GUILTY TX - Alanna Gallagher, 6, Saginaw, 1 July 2013 - #5

[skibaboo]

I wish we knew what the scale was. AFAIK, there isn't anything identifiable within the frame for us to know if what we're looking at is the size of a silver dollar (like a plastic buckle from fanny pack).....or the size of a fanny pack. :waitasec:

Did the original article that had this picture refer to it as a piece of plastic?

IDK and it's driving me crazy. I think I saw someone say that but haven't seen it myself. I think the only way to gage is by the size of the grain? in the road asphalt? It looks small to me in that comparison so I'm probably way off. Wish we knew more. The only reason I don't think its just a small piece of black bin bag is the lack of sheen which I thought you would see if the camera light was on, which I think it is.

 

[Geneva]

As a person with severe social anxiety, I can tell you for sure that I would not be able to attend a vigil if I was in her shoes.

 

[human]

OT kind of. This is about Albert Desalvo who was the Boston Strangler. He confessed then recanted.

He was just found to be the killer of a victim because of recent advances in DNA identification

http://www.mercurynews.com/nation-world/ci_23642592/boston-strangler-albert-desalvo-dna-test

 

[prima.facie]

Thank you, that is all I have been trying to say all day without coming right out and saying it.

This is not a safe town/city/whatever it is, for any children, even if no one is saying it. In fact, NO ONE had said it is. They have no one in custody and have NOT made announcements to say it is okay to let your children play in your yard. ETA: LE never said anything about safety, that is what no one means.

Forensics on the items found with the child will bring something. That does not happen quickly, like t.v. in an hour or so. The tests take time, sometimes weeks. It is because the tests literally do take time, not just spinning in a vial like on t.v. and most places don't have labs. Even if they did, the tests really do take time, they are not rapid. I'll have to eventually find some links on that for WS, or anyone else can if they want.

Labs are backed up with other murders, including children and adult murders.

I hope all know that their children should only play with an adult outside now. That is of utmost importance.

what you say above is 100% accurate. I am a forensics major. all my classes were taken with current CSI heads teaching my classes (not old school retired nobody's). CSI is not real. But the show causes a real problem called the "CSI effect" where people, including jurors think that results are produced super quick. You are also correct that labs all over the country are severely backed up, lacking staff and funding....and many many cases evidene is sent to private labs which are also backed up. The crime lab in my county is very backed up, but there is no funding to hire more people. In fact, the elected coroner (who by the way has ZERO medical history/education) got elected and fired a bunch of people in order to fix the budget. Now there is a major back up and cases are not being solved as fast as they could. One of my close friends worked for that office and lost her job in the downsizing (politics and crime solving should never be mixed) The next county over just opened up a new crime lab and there are soooooooooooooo many people who are now educated in this (like me) that they had too many people applying and not enough positions (again budget).

I am pretty sure LE have a good idea who did this and how....but until forensics is done and results are back, there is not much more they can do. They will want a very tight case w/ no holes to make sure the evil perp who did this never walks the streets again.

 

[GingerzMomma]

Going back to Opal Jo & why some don't think they got the right perp.....(came across these earlier when it was discussed but didn't have time to post):

Apparently he is actually mildly mentally retarded, so the low-IQ statement is legit. The statement below is from an archive:

"A Wise County court-ordered psychological examination concluded that Franks was a pedophile with mild mental retardation, court documents show."
http://madmax.lmtonline.com/textarchives/0820/s15.htm


Tarrant County prosecutor David Montague said Tuesday he is reviewing evidence and has not decided whether to seek additional charges against Richard Lee Franks... <modsnip>

Franks, who was not charged with murder, was sentenced to the maximum penalty of life in prison because he had a 1991 conviction of indecency with a child in nearby Wise County.

<modsnip> But after his arrest he maintained his innocence, claiming he was coerced into the confession."
http://madmax.lmtonline.com/textarchives/011404/s15.htm



And this bit is really weird:

<modsnip>

VLB, who wears his hair in a ponytail like the description of the kidnapper, said he was in Saginaw the morning Opal was abducted but not at the same time.

<modsnip>

He also told the newspaper that in 1996, he was working on the same Arlington street where 9-year-old Amber Hagerman was abducted.

http://lubbockonline.com/stories/040799/sta_040799087.shtml


Description of abductor & car from family:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.true-crime/2nRcEKdTAiU

Finally, the Tarrant County ME newsletter from Dec 2004 using this case as example of how DNA testing should be used:

"In recent years, it has become customary to conduct post conviction DNA testing when probative biological evidence is present, in order to confirm or refute the guilt of individuals convicted of crimes. Oftentimes, no other means of forensic testing is available and without DNA testing, an innocent individual could continue serving years of imprisonment."
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=richard%20lee%20franks%20dna%

Oddly, this has never happened.

 

[human]

So where s this guy today? How old is he?

 

[prima.facie]

But if they know how she died, why is the most complicated case ever, or whatever he said? Why say that anyway? It is not like they have to announce COD ever, before a trial. So they could just say they are not releasing it.

whats to say that anything LE is saying is how it really is....

and why say anything that lets the perp know they are closing in on them or know who it is. sometimes its better to let the perp think "whew I got away with it" make a mistake, slip up, not fleet, etc...and when LE has a tight case, then they move in.

they have to say something to the public, obviously. but I doubt they will show their cards to the public.

JMO

 

[KateB]

I wish we knew what the scale was. AFAIK, there isn't anything identifiable within the frame for us to know if what we're looking at is the size of a silver dollar (like a plastic buckle from fanny pack).....or the size of a fanny pack. :waitasec:

Did the original article that had this picture refer to it as a piece of plastic?

The picture of the thing was not in an article, but was attached to a tweet by the reporter for WFAA covering the initial scene July 1.

https://twitter.com/twoodard8
the reporter's profile

Direct link to reporter's tweet with picture attached: https://twitter.com/twoodard8/status/351929921033076736

 

[GingerzMomma]

So where s this guy today? How old is he?

According to this he is 43 years old today. In 1999 he was 29 years old.

http://www.texastribune.org/library/data/texas-prisons/inmates/richard-lee-franks/42246/

 

[Pensfan]

So where s this guy today? How old is he?

VLB is 50. He has zero convictions for child abuse, sexual assault, domestic violence, kidnapping, burglary, robbery, opioids, meth, or stimulants. (He might be an old hippie though.) His last known address is in the same county, but very far away from Alanna's neighborhood.

 

[human]

According to this he is 43 years old today. In 1999 he was 29 years old.

http://www.texastribune.org/library/data/texas-prisons/inmates/richard-lee-franks/42246/

Sorry. Not that one. The one with the pony tail. Anyway, I see he is 50

 

[gitana1]

If this picture of the house involved in the shooting is correct and there is a red truck at the residence, I am not so quick to rule it out as something pertaining to this case. Could be a suicide situation and could still be very much connected! :twocents:

I agree.

Going back to Opal Jo & why some don't think they got the right perp.....(came across these earlier when it was discussed but didn't have time to post):

Apparently he is actually mildly mentally retarded, so the low-IQ statement is legit. The statement below is from an archive:

"A Wise County court-ordered psychological examination concluded that Franks was a pedophile with mild mental retardation, court documents show."
http://madmax.lmtonline.com/textarchives/0820/s15.htm


Tarrant County prosecutor David Montague said Tuesday he is reviewing evidence and has not decided whether to seek additional charges against Richard Lee Franks... <modsnip>

Franks, who was not charged with murder, was sentenced to the maximum penalty of life in prison because he had a 1991 conviction of indecency with a child in nearby Wise County.

<modsnip> But after his arrest he maintained his innocence, claiming he was coerced into the confession."
http://madmax.lmtonline.com/textarchives/011404/s15.htm



And this bit is really weird:

<modsnip>

VLB, who wears his hair in a ponytail like the description of the kidnapper, said he was in Saginaw the morning Opal was abducted but not at the same time.

<modsnip>

He also told the newspaper that in 1996, he was working on the same Arlington street where 9-year-old Amber Hagerman was abducted.

http://lubbockonline.com/stories/040799/sta_040799087.shtml


Description of abductor & car from family:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.true-crime/2nRcEKdTAiU

Finally, the Tarrant County ME newsletter from Dec 2004 using this case as example of how DNA testing should be used:

"In recent years, it has become customary to conduct post conviction DNA testing when probative biological evidence is present, in order to confirm or refute the guilt of individuals convicted of crimes. Oftentimes, no other means of forensic testing is available and without DNA testing, an innocent individual could continue serving years of imprisonment."
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=richard lee franks dna%

Oddly, this has never happened.

That's crazy. Why would some guy volunteer such info to the police and even put himself in the vicinity of Amber Hagerman's disappearance when no one asked? Amber disappeared only half an hour's drive from Alanna and Opal, BTW.

 

[Magdalyn]

The picture of the thing was not in an article, but was attached to a tweet by the reporter for WFAA covering the initial scene July 1.

https://twitter.com/twoodard8
the reporter's profile

Direct link to reporter's tweet with picture attached: https://twitter.com/twoodard8/status/351929921033076736

Thank you very much! :seeya: Yeah, the 'tweeter' says "Pic of our camera's screen. FBI evidence collectors appeared to zero in on piece of plastic in road."

So who knows if she thinks it's a piece of plastic or if she knows it's a piece of plastic. (I'd insert a picture of the deeply sighing smiley here, but apparently I've been grounded from using smileys again/used up my quota using waving smiley up there.)

 

[GingerzMomma]

Sorry. Not that one. The one with the pony tail. Anyway, I see he is 50

Huh? This is from Texas Prison inmates record - he's still incarcerated; he was sentenced to life in prison (on a single kidnapping charge).

I guess I'm confused.....where is 50 years old coming from (Pensfan)?

 

[human]

Huh? This is from Texas Prison inmates record - he's still incarcerated; he was sentenced to life in prison (on a single kidnapping charge).

I guess I'm confused.....where is 50 years old coming from (Pensfan)?

In the article you posted, Ginger, it talks about VLB. That is where I got my info. I imagine Pens did as well.

 

[Pensfan]

Huh? This is from Texas Prison inmates record - he's still incarcerated; he was sentenced to life in prison (on a single kidnapping charge).

I guess I'm confused.....where is 50 years old coming from (Pensfan)?

That's Vern's age- the guy who was interrogated for Opal's abduction (because he had a ponytail). He also said he was on the same street when another child was abducted. He may like negative attention, tell wild stories when he is stoned, and/or not be the sharpest tool in the shed, IMO.

 

[GingerzMomma]

In the article you posted, Ginger, it talks about VLB. That is where I got my info. I imagine Pens did as well.

Oh! Thanks human & Pensfan!

I thought we were talking about Franks. I don't know that I think VLB is the guy, but it was interesting that he offered to take lie detector test and they didn't take him up on it. The more interesting parts of that article (IMO) were modsnipped for the 10% rule (I learn something new here everyday, it seems)...... Anyway, it was that there was a lot of discussion at the time that the cars didn't seem to match. Someone in the family also felt that police were hunting random tips more than things that linked to what witnesses (granted, children) described.

Another thought I had: Opal's skeletal remains were found w/ her pink Barbie shoes on.

What happened to her clothes? Could they have possibly completely decayed over 4-5 years? I have a hard time believing that.

 

[Pensfan]

Oh! Thanks human & Pensfan!

I thought we were talking about Franks. I don't know that I think VLB is the guy, but it was interesting that he offered to take lie detector test and they didn't take him up on it. The more interesting parts of that article (IMO) were modsnipped for the 10% rule (I learn something new here everyday, it seems)...... Anyway, it was that there was a lot of discussion at the time that the cars didn't seem to match. Someone in the family also felt that police were hunting random tips more than things that linked to what witnesses (granted, children) described.

Another thought I had: Opal's skeletal remains were found w/ her pink Barbie shoes on.

What happened to her clothes? Could they have possibly completely decayed over 4-5 years? I have a hard time believing that.

Page 28 of this unknown person's thesis shows the rate of decay for varying fabrics based on the location variables (soil ph, elements in the soil, temperature) of his/her chosen testing site.
http://etd.lsu.edu/docs/available/etd-0407103-131120/unrestricted/Gordon_thesis.pdf

 

[Mitsana]

<snip>

I've been thinking about this for days, I thought it looked like material, bandana? Bit of rag, even thought it was motor oil at one point. <snip>

Apparently, it was a piece of plastic (I'm thinking part of a garbage bag). Here is the tweet that accompanied the pic:

"Pic of our camera's screen. FBI evidence collectors appeared to zero in on piece of plastic in road"

From: https://twitter.com/twoodard8

 

[GingerzMomma]

Okay, here's the link again: http://lubbockonline.com/stories/040799/sta_040799087.shtml

To paraphrase what I thought was interesting with respect to why there remains doubt regarding Franks in Opal Jo's death (VLB, aside)....the article is regarding a car described as "similar" being searched & seized on April 7 (she was abducted March 26). The girl's uncle states there is no evidence linking anything they found up to that point, and that the search & seizure of this vehicle was based on a "tip". He also said there was debate as to just how similar (or not) that car was to the one described.

To my knowledge, I'm not aware that any physical evidence was found in that car or presented in court? Anyone?