Found Safe TN - Mary Catherine Elizabeth Thomas, 15, Maury County, 13 March 2017 #11

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bluesneakers said:
It's sad and a bit surprising to see the twists and turns a person will take, and the amount of work someone can put in to insist ET is not a victim. Why would anyone be so dedicated to convincing others she hasn't been harmed?
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I don't know. I'm just grateful that the law recognizes that when a fully grown man entices, coerces or manipulates a teen into "running off" with him, so that the man can rape and assault the minor, or allow others to do so, whether by luring him or her through the internet to meet, encouraging a sad, confused kid from a dysfunctional home to run away, or grooming the child for months by abusing their position of power or trust, the child is a victim.

Period.
 
If they put themselves in an area where there are a lot of broken Jeeps, and he knows how to fix them-usually in those back areas Jeep repairs are expensive.

Pure speculation,but possibly a good money maker. Craigslist is full of ads asking for cheaper vehicle repairs.

On a side note. You would be amazed at the number of people out there who watch no TV, no news, use facebook minimally and have no clue this story is even happening. I'd say the more rural you get, the less is spoken of this. I try to work this story into conversations if I can.
 
To those asserting that Elizabeth should be held responsible for "her" actions, keep in mind that at this point we have little evidence of how complicit she is in running away. Yes, we know that she seemed to be in love with Tad Cummins, but do we have any evidence of her state of mind at the moment? No. He could be threatening her, she could be looking for a way out, etc. We simply don't know, and writing missives about where responsibility should land helps us how?
 
Kakidoll said:
Not a troll, in fact i'm very much pro LE and take a VERY hard stance on criminal activity. HOWEVER, many of you would think i'm victim blaming in this case, altho I do not see it that way. I do however not think this type of kidnapping is on the same level as a 3 yr old being taken by a stranger from their front yard and sexually molested/murdered. BIG difference in my opinion.
At what age is a 'child' going to be held responsible for their own actions? 10? 12? 15? 18? 21? If your 13 yr old neighbor murdered your 9 year old, does he get a pass because his parents are horrible people? If a 16 yr old is stealing alcohol from the neighborhood store and drinking it with friends on weekends, is she 'allowed' because her parents are drunks, so its not her fault? LE is starting to charge 13 yr olds as adults in some criminal cases. BIG hot topic there. The stupid viral ' I cashyou ousside, how bat da' teen....... Not responsible for her attitude because?????

Where is the line drawn? If 15 is not responsible AT ALL for their actions, then they should never be out of their parents sight. No school dances, no jobs, no dating, etc. They are not mature enough to know right from wrong?

Then it can be stretched further. Girls mature more quickly than boys. So a girl is responsible enough at 21 to make decisions, but males have to wait til they are 25 to do anything without permission? Who judges when they are ready?

Yes, i'm going to extremes. I'm not trying to change anyones mind on ET. TC most definitely is WRONG, and CRIMINAL because he acted on a situation he should have NEVER even put himself into. ET was told not to do things, she did them anyway. Why, BECAUSE SHE IS 15. and 15 year olds think they know as much as adults. Its only when you are older that you can look back at yourself and say... WHAT THE HELL WAS I THINKING.

She has had a very rough life and most likely WAS looking for ANYTHING she could grasp onto. I think he sucked her in with the religious aspect, taking her to church with them... BAD MOVE. But it looked ok at the time because his wife was there, he took others, maybe there were friends of hers at that church, WE DON"T KNOW.

They need to be found, she needs MASSIVE amounts of therapy, support and a MUCH more stable environment, and i'm going to go out on a limb and say she needs it AWAY from family. She was unhappy, even in her dads house, and no one noticed this going on thru her SM.... so either it wasn't being supervised, or it didn't jump out to anyone in particular that this girl was headed down a dangerous road. She could have just run away and been a statistic on the streets somewhere. Then we wouldn't be talking about her as much.... and i'm glad it DIDN"T happen that way, because there is a MUCH better chance of finding her now.

This is not black and white. Its shades and shades and shades and until she if found and HER mindset known, its going to be hard to help her.

Its not about him at this point. He'll end up in jail, as he should. HE should have known better, even if he THINKS he had good intentions at one time. HE CAN be blamed for this and SHOULD take the responsibility for ALL of it. And again, when caught, i'll be very curious if he 'mans up' (which i doubt) and admits he knew better and to blame him.

Ok, flame away...... But please, lay it out for me about WHO/WHEN we can decide how to determine responsibility age.
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Wellp, here's one for your holster. Yes, if a minor commits a crime you, the adult parent, can be held responsible. Just an FYI and why it's best that yes we do watch our children. And there's a rather wide ocean between a sadistic 13yr old who kills because it's fun being charged as an adult for the safety of the public and a 15yr who has been groomed and manipulated by a 50 year old sexual predator and is only presenting a danger to herself. Your examples point to teen criminals, but what we all agree on is that TC is the criminal here, I know you don't mean to infer ET is in any way a criminal.
 
policyoftruth501 said:
They can easily stretch that money a long ways if they live in the car and/or squat at vacant houses or cabins. I live not far from an extremely popular resort town outside of Little Rock (Hot Springs) and the lake there is absolutely covered with thousands of houses, condos, and apartments that are only lived in during the summer - and then mostly just on the weekends. I'm sure there are plenty of places like that all over the country.


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Yes, exactly! About 8 or 10 threads ago, I mentioned those two prison escapees in New York who broke into a cabin and hid out for around 3 weeks, with a large number of LEO on their tails. IIRC, some also had tracking dogs with them. This would be an almost ideal way to escape notice.

They could rent a cabin legitimately as well, or a series of cabins. Or they could camp at beach locations that allow overnight camping. There are many of those, too.

#ohtheplaces

Where are they? If they went southwest, they could have stopped in Texas for a bit - talk about wide open spaces - then headed down to New Mexico and Arizona - checking out Carlsbad Caverns? The Grand Canyon? Maybe even the beautiful national parks in southern Utah? And then into California for some beach camping.
 
Amber Alert: Search continues for missing teen, teacher from TN

NASHVILLE, TN (WSMV) -
The focus of the search for 15-year-old Elizabeth Thomas and her former teacher has shifted after the TBI confirmed both were spotted in Oklahoma City on March 15.
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Officials said they have been in contact with authorities in Mexico and Central America but have no specific information that the pair has crossed the border. District Attorney Brent Cooper said Cummins is well versed in the Bible and could be posing as a missionary.
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Because of the relatively low number of tips, agents believe Cummins has hidden Thomas away from the general public. The TBI is encouraging property owners, especially those in rural areas, to search their grounds for Thomas and Cummins, the Nissan Rogue or any suspicious activity.

The TBI is also urging officials at campgrounds, parks or any other isolated areas to remain on alert. They are also asking for people to search large parking lots or garages for Cummins' car.
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Amber Alert: Search continues for missing teen, teacher from TN
 
KKearns said:
Ummm.. I don't know if this has a diagnosis code but it isn't bunk. You also see the same behavior with cult members. It is very much part of brainwashing.

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“The Stockholm syndrome is known by other names such as trauma bonding or terror bonding; however, this syndrome is not frequently seen in hostage scenarios, and its diagnostic criteria are not listed in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-V).”

Source: Namnyak, M.; Tufton, N.; Szekely, R.; Toal, M.; Worboys, S.; Sampson, E. L. (2007). “‘Stockholm syndrome’: Psychiatric diagnosis or urban myth?”. Acta Psychiatrica Scandinavica 117 (1): 4–11.
 
Did ET have a twitter account as well?
 
Looking at the map of the locations in which they were spotted, another possibility is that they went southeast from OK, and are somewhere along the beaches along the Gulf of Mexico. This would make sense from a climate perspective.
 
Kapua said:
TC took out a loan and had a minimum of $4500 with him when they left 3 weeks ago. That is the amount of the loan he took out on one of his vehicles. IMHO, they still have enough money to get for by for a few months, if they are careful with it. Also, he may have more than the $4500, but that has not been made public. Did he drain their bank accounts, pawn or sell some valuables? We don't know.
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We also forget that ET had a job. Now, I don't think she was "rolling in dough" working at Chick-Fil-A but she could have easily saved up a couple thousand dollars over the last few months. I know I saw somewhere the family said she left behind a paycheck but I have no doubt that TC had ET being more money along. I also believe he had more money than the $4,500 saved up for this. I would bet they have around $10,000 (give or take).


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I agree that children do need to be responsible for their actions to a point, BUT..... if we put the shoe on the other foot, if all of this was ET's idea and she expected TC to leave everything behind to "run away" with him I highly doubt he would have, because that isn't how "NORMAL" 50 year-old behaves. But how many times has a 15 year-old made silly choices, many times, BECAUSE they are still children!
 
TC and ET together stick out more than either one of them going into a store alone. I wonder if TC thinks he has to keep ET "with him"? It would be interesting to know if ET and TC separated at all in the OK City Walmart.

If TC doesn't trust ET to be much out of arm's reach he's kind of limited in where he can go and what he can do.
 
Kakidoll said:
Not a troll, in fact i'm very much pro LE and take a VERY hard stance on criminal activity. HOWEVER, many of you would think i'm victim blaming in this case, altho I do not see it that way. I do however not think this type of kidnapping is on the same level as a 3 yr old being taken by a stranger from their front yard and sexually molested/murdered. BIG difference in my opinion.
At what age is a 'child' going to be held responsible for their own actions? 10? 12? 15? 18? 21? If your 13 yr old neighbor murdered your 9 year old, does he get a pass because his parents are horrible people? If a 16 yr old is stealing alcohol from the neighborhood store and drinking it with friends on weekends, is she 'allowed' because her parents are drunks, so its not her fault? LE is starting to charge 13 yr olds as adults in some criminal cases. BIG hot topic there. The stupid viral ' I cashyou ousside, how bat da' teen....... Not responsible for her attitude because?????

Where is the line drawn? If 15 is not responsible AT ALL for their actions, then they should never be out of their parents sight. No school dances, no jobs, no dating, etc. They are not mature enough to know right from wrong?

Then it can be stretched further. Girls mature more quickly than boys. So a girl is responsible enough at 21 to make decisions, but males have to wait til they are 25 to do anything without permission? Who judges when they are ready?

Yes, i'm going to extremes. I'm not trying to change anyones mind on ET. TC most definitely is WRONG, and CRIMINAL because he acted on a situation he should have NEVER even put himself into. ET was told not to do things, she did them anyway. Why, BECAUSE SHE IS 15. and 15 year olds think they know as much as adults. Its only when you are older that you can look back at yourself and say... WHAT THE HELL WAS I THINKING.

She has had a very rough life and most likely WAS looking for ANYTHING she could grasp onto. I think he sucked her in with the religious aspect, taking her to church with them... BAD MOVE. But it looked ok at the time because his wife was there, he took others, maybe there were friends of hers at that church, WE DON"T KNOW.

They need to be found, she needs MASSIVE amounts of therapy, support and a MUCH more stable environment, and i'm going to go out on a limb and say she needs it AWAY from family. She was unhappy, even in her dads house, and no one noticed this going on thru her SM.... so either it wasn't being supervised, or it didn't jump out to anyone in particular that this girl was headed down a dangerous road. She could have just run away and been a statistic on the streets somewhere. Then we wouldn't be talking about her as much.... and i'm glad it DIDN"T happen that way, because there is a MUCH better chance of finding her now.

This is not black and white. Its shades and shades and shades and until she if found and HER mindset known, its going to be hard to help her.

Its not about him at this point. He'll end up in jail, as he should. HE should have known better, even if he THINKS he had good intentions at one time. HE CAN be blamed for this and SHOULD take the responsibility for ALL of it. And again, when caught, i'll be very curious if he 'mans up' (which i doubt) and admits he knew better and to blame him.

Ok, flame away...... But please, lay it out for me about WHO/WHEN we can decide how to determine responsibility age.
Click to expand...

While the legal age is 18 I can share with you that I found out I was pregnant 1 week before my 16th birthday. I was responsible for taking care of another life by the time I was 16. Now, on the flip side of that when I went to court to get custody/visitation established with my then ex-boyfriend my mother had to go with me because I was underage (all the court papers said "in care of" and had my mothers name on them). It's a strange way the law works in that manner.


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KKearns said:
Ummm.. I don't know if this has a diagnosis code but it isn't bunk. You also see the same behavior with cult members. It is very much part of brainwashing.

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Stockholm Syndrome is just a descriptive phrase that details how a captive can become identified with their captor. It doesn't have to be a diagnosis code to be a valid human behavior. Jealousy, for example, is not a diagnosis code but it is a valid human behavior. That's a simplistic analogy. I;m sure others could come up with more apt ones. But Stockholm Syndrome is really probably just a descriptor of behaviors that fall under a disassociative disorder. https://www.discussingdissociation.com/2009/11/attachment-to-the-perpetrator/

Where are our psych experts?

In any event, in this case I think the term traumatic bonding, a theory that explains why abused kids (and adults) bond to their abuser, probably applies well:


Trauma bonding, a term developed by Patrick Carnes, is the misuse of fear, excitement, sexual feelings, and sexual physiology to entangle another person. Many primary aggressors tend toward extreme behavior and risk taking, and trauma bonding is a factor in their relationships.Strangely, growing up in an unsafe home makes later unsafe situations have more holding power. This has a biological basis beyond any cognitive learning. It is trauma in one's history that makes for trauma bonding. Because trauma (and developmental trauma or early relational trauma is epidemic) cause numbing around many aspects of intimacy, traumatized people often respond positively to a dangerous person or situation because it makes them feel. It is neither rational nor irrational.
https://www.abuseandrelationships.org/Content/Survivors/trauma_bonding.html

Traumatic bonding
Traumatic bonding is shown when abused children cling tenaciously to the [people] who hurt them, and victims of domestic violence repeatedly return to their abusive partner. (Herman, 1992) Perpetrators of sexual abuse may manipulate trauma bonds further by giving their victim the only sense of specialness, or being loved, that they have ever had. (Herman, 1992)
When a person is subjected to coercive control there are profound alterations in the victim’s identity. All the structures of the self−the image of the body, the internalized images of others, and the values and ideals that lend a sense of coherence and purpose−are invaded and systematically broken down. (Herman, 1992)
https://traumadissociation.wordpress.com/2013/12/29/trauma-bonding-stockholm-syndrome/ (Edit by me).

Usually trauma bonds occur in relationships involving inconsistent reinforcement, such as those with addicts and alcoholics or in domestic violence situations. Dysfunctional marriages also cause trauma bonds because there is always a time when things seem to be “normal.” Other types of relationships involving trauma bonds include cult-like religious organizations, kidnapping and hostage situations, those involving child abuse or incest, and unhealthy work environments.

The environment necessary to create a trauma bond involves intensity, complexity, inconsistency, and a promise. Victims stay because they are holding on to that elusive “promise” or hope. There is always manipulation involved. Victims are prey to the manipulation because they are willing to tolerate anything for the payoff, which is that elusive promise and ever present hope for fulfillment of some deeply personal need within the victim.
https://pro.psychcentral.com/recovery-expert/2015/10/what-is-trauma-bonding/

This type of “bonding”, which they refer to as “traumatic bonding,” can happen when a child experiences periods of positive experience alternating with episodes of abuse.

Overidentifying with the abuser: Some individuals who have endured long-term abuse often find themselves harboring conflicting emotions. There are times when the abused individual may hate the abuser one minute and the next minute make statements or do things that makes the relationship appear better than it actually is. For example, a child who is being emotionally abused might make statements such as “I hate my uncle for what he has done to me,” and later make a different statement such as “Uncle Tim and I always joke around and go to the movies on Saturdays.” These two statements and the different wording often perplexes outsiders. Other abused individuals might make statements such as “Uncle Tim and I always dress alike because we enjoy it,” “Uncle Tim and I are very much alike because we like the same foods,” or “Uncle Tim and I cried when we watched Titanic together for the first time.”
Feeling indebted to the abuser: Some abused individuals may develop a sense of gratitude for something that the abusive individual may have done for them. For example, if an adolescent female was once homeless and placed in multiple foster care homes but the abusive individual took them in and treated them well before the abuse, the abused individual may feel he or she owes the abuser something. I have been told by severely abused adolescents that the abuser “loved me or he would not have helped me.”
Allowing the abuse to continue to “please” the abuser: Some individuals, primarily those who are being sexually abused and manipulated, will permit the abuse to continue to “keep problems down” or “please him/her.” The victim becomes so overwhelmed by a failure to protect or stand up for themselves that they give in. Or the individual is fearful of walking away and remains in the situation for however long they can. During my training as a clinician 8yrs ago, a child said to me “he wanted something good from me and I gave it to him because he deserved it. Dad always goes to work for us and is a hard worker.”
(Much more at link)
https://blogs.psychcentral.com/caregivers/2015/09/9-signs-of-traumatic-bonding-bonded-to-the-abuser/



I think sometimes there is a desire to blame victims (or those who were caring for the victim) of accidents and crimes, because emotionally, it lets us off the hook. It is scary to contemplate that something bad could happen to us or to our kids. We need to explain away why it could not happen - they were careless, the mother wasn't watching the child well enough, the woman wore too sexy clothes, or was out alone too late, the park didn't have adequate signs, the kid wasn't truly a victim because she ran off with the perp, that kid is a delinquent (unlike mine), etc. - whatever the excuse may be, so that we can protect ourselves from worry.

I also think that the emotion of empathy is a hard one at times. We don't want to feel helpless pain for the plight of others. Because we can't solve it. We can't fix it. It just feels...bad. So we work hard to remove ourselves from the pain of that via blame.

At least that's my inexpert theory. Psychs? Am I close?
 
Forgive me if I missed it - but has LE told us they purchased at the Walmart?
 
michael.gartley said:
Thanks for catching those mistakes of mine. Sloppy copy/pasting on my part!

Elizabeth Thomas Instagram posts date, caption edited flag, and caption text (corrected link!)
https://pastebin.com/u0J8c0LQ

Tad Cummins Instagram posts date, caption edited flag, and caption text
https://pastebin.com/sBfFfDfX

Elizabeth Thomas Instagram posts liked by
https://pastebin.com/DfA8tHLR

Tad Cummins Instagram posts liked by (corrected link!)
https://pastebin.com/YgGCBcf7
Click to expand...

Gonna look up those hashtags in IG. Lots of repeating ones but there is a few #costarica in there
Also a lot of poetry
 
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