Trial Discussion Thread #20 - 14.04.08, Day 18

[aa9511]

I just want all of you babas to know that I love you....

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:floorlaugh:

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[kittychi]

Pieter Baba mentioned triggering the alarm during his testimony. He said, if OP was that concerned why didn't he trigger the alarm. My words not his. I cannot quite remember exactly what he said but I think I posted it at the time and a link to the video where it shows him saying it.

I forgot about that! Why wouldn't Nel have exploited that in X, I wonder?

:waitasec:

,

 

[aa9511]

Rebecca Davis ‏@becsplanb 54s
The line between "protective" and "controlling" often seems hard to discern. Eg "I don't want you driving alone at night"

https://twitter.com/becsplanb

GOOD POINT. IT would be so easy for OP to disguise his controlling in the guise of "protecting" and "caring."

 

[Bazinga]

I am wondering - Is it possible for Nel not to get a chance to cross examine Oscar?
I imagine Roux finishing with Oscar at the end of the week, Nel starting cross examination Monday morning and at the first big challenge Oscar breaking down and being unable to return to the stand. Roux will describe his break down and that he now needs medical care. The trial goes on without Oscar testifying further and Roux in closing asks/pleads that Milady not penalise Oscar for his inability to continue testifying. Please consider that he recounted his entire memory of the event and that he then became medically unfit to remain on the stand. Roux might give a big sob story about a ruined and broken, heartbroken man who needs care and medical help not jail and further punishment.

quoting myself!
When I think of things Roux might say I have his voice in my head saying it. I may come away from this trial with a SA accent for a while!

Another question for anyone with better SA legal understanding - if OP cannot manage cross exam without breaking down, sobbing and adjournments and Roux says so as above but OP is able to sit through the remaining trial would it be that his testimony isn't considered in judgement as there was no ability to cross? If so then this would be v clever of DT and good scenario for OP, IMO.

 

[patCee]

I forgot about that! Why wouldn't Nel have exploited that in X, I wonder?

:waitasec:

,

Did I hear OP give an account about how the decorators had disconnected the burglar alarm, or was it the panic alarm?

 

[gajonka]

My Lady was quick to leave the bench when OP started moaning, very quick. She does not want to sit there and observe this spectacle. And she did not seem at all bothered to adjourn early either. So I suspect that one of two things are about to happen. She will continue to take Crybaby breaks and adjourn as needed, if OP looks overwhelmed emotionally, for as long as it takes to finish this man's trial. Or she will admonish him from the bench to compose himself. Either way this trial is not going to stop unless a doctor of medicine, a psychiatrist not a psychologist, testifies that OP needs to be hospitalized for whatever period of time.

Oh yes.. OP's plan is falling into place and settling nicely. We knew he would try and mesmerize the female judge... and she seems to be taking the bait. Our only hope is cross at this point... something needs to be done here... whatever it is, I hope it works... the truth needs to emerge.

Hospitalized? For what? Bad acting maybe...

 

[G.bng]

Looks like even Roux has been made a bit emotional by today too.

Karyn Maughan ‏@karynmaughan 2m
Roux tells ballistic expert Mangena:"if the state incorrectly prosecuted an innocent young men, then you have ruined him forever" @eNCAnews

Further, I think what Roux said here is unconscionable. The only person who ruined Oscar Pistorius' life is Mr Oscar Pistorius, only Oscar, not the prosecution, shot Reeva so the irresponsible and reckless act is his and his alone for rest of his days. And if I were he out of guilt, remorse and repentance I would dedicate my life to working for the good of others. Didn't OP promise God in front of Stepp to dedicate his whole life to Reeva if she lived... well it's time he started because so far it seems to me more about self pity than anything else.

 

[Gbtaketwo]

Did I hear OP give an account about how the decorators had disconnected the burglar alarm, or was it the panic alarm?

I think he may have said the outside sensors had been removed from the wall a long time ago .

 

[G.bng]

Oh yes.. OP's plan is falling into place and settling nicely. We knew he would try and mesmerize the female judge... and she seems to be taking the bait. Our only hope is cross at this point... something needs to be done here... whatever it is, I hope it works... the truth needs to emerge.

Hospitalized? For what? Bad acting?

I don't see Masipa is "taking the bait" in any way shape or form, as yet, rather Masipa cutting him short when OP turns on the tide. IMO you can be sympathetic to a point but OP really needs to act like an adult (he had guns didn't he) and face up to the recklessness of what he did instead of continually hiding from it.

 

[Carol70]

quoting myself!
When I think of things Roux might say I have his voice in my head saying it. I may come away from this trial with a SA accent for a while!

Another question for anyone with better SA legal understanding - if OP cannot manage cross exam without breaking down, sobbing and adjournments and Roux says so as above but OP is able to sit through the remaining trial would it be that his testimony isn't considered in judgement as there was no ability to cross? If so then this would be v clever of DT and good scenario for OP, IMO.

Hahaha, when I listen to Roux and Nel, I also thought their voices are soo annoying and then realized that to foreigners, I probably sound exactly the same! :blushing:

 

[G.bng]

He is going to end up keeping Shrien Dewani company at this rate .
I said yesterday that he might never end up being cross examined
If he does come back on the stand he really needs to get a grip because he has made things worse for himself and I am not surprised he is sobbing . The thought of 25 years in jail is enough to make anyone sob and wail
JMOO

Oh yeah, Dewani... another young man who has not had the bottle to face the charges. Glad he is finally back in SA and shame on the British justice system that has allowed his histrionics to go on for so long.

 

[aa9511]

Tasha's restaurant now. Lereno(sp) the young boxer had asked for help with his diet. Also Justin and Darren.

O: ...I'd been looking at purchasing a gun similar, it was smaller than mine....I wanted to see if it had an attachment for a flashlight. I asked him to pass it to me. I was stupid. I wanted to make sure it was safe, wasn't loaded. As I checked it, a round came out of the breech. Nxt thing I knew, it went off.

I was quite angry Darren Mr Fresco had handed me an unsafe weapon. I gave it back and said 'What if someone had got hurt?'

Then Darren told the party it got hooked on his pants.....I believe we were both to blame.....he told me not to say anything.

R: Did you say anything about the media?

O: Not at that point.....I said how it would look if it got out? Did her realise the severity? Dareen kept coming up with excuses.

OP said he told the owner it was 'my fault. I'll pay for the damages'.

OMG.

That is not at all what Darren said. Or what the other guy testified to.

WOW.

It's so easy for him to come up with these lies.

I have seen throughout this that Oscar comes up with lies pretty easily.

Even yesterday, they keep showing on TV part of his testimony - and this part includes the part where he says his mother always kept a gun with her. And Roux asks him, where did she keep the gun? And in his response, IMO, he is lying b/c you can tell he kind of stumbles....then immediatley IMO makes up a story about being in a leather bag under her pillow, which honestly makes no sense to me. Who puts a leather bag with a gun under their pillow while they sleep on the pillow?

IDK, I'm sure she did keep a gun, but I think he made up the part about in the leather bag under the pillow. I don't know why he would, but maybe just to emphasize how "guns were all around" him when he was a kid??

He is also lying about the whole restaurant scenario.

As someone else said, he is always trying to shift the blame to other people.

Also, with his whole sobbing they keep showing on TV, I keep thinking......What about when the security called after you shot Reeva, and you told them "EVERYTHING'S FINE"??????? WHERE was the sobbing, emotional, meek, weak Oscar then???????

 

[canny]

Isn't it a bit strange that OP says he just 'sat' there when he got to Reeva, and doesn't know how long for, and 'she wasn't breathing' - but then (presumably) quite a while later, he carries her downstairs; And only then tries to resuscitate her, when other people are present?

Sat there? With so much of Reeva's blood around in the toilet how come he succeeded in not leaving any of his blood soaked hands, prosthetics,and knee prints anywhere in the toilet.

 

[turaj]

Observations so far today...Roux is completely disorganized with the pages etc. and is wasting the court's time. Also re-reading the texts....I would assume the prosecution would like that in that it clearly indicates in Reeva's own words that she is scared of OP...what value is there in that for OP? It must be awful for her parents listening to this rubbish. So 90% of the time OP was great for Reeva but what about the 10%? Do we all have a 10% license to kill?

 

[BritsKate]

quoting myself!
When I think of things Roux might say I have his voice in my head saying it. I may come away from this trial with a SA accent for a while!

Another question for anyone with better SA legal understanding - if OP cannot manage cross exam without breaking down, sobbing and adjournments and Roux says so as above but OP is able to sit through the remaining trial would it be that his testimony isn't considered in judgement as there was no ability to cross? If so then this would be v clever of DT and good scenario for OP, IMO.

I think a mistrial could come into play if Nel's not afforded the opportunity to cross. I very much doubt Roux would allow that to happen though - without Oscar's testimony, he's almost guaranteed a murder conviction. (See De Oliveira) JMO

 

[04009margaret]

Yes! And this is exactly what I am thinking all along - he goes in this type of details without any obvious reason except to match/answer (in advance) the things that go against him. Did anyone/Roux ask him for how long? No! Why mention it then!? This is exactly why his testimony often seems so fake to me. Like he knows, and is very careful, what to say and mention, and what not to mention! And this, to me, suggests that he is not telling the truth. Because, when you're telling the truth, you don't need to be so obviously careful about what you are saying, right?

Also, I am no longer very impressed with Roux's defense tactics - it just all looks too obvious to me... that OP is prepared 'to a T'... and that he has memorised the story he is now telling, instead of telling it from his memory alone.

Many things would look much more plausable if he didn't go in such detail all by himself; if Roux had to stop him and ask him, for example, 'do you remeber for how long'...

Exactly, are they his memories or colluded memories as Roux suggested to witnesses

 

[G.bng]

His psychologist that runs to comfort him when he breaks down, was the lady with short silver/blonde hair & glasses, that was sitting next to his sister. She broke down crying herself

Then sorry but imo the lady ain't no psychologist at all but more like a nurse, or a nanny, because it is an absolute no no for a professional psychologist to demonstrate that kind of empathy with a client because it doesn't work... the "and we all cry together" routine doesn't help any patient overcome, it merely reinforces their conflicts, pain, or whatever, and stops them from moving forward. It also allows patient to manipulate the psychologist, another no no.

 

[gajonka]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hOnoiIPsLbA



@ 5.49 did he report that statement to LE?

"Get down, <Reeva.> Call the police!" (whisper)

 

[aa9511]

O: we started dinner about 7.. After we chatted about Reeva's work. We sat at the dining table...she asked me to go through a contract she was about to sign. I made some changes for her....usuall after dinner we would watch TV but we both had a taxing day so decided to go upstairs.

While we were taking the plates, Reeva asked me if I wanted a warm drink. I said yes and went upstairs. She joined me a couple of minutes later.

Long pause.

Lying. You either watched TV, or you started arguing, Oscar. That's what really happened. You did not go upstairs for an "early night."

 

[G.bng]

About OP being unstable on his stumps. I can believe some instability but after 26 years like that I would think he had compensated pretty much for it. Anyone ever seen a painter decorator working on stilts... and the people using them usually have only been doing it for a few years so not every day like Oscar.