The Springfield Three--missing since June 1992 - #5

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Thanks for posting this, althought the article is not just too short to snip--it's too short to do justice to Sherrill, Suzie and Stacy.

Bartt, you are in my thoughts and prayers.
 
Another article from KSPR 33 marking the 19th anniversary. This one is a little bit longer and mentions the "Disappeared" show from last March.

Candlelight Vigil to Remember Springfield's Three Missing Women
19 years after their disappearance and for the first time since the first year, the mother of one of Springfield's three missing women held a candlelight vigil to remember June 7, 1992.

June 07, 2011|By Joanna Small and Adriana Futrell | Reporter and Photographer

SPRINGFIELD, Mo. — On the 19th anniversary of a missing persons case that shocked Springfield three women are being remembered in Phelps Grove Park.

"When she does come home we'll have a big celebration and believe me Springfield will celebrate with us," Janis McCall told KSPR. That was in 2001.
But every year until Stacy comes home, Springfield celebrates- sadly- another anniversary.

More at link..

http://articles.kspr.com/2011-06-07/three-missing-women_29632167
 
I think that four things are probable.

1) They would have gone in one car. The other two cars would have logically been left at Janelle's house which offered better parking in a better area. There is no logic in believing they would have taken more than one car. I would have never left my car anywhere when I was 18.

2) They could have overnighted in Battlefield but chose not to. This suggests to me there were underlying reasons for the change in plans. If so, what were they? And we can probably assume, although I hate to do that, they had some adult beverages so the 11 mile drive was somewhat hazardous. They could have stayed there, but it definately would have been easier to go home. A crowded house versus a 10 minute drive to my bed is no match. I would have gone home. We also have never known how drunk or sober these girls were, we can assume that they had been drinking, but to excess? We have no idea.

3) I believe this was a planned event which brings up the obvious question. What was the motive? And as stated, if either Sheriill or Suzie remained alive they could surely point to a perpetrator(s) as they were very close as mother and daughter. That suggests the killer or killers waited until Suzie was home to strike as Sherrill was available nearly all night long. A planned event has some problems. We do not have a motive for a planned event. Why go after 3 women when 1 is the target? I also think that if someone was going into a house with 3 women, then the phone lines would be cut. There is no feel for a pro hit to me.

4) The purses were forgotten with the money. The television was left in haste. The door was unlocked in the rush to leave. And the globe was broken which probably spooked the perp(s) to leave immediately since it could have been heard and daylight was fast approaching. It would have been to the perp(s) advantage to have taken the purses, turned off the television, locked the door and cleaned up the broken globe as it would have delayed discovery of the crime scene. That suggests to me that the final victim may have been the one who kicked the globe off the wall breaking it which forced the quick exit. Had that not happened, I believe it would have been much wiser to have taken the purses, turned off the TV, locked the door and simply left with all three victims. There was no logical reasons to have overlooked these four clues that something was not right in that house. If it were a pro hit then yes it would make more sense, but if it were something different, and by people who were in a hurry to get out of town quickly, I could see all of that being left that way.

Going to respond to both of you at the same time, just to get the conversation going again.

1. The "one car" scenario is interesting. It's pretty clear that the trip to the water park would have involved kids in a group going in one car (or several cars if others not usually mentioned were involved). So, in theory, "leaving a car" would have been done the next day. Now, I can see why Stacy would have wanted to take her car to Susie's, just because most of us, given a choice, prefer to have our own transportation available ust in case something comes up. I know I sometimes drive myself when I could ride with other people because I want to be able to leave or stay based on my own preferences. So it doesn't surprise me that Stacy would take her car AND that later on she might ride with a group for an all-day trip.

2. I am never surprised when teenagers' "plans" change. Lots of their 'planning" is more wishful thinking than everything else, especially on a night like graduation, which they start out imagining as "anything is possible" only to encounter realities like family expectations, the difficulty of getting a group together after a big event, fatigue, lack of money, and parental objections. So I take the changes in plans as having more to do with "reality setting in" than anything else.

3. I don't think there is any need for a "motive" other than the pleasure of killing, controlling people, or whatever else leads psychopaths to do what they do. If there is a "motive," it is probably too sick for normal people to understand. The bottom line is that someone was bold enough to abduct three women, and apparently from the home where two of them lived. There are precedents for the abduction/murder of multiple women across generational lines: Carole Sund, her daughter and her friend; the woman and her two daughters who were lured onto a boat in Florida while on vacation; the home invasion in which a doctor was attacked, his wife and daughters were raped and murdered, and the house set on fire. Every one of these crimes were random, in the sense that there was no relationship between the victims and the perpetrators. That does not mean the abduction was not a planned event--in the sense that a predator is always looking for prey and has made preparations in advance. What might not be planned is the seeming opportunity that triggered the abduction.

4. I have puzzled long and hard about the purses. All that tells me now is that money was not a motive or the money would have been taken. My guess is that the man or men who did the abduction didn't give a second thought to the purses. Why would he want to take them, when that would mean the need to dispose of tremendously significant evidence linking him to the crime? Think of all the abductions in which cell phones, purses, wallets, and other personal items of the victim are left strewn across the landscape or found in dumpsters. No, the purses only matter to us because the first people who came in the house saw the purses, cigarettes, etc., there and that did not match up with the women having gone to breakfast or out for coffee or shopping. Then our sleuther minds get busy and we imagine the perpetrator staging the crime scene and then ask "Why did he/they leave the purses?" Because the perpetrator(s) were not stupid. Whoever did this did not need to stage the crime scene. Taking the purses might have bought another hour or so, but with teenagers involved, the chances of the alarm going up early was very good and leaving the purses caused just as much confusion. I think it is far more likely that the abductor(s) was/were far more interested in getting the women into a vehicle and away from the house on Delmar. As Mark Klaas says, a loved one can disappear at the rate of 60 miles per hour. If the abduction happened even as late as 4 am, the perpetrator(s) had 4 hours to work with. The purses weren't a factor.

And in any event, Janelle, her boyfriend, Janis McCall and a bunch of other people screwed the crime scene up by moving things around anyway.
 
Going to respond to both of you at the same time, just to get the conversation going again.

1. The "one car" scenario is interesting. It's pretty clear that the trip to the water park would have involved kids in a group going in one car (or several cars if others not usually mentioned were involved). So, in theory, "leaving a car" would have been done the next day. Now, I can see why Stacy would have wanted to take her car to Susie's, just because most of us, given a choice, prefer to have our own transportation available ust in case something comes up. I know I sometimes drive myself when I could ride with other people because I want to be able to leave or stay based on my own preferences. So it doesn't surprise me that Stacy would take her car AND that later on she might ride with a group for an all-day trip.

2. I am never surprised when teenagers' "plans" change. Lots of their 'planning" is more wishful thinking than everything else, especially on a night like graduation, which they start out imagining as "anything is possible" only to encounter realities like family expectations, the difficulty of getting a group together after a big event, fatigue, lack of money, and parental objections. So I take the changes in plans as having more to do with "reality setting in" than anything else.

3. I don't think there is any need for a "motive" other than the pleasure of killing, controlling people, or whatever else leads psychopaths to do what they do. If there is a "motive," it is probably too sick for normal people to understand. The bottom line is that someone was bold enough to abduct three women, and apparently from the home where two of them lived. There are precedents for the abduction/murder of multiple women across generational lines: Carole Sund, her daughter and her friend; the woman and her two daughters who were lured onto a boat in Florida while on vacation; the home invasion in which a doctor was attacked, his wife and daughters were raped and murdered, and the house set on fire. Every one of these crimes were random, in the sense that there was no relationship between the victims and the perpetrators. That does not mean the abduction was not a planned event--in the sense that a predator is always looking for prey and has made preparations in advance. What might not be planned is the seeming opportunity that triggered the abduction.

4. I have puzzled long and hard about the purses. All that tells me now is that money was not a motive or the money would have been taken. My guess is that the man or men who did the abduction didn't give a second thought to the purses. Why would he want to take them, when that would mean the need to dispose of tremendously significant evidence linking him to the crime? Think of all the abductions in which cell phones, purses, wallets, and other personal items of the victim are left strewn across the landscape or found in dumpsters. No, the purses only matter to us because the first people who came in the house saw the purses, cigarettes, etc., there and that did not match up with the women having gone to breakfast or out for coffee or shopping. Then our sleuther minds get busy and we imagine the perpetrator staging the crime scene and then ask "Why did he/they leave the purses?" Because the perpetrator(s) were not stupid. Whoever did this did not need to stage the crime scene. Taking the purses might have bought another hour or so, but with teenagers involved, the chances of the alarm going up early was very good and leaving the purses caused just as much confusion. I think it is far more likely that the abductor(s) was/were far more interested in getting the women into a vehicle and away from the house on Delmar. As Mark Klaas says, a loved one can disappear at the rate of 60 miles per hour. If the abduction happened even as late as 4 am, the perpetrator(s) had 4 hours to work with. The purses weren't a factor.

And in any event, Janelle, her boyfriend, Janis McCall and a bunch of other people screwed the crime scene up by moving things around anyway.

Concerning the planned trip to Whitewater my opinion is that there were many classmates going because it was the thing to do. It was an open ended “invitation” for whoever wanted to show up.

Concerning transportation for Suzie’s group of friends my thoughts are that Janelle and Mike would have driven together because they were dating, and Suzie and Stacy were to ride with Applebee who lived not far from Delmar. Applebee drove a Jeep which would hold no more than 3-4 people anyway. Another friend had been invited to go along with them but could not make it. I have no idea where they were to meet up to caravan to Whitewater or if they even knew themselves, but for one of the girls to have left their car at Battlefield after the parties would not have made any sense unless they were too impaired to drive somehow.

I just think that the overall plans concerning Sunday and the trip to Whitewater were very fluid and constantly changing; nothing was set in stone to take place with military precision.

3. I don't think there is any need for a "motive" other than the pleasure of killing, controlling people, or whatever else leads psychopaths to do what they do.


I wholeheartedly agree! This was a crime that simply presented itself to one or two frustrated criminal rapists and it got out of hand when the two girls arrived home unexpectedly at that hour.
 
This a fascinating story. I don't mean that in a good way, but more in a riveting way. Just watched the episode of Disappeared and have read a boatload here on websleuths. I have nothing to add, but how old was Sherrill? At the beginning of Disappeared they referred to her in February of 1992 as "42 year old Sherrill....," but they later kept saying she was 47 years old. Sorry, it really doesn't matter, but makes me wonder if they can't get somethiing as simple as her age correct, then what else did they state incorrectly?

Also, wanted to add that the son Bartt came across as very forthcoming and sincerely sad over his missing loved ones. He also seems to be very intelligent in his communication skills. Much so more than some of the others. That and I think Stacy's mom Janis McCall came off as articulate as you can be in conveying what is/was going through her head. I was very impressed with her.
 
Hurricane, as I was writing, I realized I've never known all that much about the Whitewater trip. I like your description of how kids handle these kinds of "plans" as "fluid". That fluidity suggests, to me, that the abductions were at least to some degree, an intersection of two fluid forces: the girls and their fluid plans, and the abductor(s) and their fluid plans. Something about the girls or Sherrill or that house looked liked an opportunity to a person or persons who had intentions to abduct, rape or kill. With the exception of the grave robbers, I still don't see a motive other than psychopathic violence; the absence of people with motives to kill any of these women also suggests a crime of prepared opportunity.
 
Hurricane, as I was writing, I realized I've never known all that much about the Whitewater trip. I like your description of how kids handle these kinds of "plans" as "fluid".
That fluidity suggests, to me, that the abductions were at least to some degree, an intersection of two fluid forces: the girls and their fluid plans, and the abductor(s) and their fluid plans. Something about the girls or Sherrill or that house looked liked an opportunity to a person or persons who had intentions to abduct, rape or kill.
With the exception of the grave robbers, I still don't see a motive other than psychopathic violence; the absence of people with motives to kill any of these women also suggests a crime of prepared opportunity.

I believe the perp’s were ex-cons who had been living or working in the neighborhood and their original plans that night were to burglarize one of the larger estate type homes just to the west. But something changed their plans. Perhaps the residents were home when they were not expected to be or had overnight guests visiting for the weekend. Something out of the norm at the estate home caused the perps to change those plans.

Driving out past 1717 they would have noticed Sherrill’s bedroom window raised open with the light on and the window blinds up one fourth of their length. From being in the area they would have known that only a single mother & daughter lived there. With only one car at home and since it was well past one o’clock and probably even past two, they would have known that only one was at home and it was most likely that the other would not be returning. After a peek in the window to see Sherrill reading her book in bed or perhaps having fallen asleep while reading, events were put in motion and entry into the house was made.

I have said before that if Sherrill’s house had been dark with no lights on and her bedroom window closed the perps would most likely have driven past without a second thought. Had the two girls not arrived home while the perps were inside the house Sherrill would have most likely been raped and badly beaten in her own home, threatened within an inch of her life, but left alive as was the case of the coed rape committed the following year. Even though the perps may have had a gun, once the two girls arrived home the situation changed. They would not have raped three women and left them alive in their own home as witnesses. And the perps were not murderers. So it became necessary to remove the women and take them out in the county to a location owned by or under the control of friends that they trusted. The friends participated in the party that followed, and they had no compunction about murder.

Call it fate or fluidity, I believe what happened was a result of the situations as they presented themselves that night.
 
i just don't see enough indications that there were people in the house when the girls came home. It would have been dangerous to the perpetrators to wait aroind while the girls got ready for bed. The perpetrators wanted to get the women out of the house for a reason. We could be more confident about these scenarios if so many people hadn't screwed up the crime scene.

(Had to make post #2000 on this thread.)
 
I think the prime suspect is and should be Larry DeWayne Hall, who has recently confessed to the murder of Laurie Depies from Wisconsin in 1992. The investigators need to get this guy talking soon while he's in the mood to talk.
 
It has been proven that Hall was in the Springfield area during the time of the women's disappearances, along with the fact that he drove a van that closely resembled the eyewitness account. Read this about his timeline.

http://maamodt.asp.radford.edu/Psyc 405/serial killers/Hall, Larry DeWayne.pdf

Interesting information. May I ask how it was established that he was in the area during the time the women went missing? If he only had an IQ of 80 and was a disorganized serial killer did he have the ability to abduct three grown women without leaving a trace?

What van did he use? How was that established? That information should be available in motor vehicle records somewhere.
 
I have seen that he Larry Hall had a van the same vintage of the model described by the porch lady. I have never seen that he was in the Springfield area. He was a disorganized/organized serial killer. According to the FBI. This is an excerpt describing Hall from a book I have read recently

While much identifies Hall as a serial killer to a savvy investigator, several aspects to both his personal history and criminal behavior are unique. Most obviously, no other documented serial killer has an identical twin. Second, he defies easy classification into the categories that criminologists use to distinguish different types of offenders who commit sexual violence. Beyond his tendencies to be both megastat and megamobile, he is also what FBI profilers would call both “disorganized” and “organized” in the way he commits his crimes. His impulsive decision to abduct Jessica Roach, his frantic efforts to take her across state lines, and finally his slipshod disposal of her body all suggest the profile of a disorganized offender. But the notes on the scraps pulled from his car and room indicate something quite the opposite: a predator that stalks, pounces, and kills with the utmost care—the essence of organized behavior.

I have few problems with him as a suspect. He is a small man, and while this does not discount the use of a weapon, which he had used a knife. I find it hard to believe he could overpower three women. His own confessions do not portray him as being in control of his situations. He was not a terroriizing person, until he snapped. He did not like struggle, he used ether to subdue his victims. He was enamored in women that gave him attention and were nice to him. It appears that he preferred dark haired women also. I do not find him a strong suspect, but his brother seems to think he could be involved.
 
Interesting information. May I ask how it was established that he was in the area during the time the women went missing? If he only had an IQ of 80 and was a disorganized serial killer did he have the ability to abduct three grown women without leaving a trace?

What van did he use? How was that established? That information should be available in motor vehicle records somewhere.

Well, his IQ may have been 80, but take that with a grain of salt. Obviously, over the years he was very adept at disposing of his victim's bodies without ever being detected.

Larry Halll was a Civil War re-enactment enthusiast, so he traveled everywhere around the country, but especially the Midwest. The van he had was an older Dodge model similar to the witness account that said they saw a blond haired woman being told, "don't do anything stupid" by an unseen male in the van. So here we have a known serial killer who knew the area well, drove an older model van (if you believe this info relates to the Springfield 3 case), and just like his past crimes has left little evidence and no bodies found. While it may be coincidental, I doubt it.

As for my personal theory on this case, I think that somewhere along the way, the two friends (and possibly the mom) met up with Larry Hall. Was it at that restaurant? Or did he follow them home from somewhere else? The confession that he made to the Wisconsin police on the case of Laura Depies, who has been missing since 1992 as well, was that he went to the mall where she worked and stopped in her store and bought a shirt. He waited for her to get off work and followed her home. As she pulled up to her apartment, he drove by and said something relating to that shirt to start conversation and lured her. The police have stated that he has given info that only the killer would know and that it is credible. He gave them a general area where to find her body and they are currently doing that. They also found his own diary entries regarding the case.

Some may ask how did he manage to incapacitate 3 women if it was only himself? First of all, with his history, he probably subdued one or more of the women first and told the other that she better follow his orders. Maybe that may explain the witness account of a blonde woman looking terrified driving the van while also hearing a male speaking to her, but who wasn't seen.

Note added: the case of Laura Depies is one of the few where he told investigators his MO on how he planned the crime and acted on it. Think it might be of importance in relation to the Springfield 3 case and possibilities

I watched the show 'Disappeared' on this case a while back and really hope their families can finally get some justice. 19 years, and still nothing to go on. I'm sure the police have looked at Larry Hall as a suspect, but the fact is that he is a suspect in so many Midwest cases from so long ago (he's been incarcerated since 1994) that finding the time to talk to him might prove difficult- and that's under the assumption that he wants to talk with the police about it. The investigator from Wisconsin said that it was like pulling teeth to get him to open up about anything, but finally relented after he felt comfortable to one specific investigator. Hope the police at least try to see if he will talk, not just one time and forget about it either.
 
Interesting information. May I ask how it was established that he was in the area during the time the women went missing? If he only had an IQ of 80 and was a disorganized serial killer did he have the ability to abduct three grown women without leaving a trace?

What van did he use? How was that established? That information should be available in motor vehicle records somewhere.

Yes--and is there another indication that he was active in Misouri--and whether he was there that weekend? The US court document indicates that he liked to stalk young girls and woukd act on impulse if he spotted the right victim. However, it seems very unlikely that he would have been trolling for victims in the middle of the night in Soringfield. I've always thought that the girls stopped somewhere--George's? for cigarettes? And that stopped attracted someone's attention.

I would also be interested to know the make, color, year and condition of his van.
 
Yes--and is there another indication that he was active in Misouri--and whether he was there that weekend? The US court document indicates that he liked to stalk young girls and woukd act on impulse if he spotted the right victim. However, it seems very unlikely that he would have been trolling for victims in the middle of the night in Soringfield. I've always thought that the girls stopped somewhere--George's? for cigarettes? And that stopped attracted someone's attention.

I would also be interested to know the make, color, year and condition of his van.

All this guy did was troll for victims, regardless of time of day or location. If I remember correctly from an article I read long ago (I'll post it here if I can locate it) the van was almost identical to the eyewitness account of the van they said they saw.

Quote from Illinois investigator: Krueger and former DCI agent Dick McSherry traveled to Springfield, Ill., in 1995 to learn more from the FBI about Hall and the items seized from his house, vehicles and barn.
They were shown one large storage room "filled with clothes from floor to ceiling — women's clothing, girls' clothing," Krueger said. "It was everything from undergarments to pants to shirts to shoes to purses."
 
All this guy did was troll for victims, regardless of time of day or location. If I remember correctly from an article I read long ago (I'll post it here if I can locate it) the van was almost identical to the eyewitness account of the van they said they saw.

Quote from Illinois investigator: Krueger and former DCI agent Dick McSherry traveled to Springfield, Ill., in 1995 to learn more from the FBI about Hall and the items seized from his house, vehicles and barn.
They were shown one large storage room "filled with clothes from floor to ceiling — women's clothing, girls' clothing," Krueger said. "It was everything from undergarments to pants to shirts to shoes to purses."

Actually I am not sure he had a van like the one suspected in the Springfield case. In 1992 a report says he had a light colored van possibly dodge or ford and it was an early 80s model. I also found in the book that he had 1980 and 1984 vans at his residence. He also had a storage area that was searched. One other note is he kept some of the newsclippings of the two murders he was convicted for, he followed those cases in the news? Are we to believe he only did that with two cases? Did he have anything about the 3 missing women in his possession? That would be a milestone for a serial killer. I would think he would have had something. That was his behavior on the others.
 
My own personal opinion is that if he owned a second generation Dodge van he can be ruled out on that account alone. I am personally of the view that the "porch lady's" account of the van is credible and the reason I believe that is because of information that came to me shortly after the crime that the "porch lady" along with her husband owned or did own a used car lot and she was quite familiar with various vehicles. The second generation van in no way appeared similar to the early Dodge van, which are, even today, somewhat of a collector's item due to the unique layout of the engine inside the van and usability that it affords. The later generation vans are of no interest to anyone that I know of. Plus they were rust buckets.

I doubt seriously this person is a viable suspect, although I would, if I were the police, attempt to question him. Perhaps he is. Anything is possible, I suppose.

Until I see a better suspect, my money is on Cox. Anyone who concocts an extra alibi when he doesn't even need the first one is suspect in my book. Plus he had the ability; especially physical and training to have carried out this crime by himself.

The great unknown, for me at least, is who and what was the business of that white van that roamed the area in the days leading up to the abduction? On that matter I can't reconcile Cox to the crime.

We need a motive.
 
My own personal opinion is that if he owned a second generation Dodge van he can be ruled out on that account alone. I am personally of the view that the "porch lady's" account of the van is credible and the reason I believe that is because of information that came to me shortly after the crime that the "porch lady" along with her husband owned or did own a used car lot and she was quite familiar with various vehicles. The second generation van in no way appeared similar to the early Dodge van, which are, even today, somewhat of a collector's item due to the unique layout of the engine inside the van and usability that it affords. The later generation vans are of no interest to anyone that I know of. Plus they were rust buckets.

I doubt seriously this person is a viable suspect, although I would, if I were the police, attempt to question him. Perhaps he is. Anything is possible, I suppose.

Until I see a better suspect, my money is on Cox. Anyone who concocts an extra alibi when he doesn't even need the first one is suspect in my book. Plus he had the ability; especially physical and training to have carried out this crime by himself.

The great unknown, for me at least, is who and what was the business of that white van that roamed the area in the days leading up to the abduction? On that matter I can't reconcile Cox to the crime.

We need a motive.
Rapist's rape and kill, serial killers have urges to do the things that drive them to kill. A motive or reason is not needed. Drugs and alcohol change people and maybe push a person to act on impulses which they normally would not. If Cox is the suspect, then find where he could get the van? Who were his friends his associates. He was not a heavy drinker or drug user. He liked to gamble. Sometimes triggers are there for people with this kind of impulsive behavior, life changes or circumstances that push them over the edge, what are his?
 
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