GUILTY TX - Alanna Gallagher, 6, Saginaw, 1 July 2013 - #8

[pinkfly]

Here is some information about chromatic aberrations. Cheaper lenses and high contrast (like back-lit leaves) often leave purple fringing. Scroll down to bottom example.

http://www.dpreview.com/glossary/optical/chromatic-aberration

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I don't think it matters whether Saginaw is rural, suburban, or urban. Half of all murders in the town in 14 years have been children abducted while playing outside by a stranger (possibly) and brutally murdered. That would be weird for a city of any population.

 

[SCHMAE]

I don't think it matters whether Saginaw is rural, suburban, or urban. Half of all murders in the town in 14 years have been children abducted while playing outside by a stranger (possibly) and brutally murdered. That would be weird for a city of any population.

I agree with you . I only mention it smaller and near a bigger city because I wonder if some seedier type perp may have come from FW or another local bigger town into Saginaw. But let's face it, that's wishful thinking. No matter how tiny and small and quaint your town is, there are SICKOS living in it!

 

[blue22]

I don't think it matters whether Saginaw is rural, suburban, or urban. Half of all murders in the town in 14 years have been children abducted while playing outside by a stranger (possibly) and brutally murdered. That would be weird for a city of any population.

I guess I think 4 murders over 14 years are the kind of statistics you want, when you live in an area as huge as this. I truly don't find 2 child murders (even if it's half) in a large population over 14 years, strange. The Dallas metroplex, as a whole, has one of the higher murder rates in the country. I'm a bit surprised there haven't been more, to be honest. 2 adbuctions/ murders in a rapidly growing city over 14 years, still makes this crime exceedingly rare.

I just think maybe we are looking for a trend, that really isn't there. Just a differing of opinions, and that's OK.

**I should say, I find ANY child murder and abduction strange. Morally, personally, emotionally. Statistically, I do not.

 

[:+:MrTT:+:]

I don't mind scrolling. But would it be possible to have a separate thread for the discussions of the vehicles.

 

[Snoopster]

Thank you for the map. I don't know about the clump of trees being the scene of the murder. Why not just leave her there in the woods that are thick and overgrown? Why risk being seen with a deceased body? Just some thoughts.

Also, the route doesn't make sense. It seems illogical to take that route in order to dispose of her body. Why did the person take that route, I'm wondering. Why not just head out of either neighborhood onto Old Decatur Road? There has to be a reason she was taken into the neighborhood where she was found on the other side of W. McLeroy Blvd. Which makes me wonder if that is where the crimes against her ultimately happened? JMHO and I have nothing to support this speculation except using the walk feature on google maps---but I think she was taken from her neighborhood and didn't cross W. McLeroy on her own. Meaning I don't think she was abducted from the Cindy Ln neighborhood where she was found. I think she was transported there either alive or deceased. But if she were deceased already why?

So if she was taken from her neighborhood alive then why go into the other neighborhood? Why not head out into open territory so the crimes that were committed against her could be done in relative isolation and/or privacy? ETA: Did they want to take her to their own home?

JMHO but I think this is a local living in either of those neighborhoods at this point in time. It would be someone that none of the neighbors would ever suspect. They would probably say after an arrest "But they were the nicest person, never in a million years would I have suspected...".

Just where my thoughts are today. Again, thank you for the map.

I agree that this is a key point.

What do we know? AG was already deceased at time her body was dumped at Cindy/Roundrock. The perp was heading away from the spot where she was killed. So the ultimate question is why was the vehicle at that particular spot?

Two possible scenarios are:

1) The perp(s) intentionally dumped the body there to direct investigators away from another neighborhood. But, it seems like an odd place to drop a body as there's too great a chance of the perp being seen.

2) The more likely scenario in my mind is that the perp was heading away from the kill spot in that neighborhood. So what locations would cause someone to go through that intersection? The general area seems very open, so there is a good chance that AG was taken to someone's home. Most of the roads in that area lead straight out to Old Decatur. That leaves houses along Woodcrest, Roundrock (Dr. and Loop) and a small part of Cindy as key ones to focus on.

Here's a map highlighting those houses.
http://goo.gl/maps/EeYH4

I've included the house on the NW corner of Cindy/Roundrock even though they wouldn't drive through the intersection, because if someone was in a too big of a hurry backing out of the driveway and then accelerated forward, a body might be able to slide out of an open truck bed and end up near the intersection. (a longshot, I know)

Of course she could have been killed right in a vehicle, rather than a house, but the vehicle would have to be big enough allow for attacking an binding poor Alanna.

Just some thoughts.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I guess I think 4 murders over 14 years are the kind of statistics you want, when you live in an area as huge as this. I truly don't find 2 child murders (even if it's half) in a large population over 14 years, strange. The Dallas metroplex, as a whole, has one of the higher murder rates in the country. I'm a bit surprised there haven't been more, to be honest. 2 adbuctions/ murders in a rapidly growing city over 14 years, still makes this crime exceedingly rare.

I just think maybe we are looking for a trend, that really isn't there. Just a differing of opinions, and that's OK.

**I should say, I find ANY child murder and abduction strange. Morally, personally, emotionally. Statistically, I do not.

But I'm not talking about the entire DFW area. I am just talking about Saginaw. Saginaw has a population of 20,000. They've had about four murders in 14 years. Two of them were children abducted and murdered. Can you imagine if half of all murders in NYC were stranger abductions of kids?

I live in a county of 800,000 people. We are part of the NYC Metro Area. Very densely populated. We haven't had a similar case in 20 years (and more).

 

[CherBearSTL]

Look at it this way. Saginaw has a population of 20,000 people. From 1999-2006, there were two murders. I don't know how many from 2007-2013 but let's say there were again two murders in that time span. So that's four murders in 14 years. One case is Opal's, on case is Alanna's. So half of the murders in Saginaw in 14 years involve a child being abducted and murdered by a predator. That's really off.

Interesting point. I live in St. Louis, MO and I could only think of 3 cases, but they were stranger abductions without murder (Shawn Hornbeck, Ben Ownby and another girl that was abducted and dropped off at a carwash because of intense media coverage. I can't think of any stranger/child murders, and this is a very large metropolitan area.

Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using Tapatalk 2

 

[human]

The vehicles look like kid ones because of the black hub caps on the wheel areas.

I have my original 2001 Honda. My dream has been to have a car that makes it to the 20 year mark. We all have our own issues, no?

Anyway, it has it's original wheel stuff. Anyway, what's with the black unless it's something kids of a certain age like to do?

I was thinking that maybe if the car is really old, the wheels are replaced with black? But my car is pretty old and the wheels, I hope, are fine

 

[Linda7NJ]

Ohmyblobs ! Good eye. you're right. Those trees' shadows are from directly overhead. But I will say in Texas in the afternoon, that bad boy shines from straight above until about 2 pm ish. I'll try to remember today to keep a peak outside until it starts to move the trees' shadows and report back. Someone help me remember.

So.... Noon- 2pm the sun could still be overhead. At noon she was seen by verified friend and mom, when they left Alanna was still at home & doing chores.

LE is saying these two vehicles were sighted around the time of the tarp placement. Or possible abduction time? Which is correct?

Timeline is still making zero sense. If she was last seen by a dad @4pm

IMO

 

[Marnie]

Just going back and trying to piece together a possible timeline.

Looking for the article that mentions a "grandfather" who said he saw Alanna the afternoon she went missing, playing on his front lawn with his grandchildren.

Anyone know where I can locate that article? TIA

 

[mysticrose]

Just going back and trying to piece together a possible timeline.

Looking for the article that mentions a "grandfather" who said he saw Alanna the afternoon she went missing, playing on his front lawn with his grandchildren.

Anyone know where I can locate that article? TIA

Give me a second and I'll post it right here....brb

Sorry son is downloading something and it's making my computer really slow. Here it is:
____________________________________________________________________________

Street where slain child lived reopened in Saginaw; investigators release little info .

The FBI meticulously combed through every inch of the house. Agents removed boxes.

They interviewed neighbors, one of whom told police he last saw the little girl in his front yard around 2 p.m. She was playing with his grandchildren.

By 7:30 p.m., she was discovered dead.

http://www.khou.com/news/texas-news?fId=214092951&fPath=/news/local/&fDomain=10247

 

[alterholic]

But I'm not talking about the entire DFW area. I am just talking about Saginaw. Saginaw has a population of 20,000. They've had about four murders in 14 years. Two of them were children abducted and murdered. Can you imagine if half of all murders in NYC were stranger abductions of kids?

I live in a county of 800,000 people. We are part of the NYC Metro Area. Very densely populated. We haven't had a similar case in 20 years (and more).

I think the point the poster was trying to make is that you really can't separate a suburb like Saginaw from the surrounding area in DFW.

For example, I grew up in a house that was in City A, had an address from City B, my next door neighbor had an address from City C and the guy down the road lived in City D. Property lines and town limits are a strange science in this area. I think they can tend to skew statistics.

I agree that it's weird and a point to be considered. BUT in this area (and I honestly don't know if this is the same elsewhere), all of the suburbs blend with bigger towns. So the fact that two murders were "IN" Saginaw wouldn't be as odd as two murders in a place where towns DO have more of a separation.

Looking at the huge time gap between the two Saginaw cases - I think it's unlikely that they are related, but I also wouldn't be so sure as to put money on it.

Just trying to give an insight to non-locals! :seeya:

 

[blue22]

But I'm not talking about the entire DFW area. I am just talking about Saginaw. Saginaw has a population of 20,000. They've had about four murders in 14 years. Two of them were children abducted and murdered. Can you imagine if half of all murders in NYC were stranger abductions of kids?

I live in a county of 800,000 people. We are part of the NYC Metro Area. Very densely populated. We haven't had a similar case in 20 years (and more).

I totally understand what you are saying. I live here, I get it

What I'm saying is, you can't really JUST consider Saginaw, because Saginaw is part of a larger community. Saginaw is not separated from other communities. They are all connected very easily by several major highways, neighborhoods, and cities. While the population of Saginaw is 20,000, that really isn't accurate considering it is really only part of the much larger population. (To be very honest, it's hard to imagine what I'm trying to explain, unless you live here. There are only technical city lines around here, not actual separation from other cities.)
The COUNTY Saginaw is in has a population is 1.85 million. The metroplex they are in the middle of is over 6 million. Similar cases are not odd, just because they involve children. We have murders that are similar all the time here, and it doesn't mean there is an epidemic.
Oh, and NYC has a lower murder and violent crime rate then DFW. Ours is very high.

Sorry, I'm not trying to argue. I'm just struggling to communicate what I want to!! I talk much better then I type.

 

[alterholic]

What is everyone's opinion on the Crime Reports map? In the last six months, does anyone see any patterns with assault/RSOs/etc in the immediate surrounding area of Saginaw?

I did an advanced search earlier, but I'm not sure what would strike experienced sleuthers as "odd" (if anything)?

https://www.crimereports.com/

 

[Linda7NJ]

Give me a second and I'll post it right here....brb

Sorry son is downloading something and it's making my computer really slow. Here it is:
____________________________________________________________________________

Street where slain child lived reopened in Saginaw; investigators release little info .

The FBI meticulously combed through every inch of the house. Agents removed boxes.

They interviewed neighbors, one of whom told police he last saw the little girl in his front yard around 2 p.m. She was playing with his grandchildren.

By 7:30 p.m., she was discovered dead.

http://www.khou.com/news/texas-news?...&fDomain=10247

So if that's true. The car photos were taken around the same time period. If speculation about the shadow placement is accurate. The car/cars would have needed to stay in the area until sometime AfTER 4 pm when dad last claims to have seen her.

I think "lingering" is a shorter time span than 2+hrs. IMO

 

[Linda7NJ]

Give me a second and I'll post it right here....brb

Sorry son is downloading something and it's making my computer really slow. Here it is:
____________________________________________________________________________

Street where slain child lived reopened in Saginaw; investigators release little info .

The FBI meticulously combed through every inch of the house. Agents removed boxes.

They interviewed neighbors, one of whom told police he last saw the little girl in his front yard around 2 p.m. She was playing with his grandchildren.

By 7:30 p.m., she was discovered dead.

http://www.khou.com/news/texas-news?...&fDomain=10247

can't find the article it links me to Six Flags story

 

[blue22]

I think the point the poster was trying to make is that you really can't separate a suburb like Saginaw from the surrounding area in DFW.

For example, I grew up in a house that was in City A, had an address from City B, my next door neighbor had an address from City C and the guy down the road lived in City D. Property lines and town limits are a strange science in this area. I think they can tend to skew statistics.

I agree that it's weird and a point to be considered. BUT in this area (and I honestly don't know if this is the same elsewhere), all of the suburbs blend with bigger towns. So the fact that two murders were "IN" Saginaw wouldn't be as odd as two murders in a place where towns DO have more of a separation.

Looking at the huge time gap between the two Saginaw cases - I think it's unlikely that they are related, but I also wouldn't be so sure as to put money on it.

Just trying to give an insight to non-locals! :seeya:

Thank you! I think you explained it much better. City lines are totally arbitrary here, and don't actually mean anything. I live down the street from my parents, and they are in a different city. Our family friend lives 3 blocks down and they are in a different city then both of us. MY city has close to 20,000, my parents city has nearly 100,000, and our friend's city has 68,000. All within a few blocks.

 

[mysticrose]

can't find the article it links me to Six Flags story

Try this one, I fixed it in my earlier post:

http://www.khou.com/news/texas-news?fId=214092951&fPath=/news/local/&fDomain=10247

 

[briTCU]

What is everyone's opinion on the Crime Reports map? In the last six months, does anyone see any patterns with assault/RSOs/etc in the immediate surrounding area of Saginaw?

I did an advanced search earlier, but I'm not sure what would strike experienced sleuthers as "odd" (if anything)?

https://www.crimereports.com/

Thank you for posting this link! When I showed my husband he said, "uh-oh" lol he already knows I'm going to spend hours on it.