Theories #1: What Happened to Jennifer Kesse?

[Myserty64]

Right at the beginning detective (sorry, I have forgotten his rank) Richard Ring stated 'this is as close to a vanishing as I have seen.'

Can anyone supply a link to where LE has stated the phones were powered off at 10:40 pm.

I'm not saying this didn't happen but confirmation from LE would a solid starting point.

 

[marable]

The family certainly deserve to have Jennifer come home.
It is a dreadful tragedy. Just dreadful.

After 11+ years it would be nice if LE could let everyone know if it was a morning or evening abduction.
I'm sure they know but perhaps they are keeping those cards close to their chests because the perpetrator knows the answer.

If it was an evening abduction I believe the case should have been solved years ago. For me there is one suspect for that scenario.

If it was a morning abduction I fear the perpetrator is long gone but then he may have re-entered the country by now.

Going off on a tangent..........................what is the height is the POI in the video?

I am curious as to why you believe if Jennifer was abducted in the evening her case would have been solved years ago? Thanks....

 

[Shin Masamura]

All great points but something I kinda over looked was that the abduction had to o happened at her condo and or parking lot, unless the poi knew here. How would he know to walk back to her place of residence after dropping of the car. Sure he might of had her license but that would be the last place to show up. What if she lived with someone and they didn't know? They had to of known her living status and not just the day of, mind you she was only at her condo the prior day before being on vacation for an extended period of time. I think the dog scent has narrowed it down if it is to be believed.

I just think about the risks involved returning to the scene, leaving the cigarette behind, abducting in broad daylight, or transporting her in daylight. Where could they have abducted without being seen, all in time frame of the morning, a work van in the parking lot? A snatch and grab then moved her car to throw us off ,then be picked up at the condo? Why not pick the POI up on Conroy/Americana? Was there only one person then? Sigh.. Brainstorming done for now...

 

[Shin Masamura]

All great points but something I kinda over looked was that the abduction had to of happened at her condo and or parking lot, unless the poi knew her. How would he know to walk back to her place of residence after dropping of the car. Sure he might of had her license but that would be the last place to show up. What if she lived with someone and they didn't know? They had to of known her living status and not just the day of, mind you she was only at her condo the prior day before being on vacation for an extended period of time. I think the dog scent has narrowed it down if it is to be believed.

I just think about the risks involved returning to the scene, leaving the cigarette behind, abducting in broad daylight, or transporting her in daylight. Where could they have abducted without being seen, all in time frame of the morning, a work van in the parking lot? A snatch and grab then moved her car to throw us off ,then be picked up at the condo? Why not pick the POI up on Conroy/Americana? Was there only one person then? Sigh.. Brainstorming done for now...

 

[Myserty64]

Just my opinion but If it was an evening abduction there must be a very good chance it was an ex.
If not an ex then a person from the workplace who obviously wasn't at work at that time of day.

That equals two suspects which is a lot better than having none or a hundred.

The elephant in the room is the POI. The POI causes problems with any of my guesses except the one that has a worker being the perpetrator.
<modsnip>
Why was it there?

 

[Rust Cohle]

I'm of the belief Jen's disappearance is much simpler than it appears. The overwhelming majority of crimes are committed by a person known to the victim. I believe Jen was confronted by someone in the morning whom she had a relationship with, or at least this person thought it was a relationship and the confrontation escalated. He then panicked for the greater part of the morning, he was in a position that allowed him the privilege of knowing when her family or friends became aware she was missing, this would explain the timing of her car being parked only hours before family arrives at her condo and within the hour of her family becoming aware of her being missing. This leaves the POI being either Mosaic staff or a work colleague. The car being park at the Greens was about location, and timing. The car needed to be offloaded before family arrived, but he also needed to get his transportation which was close by, possibly still at the Mosaic.

The car being parked at the Greens in broad daylight, at noon IMO says the POI was desperate, this was unplanned and the risk of doing so is far less than leaving her car where it may be, or being caught with her car. That tells me either her car was somewhere that ties this person to the crime or his vehicle was left somewhere that ties him to the crime and he needs his car asap before it is recognized.

 

[scadagirl28]

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ennifer-Kesse-24-Orlando-24-Jan-2006-1/page12 If you go to 13 juror post #175 you can see where Travis called Jennifer. She tells him he has messages. I am going both phones were powered off together jmo

 

[Rust Cohle]

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ennifer-Kesse-24-Orlando-24-Jan-2006-1/page12 If you go to 13 juror post #175 you can see where Travis called Jennifer. She tells him he has messages. I am going both phones were powered off together jmo

To me, powering off both phones (if they were even really powered off) simply means she wanted sleep, especially if the other phone had missed calls. I think I had a Palm Treo in 06', I would power it off at night too

 

[Harmony 2]

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[Truth Prevails]

All great points but something I kinda over looked was that the abduction had to of happened at her condo and or parking lot, unless the poi knew her. How would he know to walk back to her place of residence after dropping of the car. Sure he might of had her license but that would be the last place to show up. What if she lived with someone and they didn't know? They had to of known her living status and not just the day of, mind you she was only at her condo the prior day before being on vacation for an extended period of time. I think the dog scent has narrowed it down if it is to be believed.

Or, say a stalker. Maybe someone from her gym, or a pub she went to often. Someone who felt she had rejected him, but in reality she hardly knew he existed. Those kind of people will stalk, and stalk, and stalk, until they know a lot about the person. Where she lived wouldn't have been a problem. I just mention this because it seems planned-out to me, not a random crime of passion, but you are right, the perpetrator had to have at least known where Jenn lived.

I just think about the risks involved returning to the scene, leaving the cigarette behind, abducting in broad daylight, or transporting her in daylight. Where could they have abducted without being seen, all in time frame of the morning, a work van in the parking lot? A snatch and grab then moved her car to throw us off ,then be picked up at the condo? Why not pick the POI up on Conroy/Americana? Was there only one person then? Sigh.. Brainstorming done for now...

BBM - this is knew to me. I hadn't heard it before. If they have a cigarette butt from the perpetrator and/or the POI (if they are two different people), LE has his DNA.

Something I noted from reading Jenn's guest book--a member of the Kesse family said that every Tuesday morning at 7:30 AM--regular as clockwork--five lawn care workers arrived at the building Jenn lived in to do grounds maintenance. Jenn should have been leaving around that time. So, if they didn't see her come out--either all five are lying, or the odds are high that she did not come out on the morning of the 24th. Maybe abducted in the hallway after locking her condo door, but not turning on her alarm? Pulled into the empty, unlocked condo right across the hall? (Others than the workers could have been aware of that unit.)

I don't know--but I kind of think careful, deliberate, and planned; rather than a snatch and grab.

 

[Truth Prevails]

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ennifer-Kesse-24-Orlando-24-Jan-2006-1/page12 If you go to 13 juror post #175 you can see where Travis called Jennifer. She tells him he has messages. I am going both phones were powered off together jmo

BBM - Something else I had never been aware of.

Plus the ping just before the phones went off. I think I have read that Mr. Kesse mentioned both events--the powering off/going dead and the ping, with times--on Jenn's guest book. I'm slowly plodding my way through it--but if I ever come across this info from Mr. Kesse, I'll link the page here. (I think we are allowed to link the guest book?)

If I can confirm this information came from Mr. Kesse, then I personally will find it very hard to overlook.

 

[marable]

BBM - Something else I had never been aware of.

Plus the ping just before the phones went off. I think I have read that Mr. Kesse mentioned both events--the powering off/going dead and the ping, with times--on Jenn's guest book. I'm slowly plodding my way through it--but if I ever come across this info from Mr. Kesse, I'll link the page here. (I think we are allowed to link the guest book?)

If I can confirm this information came from Mr. Kesse, then I personally will find it very hard to overlook.

Drew referenced the phones pinging and the power source removed, presumably batteries 2/15, 2/27/15, 3/14/15.....I believe there were other times as well on the guestbook....Also, referenced in interviews that I have listened to , ie, perhaps Toc Doc, Nancy Grace, Jane Velasques Mitchell....

 

[Truth Prevails]

Drew referenced the phones pinging and the power source removed, presumably batteries 2/15, 2/27/15, 3/14/15.....I believe there were other times as well on the guestbook....Also, referenced in interviews that I have listened to , ie, perhaps Toc Doc, Nancy Grace, Jane Velasques Mitchell....

Thanks very much for this, marable.

One thing that just confuses the heck out of me then is it looks like at least Mr. Kesse may consider that Jenn did go out on the evening of the 23rd. So, I wonder if he believes she went out and did whatever on the evening of the 23rd; came home; went to bed; got up and prepared for work; walked out her condo door on the morning of the 24th; and seemingly disappeared?

I admit of all the theories I have considered for this case, that isn't one of them.

 

[Myserty64]

RE The phones being powered off at 10:40pm in the evening:

Where did Mr Kesse get the information regarding the phones being powered off?


I would have thought that is exactly the kind of information LE would keep to themselves.
From dozens of investigations I have seen the investigating detectives give out very little. Not to family, loved ones, friends, not anybody.

So, the question is, how did the powering off of the phones, at 10:40 pm get into the public domain.
Especially since both of those phones are missing.

 

[marable]

RE The phones being powered off at 10:40pm in the evening:

Where did Mr Kesse get the information regarding the phones being powered off?


I would have thought that is exactly the kind of information LE would keep to themselves.
From dozens of investigations I have seen the investigating detectives give out very little. Not to family, loved ones, friends, not anybody.

So, the question is, how did the powering off of the phones, at 10:40 pm get into the public domain.
Especially since both of those phones are missing.

<modsnip>

If you will notice in Drew's interivews, he keeps mentioning that their love for Jennifer is unconditional, <modsnip> Jennifer left her condo Monday night after talking to Rob to meet someone which the Kesse's were adamant that she would not do? They stated it was Jennifers habit once home was in for the evening....

Another thing, Drew often states something to the effect , "we just need that one person with that one piece of information", to do what? Bring Jennifer home, make an arrest?

 

[The_James_Champ]

Another thing, Drew often states something to the effect , "we just need that one person with that one piece of information", to do what? Bring Jennifer home, make an arrest?

I think either or. I would highly doubt at this point that she's alive. Though it would be great if she was, but that one piece of info is likely an actual person of interest, a confession, a body, etc.

This case sucks. I feel for her family.

 

[Truth Prevails]

<modsnip>

If you will notice in Drew's interivews, he keeps mentioning that their love for Jennifer is unconditional, did <modsnip> Jennifer left her condo Monday night after talking to Rob to meet someone which the Kesse's were adamant that she would not do? They stated it was Jennifers habit once home was in for the evening....

Another thing, Drew often states something to the effect , "we just need that one person with that one piece of information", to do what? Bring Jennifer home, make an arrest?

BBM - When I hear him make that statement, I always think he could mean that they (maybe meaning LE & the family together) have the time line and at least circumstantial evidence to back it up. Maybe they even have a strong suspect that they won't reveal, and with physical proof that Jenn has passed, or even the right statement offering enough circumstantial evidence, arrests can be made.

Probably wishful thinking on my part.

I think either or. I would highly doubt at this point that she's alive. Though it would be great if she was, but that one piece of info is likely an actual person of interest, a confession, a body, etc.

This case sucks. I feel for her family.

I so agree. Everything about this case is heartbreaking.

 

[Rust Cohle]

There is no evidence to suggest Jen left her condo that night.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

 

[kemo]

It is frustrating that LE has not disclosed when the phones shut down and any known ping information. If they were both shut down at the same time, in all probability it was done as part of the abduction. If they were both shut down at 10:40 Monday night it would pretty much prove a PM abduction and it would change a lot of my assumptions about this case.

 

[rd_jfc]

RE The phones being powered off at 10:40pm in the evening:

Where did Mr Kesse get the information regarding the phones being powered off?


I would have thought that is exactly the kind of information LE would keep to themselves.
From dozens of investigations I have seen the investigating detectives give out very little. Not to family, loved ones, friends, not anybody.

So, the question is, how did the powering off of the phones, at 10:40 pm get into the public domain.
Especially since both of those phones are missing.

I can add only an opinion to this. The specific wording that Drew used in Guestbook post ( one of the ones cited above) he carefully used same phrasing he was given, and that is clearly phrasing based on a telco analysis of the tower site logs, probably conveyed via LE to him.

The "how can phone be in two places at once" in my opinion is an LE statement to him based on the telco analysis given to them, i.e. tower ping locations and times, where two towers are pinged by same phone close together in time but then ping reverts back to one of the two towers, as tower 1, tower 2, tower 1 in less time than you could drive to tower 2 promimity and back to tower 1. I have commented that my research back on other cases showed that it is known this is possible, a phone can be in range of more than one tower and can connect to another one and back, especially if signal is disrupted by something in between while moving and then signal from closer tower is seen again. I would say my research back then is appropriate for this January 2006 behavior, but I haven't followed changes in technology if any since then and don't know how different it may be now.

It is also the case as I have commented before that a cell phone sitting in the home could likewise communicate with more than one tower if they are within range, it is more likely when moving that a change would occur.

This is also just my opinion based on a few quotes from Drew and my cumulative research on cell tower call and ping handling through the years on various cases. As always we all welcome any additional technical insight into Jennifer's case which IIRC we got after a similar post in another thread awhile back.

Edited to add that while I can understand the reason for details not given, obviously things like the locations of the towers involved and specific times of pings involved, in other words, the details in the logs the carrier telcos had to analyze would take a lot of guesswork out of this.