trial thread: 04/03/2012

[roseofsharon]

BBM

Planted by whom? TLM? The person who told MTR that she would take the fall for him, the person that reneged her testimony to try and shift all the blame on herself? The junkie that was so high at the time of the crime?


And why immediately come up with a scenario that might explain away any hypothetical fingerprints? No one testified anything about the lids, other than to note that they were there.:waitasec:

I can understand wanting to keep an open mind throughout the trial, but this is really stretching it. IMO.

They simply were cleaning up where they had been, missed the caps and them put them in the coffin garbage bags. They never thought they were ever going to be caught. MTR was there, so fingerprints and other biological material doesn't matter, he and TLM could have engaged in some type of sexual activity and then touched a cap. IMO

 

[brighidin]

What kind of "defensive wounds" are people expecting to hear about? According to TLM's testimony, Tori was lying motionless on the ground when she was kicked and hit with the hammer. If she had been punched previously, as the coroner's testimony suggested was possible, then she might well have been unconscious (but still alive) and curled up in a fetal position before she was murdered. If that was the case, there wouldn't be any "defensive wounds."

That isn't to say she didn't try to fight off her attacker, but the way the coroner's testimony sounds, unless her arm bones were cracked/broken in a defensive context, there wouldn't be any evidence to that effect left.

 

[Macright]

A NORMAL MALE WOULD NOT ALLOW A STRANGE FEMALE CHILD IN THEIR CAR, ESPECIALLY KNOWING HE IS HELPING OUT A DRUGGIE, PERVERSE FEMALE WITH A REVENGE PLOT. :moo: <modsnip> :moo:

not if that female told him she was babysitting TS when she brought her to the car..we don't know when he was told or figured out that this was a kidnapping and may never know unless he takes the stand and we hear his side to this tragedy.. my mind always goes back to the breeding of those dogs that never happened...:moo:


I have edited my response because I do not want to take any credit one way or the other for using another poster's description of TLM...

 

[ChaChaCha]

Okay, I have NO IDEA what is going on with these quotes and posts .... Rose of Sharon are you SURE you are doing quotes right because you have incorrectly attributed posts above to me that are not mine... a little bit unsettling lol! Can we fix please??? You have me arguing with myself - which I seldom if ever do. Thx!

 

[swedie]

~Respectfully snipped~

It sure doesn't bode well for MR though - with all this rage - there is no way in Hades he could have innocently stood by and not tried to help Victoria. And then to follow it up with lying, etc. to LE - refusing to say what happened and where Victoria was - is about as disgusting as it comes. His own lawyer implies MR was there, cleaning up the scene - in my opinion - you don't clean up a scene like this and then try to hide it, unless you have a reason too, unless you are involved in this ugliness.

This is horrifying.

Salem

:goodpost::yesss::gomods:

 

[brighidin]

Okay, I have NO IDEA what is going on with these quotes and posts .... Rose of Sharon are you SURE you are doing quotes right because you have incorrectly attributed posts above to me that are not mine... a little bit unsettling lol! Can we fix please??? You have me arguing with myself - which I seldom if ever do. Thx!

LOL. I think that if you alert on the post, a mod will fix the broken quotes.

 

[Hello_Kitty]

The defense may suggest that the scene was staged by TLM to look like a sexual assault and therefore deflect suspicion away from herself as a female ...
JMO

Snipped for space:

I really don't understand why people are suggesting that TLM staged this to look like a sexual assault or that evidence was planted (like the bottle caps). That would mean that she knew before she left Woodstock that she would be blaming this on MR, because I can't imagine her doing this while she was killing Tori nor after. Why would she want to blame her boyfriend at this stage or even at any stage before she was actually caught.

 

[swedie]

As soon as I read about the facial injuries, I thought about him punching her right in the face and breaking her nose and cheekbones. He could have broke the skin in his hand from this and caused his own bleeding from his hand. If he touched his gym bag, he could have mixed his own blood with Tori's blood from him breaking her nose. I've seen the same type of facial injury as described by the chief pathologist and it was done by the person who raped and killed that victim. It took violent force. This facial hit could have caused the gurgling sound and swallowing blood as well as the liver injuries could have made the gurgling sound. Rapists hate their victims, he could have hit her to make her stop crying or because he was disappointed with something. This just makes me think he is responsible for this horrible deviant death. JMO

also: TLM said that Tori was motionless on the ground when she approached the car in her version 2. Why was she motionless? Because she was punched in the face? JMO

:goodpost: Bolded above, totally feel this is what happened MOO.

 

[Macright]

Okay, I have NO IDEA what is going on with these quotes and posts .... Rose of Sharon are you SURE you are doing quotes right because you have incorrectly attributed posts above to me that are not mine... a little bit unsettling lol! Can we fix please??? You have me arguing with myself - which I seldom if ever do. Thx!

sorry but your post has given me a chuckle for once today...:what:

 

[roseofsharon]

<modsnip>

My interpretation of the ME's statements are that he could not make any determinations on that area of TS's body during autopsy based on decomposition in that area of TS's body. To me, there are no absolutes with what he is saying one way or the other.

MOO

 

[Hello_Kitty]

sorry but your post has given me a chuckle for once today...:what:

Me too, I was actually giggling.

 

[swedie]

Or......MTR could have thrown VS to the ground, kicked her repeatedly, and then sat on her chest, pinning her armst to the ground, while he reigned blows down.

BBM: I agree, both are involved.

http://cdn.dipity.com/uploads/events/01ba5a29380fbff8e3daed7cee296a03_1M.png

He gives me the heebie jeebies. Imagine how poor little Tori felt looking at that face, those deviant eyes. :tears: No wonder Tori begged TLM not to leave her alone with him at HD and at the murder scene. Karma happens in prison too.:moo:

No more suffering precious one. Rest in eternal peace, never to remember the evilness that was forced upon your innocent little body and mind. :angel:

 

[Macright]

He gives me the heebie jeebies. Imagine how poor little Tori felt looking at that face, those deviant eyes. :tears: No wonder Tori begged TLM not to leave her alone with him at HD and at the murder scene. Karma happens in prison too.:moo:

No more suffering precious one. Rest in eternal peace, never to remember the evilness that was forced upon your innocent little body and mind. :angel:

I didn't know that little Tori had begged TLM not to leave her alone at the Home Depot store:what:...can you guide me to that link.. thanks....

 

[Macright]

me too, i was actually giggling.

lol...

 

[roseofsharon]

LOL. I think that if you alert on the post, a mod will fix the broken quotes.

Sorry Cha, thank you Salem!!

P.S. I didn't mean to ;-)

 

[matou]

I didn't know that little Tori had begged TLM not to leave her alone at the Home Depot store:what:...can you guide me to that link.. thanks....

But the next stop they made was at a Home Depot in Guelph, where Rafferty gave her cash to go in and buy a claw hammer and some garbage bags, she testified. Tori asked her not to leave her alone with Rafferty, but McClintic promised she would be quick, she said.

http://www.citytv.com/toronto/citynews/topic/Michael_Rafferty_murder_trial/Article/print/193054

 

[Macright]

http://www.citytv.com/toronto/citynews/topic/Michael_Rafferty_murder_trial/Article/print/193054

thank you..I must have missed that...:blushing:

 

[Juris_Prudence]

She was found without underwear or pants/skirt. No clothing on her lower half. That speaks to sexual assault. :moo:

It implies sexual assault maybe, but doesn't prove it in my opinion. Who is to say that TLM didn't remove the child's tights, skirt and panties herself for whatever sick reason? To make it look like a sexual assault perhaps? This would certainly help steer police away from looking at HER as a suspect if that is what she did, she probably figured it would lead police to look for a male suspect more than a female. JMO.

 

[snoofer]

many little children have been raped and lived without the breaking of any ribs and I am sure many of them have tried to fight off the offender..JMO is that she was kicked and stomped on as we heard in court todayfrom a pro...JMO I know it will not be accepted by some but I wonder if now that charge will be dropped because there is no evidence to back it up..unless there is more evidence to come...:twocents:

common sense dictates she was sexually assaulted. She had no undies or pants on. Just because she was hidden so well and evidence was not able to be recovered does not mean that Tori's voice and story should not be told or heard. This is her story and <modsnip> inspite of destroyed evidence...her story supports a sexual assault.:twocents:

 

[swedie]

Just a question for those of you in the legal know.. Does it matter here who yielded the hammer or did the killing blows under Canadian law? If you are present when the killing happens but did not do the actual killing, are you equally as guilty? Or are you innocent to the killing since you did not do the deed yourself? Does the Crowne have to prove that the murder was done by MR, or just within reasonable doubt that he was there when it happened?

Sorry if someone already answered, I have not caught up. In Canada the law is, because MR was there in the commission of the abduction and died while in their custody, whether accidental or deliberate he is guilty. I believe this will be, and has been made very clear to the jurors. HTH