and I rarely pass up an opportunity to talk to strangers. People who know me often comment on it. I find it somehow validating and grounding, if that makes sense. Perhaps, it triggers the release of endorphins, just like hiking.

 

[Grouse]

<snipped for focus>
There have been 5 other instances of hikers gone missing in that general area in the last 15 years, but one in particular caught my interest: Francoise Dasnois, also inexplicably vanished without a trace back in 2009 - also widely publicized. Colungo, from where she disappeared, is about a one and a half hour drive from Benasque.

Both these cases have also been “Websleuthed”.

Interesting. I might be getting forum fatigue now, but I can't seem to find anything on Francoise Dasnois on WS other than references in this thread. Is it still available?

 

[Grouse]

I agree wholeheartedly. I‘ve coped with general anxiety since childhood, and I rarely pass up an opportunity to talk to strangers. People who know me often comment on it. I find it somehow validating and grounding, if that makes sense. Perhaps, it triggers the release of endorphins, just like hiking.

Absolutely it makes sense! Good to hear that you've coped, that's the main thing.

 

[miekei]

Interesting. I might be getting forum fatigue now, but I can't seem to find anything on Francoise Dasnois on WS other than references in this thread. Is it still available?

It's been a while since I last saw it, it might no longer be available. Francoise was Belgian, on holiday in Spain, so if you Google her, most of the info will be in French. It's been 11 years since she went missing, she has recently been in the news again because they just now officially declared her deceased.
https://www.sudinfo.be/id293159/art...uis-11-ans-francoise-dasnois-une-habitante-de

 

[Grouse]

It's been a while since I last saw it, it might no longer be available. Francoise was Belgian, on holiday in Spain, so if you Google her, most of the info will be in French. It's been 11 years since she went missing, she has recently been in the news again because they just now officially declared her deceased.
https://www.sudinfo.be/id293159/art...uis-11-ans-francoise-dasnois-une-habitante-de

Yes I googled and found mostly French articles, though not much of substance. There was something up thread on here as well. From the snippets I've seen it does look like another strange disappearance, and given the proximity I am interested in reading more on it.

 

[otto]

Lately I’ve certainly moved more into the “third party” column myself, except I can imagine a voluntary disappearance with third party help. Much like the Wheaton case I posted from the past, I wonder if this was indeed the case, if Esther would have any idea how much publicity her disappearance would generate?
I imagine a situation where she met...as she always seemed to do...a kind fellow hiker that she confided in. In her mind, she might have been weary of the requests that she come home, but really, really not wanting to. She might confide this ‘soul-searching’ and the new friend might have offered a place to stay for awhile. She turns off the phone and off she goes.

Then, imagine a few days later, she hears of a massive search, and international publicity. Maybe she thought Dan would give her some space...but instead, her face is everywhere.

Here’s that long ago quote from Carolyn Swanson...

“But when they began to have second thoughts, she said, the possibility of contacting their families was complicated by the unanticipated and intense publicity surrounding their disappearance.’

All my imaginings, of course.

But...I know this question has been asked by others and myself...would we even know, if indeed she did make contact now...to at least let Dan and family know she is safe? In the case above, it was front page news when they returned, but that was Chicago...and many years ago.

Dan reported to police that Esther is missing. Police in three countries announced that she is missing. If Dan knows where she is, he has an obligation to report that to police. When police have located Esther, they have a responsibility to announce that she is no longer missing.

It is not possible that she has been located and it is kept a secret.

 

[stmarysmead]

Dan reported to police that Esther is missing. Police in three countries announced that she is missing. If Dan knows where she is, he has an obligation to report that to police. When police have located Esther, they have a responsibility to announce that she is no longer missing.

It is not possible that she has been located and it is kept a secret.

Thank you. That’s the answer I hoped for.

 

[RickshawFan]

On the subject of ED asking for fruit as a way of engaging with people she met, and in light of much recent analysis here of her mental well being, I just remembered today something I read a while ago in an email newsletter, about talking to strangers being mood enhancing. Did some searching this evening and I was surprised how much there was out there. I can imagine ED would have seen some of this as well and incorporated it into her routine.

Want To Feel Happier Today? Try Talking To A Stranger

Does talking to strangers help your mood? Moodscope blog.

The surprising benefits of talking to strangers

Hikers talk to strangers all the time on the trail. Asking for food is a whole 'nother matter.

 

[otto]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>

She is missing. Sadly, her partner admits that : if she made mistakes, it could have been the provisions. If she went off trail by accident, that mistake could have cost her life. Traveling without sufficient food - expecting strangers to part with their food in the backcountry - could be at the core of her disappearance.

'She said she liked to travel light when she was in the mountains.'

'If she made mistakes anywhere, it could have been the provisions she'd take because she was well-prepared in terms of equipment and very strong physically.' "
​

Missing hiker Esther Dingley had love life problems says witness as British police called in to help | Daily Mail Online

 

[CharlesSwann]

I don't believe the food issue has anything to do with it. She was only a couple of hours from civilisation in either direction - and all downhill - and she was physically very fit. I always find that once I start off down a mountain I'm back down before I know it. Anyway, you can go for days without food if you have to.

Asking for food was probably just a way of bonding. Highly sociable people are often quite naive about the way they come across. I would be interested to know the exactly how that conversation went, but in context, the request was probably quite harmless and certainly not significant to the case.

 

[stmarysmead]

Yes I googled and found mostly French articles, though not much of substance. There was something up thread on here as well. From the snippets I've seen it does look like another strange disappearance, and given the proximity I am interested in reading more on it.

I would like to read more too about this case. But if the only thing that matters...as you say, is that the “poor girl is missing”...why would you or I bother?

I think we are interested because ...like this case...the circumstances are “strange” and we’d like to understand what happened. Maybe it might “save the next girl.”

We all know when we come to a Website called Websleuths, what to expect. I d0nt mean this unkindly as I recognize and respect your sensitivity. But IMO we are here to try to sleuth WHY something tragic happened or in some cases, IF something tragic... happened at all. I’m sure there are FB pages just set up for just sympathy and condolences.

IMO the issue of asking for food, Esther’s hunger or poor preparation is just as valid as any other possible causative factor in discussing this case.

I’ve learned a lot from the expertise of others on this thread and I appreciate it.

 

[Grouse]

I would like to read more too about this case. But if the only thing that matters...as you say, is that the “poor girl is missing”...why would you or I bother?

I think we are interested because ...like this case...the circumstances are “strange” and we’d like to understand what happened. Maybe it might “save the next girl.”

We all know when we come to a Website called Websleuths, what to expect. I d0nt mean this unkindly as I recognize and respect your sensitivity. But IMO we are here to try to sleuth WHY something tragic happened or in some cases, IF something tragic... happened at all. I’m sure there are FB pages just set up for just sympathy and condolences.

IMO the issue of asking for food, Esther’s hunger or poor preparation is just as valid as any other possible causative factor in discussing this case.

I’ve learned a lot from the expertise of others on this thread and I appreciate it.

OK but too much is being made of this IMO. Overanalysing and judging ED's simple requests for fruit as an ice breaker to make contact is not helping to sleuth WHY something tragic happened at all IMO. As I said I saw it as a way of maintaining a positive mood. It seems she can't do right for wrong in some people's eyes.

Some of the meanness of spirit in comments regarding ED/DC's lifestyle has rather surprised me this last day or so, I'd hate to meet some of these people out on the trail.

 

[miekei]

OK but too much is being made of this IMO. Overanalysing and judging ED's simple requests for fruit as an ice breaker to make contact is not helping to sleuth WHY something tragic happened at all IMO. As I said I saw it as a way of maintaining a positive mood. It seems she can't do right for wrong in some people's eyes.

Some of the meanness of spirit in comments regarding ED/DC's lifestyle has rather surprised me this last day or so, I'd hate to meet some of these people out on the trail.

Couldn’t have said it better.

 

[Grouse]

Couldn’t have said it better.

Cheers! I'm struggling to see how a lot of what I've read recently on here will "save the next girl".

 

[Auntie Cipation]

Can anyone remind me how close to the trailhead was her "asking for fruit" encounter? I seem to be thinking the others were almost down off the trail, meaning ED would have been freshly setting out. Or was it actually higher up that they passed each other? Thanks.

 

[stmarysmead]

Cheers! I'm struggling to see how a lot of what I've read recently on here will "save the next girl".

Well, first we don’t know...if Esther needs saving. This may be a voluntary disappearance and she is alive and well. In those discussions, sympathies may lie more with Dan and her family. But we are still allowed to try to understand...should that be the case...her motivations. We may look at the “clues” from a different perspective. But other sleuthers, are free to counter with other interpretations, That kind of response is really more powerful than just disapproval with no factual rebuttal.

But back to Save The Next Girl...because of Esther’s own posts and numerous odd actions, sadly, this could be a suicide. The discussions about her emotional state,the clues we see, could help someone reading here...see those signs in someone they know and take preventative action. Save the next girl.

We have had some expert testimony about nutrition, thirst, time of day, weather conditions, clothing, hitching... Any and all could help.The Next Girl from not making the same mistakes.

Hope you at least see my point even if you disagree.

 

[RedHaus]

Can anyone remind me how close to the trailhead was her "asking for fruit" encounter? I seem to be thinking the others were almost down off the trail, meaning ED would have been freshly setting out. Or was it actually higher up that they passed each other? Thanks.

Hi Auntie Cipation. ED encountered the skier and his girlfriend at around 3:00pm 22/11 (exact time not known) and ED summitted pic de sauveguarde at about 3:30pm per DC's dossier. We believe that puts ED's encounter with the skier below the port de vanesque (into France) and above the primary summit trailhead. We don't know what ED did earlier that day. Per DC's dossier ED told him she stayed 21/11 at the cabane de la besurta - one access point from a road from Banasque to the summit trail.

So for 26 hours, from 21/11 at 1pm when ED posted the pic de sauvegarde summit pics on Instagram and 22/11 when ED encountered the skier, we do not know much about what ED did other than where she told DC she stayed the night. And we believe from the information we have, there was no cell service at the cabane. If you go to the top of this thread (#4) you may find otto's map with key locations. I've re-attached my map from Thread 3 with the possible trail route starting 22/11.



And up thread(s), you may find various musings from other WS'ers, including myself, about what ED did for those 26 hours, and where else she might have stayed 21/11.

ETA sources:
1. Missing hiker Esther Dingley 'last seen by Olympic skier asking for fruit'
2. ESTHER DINGLEY DOSSIER.PDF

 

[RickshawFan]

We have had some expert testimony about nutrition, thirst, time of day, weather conditions, clothing, hitching... Any and all could help.The Next Girl from not making the same mistakes.

Snipped for focus

The "next girl" might even be someone on this board. If our posts have kept even one person safe, we will have done a good job despite the detours.

 

[Sillybilly]

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[RickshawFan]

I don't believe the food issue has anything to do with it. She was only a couple of hours from civilisation in either direction - and all downhill - and she was physically very fit. I always find that once I start off down a mountain I'm back down before I know it. Anyway, you can go for days without food if you have to.

Asking for food was probably just a way of bonding. Highly sociable people are often quite naive about the way they come across. I would be interested to know the exactly how that conversation went, but in context, the request was probably quite harmless and certainly not significant to the case.

Just so we don’t go off track again on the nutrition issue, maybe we can get @10ofRods to weigh in again on the necessity of eating sufficiently, whys and wherefores, as s/he did upthread in substantial posts. IIRC s/he made clear that being able to go without food for several days is something of a myth, especially when you consider the massive caloric requirements of a muscle-bound person in a strenuous activity like a multi-day hiking trip in the mountains.