Trial Discussion Thread #57 - 14.16.10, Day 46 ~ sentencing~

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As per below AKP:

Barry Bateman @barrybateman · 28m 28 minutes ago
Schultz is friends with Mortimer, who is friends with Guil Yahav. Pistorius was partying with Yahav at VIP lounge...Yahav introduced Pistorius to Mortimer, before the two had an altercation. Mortimer was potential state witness.
 
I heard that man being interviewed earlier I think, but couldn't mention as I didn't catch any of his details and so wasn't sure if he was credible or it was just a member of the public's opinion. Sounded very emphatic that Oscar had never done anything for people with a disability though.

There is a bit more about that:

Outside of the courtroom, a lobby group for people living with disabilities slammed Pistorius' attempts to avoid jail time.

In an open letter to Pistorius, the CEO of the QuadPara Association of South Africa (QASA), Ari Seirlis, told Pistorius that he should stop trying to avoid prison and "Stand up and shows us the man that you said you were."

The group said it wanted to ensure that people with disabilities had access to mainstream society.

"If you want to make a difference for the disability sector, please go to jail and make sure that they provide the necessary reasonable and accessible accommodations for yourself," the letter stated.

http://abcnews.go.com/International...storius-raised-court/story?id=26235208&page=2
 
I think the opposite. That they were in court to intimidate Pistorius, and to make them think that prison might actually be a safe haven for him in the near future.

But what is the point of intimidating OP? He does not decide if he'd go to jail or not. Besides there is no reason he has to stay on in SA.
 
Here is the whole letter. Very powerful.

----------------

Dear Oscar – here’s how you can still make a difference

Mr Pistorius, the greatest contribution you can make for those with disabilities will be in prison. So show the country that you are the great man you said you were – take your punishment, and make prison a place where disabilities are well accommodated.
People with disabilities in South Africa - and the formal disability agencies and associations representing this constituency - have been trying, desperately, to be recognised in the mainstream.

We want equal employment opportunities, we want to be recognised as contributors to society in South Africa, we want the opportunity to circulate in accessible transport and building infrastructure. We want to get degrees, diplomas, jobs, promotions; we want to have families.

All part of normal society.

However, when we transgress, and break the law, we must accept the appropriate punishment, too. We do not want special laws for people with disabilities just because one OP killed his girlfriend. And now you, the very same person who bragged about fighting your way into the Olympic arena, which you thought was greater than the Paralympic arena, are desperately trying to find a way of doing community service in the disability sector and community.

You must also show your colours in the correctional services arena. JAIL.

We do not want you doing community service in our sector. You profess to have inspired the disability sector and constituency. A referendum would prove you wrong. Your arrogance has never been embraced by us. Your achievements have only fed your own ego. Your definition of philanthropy is giving away an old pair of Nikes and a scratched pair of Oakleys, mixing with people with disabilities whilst cameras flash; giving away your signature.

You should learn from the greatest philanthropists. Alas, it is too late.

If you want to make a difference for the disability sector, please go to jail and make sure that they provide the necessary reasonable and accessible accommodations for yourself and those with disabilities to follow.

Influence the correctional services authorities on what is required to have basic human rights in prison. No more, no less.

By not serving time in jail, you are ensuring that those facilities, should they not be accessible, will simply remain so.

You are fast, you are agile, you know how to use a weapon - so don't fear, you will survive. The only difference is that you won't have a fan club.

Stand up and show us the man that you said you were. Take your punishment, and you will see that South Africans are very forgiving.

You have lots to contemplate behind those bars and, I guess, still plenty of time to make a difference on this earth. DM

http://www.dailymaverick.co.za/opin...you-can-still-make-a-difference/#.VD_9Bb5xuTM

By CEO of the QuadPara Association of South Africa (QASA), Ari Seirlis.
 
The "Behind the Door" is out on Amazon now (Kindle). If you’ve got it - can you share your thoughts? Is it worth it? Thanks :-)

http://www.amazon.com/Behind-Door-O...id=1413476242&sr=1-1&keywords=behind+the+door

I picked up a hardback copy the other day. My first impressions from dipping into it:


  • This was touted as THE book of the trial but it was clearly rushed out to be one of the first. No index.
  • The very first words I read were the first reference in the back. The wrong date was quoted.
  • It reads a bit like a novel, there is some repetition of detail and it's not always presented in the order that things occurred.
  • It is generally factual with little analysis or speculation.
  • There are some interesting interviews with Dixon, Sam Greyvenstein (sp?) and Trish Taylor.
  • There are a few more photos in the book cf the website, including one of Gerrie's doodles.
  • I don't think there is any input from the Pistoriuses or Reeva's family.
  • It finishes before the verdict, leaving it nicely open for a follow up book/second edition.
It is certainly seems to be well worth a full read and unless someone can get closer to the defence or prosecution teams you won't get more.

But then again Frank may write a book.
 
I wish that letter had been written a few days earlier so Nel could have confronted the manager with the bit below. Would have made a good counterpoint to all the Saint Oscar bilge.

We do not want you doing community service in our sector. You profess to have inspired the disability sector and constituency. A referendum would prove you wrong. Your arrogance has never been embraced by us. Your achievements have only fed your own ego. Your definition of philanthropy is giving away an old pair of Nikes and a scratched pair of Oakleys, mixing with people with disabilities whilst cameras flash; giving away your signature.
 
yes, joining in with the joke, and that long, open, lingering smirk... facing directly towards nel.
then... later, for the court record, insisting on a retraction from roux. very odd.

presumably the court record does not record her own behaviour.

I agree I felt she smirked far longer than was necessary. I do think she apologised for her own behaviour though, just before she told Roux to withdraw his comment.
 
Interesting video featuring Mandy Weiner on the background to Shultz involvement in the Kebble murder. Kebble was a businessman with fingers in a lot of pies, including gold mines. These were all involving very powerful people.

Thanks to WilliamMunter as I found it via the site he put up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ACaTJCY0GXA
 
But what is the point of intimidating OP? He does not decide if he'd go to jail or not. Besides there is no reason he has to stay on in SA.

Really? I've had the distinct impression that the Pistorius family have been calling all the shots in this farce of a trial.

All the same, I'm not sure that the judge can go quite so far as to allow him to leave the country while being grounded without any pocket money, or whatever "punishment" Arnold she decides on.
 
The Steenkamps are much better people than I.

I’ve always tried to see the good in people (sometimes to my terrible detriment) but if someone seriously, irretrievably ####’s me over, I’m DONE. I’m not the vengeful type but I’m not at all forgiving of betrayal, abuse or psychopaths. One man taught me that brutal lesson long ago. Married at 19, I was a trusting, naive babe in the woods. My abusive ex was my first experience with men.

ONCE I did very seriously consider murder in defense of my life.

My vicious, violent ex was a bitter, messed-up, two-tour Vietnam vet who had numerous times threatened to kill me. He regularly terrorized me with physical, verbal and psychological abuse.

Where were no women's shelters back in those days. You were essentially on your own.

Everyone has a breaking point - I’d finally reached mine one night. I was 21 years old.

Lying in bed after that last assault, I shivered uncontrollably, head to toe, in mortal fear (have you ever been that afraid?), waiting for the next attack(?) - afraid to breathe, afraid to move.

For hours in total darkness, I silently cried and seethed ... him sleeping mere inches from me. (Yes, I could taste primal revenge in my mouth and I won’t lie, the freedom and peace it promised was sweet. I absolutely understand how some abuse victims finally break and kill their abusers. Too many DV victims who leave are still stalked and killed by their abusers.)

I went over and over and over it in my head, debating, weighing my options, my chances, my future (if any). I imagined what prison might be like and was I willing to pay the price? In the end I chose to spare his life and move out the next day - he wasn’t worth prison.

Would I have been remorseful had I killed him? NO.

I can say that with a very clear conscience. Some vile people on this earth should not be alive, period, to rain misery, terror and destruction on innocent, defenseless women, children, animals - but I decided that dark night that someone else would have to take him out. I decided to save myself - and I couldn’t do that if I committed murder ... he would have won by destroying the rest of my life.

I cannot tell you the excruciating mental battle I fought against my visceral instincts for justice ... revenge. He never knew how razor close he came that night to never waking up. The plan was made ... all I had to do was do it. How I ever kept from doing what I so desperately wanted to do is still a mystery these many years later. Perhaps some kind angel was whispering in my ear, guiding the way out.

It’s very important for us to tell and share our stories. We are not alone.

Who knows, perhaps by telling your story, you’ll become someone’s desperately needed “angel”. :D
 
I actually think Judge M is going to allow OP community service. I also think Dewani (who is likely to be found guilty, imo) is then going to use OP's sentence as grounds for an appeal himself - that he is too mentally disabled to stay in prison.

It's just a thought.

I'm with you. Judge Masipa is a sad excuse for a judge. I find her embarrassing. Is this killer was a poor, uneducated, black man from Pretoria, he would have been found guilty and sentenced way back - the end. But Masipa is giving this one a pass. The entire thing is disgraceful.
 
The Pistorius family’s haughty, contemptuous, very PUBLIC self-righteousness makes me want to grab a green bucket and hurl my guts.

They proclaim Christ with every breath but their lives scream Pharisees.
 
Really? I've had the distinct impression that the Pistorius family have been calling all the shots in this farce of a trial.

All the same, I'm not sure that the judge can go quite so far as to allow him to leave the country while being grounded without any pocket money, or whatever "punishment" Arnold she decides on.

I do not believe that it has come to a stage where the OP family is deciding the exact outcome; I think it is more Masipa's admiration for Roux and sympathy for OP. I do agree however that they are doing everything possible to influence the outcome. And that is exactly why I was thinking along those lines - some of those guys may have had a row with OP in the past, but they are not exactly known for standing up for a cause or things like that. So it may not be difficult to win them over with money and then, as the events today show, you manage to generate some sympathy.

Anyway, it is all just speculation, and let us not carry it any further.
 
yes, joining in with the joke, and that long, open, lingering smirk... facing directly towards nel.
then... later, for the court record, insisting on a retraction from roux. very odd.

presumably the court record does not record her own behaviour.

Exactly. She covered her butt.
 
Stephanie Findlay @SJFindlay 10h 10 hours ago
Vergeer also said #Pistorius should not go to jail because he could be "gang raped" and can not take a proper shower

[Vergeer] says he might be raped in prison. Without legs he is more vulnerable - how does he shower without legs?
http://www.iol.co.za/oscar-pistorius-live-blog-1.1642975

He would find it “extremely difficult” to walk on his stumps on concrete and slippery floors like those in prisons and would find the showers not equipped with the rails he needs.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/14/reeva-steenkamp-parents-payments-oscar-pistorius


Well, that settles it.

OP cannot be sentenced to prison because he can’t take showers!

Except it’s a freakin LIE.

(Psssst ... dang it, Defense forgot to tell Snickering-Laughing-Gum-Popping-Goth-Girl that OP only takes “baths” wink-wink)


David SmithVerified account @SmithInAfrica
Versfeld: #Pistorius said, "I fall about once a week or every two weeks... I bath rather than shower because I can't stand long."

“I can barely stand on my stumps, let alone yield a bat.”
- Oscar Pistorius, testimony April 9 2014
@22:25 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgGuW2XPL5E

“I went upstairs then, I was ... I wanted to get out of the clothes I’d been in for the day and I went upstairs and got changed and SHOWERED. ...”
- Oscar Pistorius testimony

Oscar Pistorius @OscarPistorius 22 Jun 2011
Could definitely think of worse views from a SHOWER in the morning! http://yfrog.com/h3hnlmncj


“I usually SHOWER as I wake up to get my day going, after my morning gym session I usually have an ice bath or shower again. ... I just use shower gel: *advertiser censored*Men Hair and Body Shampoo. It is very gentle and scents my skin with the elegant fragrance of *advertiser censored*Men. And if I’m in the bath, throw salts in it for relaxation.”
- Oscar Pistorius, 9.1.2011
http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...on/oscar-pistorius/+&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
 
This is all Oscar Pistorius's fault. By his act of killing Reeva, he has given these people a platform, presenting the worst that South Africa has to offer, to the entire world. It's such a crying shame.

And so the Oscar destruction machine rolls on........

This family has no sympathy, no empathy, no guilt - They should be "ashamed" of themselves with their arrogance.
Because he was caught red-handed, Oscar cried about his disability and insecurity, but not once, did he ever say that he needed and would get counselling. Just that it was an accident and life will go on for him.
 
I wonder if OP will be warned by Masipa tomorrow of the possibility that he could face a custodial sentence on Tuesday (or whenever it is). I've certainly heard of that being said here in the UK before sentencing.
 
Maspia seemed very interested in the prison hospital option and I think this will be what she decides.

There is no recommended prison term for culpable homicide, but considering his recklessness a 7-8 year sentence seems appropriate.

This could be mostly suspended. OP has already been found guilty of a gun charge so any similar transgression would result in him serving the longer term.
 
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