TN TN - Kathy Jones, 12, Nashville, 29 Nov 1969 #1

[December]

An article about a few snags during racial integration from 1968
I do not feel it has any relevance to this thread ... it's just Roller Drome trivia I came across in old newspapers
And it does tell us there was an eating facility there too

yes, this is very helpful to reveal the eating facility. i just wasn't sure about that as no one talks about eating there. but, apparently, it was possible.

maybe she was going to split her $1 between RD and KK?

 

[December]

I came across the lawsuit awhile back and for about five minutes considered the possibility of a racially motivated crime. Had the murder occurred prior to the suit when tension was high, I might have given it a little more thought. But afterward, nah, and none of the facts we know support the notion in any way. It is of interest, however, because it adds to the backdrop, and as you said, confirms that refreshments were served.

Here's the link, btw.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=pOVfAAAAIBAJ&sjid=HAMGAAAAIBAJ&pg=6702,2360891

i ran into all of that stuff as well...

but, i will say, at the time this occurred the woodbine area was mostly white.

 

[Arnie M]

I came across the lawsuit awhile back and for about five minutes considered the possibility of a racially motivated crime. Had the murder occurred prior to the suit when tension was high, I might have given it a little more thought. But afterward, nah, and none of the facts we know support the notion in any way. It is of interest, however, because it adds to the backdrop, and as you said, confirms that refreshments were served.

Here's the link, btw.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=pOVfAAAAIBAJ&sjid=HAMGAAAAIBAJ&pg=6702,2360891

Makes me wonder about Jerome Sidney Barrett .... who Killed 9 year old Marcia Trimble in 1975 in the Green Hills area , not far from the Roller Drome .... he has a history of assaults on women and girls ..... has he been eliminated as a suspect regarding Kathy J ????

 

[December]

Makes me wonder about Jerome Sidney Barrett .... who Killed 9 year old Marcia Trimble in 1975 in the Green Hills area , not far from the Roller Drome .... he has a history of assaults on women and girls ..... has he been eliminated as a suspect regarding Kathy J ????

it's not that close, really... but, he is from mMemphis so maybe it would be to him.
but, i believe he has been cleared.

the style of the murders was really different though the victims were similar in some ways.

 

[Arnie M]

Probably cleared .... Going by this report Barrett was in Memphis around 1969

-Jerome Sidney Barrett was investigated in a homicide in 1967 (in Memphis)

-In January of 1973, he was arrested for attempted rape and a stabbing. In fact, the report reads Barrett was running and had blood on his hands and blood on his face and mouth". (in Memphis)

-In 1974, Barrett was convicted of carnal knowledge and assault with intent to rape. He served his time in the old Tennessee prison and then got out a year and a half later on parole. (Then, Barrett moved to Nashville.)

http://www.newschannel5.com/Global/story.asp?S=8441550

 

[bessie]

That is so great that you have spoken with the detective, he is reading the file, and that there WAS an autopsy!

I wanted to go ahead and post this as I have been looking through old newspapers on ancestry. I can't link, because it is the paid subscription, but will see if I can take a screenshot of the photo of the articles if needed. I was looking for any earlier articles, but the closest I could get was the 3rd and 4th of Dec. Here are just a few paraphrased quotes I wanted to note here (from the Kingsport Times) for the timeline/location.
Dec 3:
*she was found shortly after NOON tuesday
*two strips of the lining of her jacket were used to tie her hands behind her back
*the rest of her clothes were at her feet
*articles were missing from her purse
*foreign particles were on her coat
*woman next door to lot burned trash on Tuesday morning FIFTEEN feet from where Kathy was found. Did not see her (because of tall weeds??)

Dec 4th:
*apparently tortured with a 'razor sharp instrument'
*search started when she failed to call her mother to pick her up from AWRD
*ME says she was sexually assaulted at LEAST 24 hours before her death on Monday

Some of this in new info (to me), so just wanted to include it.
Will see if I can get shots uploaded to Photobucket.

Great find, MrsT! :thumb:

New facts!!

• articles were missing from her purse
• foreign particles were on her coat
• woman next door to lot burned trash on Tuesday morning FIFTEEN feet from where Kathy was found. Did not see her (because of tall weeds??)
• ME says she was sexually assaulted at LEAST 24 hours before her death on Monday

We knew the purse was opened, because the playing cards and Bible were on the ground. Small objects could have been lost in the weeds, like a house key, for instance, or coins. Or, as has been mentioned, a souvenir was taken by the killer. Besides the usual objects like wallet, comb, etc, I wonder what else she might've carried that her mother would have been aware was missing.

"Particles on the coat" is very interesting. Now I'll drive myself bats wondering what they were, and could they be of any use now.

Sexual assault "at least" 24 hours prior to death suggests she wasn't held captive and repeatedly raped for 36-40 hours, thank goodness! But it could mean she lay dying in the weeds during that interval, instead. Or, TOD is off and she died earlier than Monday, which I still think is a possibility.

Between the cold temperatures and the tall, thick weeds, it's not too surprising that K's body remained concealed from the neighbor with no strong odor or unusual presence of insects and animals to attract her attention. Apparently, there were no tire tracks or other obvious signs of activity at the site, either. JMO

 

[MrsTigglesworth]

Here is the link to the uploaded pictures of the articles. It should work. I also uploaded one from the second of December about Glenda being missing. Click on library and you can see all three.
http://s1317.photobucket.com/user/Mrstigg/media/image_zpsddc53faa.jpg.html

 

[nerosleuth]

Something I've been meaning to mention, the AWRD building was large, at least two stories. In addition to the skating rink, the owner also ran an insulation business at the same location.

I read somewhere that the second floor was used for baton twirling classes, too.

The baton twirling classes caught my attention.

Lessons that are taught to youths outside of the school, such as roller skating, swimming, baton twirling, cheerleading, and gymnastics would attract a pedo.

 

[nola]

Just catching up with the posts from this weekend --

Great info MrsT!
Interesting that December was able to confirm that the lot was searched prior to Tuesday -wonder what day? -- def a smaller window for the perp to place Kathy in this location.

The neighbor (burning trash 15 feet away) was so close to Kathy and didn't see her -- those weeds had to have been tall and thick. As a child we had a similar lot across the street; we could build 'forts' within those weeds and NO ONE ever knew we were there. We had to really stomp repeatedly to get our weeds to stay down.

The burning trash next door would have covered any smells of decomposition if had been there more than a day.
And now I'm wonder if these 'particles' could have actually have been debris floating in the air and landing on Kathy's body from the fire 15 feet away...?

 

[December]

I have considered the particles are from the lot or fire or who knows.I have to go sorry... but, this is the first I've heard of particles for what that is worth.
i

 

[Betty P]

Here is the link to the uploaded pictures of the articles. It should work. I also uploaded one from the second of December about Glenda being missing. Click on library and you can see all three.
http://s1317.photobucket.com/user/Mrstigg/media/image_zpsddc53faa.jpg.html

Thanks! I noticed that the last article quoted the woman living next to the lot saying her dogs usually bark if someone is near the yard, but that she was out of the house most of the day on Sunday.

OT, this may have been answered before, so forgive me, but was the Rollerdrome open on Sunday or Monday? Were there any maintenance or security people who stayed there overnight when it was closed? The police probably interviewed them if there were any.

 

[Betty P]

I have considered the particles are from the lot or fire or who knows.I have to go sorry... but, this is the first I've heard of particles for what that is worth.
i

Agree, that was one of my daily chores when I was a kid - taking the trash to the barrel out back and burning it. If there were large pieces of cardboard, etc. the ashes would fly around, especially if the fire has to be "poked" to keep the flames going until everything is burned.

 

[Backwoods]

It seems to me that if the "foreign particles" were from the weedy lot or the fire, they wouldn't be limited to her coat (and maybe they weren't, but the article does specify "coat").

Of course, if the original attack/struggle were IN the lot, I guess more-than-elsewhere seeds/debris etc. might have gotten on and adhered to the coat during that ... but still.

Of course, I'm wondering about carpet fibers, insulation, pet hair, etc. from another location where Kathy might have first been attacked and/or possibly held for a time.

I also wonder whether there was any blood on the coat, possibly indicating that the coat could have been laid down (in a car trunk, for example, or somewhere else there may have been "foreign particles" to adhere)) to avoid blood-staining the surface and then Kathy placed on the coat -- if she was transported from somewhere else

 

[December]

I think the police would have taken into account anything flying about from burning trash since they knew what that woman had done. Now, whether the 'foreign particles' are important to the police or only the newspaper, we do not know.

if they are not important to the police, then i would take that to mean that they can be explained by something in that lot that would have occurred to anything in the lot (stuff from weeds, stuff from burning trash, bird poop, whatever). but, if they are important to the police (which i have no idea on that), then that would indicate to me that there is nothing easily explainable... it is part of the crime, not something that happened just because the coat was in the lot.

anyway, there is proof people went into the lot before the tuesday afternoon search and did not see her or her things. i believe searchers went in as well (this is my strong belief) before tuesday.

now, why did no one see her? maybe the weeds... maybe a different reason.

the searchers, i really think, were looking for a living girl. so, there's that. but, people going into the lot and not seeing her? idk? the lot is not that big.

 

[December]

It seems to me that if the "foreign particles" were from the weedy lot or the fire, they wouldn't be limited to her coat (and maybe they weren't, but the article does specify "coat").

Of course, if the original attack/struggle were IN the lot, I guess more-than-elsewhere seeds/debris etc. might have gotten on and adhered to the coat during that ... but still.

Of course, I'm wondering about carpet fibers, insulation, pet hair, etc. from another location where Kathy might have first been attacked and/or possibly held for a time.

I also wonder whether there was any blood on the coat, possibly indicating that the coat could have been laid down (in a car trunk, for example, or somewhere else there may have been "foreign particles" to adhere)) to avoid blood-staining the surface and then Kathy placed on the coat -- if she was transported from somewhere else

i think at the very least she may have been in a vehicle for a while. she may have still been wearing her coat then and perhaps pushed onto the floor. i mean, this is speculation. but, that would be a simple way to get foreign particles on her coat.

insulation is interesting since that relates to another business in the roller drome building. was she pulled away from skating into another room at some point?

 

[December]

Thanks! I noticed that the last article quoted the woman living next to the lot saying her dogs usually bark if someone is near the yard, but that she was out of the house most of the day on Sunday.

OT, this may have been answered before, so forgive me, but was the Rollerdrome open on Sunday or Monday? Were there any maintenance or security people who stayed there overnight when it was closed? The police probably interviewed them if there were any.

i believe it'd be open on monday. but idk about sunday... maybe since it was a recreational type of thing.

also, on monday the insulation business would start back up. it might have been closed for the holiday.

then, perhaps, there would be the baton twirling classes. i wonder if the girls from those classes had prepared for any parades? there would be parades that time of year and the baton girls might have done extra practices to prepare or come to the classroom to get ready. (speculation.)

idk if there would be anyone there 24/7 since there wasn't much to steal from the place...

 

[December]

Agree, that was one of my daily chores when I was a kid - taking the trash to the barrel out back and burning it. If there were large pieces of cardboard, etc. the ashes would fly around, especially if the fire has to be "poked" to keep the flames going until everything is burned.

the thing that mystifies me about the burning trash, apart from poor Kathy probably only a few feet away, is if the lot had so many weeds and other growth that it could conceal a girl and all her possessions (hypothetically) is this really the place to burn trash? i mean... what? everyone i have ever seen burn trash picked a cleared off place. it is a thousand wonders they didn't set the whole lot on fire.

btw, the wind was pretty calm that day which probably did keep the fire department from having to spray down half the block. it also may have prevented too much trash from getting all over my cousin.

they have trash pick up in Nashville, so i hope someone cited this neighbor for practically setting woodbine on fire.

eta
i am afraid of fire. so people blithely burning trash in the most flammable place they could find is freaking me out. i guess i should remember she did not actually set anything on fire.. as far as we know.. there were firefighters around that afternoon..hmmmmmmm

so what do you think?
no one ever has mentioned a fire barrel, so i assume they just dropped it on the ground among a bunch of dry weeds. it really is the dumbest thing i have heard outside of the idiot who built a fire under his sink to thaw out his pipes (yes, he set half an apartment complex on fire).

i am not getting onto you. i just cannot believe this woman beside the lot.

maybe a murder could take place in her living room and she wouldn't notice?

which... what was she burning? that couldn't go with regular trash pick up? i wonder?

 

[December]

Thanks! I noticed that the last article quoted the woman living next to the lot saying her dogs usually bark if someone is near the yard, but that she was out of the house most of the day on Sunday.

OT, this may have been answered before, so forgive me, but was the Rollerdrome open on Sunday or Monday? Were there any maintenance or security people who stayed there overnight when it was closed? The police probably interviewed them if there were any.

i wonder if this woman owned the lot?

it doesn't sound like it... but, her dogs must have thought so.

i wonder if these dogs just ran around the neighborhood. if she was gone sunday maybe they visited dog friends.

 

[bessie]

the thing that mystifies me about the burning trash, apart from poor Kathy probably only a few feet away, is if the lot had so many weeds and other growth that it could conceal a girl and all her possessions (hypothetically) is this really the place to burn trash? i mean... what? everyone i have ever seen burn trash picked a cleared off place. it is a thousand wonders they didn't set the whole lot on fire.

btw, the wind was pretty calm that day which probably did keep the fire department from having to spray down half the block. it also may have prevented too much trash from getting all over my cousin.

they have trash pick up in Nashville, so i hope someone cited this neighbor for practically setting woodbine on fire.

eta
i am afraid of fire. so people blithely burning trash in the most flammable place they could find is freaking me out. i guess i should remember she did not actually set anything on fire.. as far as we know.. there were firefighters around that afternoon..hmmmmmmm

so what do you think?
no one ever has mentioned a fire barrel, so i assume they just dropped it on the ground among a bunch of dry weeds. it really is the dumbest thing i have heard outside of the idiot who built a fire under his sink to thaw out his pipes (yes, he set half an apartment complex on fire).

i am not getting onto you. i just cannot believe this woman beside the lot.

maybe a murder could take place in her living room and she wouldn't notice?

which... what was she burning? that couldn't go with regular trash pick up? i wonder?

The very last sentence of the article says the neighbor burned trash in a barrel, and it doesn't say the barrel was in the lot. It might have been in her backyard.

...when she went to burn trash in a barrel fifteen feet away.

http://s1317.photobucket.com/user/Mrstigg/media/image_zpsddc53faa.jpg.html

 

[December]

The very last sentence of the article says the neighbor burned trash in a barrel, and it doesn't say the barrel was in the lot. It might have been in her backyard. http://s1317.photobucket.com/user/Mrstigg/media/image_zpsddc53faa.jpg.html

oh o.k.I am wrong I
iam having issues again
sorry