Trial Discussion Thread #5 - 14.03.11-12, Day 7-8

[Interested Bystander]

Hi all,

New to the thread but been following the trial. I have to say I am very doubtful that OP will be convicted. Not enough here (yet at least) to prove anything at all beyond reasonable doubt, IMO.

I know that will not be a popular first-post-in-thread post but JMO of course

Happy to post Twitter updates as they happen as I am at work and can be constantly refreshing. I follow @AlexCrawfordSky.

eta; big mistake on fresco's part to admit to following social media. huge.

We are only at the beginning of the trial so way to early to be able to judge one way or the other. The forensic evidence will play an enormous part in the trial and I suspect Nel has more evidence from OP's immediate neighbours, either side. Both are on the witness list, as is Pistorius's gardener who has a room within the house at the back.

 

[Trooper]

I'm also confused as to why this would discredit him... haven't been following the live coverage, only the tweets - but to me he came across as a bit of an irresponsible guy who actually told the truth as far as he saw/remembered it... he admitted to following some of the trial, but I would say that is simply an honest admission, since the coverage of it is everywhere and you'd have to be in a bubble not to!

Darrin was unexpectedly to me, a very good speaker.. very calm.. very concentrated.. he knew he was in deep doodoo for taking the blame for Oscar re the restaurant shooting ( Darins gun) .. he didn't evade or wriggle about it .. he certainly got the fright of his life when Oscar fired the gun ( Oscars gun) in Darrins car..

 

[jassy writer]

Yes, he corroborated both Kevin's and Sam's evidence in terms of Oscar's shooting. Also to me, the prosecution is using this to paint the picture of a man with a cavalier disregard for the law...

 

[graceholl]

Wy is it huge? Darren's testimony has nothing to with the murder, only Oscar's concern for his public image and his carelessness with guns, as well as his well-documented anger problems. It means nothing in the bigger picture if he saw or read about certain proceedings and his testimony is discredited. He's only one witness. Kevin Lerena has corroborated his version of events, as well. This admission does not discredit his entire testimony, IMO.

whilst i'm sure everyone is implicitly aware that it is hard to avoid any coverage at all - to actually state so on the witness stand is playing with fire really. wrong or right, it's something for roux to grip on to.

i'm not team pistorius btw - no idea if it was premeditated or not and feel for witnesses/judge - but think prosecution has not been particularly strong thus far. fresco hasn't helped that :twocents:

 

[Trooper]

- Many inconsistencies
- Backtracking
- He has admitted to following social media around the case

Whilst he may not be officially discredited and cast off as a witness, I doubt his testimony will hold much weight when Judge Masipa comes to her verdict.

:twocents:

you don't think Oscar fired Darrins gun in the restaurant, or his own gun in Darrins car??

 

[jassy writer]

I've been told by a lawyer friend, that Nel is a top, top prosecutor... he does not launch in for the attack - that is not his strategy. He is calm, quiet, very calculated in his approach and he builds the case carefully, step by step, and then at the end he puts all the pieces together and tightens the noose.

 

[graceholl]

you don't think Oscar fired Darrins gun in the restaurant, or his own gun in Darrins car??

No I do think he was generally truthful in as much as he could remember of the event but he was getting increasingly agitated, almost confused, at the end of his testimony. Personally I didn't feel he came across as a particularly strong or overtly credible witness. All JMO and clearly in a minority here!

 

[MeeBee]

whilst i'm sure everyone is implicitly aware that it is hard to avoid any coverage at all - to actually state so on the witness stand is playing with fire really. wrong or right, it's something for roux to grip on to.

i'm not team pistorius btw - no idea if it was premeditated or not and feel for witnesses/judge - but think prosecution has not been particularly strong thus far. fresco hasn't helped that :twocents:

That happens from time to time. I was recently following a trial where two witnesses, one a prosecution witness and one a defense witness, admitted they had followed the particular trial on TV before being told not to. It's up to the judge if that misstep outweighs his testimony or if there is evidence he catered his testimony around what he saw. I doubt very much the judge will throw his entire testimony away when she goes back. I suspect his testimony was not going to carry as much weight anyway. Neither will Sam's or Lerena's. At least not as much as the ear/eye witnesses or the forensic experts. These are nothing more than character witnesses. Not weighty evidence anyway.

 

[Trooper]

Fairly uneventful day all round...think Fresco will be discredited. IMO JMO.

the Professor of Forensic medicine, the man who did the autopsy was 'uneventful'??


that surprises me.

 

[graceholl]

That happens from time to time. I was recently following a trial where two witnesses, one a prosecution witness and one a defense witness, admitted they had followed the particular trial on TV before being told not to. It's up to the judge if that misstep outweighs his testimony or if there is evidence he catered his testimony around what he saw. I doubt very much the judge will throw his entire testimony away when she goes back. I suspect his testimony was not going to carry as much weight anyway. Neither will Sam's or Lerena's. At least not as much as the ear/eye witnesses or the forensic experts. These are nothing more than character witnesses. Not weighty evidence anyway.

I agree. His admission would have been graver had he been more of a key witness I think.

We will see, anyway.

 

[graceholl]

the Professor of Forensic medicine, the man who did the autopsy was 'uneventful'??


that surprises me.

No...Fresco mostly...I only started watching at work just before Fresco came on.

put it this way, less eventful than yesterday.

 

[BritsKate]

Fairly uneventful day all round...think Fresco will be discredited. IMO JMO.

I'm not particularly fond of Mr. Fresco to be blatantly honest. However, if I were to have to mull the veracity of his statement vs. live testimony...

The facts that he could face prosecution if not testifying truthfully, he may have still been trying (in some sense) to cover for OP at the time of the statement and that he admitted following the trial via twitter would be points in his corner for believing his live testimony.

I think this all goes to showing a reckless disregard for other's safety and Fresco's (rather insignificant) discrepancies won't really impact that.

JMO

-------
At this point, I have a very hard time seeing it as anything other than (at least) culpable homicide...Reeva screaming, and all the many witnesses now that confirm those screams, was enough to cinch that for me.

We'll see what, if anything, the defence can do to convince me it was accidental when so clearly she WAS screaming. (Not an OP girl-screamer convert yet.)

 

[MeeBee]

No...Fresco mostly...I only started watching at work just before Fresco came on.

put it this way, less eventful than yesterday.

Yesterday was pretty eventful! The pathologist outlined Reeva's injuries, some peculiar, some in fitting with the bullet strikes. And Oscar threw up everywhere the whole time.

 

[Trooper]

certainly, all day, Oscar vomited in a masculine pitch and frequency.. his groans were most certainly not girlish.

 

[jassy writer]

I am sure that Darren's testimony will also help the State with the other charges OP is accused of... there are two additional charges of discharging a firearm in public and it is now very difficult for OP to claim that the car sunroof one did not happen when the two other occupants of the car have insisted it did. The fact that he is claiming it did not happen, now shows him up in another lie, if you ask me!

 

[Estelle]

So do you think Darren Fresco will get immunity from any charges?

In other words, was he honest enough?

 

[soozieqtips]

The point is that people can witness the same event and remember it slightly differently. I fully understand this. However, I don't accept that OP didn't hear a peep out of Reeva when so many other witnesses did. Reeva's complete silence is crucial to his 'story'.

 

[Interested Bystander]

I am sure that Darren's testimony will also help the State with the other charges OP is accused of... there are two additional charges of discharging a firearm in public and it is now very difficult for OP to claim that the car sunroof one did not happen when the two other occupants of the car have insisted it did. The fact that he is claiming it did not happen, now shows him up in another lie, if you ask me!

Totally agree.

 

[Trooper]

So do you think Darren Fresco will get immunity from any charges?

In other words, was he honest enough?

I believe he was... Roux 's theories didn't have anything substantiated.... Larena told the same story Samantha told the basically same story, she painted the mood of that Vaal river drive, Darrin painted the events. . its difficult to believe they ALL collaborated.. What could be the benefit to them?? whereas.. the benefit to Oscar is crucial if Roux can make them out to be liars.. and no doubt Darrin ,Samantha , Kevin, all the witnesses so far have had to go thru that process.. all liars, all mistaken. its getting bit wearisome ,really.. I long for Roux , under Oscars instructions, to come up with something concrete that exonerates his client .

certainly, in the car shooting.. Oscar getting out and haranguing the Metro officers has the clang of raw truth to it..

 

[Interested Bystander]

So do you think Darren Fresco will get immunity from any charges?

In other words, was he honest enough?

Probably.