TX - Jonathan Foster, 12, Houston, 24 Dec 2010 - Mona Nelson charged w/ Murder - #11

[everyoneneedsavoice]

Thank you everyoneneedsavoice! I remember being horrified about Tynesha's case when it happened. My sympathy, which seems completely inadequate, to you and your family!!! I don't suppose there is any chance MN could have known Shepherd or had ever worked at Red Oak Place Apartments? In regards to your idea about the traffic cams, that would be fantastic if they worked like that!!! I rarely can find traffic cams that have any sort of visually useful historical data. I remember in the Natalee Holloway case, there were some "beach cams" that had some historical data. I spent too much time pouring over those images hoping to find something of use. Maybe LE has access to much better info than we do. I bet they don't have the manpower to sit and pour over the information like we would, however!!! :websleuther:

Thank you for the condolences.

Actually, HPD does have dedicated staff to "man" / watch the cameras. I was surprised when first learning this myself...as this was the first time I had seen such technology used.

<<snipped>>

HPD tied analytics associated with crimes to incident locations, providing insights into specific incidents and trends. For example, those dealing with a crime scene can analyze all the statistics around the area, looking at what has happened within a time frame and even seeing parolees and sex offenders in the area. Users can also zoom in on a neighborhood, block or street, and see houses, cars, yards and fields.

In addition, crime center analysts have real-time access to Houston 9-1-1 calls, where they watch on a rolling screen as calls and messages go between the dispatcher and the car. Analysts work 24/7 analyzing data, generating reports on the fly, and providing information to officers in the field. Recently, for example, the emergency center received a disturbance call, and while the officers were being dispatched to the scene, analysts ran the name, found out the man creating the disturbance was a fugitive, and alerted the officers, who arrived at the scene knowing he was a fugitive and arrested him.

http://www.hendonpub.com/resources/articlearchive/details.aspx?ID=207950


Houston Police Chief Harold Hurtt said the system will enable the department to recognize crime activity and trends as they happen. He also said the data can be used in homicide investigations to "freeze all the activity that was going within a mile of that homicide (at the time of the crime)," such as reports of speeding vehicles, or other suspicious activity.

"All of that will be captured," Hurtt said on Monday. "So by the time the detective responds (to the crime scene) he will have all that."

<<snipped>>

Every crime that happens in the city, immediately when it happens, shows up with written details and pops up on a giant map on the wall in the center. The officers and analysts in the room then immediately start working to solve the crime.

Initial staffing plans for the crime center call for 20 criminal intelligence analysts and 20 police officers, paired into teams and working at the headquarter site. At any given time, three or four teams will operate, on rotating shifts.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/5236601.html

"Increased technology allows us to be able to, like you've heard a million times, do more with less. When it comes to increased technology, this is the place (HPD's 24/7 Crime Center). We have the real time information to help the officers. We have the databases to do research," says HPD Captain Charles Dunn, which means HPD solves crimes faster.

"We monitor TranStar cameras and we can monitor all the downtown cameras. If we see something of interest we can zoom in on it, get a license plate on a car," says Dunn.


http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/news/scitech/101123-houston-crime-rates


Lots of information there and other places. It's truly amazing.

 

[impatientredhead]

After having transcribed the short probable cause hearing today I realized that it was not just the poor and shoddy reporting that phone calls were labeled as "threatening"..
The D.A.'s office stated that when Angela was on her way home "that she received a mysterious phone call from her residence with a woman making 'threatening' remarks towards her son{JF}"..

Since having heard this directly from the DA's mouth I now am perceiving that there were definitely threats made by Mona towards Jonathan in that last phone call between her and mom.. I am assuming that we will not know what those threats were or why until this goes to trial..

Also now knowing this the video from early on of mom and DD where mom starts to go into detail about the phone calls with the "raspy voiced woman" and we saw DD tell her to be careful about giving too much detail of the calls.. At that time many saw this as DD being controlling and that it even possibly was indicative of DD having something to hide with regard to those calls.. But now knowing this detail from the DA's mouth that there were indeed threats made toward Jonathan in that call.{and it being SOP for LE to tell family notto share certain details with the media that LE have decided do not need to be known by the public for a multitude of reasons}.. I now I see DD's remark to mom as nothing more than a reminder of possibly what LE had told them{NOT AT ALL INDICATIVE OF ANYTHING NEFARIOUS}..

If threats were made against during that call why not call the police?
Why look for him at the playground?
Why lie about the babysitter?

 

[Crosby87]

I had just had a shower and there is all this talk of sociopath, serial killer etc and I am wondering if the true motive is not something more simple.

I do beleive this woman is a weird, sadistic, angry, violent person who I am sure has had a abusive childhood.

Has anyone heard any comments made from SE????? I would be very interested to know the state of their friendship. I dont think MN had too many friends judging by comments made about her ie hard to understand, etc. Maybe SE was more special to MN than vice versa and SE was distancing herself and hadnt invited her over for christmas or something similar.

what if the scenario went like this

MN goes over to see SE either in a rage due to breakup of friendship or
just to pop over to see her

She gets there and no adult is home. she either lets herself in
or Jonathon lets her in

She is either ranting or raving OR as we know she has a criminal background, sees the opportunity to steal something, be it jewellery, money, drugs...

Jonathon knows something is wrong, calls him mum at work, hence the emergency call to mum......Mona hangs up, mum rings back and mona answers.....knows she is in the poo poo either because jonathon has seen her doing something or she is just in some form of a rage......

Takes Jonathon and phone........in her rage or to stop him talking, kills jonathon with what she has available..the blow torch.

Another thing that baffles me is why the woman at SE's bothered to answer AD's phone call?

 

[Crosby87]

Maybe she didn't lock up the front door. Maybe MN entered and then exited with JF by way of a side or back door???

This is why I wanted to know how many exits there are at SE's cottage.

 

[georgiajean]

Sure, but why bother to lock the barn door when you're already getting away with stealing the horse? So to speak.

And why would a kidnapper care about preventing accidental access by someone arriving after him/her?

It just strikes me as weird that Mona would have bothered to lock the door behind her. Even if it only took an action as small as pressing a button.

Unless MN and JF went out the door together, like MN was taking him somewhere and JF was okay with it. I could see JF carefully locking the door behind him, being the responsible kid doing what his mom had asked (always lock the door behind you, JF...). This would make sense if the phone calls happened outside the house, after JF was in MN's custody in her truck, but close enough so the cordless phone still worked. IMO.

 

[Jolynna]

Wasnt there another case where a girl was murdered and the other girl who murdered her pretended to support and grieve with the girl's family? I think I remember she even moved in with the murdered girl's family and all along she was the one who had murdered her.

Does anyone remember that case?

imo

Wasn't there a Lifetime Movie made about this case? Patty Duke played the victim's mother and I am thinking the girl who was Darlene on Rosanne played the role of the murderer.

 

[Crosby87]

I wonder if it would have been helpful if LE had taken scent dogs over to SE's to follow JF's scent?

 

[Crosby87]

Great points.
LE claim JF was abducted, in fact the initial charge was going to be kidnapping (then the tape arrived). This means Jason was taken from the house alive. (You can't kidnap a body).

Even if he knew MN, wouldn't the earlier threats (per the phone calls) have made him fearful and hesitant?

At what point does threatening, angry and enraged switch to allow him to collect his stuffed toy?This crime required very swift movements, involved much rage and yet the cottage remained undisturbed, the door was locked, and a cuddly toy was missing?

And put his shoes on. AD said JF was wearing black and white runners. As a general rule, do kids wear their shoes inside the house? Did JF wear his shoes in the house or did he put them on when the perp was there?

 

[georgiajean]

And put his shoes on. AD said JF was wearing black and white runners. As a general rule, do kids wear their shoes inside the house? Did JF wear his shoes in the house or did he put them on when the perp was there?

Depends on the adults' rules/expectations, I think. I have a no shoe policy in my house, just because I live in a wet, muddy climate, and it saves the floors and need for cleaning. I know other people who have houses where everyone keeps their shoes on. And there are kids who, despite the house rule of no shoes, keep their shoes on because they forget. If JF hadn't gone outside yet, I would bet he was wearing socks in the house. If he had gone outside to play or check on his neighbor, he might have left his shoes on when he returned. (Clearly I need to go to bed. Not sure I needed to write a whole paragraph about shoes.)

 

[SmoothOperator]

If threats were made against during that call why not call the police?
Why look for him at the playground?
Why lie about the babysitter?

Your above post is the one thing that I cannot find a satisfactory reason that could possibly explain the why...

Everything else IMO I can say I have been able to come to a satisfactory reason for "it"{actions, behaviors, statements, etc}..

But it is the one last phonecall and all that the call entails{which includes the questions in your above post}.

First, I need to know why in the world that Mona would answer that last call at the residence? why after according to mom she had called repeatedly while on her way home but was getting no answer.. and then finally when Angela was literally just a few short minutes from arriving home, all of a sudden Mona chooses to answer that call.. I cannot come up with a reason that makes sense to me why and what reasoning could she have had to make her answer that call???

Secondly, everyone is seeming to agree{atleast at varying degrees}that MN was somewhat known to AD, DD, and JF..with LE stating that MN was an acquaintance that came and went from the cottage where mom and son were living..and that yes MN was familiar with JF..So, knowing that just how in he!! is it possible that first, MN strangely decides to answer that phone call, and second, why in the he!! would MN be asking JF if his mom was Angela?..Even if just an aquaintance she would know whom was Jonathan's mother..KWIM?

and lastly of course is the questions that you have asked in your ^above post{that according to DA this last call was "threatening" remarks from Mona towards Jonathan..and that AD heard these "threats" obviously}..
Then how in the he!! is it that she DOES NOT choose to immediately call in LE, why would she go look in area courtyards and playgrounds? ..
If she had just spoken with a woman who heard with your own ears was there in your house with your 12 year old son and you heard with your own ears threats made directly towards your 12 yr old son..why when you arrived 5 mins later from time of the call at the duplex and there is not trace of your son whatsoever..why would you go look in courtyard or park{as if he'd just voluntarily walked out of that duplex of his own free will just go walking and playing around}..

YOU HAD JUST HEARD A STRANGER ON THE OTHER END OF THE CALL THAT WAS COMING FROM YOUR RESIDENCE WHERE THIS STRANGER WAS ALONE WITH YOUR CHILD, AND EVEN TO GO A STEP FURTHER YOU HEAR THIS STRANGER THREATENING YOUR CHILD?
WHY OR HOW COULD U POSSIBLY THINK ANYTHING OTHER WAS EVEN REMOTELY A POSSIBILITY OTHER THAN THE FACT THAT HE HAD BEEN TAKEN BY THIS STRANGER WHOM 5 MINS PRIOR YOU HAD HEARD MAKE THREATS TO THAT CHILD???

So, ya see EVERYTHING IN AND/OR AROUND AND PERTAINING TO IN ANY WAY TO THAT LAST PHONE CALL I CANNOT COME UP WITH ANY SATISFACTORY REASONS THAT WOULD MAKE THE CHOICES UNDERSTANDABLE???

 

[georgiajean]

On FB, there is a page for JF.
http://www.facebook.com/#!/justice.for.jonathan.foster

There is a comment that was posted there. Unfortunately, they have not linked the original source, so who knows where it came from. Anyway, it lays out a scenario that actually makes some sense, especially when paired with the last two comments on MN's myspace.

Also, there are some really sweet pics of JF there, that I haven't seen elsewhere. What a brilliant light of a boy.

ETA: I found the original source of the comment quoted on the FB page. It's in the comments of this article/blog: http://www..com/2010/12/woman-to-be-charged-with-murder-of-missing-houston-boy/#comments

 

[Crosby87]

I understand having questions. I would like to know why MN was fired from her maintenance job. I would think she may have been living in the apartment complex and after she was fired she was forced to move into the empty duplex. If it didn't have electricity or water, she was basically homeless and trespassing. How anyone missed her big truck outside the duplex is beyond me.

I have thought this crime might be related to a drug deal that went bad or a payment for drugs that was not made. Or, MN was jealous of AD for moving in with MN's friend especially if MN was homeless. Now I could see MN becoming outraged by any of these events and she went seeking payment, a confrontation, or revenge. I could see AD, DD, SE not even knowing MN was out there with this pent-up rage. The anger she felt was in her mind and not something she expressed to them until that Friday and Jonathan was the person she encountered first and finally. Her first visit to the house may have been nothing more than a quick stop by. Nothing to make Jonathan suspicious or nervous. Not enough to even have him mention it to DD. She could have just asked if SE was home or some excuse to see who was home -- a scouting trip. When DD came and went, she may have sat brooding over whatever was making her mad and she decided to strike. The second time Jonathan had her at the door would have probably scared him and consequently he called his mom. When AD called back, MN was in the house and MN knew she had to leave and take Jonathan. He could identify her or she wanted to hurt him. I know it is a stretch but there is a motive to this, and I can make a case in my mind where AD, DD, and SE were not involved. I think MN is ruthless but I do not think she is smart. She will slip up. Right now, the best she could do was cook up the excuse she was paid to dispose of a crate and that didn't hold water. Maybe she saw DD when he came to the house to check on Jonathan and she thought she could use him as her fall guy. Time will tell, and I think, eventually, the entire truth will come out.

At the pressor, Captain Gott said “MN had been released from her duties several months prior but people said she came around a lot.”

It was discussed in a previous thread that MN was “laid off” by her employer because the buildings she maintained were shut down due to code violations and she was not “fired” due to poor performance or for doing anything wrong.

 

[SmoothOperator]

Quick question that Ive been wanting to know the answer to for a couple days now..

Do we know for sure that the cordless phone was indeed TAKEN/STOLEN from the duplex?

I know that we heard several mention this early in the case at one point early in Harris said print interview that cordless phone was missing..but then we have not heard anymore about it missing..and certainly when Angela spoke about what was missing from the home she stated "that the ONLY THINGS MISSING FROM THE RESIDENCE WAS GUITAR SHIRT, SNEAKERS, AND THE STUFFED TOY THAT WAS GIVEN BY HER GRANDMOTHER..

NOTHING AT ALL ABOUT THE CORDLESS PHONE..So, do we know for sure that the cordless phone is for A fact actually missing from the residence..

TIA to anyone who knows

 

[claudicici]

AD's comment baffles me too. Did AD ever retract her claim that the door was locked when she returned? LE did not give any details about the door during the presser and a media report I posted earlier didn't say AD unlocked the door before she entered the cottage when she returned, so I am glad there is a video where AD said she unlocked the door.

IMO, 99% of the doors to dwellings have to be locked on the outside with a key and the door knobs with push buttons aren't common because they are too easy to pick. I can't think of a place where I didn't need a key to lock the main door.

If it was the cottage,not the apartement it may have been the cheap lock that you can lock from the inside.
Watching the old footage again,I think I may be able to make sense of what is being said,keeping in mind that AD was ashamed that Jonathan was left alone.
I think Jonathan was at the cottage (the babysitters house,not really a lie after all) and ran to the apartement at 01:45PM and that's when the stepdad saw him.Maybe Stepdad did not come to check on him ,that's what really confused me and made me suspicious all along.But it would make sense if Jonathan went to the apartement ,picked up a video game and shortly thereafter Mona returned.

 

[georgiajean]

Quick question that Ive been wanting to know the answer to for a couple days now..

Do we know for sure that the cordless phone was indeed TAKEN/STOLEN from the duplex?

I know that we heard several mention this early in the case at one point early in Harris said print interview that cordless phone was missing..but then we have not heard anymore about it missing..and certainly when Angela spoke about what was missing from the home she stated "that the ONLY THINGS MISSING FROM THE RESIDENCE WAS GUITAR SHIRT, SNEAKERS, AND THE STUFFED TOY THAT WAS GIVEN BY HER GRANDMOTHER..

NOTHING AT ALL ABOUT THE CORDLESS PHONE..So, do we know for sure that the cordless phone is for A fact actually missing from the residence..

TIA to anyone who knows

If you do a google search of JF and cordless phone, you come up with a lot of reporters saying this. In the transcript for the NG show that covered JF, there's a reporter (Gomez) talking about the missing phone. AD is the one who told reporters about the missing phone. It never came from LE as far as I can tell.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1012/28/ng.01.html

 

[Openmind]

At the pressor, Captain Gott said “MN had been released from her duties several months prior but people said she came around a lot.”

It was discussed in a previous thread that MN was “laid off” by her employer because the buildings she maintained were shut down due to code violations and she was not “fired” due to poor performance or for doing anything wrong.

Thanks for the info.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Izzy :wave: you made me think two things:

1-if she has been doing apartment maintenance and has been used to using a key to access apts for whatever purpose & then leaving, she would be used to locking the place when she left.

and 2 - AFAIK we do not know how JF left the house. We know his computer was still on, but that doesn't mean he was dragged out struggling or that he was incapacitated inside his home and taken out in some kind of cover. JF may have locked the door after himself if he trusted that he was leaving with someone to "go meet his mom" or some other excuse.

I trust that LE has coated that place looking for fingerprints, including the doorknob/lock.

Excellent theories that I hadn't thought of, Y. Very sensible. Thanks and :wave: back atcha.

 

[claudicici]

On FB, there is a page for JF.
http://www.facebook.com/#!/justice.for.jonathan.foster

There is a comment that was posted there. Unfortunately, they have not linked the original source, so who knows where it came from. Anyway, it lays out a scenario that actually makes some sense, especially when paired with the last two comments on MN's myspace.

Also, there are some really sweet pics of JF there, that I haven't seen elsewhere. What a brilliant light of a boy.

ETA: I found the original source of the comment quoted on the FB page. It's in the comments of this article/blog: http://www..com/2010/12/woman-to-be-charged-with-murder-of-missing-houston-boy/#comments

I don't buy that MN had a romantic relationship with SE.Just from looking at her myspace her type are really pretty young girls.I'm much more inclined to believe that the connection was drugs.One thing I do believe out of MN's mouth is that they were partying together.She may have been selling and that's how they know her.I think it's much more plausible that this was about a drug debt than a romantic relationship.

 

[impatientredhead]

I don't buy that MN had a romantic relationship with SE.Just from looking at her myspace her type are really pretty young girls.I'm much more inclined to believe that the connection was drugs.One thing I do believe out of MN's mouth is that they were partying together.She may have been selling and that's how they know her.I think it's much more plausible that this was about a drug debt than a romantic relationship.

Mona may prefer young/hot girls but I highly doubt that has precluded relationships with people outside that demographic.

 

[Openmind]

Trusting and sweet to the end

Jonathan Foster's wish to live with his mom came true &#8212; and put him in harm's way

When Jonathan Paul Foster is buried in South Park Cemetery in Pearland on Tuesday, he will be the first interred in a family plot that will someday hold his grandparents.

That Jonathan eventually will rest with his family offered a little solace to relatives of the 12-year-old boy killed on Christmas Eve, his remains charred and left in a drainage culvert in Houston.

By all accounts, it is an unspeakably sad end for a boy whose family members described him as deeply loving and affectionate. Even after bouncing from house to house in his 12 years &#8212; living with his mother, his grandmother and an uncle &#8212; he still had the trust of an innocent child.

"He was just so sweet and submissive, always looking for a hug," said Glenn Scrimsher, 33, Jonathan's uncle who raised him from the time he was 6 until a year ago, when his grandmother, Mary Gifford, sent for him in Channelview. "I bet he didn't even put up a fight."

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/7362771.html