The Crown v Gerard Baden-Clay, 11th -12th June - Trial Days 2 & 3 - Week 1

[marlywings]

Thanks, MarlyWings. I'm sure we'll hear more about this during the trial (ie another attending police officer or two who will attest they didn't dissuade GBC from helping). This will directly contradict what GBC told Wendy - a clear-cut example of dishonesty/deception that will cast a pall on many other pieces of evidence.

With regards to discussion about whether Nigelaine and OW knew from the outset, I honestly believe that while they "knew" (in terms of strongly suspected) and while GBC "knew" that they knew, that discussion ("I did this - help me") probably never took place. Ever. Seems like the sort of family in which everyone intuitively "knew" what needed to be done from here on in, and perhaps they could justify to themselves under the umbrella of "protecting the girls". MOO.

Inspector Ainsworth himself may even be on the witness list.

Now that would be mighty interesting!!

 

[itsthevibe]

But didn't daddy go to bed after his daughters? So how would they know if he had those scratches or not?

These interviews commenced at 4:00pm on 20 April 2012. That is the day GBC reported Allison missing. The girls had spent some time in school and from memory GBC collected them early. There was very little time for coaxing or de-briefing them IMO. I do believe that they know a whole lot more but are too afraid to say because it may get daddy into trouble.

I think it was more that he prepared their minds as he went along - such as walking around with shaving foam on, explaining what he was doing and why, giving them plausible reasons for things as everything unfolded, so a picture and impression is painted that they believe as fact due to being children and trusting of their Dad.

 

[JAM13]

For some strange reason all I can visualise is a suffocation in bed (i.e. With a pillow). A person straddling the victim hence facial scratch marks but no serious fractures to the body. I just can't get that scenario out of my head. Thoughts are with the Dickie family and the girls right now. I sincerely hope they heard nothing. X

100% and I believe this is why the girls weren't woken from any fighting/screaming for help when she was killed.

Maybe when she was sound asleep she was quickly smothered by a hand or pillow. She woke up with something covering her face and tried to use her hands (shaving cuts) to stop the perp, but before long it was all over. All without any sound or much of a struggle.

Man that gives me goosebumps.

 

[coolcat]

Baden-Clay saw two doctors on April 20 and 21, 2012, who examined the marks on his face, neck and chest.

Sounds like a selfish man caring about his own well being instead of a distraught husband worried about the whereabouts of his wife.... Can't wait to hear from the pharmacist and doctors!

This has always bugged me... Why did he go to the docs for such a minor thing when a much more major event was taking place and strangers ( like all of us) seemed to show more concern?

 

[itsthevibe]

Methinks this little one's answers are just too good. Police Officer asks an open question and the little girl's reply volunteers two key matters i.e. parental 'arguments' and 'the duration of parental arguments'. Interesting IMO.

This does smack of coaching. if the parents were happy and didn't fight, why would it even be brought up, the issue of fighting, and specifically saying it was only for a second or a few seconds? Like it was important to highlight that. Concerning.

I too wonder what has come forth in these children's minds over time? Two years have passed and they have grown a little older, and had plenty of time toreflect. Out of the three of them there could possibly be at least one who remembers other things, who allows themselves to think differently about what was said to them and to question what it all meant. Children can have great insights, and it can be amazing what can come out of their mouths. Only barrier I could see would be concern about causing trouble, or simply not being able to deal with the pain of letting those other thoughts come to the surface.

 

[Snails]

100% and I believe this is why the girls weren't woken from any fighting/screaming for help when she was killed.

Maybe when she was sound asleep she was quickly smothered by a hand or pillow. She woke up with something covering her face and tried to use her hands (shaving cuts) to stop the perp, but before long it was all over. All without any sound or much of a struggle.

Man that gives me goosebumps.

Indeed. And premeditated too.

 

[emirates1957]

Seeing dear Allison's rings covered in dirt on a plastic sheet. Her children in tears recounting the last time they saw her, reading to them, tucking them in, singing, not to mention being worried that these beautiful young ladies may inherit some anxiety symptoms. She loved them from her soul.

Thank you all posters for giving me an insight to this mothers, love, care, intelligence and gusto.

May justice prevail.

 

[Forthegirls]

Can someone refresh my memory from a discussion many months ago about why Gerard didn't participate in the search? Today we heard that he texted Wendy Mollah to say he had been told to "leave it to the professionals", but didn't Det Atkinson contradict this at some point?

He sent this text to many of us, which I have to say came at some surprise. As my husband and I discussed at the time, if it were either one of us missing, we would out there 24/7, non stop looking, searching, begging, pleading, desperate to find the other, to find the truth, to find answers. We saw none of this in GBC. He sent us away, rejecting our help and many others like us in the community. Ok, maybe he was going to end it with his wife, but for the sake of the girls, would he not want their mother found? Would he not want to get to the bottom of what happened? I guess he already had the answers and we were forced to play it his way....so very very sad. lease:

 

[itsthevibe]

Baden-Clay saw two doctors on April 20 and 21, 2012, who examined the marks on his face, neck and chest.

Sounds like a selfish man caring about his own well being instead of a distraught husband worried about the whereabouts of his wife.... Can't wait to hear from the pharmacist and doctors!

This has always bugged me... Why did he go to the docs for such a minor thing when a much more major event was taking place and strangers ( like all of us) seemed to show more concern?

Very good point - I hope this is highlighted by the prosecution. Although i guess GBC could say it was because he thought he would become a suspect because the husband always is, so he was protecting himself, his innocent self. However it is still stupid because surely a medical professional would recognise they weren't made by a razor.

 

[LadyBird1]

Another subtle anomaly: Did her Mother REALLY tuck her in that night of the 19th April?
Through tears she said she knew that her Mother had tucked her in, because "She told me she would."

Not very convincing. IMO. And certainly not conclusive that Allison was there for the tuck in.

The Baden-Clays' second daughter said her mother checked on her in her room about five minutes after tucking her into bed.

"She checked on me when she went to bed," the then-eight-year-old said.

"How do you know that?" the detectives asked.

Through tears the little girl replied: "Cos she told me she would."

She woke the next morning to find her mother missing.


Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...ay-2-week-1-20140611-39wcd.html#ixzz34Jtbg4SK

 

[Radster]

Very good point - I hope this is highlighted by the prosecution. Although i guess GBC could say it was because he thought he would become a suspect because the husband always is, so he was protecting himself, his innocent self. However it is still stupid because surely a medical professional would recognise they weren't made by a razor.

But a suspect of what crime? At that point Allison was only missing.

 

[Forthegirls]

Very good point - I hope this is highlighted by the prosecution. Although i guess GBC could say it was because he thought he would become a suspect because the husband always is, so he was protecting himself, his innocent self. However it is still stupid because surely a medical professional would recognise they weren't made by a razor.

Agreed xx

 

[wewillgetyou]

https://twitter.com/katekyriacou/status/476607778438393856

Out of everything that was tweeted and reported today, this broke my heart :crying:

The fact that the little girl ' knew ' her mum had checked on her just because she said she would.
In all probability Allison never had the chance to do that final check.

 

[Oz Jen]

He sent this text to many of us, which I have to say came at some surprise. As my husband and I discussed at the time, if it were either one of us missing, we would out there 24/7, non stop looking, searching, begging, pleading, desperate to find the other, to find the truth, to find answers. We saw none of this in GBC. He sent us away, rejecting our help and many others like us in the community. Ok, maybe he was going to end it with his wife, but for the sake of the girls, would he not want their mother found? Would he not want to get to the bottom of what happened? I guess he already had the answers and we were forced to play it his way....so very very sad.

Wow. Unbelievably sad.

 

[marlywings]

Baden-Clay saw two doctors on April 20 and 21, 2012, who examined the marks on his face, neck and chest.

Sounds like a selfish man caring about his own well being instead of a distraught husband worried about the whereabouts of his wife.... Can't wait to hear from the pharmacist and doctors!

This has always bugged me... Why did he go to the docs for such a minor thing when a much more major event was taking place and strangers ( like all of us) seemed to show more concern?

I think he tried to get a doctor to confirm the marks on his neck/chest were from caterpillars/scratching.

 

[Oz Jen]

He sent this text to many of us, which I have to say came at some surprise. As my husband and I discussed at the time, if it were either one of us missing, we would out there 24/7, non stop looking, searching, begging, pleading, desperate to find the other, to find the truth, to find answers. We saw none of this in GBC. He sent us away, rejecting our help and many others like us in the community. Ok, maybe he was going to end it with his wife, but for the sake of the girls, would he not want their mother found? Would he not want to get to the bottom of what happened? I guess he already had the answers and we were forced to play it his way....so very very sad.

Wow. Unbelievably sad

 

[coolcat]

So as the case builds I wonder if the mud covered shoes were subject to a comparative analysis with the dirt and mud at the Kholo bridge area? if not, why not? Because if they showed a match then it would place him at the Kholo Bridge or nearby. Not sure why this wouldnt have been a much bigger deal so maybe it is not relevant?

I must of missed that they found muddy sneakers.... Where is this information or do you know the link regarding it?

 

[Forthegirls]

Another subtle anomaly: Did her Mother REALLY tuck her in that night of the 19th April?
Through tears she said she knew that her Mother had tucked her in, because "She told me she would."

Not very convincing. IMO. And certainly not conclusive that Allison was there for the tuck in.

The Baden-Clays' second daughter said her mother checked on her in her room about five minutes after tucking her into bed.

"She checked on me when she went to bed," the then-eight-year-old said.

"How do you know that?" the detectives asked.

Through tears the little girl replied: "Cos she told me she would."

She woke the next morning to find her mother missing.


Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...ay-2-week-1-20140611-39wcd.html#ixzz34Jtbg4SK

Not sure of your point...A sleepy 8 year old recalling the last moments with her mother...you can bet your bottom dollar that Allison would have gone back in there. This is a girl who trusted her mummy 100%.

 

[they'll get you]

100% and I believe this is why the girls weren't woken from any fighting/screaming for help when she was killed.

Maybe when she was sound asleep she was quickly smothered by a hand or pillow. She woke up with something covering her face and tried to use her hands (shaving cuts) to stop the perp, but before long it was all over. All without any sound or much of a struggle.

Man that gives me goosebumps.

Agreed. But what about the screams?

 

[Oz Jen]

Not so good at posting. Sorry. Feeling nervous and emotional right now as I'm sure we all are.