The Duct Tape Match #3

[notthatsmart]

It is true that the prosecution has not presented their case.
It is true that the defense has not presented their case.

It is true that none of us were there and that we dont know what happened.

I base my opinion on the same evidence as everyone else. I just interprit it differently. I have a right to my opinion and I like sleuthing. I just dont assume at a certain point. I want to continue sleuthing until I am satisfied that that particular item has been fully sleuthed.

In my humble opinion, there is a lot more sleuthing to do. Until then, She is assumed innocent.

 

[angeldust]

The probability of someone else putting Henkel duct tape on the posters is good. There could be thousands of rolls in Orlando and there could have been thousands of volunteers helping with those posters. I just dont assume like some of you.


Didnt that reporter Cathy Belich say they had actual footage of ga putting a poster up with the henkel tape.

I guess if true its not an assumption

 

[coco puff]

It is true that the prosecution has not presented their case.
It is true that the defense has not presented their case.

It is true that none of us were there and that we dont know what happened.

I base my opinion on the same evidence as everyone else. I just interprit it differently. I have a right to my opinion and I like sleuthing. I just dont assume at a certain point. I want to continue sleuthing until I am satisfied that that particular item has been fully sleuthed.

In my humble opinion, there is a lot more sleuthing to do. Until then, She is assumed innocent.

How do you successfully sleuth anything when the last person that saw Caylee has not given one truthfull thing to sleuth?

 

[sumbunny]

A silly question for anyone who can answer..and only because there is a tape discussion.

In order to pour gas wouldn't the breather hole need to be opened in order for the gas to pour smoothly?

ETA --i'd think opening and closing and opening and closing the tape, would render it "messy" looking?

 

[RubyB]

Did you read GA's depo? Full of inconsistencies.

Indeed. I can't for the life of me understand why he wouldn't cop to putting that tape there. You know, maybe he didn't, but whenever the SA would try to suggest the possibility, he'd just flip out. He claimed that when KC returned the cans on 6/24 the tape was not there. He also said that he was pretty religious about mowing the yard every week to ten days. Of course it stands to reason that he'd of had to put some gas in that can before it was seized & photographed on 8/1. If not for the mower, then to carry to the tow yard. Good grief! You'd think they were trying to extract a state secret from him! I personally don't care which member of the family put it there, but to try and deny that his roll of duct tape was used for the purpose would be ridiculous.

I think it's important to remember that GA sat for this depo in early August, before the evidence of this same sort of duct tape being used, by him, to hang missing posters came to light. In retrospect, not a good place to make your stand! Also important to remember is that the SAO wants to compare his depo testimony to his grand jury testimony. That issue wouldn't have anything to do with duct tape IMO, but more so his interpretation of the smell that suddenly ain't as bad as it seemed in July of 08. So GA's words are getting him in hot water all the way around.

 

[notthatsmart]

The probability of someone else putting Henkel duct tape on the posters is good. There could be thousands of rolls in Orlando and there could have been thousands of volunteers helping with those posters. I just dont assume like some of you.


Didnt that reporter Cathy Belich say they had actual footage of ga putting a poster up with the henkel tape.

I guess if true its not an assumption

If she has it, then why not show it. I also noticed that in Ca depo in July she said that they used tape to put up posters. So Cathy did not break this story. It was already known by the state, defense and Anthony's.

 

[notthatsmart]

How do you successfully sleuth anything when the last person that saw Caylee has not given one truthfull thing to sleuth?

yeah I agree to a certain point. We talked about it before opening a thread to go through Casey's lies. It should be sleuthed . I mean her statements to police. I think that is a stretch to say she lied about everything. It seems Cindy is going along with this Jeffery Hopkins story. I noted today that Ricardo Morales said that she often talked about Juliet.

I wish I knew how to open a thread.

 

[AZlawyer]

yeah I agree to a certain point. We talked about it before opening a thread to go through Casey's lies. It should be sleuthed . I mean her statements to police. I think that is a stretch to say she lied about everything. It seems Cindy is going along with this Jeffery Hopkins story. I noted today that Ricardo Morales said that she often talked about Juliet.

I wish I knew how to open a thread.

Believe me, the lies have been sleuthed. There was certainly a thread on her lies in general early on, and specific threads about specific lies later. If you do some searches, you should be able to find whichever ones you want to discuss further.

 

[MyTinkieGirl]

You called them? Thank you, only one problem. JWG says it was manufactured by Shurtape and you say it is manufactured by Henkel.

There are plenty of companies that put their main office on their product, but do not manufacture it or manufacture it in that location. Pillsbury flour, Gateway computers, Gm, Ford, and so on and so on.

Henkel and Shurtape are related companies in many ways, but they are not located in the same place.

I want to know for sure who made this tape. I love a spirited debate.

Oh, my...LOL The companies went thru some sort of merger thingie...changing of who makes what...the point isssss.....the A's tape on the gas can said "Henkel"....the tape over Caylee's skull said "Henkel"....MY tape from MY tape drawer says "Henkel" .....the 800 # answers "Welcome to Henkel".....I believe it's Henkel....mine has the "Avon, Ohio" address, I asked the woman about the meaning of that...and what I said earlier was her answer.

I understand about production, etc....I PURPOSELY asked the woman on the phone about that...they produce at MANY plants across the USA.....apparently certain products designated to certain production facilities.

MAYBE THIS WILL HELP - about recent sale of "Duck" brand
http://www.duckproducts.com/default.asp

And this explains about how "Duck Tape" is "made", per se...and why "where it's made" or labeled is where it's actually "processed"...
As of 2003..."The tape isn't made in Avon. Henkel buys it from Shurtape in North Carolina, which ships massive rolls to the plant. Henkel then re-rolls it onto small spools, which are then cut, packaged and labeled as Duck Tape"....so, yessss, JWG is correct about the manufacturer.

AND...I have some black "Shurtape" electrical tape....it says specifically..."Made in Taiwan".




ETA : I DID say I wasn't going into duct tape anymore.....but it's "notthatsmart's" fault...they made me do it...I swear!!! LOL J/K

 

[MD MOMMY]

And we know for a fact that the knife LE took had some sort of sticky residue that neither CA or her dishwasher was able to adequately clean. I think it is safe to assume that indeed this may have been the knife with which the duct tape was cut...

Where is this info in the docs roughly? I must have skipped right over it.

 

[MissJames]

This was suppose to be in response to notthatsmart's question above. For some reason when I reply to a post it always goes to the end of the thread.

All new posts go to the end of the thread.If you are replying to someone just hit the quote button and their post will show up in your post so everyone's on the same page : )

If broken quotes happen all bets are off.It seems to create a string of posts attributed to people other than the poster.Very freaky,but the mods can fix it.

 

[celticthyme]

Why was the gas can returned to the A's with the duct tape still on it? Did they test it?? For Georges fingerprints/DNA (to prove he put it on the can), and for fibers that match to the other duct tape on Caylee?
I'm confused..

Me tooooo
In George's testimony
From what I can tell, LDB et al were going after the gas can & duct tape for some specific information and I'm not sure I've figured it all out exactly, but these are the issues I've picked up on,( and you folks I'm sure can figure out more)
1) Establishing a timeline: When he went to the shed on the 24th of June, it had been broken into, & the cans were gone, so he reported it & called Cindy about it
We believe Caylee died on the 16th
Was in the trunk at least 3 days, and dumped b4 the 27th, because that is when the car showed up at Amscot
2) Cindy immediately calls Casey, who then shortly shows up at the house /gas can car trunk scenario plays out between George & Casey

3) George gets the cans back that day
Question?? Was that tape on their then, and put on there at some point by Casey in the taping up of Caylee??
Cross contamination ??? Evidence on the tape or on the can???
LE is interested in finding evidence of decomp on the tape / the bottom of the cans, from the trunk and connect the dots

The issue of the tape, from what I can tell is that George adamantly denies putting that large a piece of duct tape, in such a manner on the cans . . he absolutely did not put it there. However, LE knows that Casey 1) had the can & 2) had used duct tape on Caylee
Were they looking for cross contamination from Caylee, decomp, prints & fibers on the tape??? I'm sure there are better sleuthers than me that can add specifics to this issue

ETA So maybe part of their point was to emphasize for future reference that GORGE DID NOT PUT THE DUCT TAPE ON THE CAN ( at the time, George would not have known the significance of this?)

 

[ronstet]

celticthyme:
"LE is interested in finding evidence of decomp on the bottom of the cans from the trunk"

Wow! Thats good

 

[MissJames]

Me tooooo
In Georges testimony
From what I can tell, LDB et al were going after the gas can & duct tape for some specific information and I'm not sure I've figured it all out exactly, but these are the issues I've picked up on,( and you folks I'm sure can figure out more)
1) Establishing a timeline: When he went to the shed on the 24th of June, it had been broken into, & the cans were gone, so he reported it & called Cindy about it
We believe Caylee died on the 16th
Was in the trunk at least 3 days, and dumped b4 the 27th, because that is when the car showed up at Amscot
2) Cindy immediately calls Casey, who then shortly shows up at the house /gas can car trunk scenario plays out between George & Casey

3) George gets the cans back that day
Question?? Was that tape on their then, and put on there at some point by Casey in the taping up of Caylee??
Cross contamination ??? Evidence on the tape or on the can???
LE is interested in finding evidence of decomp on the tape / the bottom of the cans, from the trunk and connect the dots

The issue of the tape, from what I can tell is that George adamantly denies putting that large a piece of duct tape, in such a manner on the cans . . he absolutely did not put it there. However, LE knows that Casey 1) had the can & 2) had used duct tape on Caylee
Were they looking for cross contamination from Caylee, decomp, prints & fibers on the tape??? I'm sure there are better sleuthers than me that can add specifics to this issue

I got the feeling George might be implying LE put it on there to implicate Casey.
He kept insisting it wasn't there when Casey gave the cans back and that HE didn't put it there.In the depo he's asked when it was put on [or maybe who put it on] and he says "you tell me!"
He also talked about the missing notebook that LE says they didn't take,yet he obviously wants us to believe they are lying.
I think the A's and defense are moving to a Casey was framed by LE scenario.They are making a stink about not being at the recovery site.Perhaps the defense is setting LE up to take the fall.
Won't work,but they might try and GA and CA seem to be helping.

 

[countzero]

celticthyme:
"LE is interested in finding evidence of decomp on the bottom of the cans from the trunk"

Wow! Thats good

LE took and sent to the FBI:

Q220 - 2 swabs from bottom of gas can #1
Q221 - 2 swabs from interior of oil pan
Q222 - 2 swabs from bottom of gas can #2

We, well me, are still waiting for the forensics report from the FBI. Hopefully it will be in the next dump due soon.

 

[JWG]

I don't think we've seen the edges of the tape, because the ME said the tape had to be cut out of Caylee's hair. So the ends of the tape should be still attached to the hair mass, and the pictures we're seeing are the parts of the tape cut away from the hair by the ME.

I think it was the other way around, AZ. The hair was cut from the tape, not the tape from the hair. The images of the tape I have seen show ragged ends, not the sort of clean edges one would expect from cutting with scissors.

 

[celticthyme]

I got the feeling George might be implying LE put it on there to implicate Casey.
He kept insisting it wasn't there when Casey gave the cans back and that HE didn't put it there.In the depo he's asked when it was put on [or maybe who put it on] and he says "you tell me!"
He also talked about the missing notebook that LE says they didn't take,yet he obviously wants us to believe they are lying.
I think the A's and defense are moving to a Casey was framed by LE scenario.They are making a stink about not being at the recovery site.Perhaps the defense is setting LE up to take the fall.
Won't work,but they might try and GA and CA seem to be helping.

Can't you just picture the A family meeting, where they sit down with their respective notebooks and say OK now, What's our story going to be about the gas can? What's our story going to be about cleaning the trunk? What are we going to admit to removing from the Pontiac?

As LE stated in the beginning of the depositions, this was a deposition, not a 2 way question & answer. So though G,CA & LA all tried to get their digs in, put their slants on different stories & lines of questioning, LE just glazed right on over it & kept going. They are lining up their ducks with questions from these depositions.
There is method to their madness, and that will be made clear to one & all as time goes on.

Though I've read all the depositions, more than once, and did the 48 hr thing, I just do not put stock in just about anything any of them say. LE & all of us lunatics who are obsessed with this case know about of the bold faced lies, ZFG, made up ZFG family / hard rock nonsense, we never fight at our house . . Blah Blah
The defense and the Anthony's have only one agenda, which is to protect Casey in any way possible, and they were not kidding that they would lie, cheat steal to do it. Probably the only truth coming from them.

They have no option but to try to slant & skew the evidence,lie, obfuscate, hide, cover up. There is no other person in the world who would benefit from Caylee's death except Casey. So even if the Duh-fence tries to roll the Anthony's under the bus, what possible motive would any of them have to murder that child? It may have been a strange family dynamic, but I do believe they loved their grand daughter. I;m just not sure they will ever be able to face reality, especially cindy.

 

[Valhall]

It is true that the prosecution has not presented their case.
It is true that the defense has not presented their case.

It is true that none of us were there and that we dont know what happened.

I base my opinion on the same evidence as everyone else. I just interprit it differently. I have a right to my opinion and I like sleuthing. I just dont assume at a certain point. I want to continue sleuthing until I am satisfied that that particular item has been fully sleuthed.

In my humble opinion, there is a lot more sleuthing to do. Until then, She is assumed innocent.

Actually, she is presumed innocent in the court of law - not assumed innocent. Slight - but very important difference.

 

[RubyB]

Why was the gas can returned to the A's with the duct tape still on it? Did they test it?? For Georges fingerprints/DNA (to prove he put it on the can), and for fibers that match to the other duct tape on Caylee?
I'm confused..

I think the confusion comes because LE had the gas cans twice. Back on 8/1/08 when G & CA related the gas can incident to LE, they escorted the A's back to the house and GA gave them the cans. At that time LE was interested to know if the cans had been in contact with whatever was rotting in KC's trunk. They photographed them (complete w/tape), swabbed them for evidence and returned them at some point. The duct tape wasn't an issue at that time because Caylee's remains w/duct tape hadn't been discovered yet.

After the remains were discovered, these two examples of visually similar duct tape became important as evidence. LE raced back over to the A's and grabbed the gas can w/tape again. I'm sure this time around they subjected the tape to testing. There has been info released about the comparison of the two samples fabric content not matching identically. Any tests results for fingerprints or DNA haven't been shared to date.

I'm personally not convinced it's all that important who put the tape on the can, it's the fact that the same type of tape was found on the A's personal property and their grandchild's remains.
And it's disingenuous of GA to accuse LE of putting that tape there before anyone knew how important it was going to be. It was photographed there on 8/1/08!

 

[celticthyme]

I think the confusion comes because LE had the gas cans twice. Back on 8/1/08 when G & CA related the gas can incident to LE, they escorted the A's back to the house and GA gave them the cans. At that time LE was interested to know if the cans had been in contact with whatever was rotting in KC's trunk. They photographed them (complete w/tape), swabbed them for evidence and returned them at some point. The duct tape wasn't an issue at that time because Caylee's remains w/duct tape hadn't been discovered yet.

After the remains were discovered, these two examples of visually similar duct tape became important as evidence. LE raced back over to the A's and grabbed the gas can w/tape again. I'm sure this time around they subjected the tape to testing. There has been info released about the comparison of the two samples fabric content not matching identically. Any tests results for fingerprints or DNA haven't been shared to date.

I'm personally not convinced it's all that important who put the tape on the can, it's the fact that the same type of tape was found on the A's personal property and their grandchild's remains.
And it's disingenuous of GA to accuse LE of putting that tape there before anyone knew how important it was going to be. It was photographed there on 8/1/08!

Obviously the duct tape from Caylee / & the suburban site having been subjected to the elements for so many months has been severely compromised, and there are no prints. That tape may be from the same Henkel role as that on the gas can, but we do not know if they have definietly connected them yet do we?