Snipped.
But when the story likely didn't hit the press for a few days, even people who are really good with faces and may remember one or more of the girls likely won't remember the exact day, time, or place when they saw someone.
Unless someone had direct, personal interaction with them I don't put much weight behind random sightings. Too many people have been "seen" long after they were really dead in missing person cases over the years.
In general yes, but I think that in this case there is quite a chance for the opposite.
It's not a random day, it's before Christmas. So higher chances that many people in the mall didn't just get to the mall, but had to schedule this trip, plan it, this may be a big deal to go there to buy gifts (for some people it is, less now cause we can order things online, but then it could be like one in a few months, maybe one in a year time when they went to the mall and checked many stores in search for gifts).
And what to do later? At least where I live it was complaining how crowded it was, chatting with friends, family and neighbours about everything that could be considered odd or unusual.
I'd be much more skeptical if these sightings from the mall were just like "
oh, I think that I saw these girls there on that day, one wore this cute bright yellow shirt and everything seems fine".
But no, all three I found mentioned so far are of the things that'd stood out. They're all very probable as something that average person would remember for quite a bit.
Is it unusual scenario that store clerk remembers seeig a friend in his store and chatting with her companion?
For me not at all, I would remember that. I'd probably feel bit disappointed that I didn't get a chance to exchange few words with a friend, likely also take a note that her companion seemed nice or wore some memorable shirt.
Second whitness was that old lady that (not exactly) came forward weeks ago and told clerks what she saw.
And she saw a girl being forced into a car where already were two other girls and a man. This is not something that majority of people would consider as normal.
LE failed to locate her but we don't know if it was due to lack of trying.
Three months passed but as the clerks said, it was an elderly woman. So high chance that she may visit the mall rarely. On the 23rd, before Christmas, and sometime in early March, maybe that was her before-Easter shopping trip?
No idea what "elderly" meant for the clerks, but... over 60? Older? She may figure that as long as she discusses the thing with someone who can pass this info forward, she did as much as she could. And well... even thou, this article quotes Mrs. Arnold promising to keep her name a secret it clearly states: elderly woman. How many elderly women could pass the possible abductors?
I'd be scared to read about myself in the newspaper and realise that now these abductors know that I saw them, remembered them and tried to came forward. If I was living alone I'd probably avoid that mall to the rest of my life. If the article would say it vaguely, as "just a whitness", then okay, but outed like that? I'd be scared for my own safety.
And the third whitness, man who came forward years later and saw three men struggling to push three girls into a van. He confronted them, heard that one is guy's wife, and actively tried to remember that thing, cause it disturbed him so much.
It seems probable to remember something like that for years and have a flashback while suddenly learning that on this very day, only time when he was there, while visiting (so date relatively easy to remember) family three girls disappeared.
What he describes slightly differs from the woman's story but in my mind it's just adding more credibility to all of these.
What they are saying helps to create a timeline that makes sense. I wouldn't expect myself to see even a hypothetical timeline in this case that doesn't sound ridiculous at one point or another, but damn, there is one.
Monday Morning, 23rd of December 1974:
Rachel wants to go to the mall to buy gifts. Asks her sister to join her, but Debra is still in bed and wants to sleep some more.
Around 10am - not sure if Rachel called Renee to invite her on a trip to the mall that they never discussed before, or if she called her to confirm if she's going. Just my assumption and it may be wrong, but I get an impression that it
wasn't a choice between Debra and Renee (
with Renee as second choice) but just casually asking Debra if she want's to join her in the mall, with somewhat pre-planned company of Renee (
who previously may be unsure if she will go, but for sure they planned to at least meet before Christmas cause Renee had a gift for Rachel stepson - seems for me that they discussed how to make the best possible Christmas for this boy way before).
Renee just got promise ring from her boyfriend Terry who was at her (Renee's) home with his two younger sisters - Janet (11) and Julie (9). They knew that Terry gave Renee a ring, so they came in from their next door home to check it out.
Renee agrees to go on a trip, but states it clearly that she needs to be back home before 4 P.M. to make herself ready for her first christmas party with a ring from Terry.
Later - Rachel visited her family home to ask her mother if she wants to go to the mall, but she refused cause Rachel's father, wasn't feeling well (he was diagnosed with cancer).
Bit later - Rachel arrives at the Renee's house. Gets out from the car and spends a bit of time with other kids.
Rachel and Renee invite Terry (15) and Janet (11) to join them on a trip to the mall but they refuse cause they already made a different plans.
9 year old Julie didn't have any plans. And even thou it's repeatedly implied that they didn't want to take her with them due to her young age, for me it seems like they didn't cause they knew that she's just not allowed to make such decisions herself and would have to ask her mom. For me it's pretty reasonable assumption on the Rachel's (and Renee's) side that Jule doesn't get an invitation. It would look weird that some 17yo that Julie's mother don't know invites her 9 year old child to go with her to the mall of all the sudden. I'd just get angry (as a mother) with the idea. But Julie wants to go, has nothing else to do, calls her mom and begs her for permission to join the girls. Mother reluctantly agree.
Bit later but still before noon - Renee grabs a gift for Rachel's stepson and puts it on the floor. She's careful with the gift, it's nicely wrapped and easy grab for her while exiting the car.
Rachel, Renee and Julie get in the car but they are not heading mall just yet. They're going to the Army Navy store where Renee had some items on layway, including new pair of jeans.
Her old jeans are found in the trunk, along with other items she got there.
What coud be alarming at this point is that people from Army Navy store weren't recalling seeing Julie with Renee and Rachel. Was it cause Julie just got to check out some interesting things in the store and wasn't following girls closely? - she may do that, surely she wasn't used to follow Rachel as her guardian, and girls could have her in sight while clerks haven't noticed her but we don't know that.
Or maybe Julie wasn't there? Leaving a 9 year old kid alone in the car is not good, and not that convenient idea. Did they picked up someone else to join them and that person stayed with Julie in the car? Possible, but unlikely cause of the gift. Older person (older than Renee I mean) would probably request sitting in front and usual choice for people sitting in the back is behind the passenger, not behinf the driver. But there was gift on the floor there. So likely nobody else was with them.
Is that possible that Julie was all excited about visiting the mall and not that much about just collecting pants from the store, while girls were likely in a hurry and didn't plan to wander around this particular store? Yes, but unless someone could say that
Julie would be overly excited to listen to the radio in a car cause she always was wondering about it more would mean just exploring the rabbit hole.
I'm just going to assume that Julie was with them. Likely not more than 10 minutes passed since they left Renee's home and everything seemed to be okay.
It's just my speculation now, justified only by the gift's placement.
Yes, girls were in a hurry, but they still had about 4 hours to spend at the mall. Not that much, but not too little either.
But as much as I'm getting from it, Debra didn't said that she doesn't want to go to the mall when Rachel asked. She just wanted to sleep bit longer. And visit in Renee's house and trip to the Army Navy took like an hour, maybe 1,5h.
It may be possible that girls decided to stop at Rachel's house, on the way to the mall and check if Debra is still asleep, still at home and possibly now ready to head to the mall with them. If they considered it earlier, that may be the reason why Renee put a gift inside the car instead of the trunk, where it will be safer.
From there, we have to work with possibilities and likely & unlikely scenarios.
1. Girls never made to the mall.
2. They headed straight to the mall.
3. Girls decided to stop by Rachel's home on way to the mall.
I don't believe it was the 1. with the reason I'll explain bit later. I'm hesitant about the third. Could be, but it as good guess as 2nd. I see things that spoke in favor of both.
I recall reading conflicting statements about the Julie's goal for the day. Most sources repeat that she had no money, and that her mother used it as reason why she shouldn't go, but I think I stumbled on claim that she wanted to buy a gift for her Grandpa. If so, and no reason for her to have any money on her while just visiting Renee in the morning. So how did she wanted to buy a thing? Did Renee had enough to borrow her some money for that purpose? If not, maybe Rachel offered to help her, but she didn't have enough with her and decided to take some more from home?
Not sure how tight could be their budget, Julie probably wasn't thinking of anything expensive, but even a dollar or two could be an issue if both girls had only the exact amount that they need on them. Why not stop by the home and take a few bucks to help the girl?
It's still just sheer speculation, but what else could I possibly offer?
Sometime around noon there is a reported sighting of Rachel's car leaving their driveway. Speculated or confirmed that it was Rachel's husband's first wife who saw the car then there.
Could she be off with her timing to see Rachel while she was leaving home earlier (than noon) this morning?
Why she was there? Did she lived next door? I haven't stumbled on this information anywhere so I'd assume that it was not the case.
Later we have a guy from the record store who saw all three girls there, was Rachel's friend, talked with Renee and saw someone else with them.
If they had intention of meeting with some friends around 1pm at the mall, they didn't make it there. So something was already off.
And who was accompanying Rachel? Nobody came forward to identify themselves as the person seen with her there.
Later, a man sees three guys pushing three girls into the van. He was worried enough to confront the men, but was told by the man who held a person that could be Rachel that he should leave it, cause it's family business and the eldest girl is his wife.
Then, elderly woman sees one guy, forcing a girl into whatever she described as "pickup" - but that could be the same car from before cause she stated that two girls and one guy were already in. So how many people could fit in just one front seat of a pickup? This may be a car that could be described as both: a van and pickup, especially considering that older woman may not know that much about the cars.
So.
I think that may be the exact same situation unraveling that they both whitnessed.
Man came across them first, as men just started pushing girls in. And woman bit later, as two were already in, with another guy that kept them from escaping.
But the man saw three men and she mentioned only two. What about the third?
Well, there is still a thing about the Rachel's car location. Cause AS it was found, it was left at very inconvenient, pretty well obscured spot. Odd place to choose. Maybe that was the only free spot that they could find, and maybe it was parked then later, as girls fate was already sealed.
I believe that third man went to get Rachel's car from it's original place.
Cause whatever happened to them didn't seem as planned ahead well.
Now, let's look at Rachel's husband timeline from that day.
So he left for work at his and her family workshop/store where he was doing things that should be done at such place. Then he headed to the bowling alley, where he chilled till Rachel's mother called to notify him that girls are missing.
I saw that he reportedly claimed that Rachel's mother can confirm that he was at the store whole day. Same women that refused to go to the mall cause she needed to care for her terminally ill husband. BUT she could still confirm his whereabouts cause he called her multiple times that day. Not cleared at what time he was calling but hinted (by him) that he must be in that store whole day to call, cause mobile phones weren't around yet.
I saw some post from a person claiming that Rachel's mom told police that she was at the store with her husband that day (but he didn't claimed the same) and later wondering why would she gave him false alibi.
And why IMO is a no brainer. LE wasn't helpful, LE wasn't interested that much in investigating, looking for the girls, if she believed that he couldn't possibly have anything to do with it then it's kinda obvious that she figured that she doesn't want LE to "waste time" troubling her innocent son-in-law instead of looking for the "real perp". It's not like they were all on it, exploring every lead right away. In her mind it could be all for the good, to speed up that already half-not-existing, lazy investigation that was going on.
IMO every statement that I saw, and that supposedly came from Rachel's husband could be a joke if it wasn't this horriffying and heartbreaking that literally everyting what he come up with, no matter how ridiculous was and with some reason still is taken as the most believeable thing ever.
He was unemployed when he met Rachel. Possibly earlier too. His parents passed away leaving him a bit of money, which he used to pay off Rachel's father workshop debts and then started working there, as co-owner.
His parents left him this money and their car. Before they bought him a car as a graduation (?) gift. So at some point he had two cars. Multiple people wondered how he seemed to own two cars all the way up till the time of the girls disappearance. But he claims he didn't. Cause he sold it. Or maybe used parts of it while repairing other cars. He didn't remember which one.
How believable is to forget what did you do with you'r deceased parents car, that you inherited, while having less than six moths to either sell or disassemble it? Seriously.
And why his mother-in-law is his alibi? Mother-in-law on call, sometime that day, possibly before noon - let's remember that.
No coworkers around to confirm where he was? No customers showing up? No friends stopping by for a quick chat? No friends from the bowling alley?
Ridiculessness surrounds this guy and covers him up all, head to toe.
Why was his first wife close enough to their home to see Rachel's car leaving driveway? Was she just wasting her time, showing up at random times to check if he's at home or not? Did she went there to chat with Debra?
Or maybe, since their son was going to spend Christmas with him, she stopped by to discuss something face to face? Drop some child's stuff? Maybe they were meeting there, cause Thomas, being co-owner and knowing that his in-laws are at home and nobody will check on him, decided to give himself some more free time and headed back home to get ready for bowling?
He could do that even not meeting with his ex then.
What if he headed home, with two friends, either to grab something or chill before bowling and saw Rachel leaving, or maybe even met with her and argued about something. Maybe he got angry or suspicious and decided to follow her, and did so, right to the mall. Then he got out till he located the girls at the record store. Convinced them to go outside to talk, to not "make a scene" in front of everyone and then decided that he's done, and they're coming home, or with him and he'll make sure of it by forcing them into the car that he came in.
Then, if girls didn't wanted to go - and why would they? - he'd likely decide to use some force. But he was Rachel's husband after all. Even if they were scared and stressed out, probably not enough to scream, try to run or plead for help from other shoppers. It would just make things worse at home.
Then the second whitness may saw them. Confronted them. And since Thomas didn't planned to kill or imprison the girls just yet, he just told him to mind his business and leave this family matter with him.
As only Rachel left outside, he could grab her car keyes and asked one of the other guys to get into that car and drive after him - cause then there was no need to leave their car behind.
Whenever they drove... probably not back to their home, cause unless Debra had some solid schedule which would allow him to be sure that she won't be home then. Renee and Julie already whitnessed enough, so they could see some more, maybe to embarass Rachel further and make a point that she doesn't have an independence that she - in his eyes - claimed to have.
Whatever happened later and where it happened - I have no idea, but probably somewhere where he felt comfortable at.
And then things went too far. No idea how, but - if it happened like that -
surely in a way that made it clear that there is no coming back to how things were before.
After that point, he/they may decide to act quickly. One jumped into the Rachel's car to leave it at the mall. Thomas (my speculation) addressed the envelope to mail it to himself and figured that he'll think what to write in there as he'll know how this day will end for them - so at night? early morning?
Whoever drove the car back to the mall, left it in a spot where risk of accidentally meeting someone who knew them was the lowest. Ran to mail the envelope. Joined the others.
They had few hours to hide the bodies, move girls to location where they could be held captive or even dispose of the bodies.
Three girls and possibly one car disappeared on that day.
Drowning it somewhere is a possibility, but more I'm learning about this Thomas-guy, less creative liar he appears to be.
Maybe he disassembled the other car, just not before girls went missing but after that. Maybe it was all bloody? Maybe someone saw them in that car and they had enough whitnesses already, so decided to get rid of it and act like it wasn't around for quite some time?
Was Thomas shady enough to have a trust of people that would get into human trafficking business with him?
My guess is that girls never saw Christmas that year, but I suspect - as my theory goes - that this guy has better insight into the timeline and details of this case than everyone else combined; and he said, that he believes that girls were trafficked. He may know what he's saying and Julie's mom may really get a call from her daughter.
Also, according to his own statement - his wife drove him to work that day. I can't help but wonder: which wife - ex wife or Rachel?
Also at what time exactly? Earlier in the morning? Before 10am?
So...
Did Rachel
1. woke up,
2. drove Thomas to family workshop
3. came back home to ask Debra if she wants to go to the mall
4. then call Lisa to ask her/confirm that she can go,
5. get back into the car and visit her mom to ask if she wants to go to the mall
6. arrived at Renee's
in this order?
How far that workshop was from Arnold's family home?
At what time they were opening? How long before 10am?
Was Thomas usually on time?
Renee's and Rachel's family homes weren't far so I get why she'd visit and ask her mother if she wants to go to the mall before getting to Renee's.
Debra was in bed, so she didn't knew when Thomas left... and if she talked with Rachel from bed...
Is it possible that Thomas was in the car with Rachel ALL that morning? Just didn't get out while he visited her mother and stayed in the car while she was at Renee's? Got annoyed with how long it all took, so then he decided that Julie is not going to the Army Navy but stays with him and girls have to be quick? And then just contiued to be annoyed?
I know that this idea just ruined my previous hypothetical timeline but it seems like nobody can place him anywhere on that day, from the morning till late evening, where he was, at the bowling alley.
Did anyone from Renee's and Julie's family saw Rachel's car that day? Saw it empty? With no Thomas in it? Maybe he decided to give himself a free day as he learned that Rachel's parents are staying at home? And either joined her or figured that he will just wait for her to take Renee and drop him off while heading the mall?
4.00 PM - families are worried
5.00 PM - families are searching
6.00 PM - Rachel's parents located the car parked at the "sear's upper lot"
But only at the 8:30 PM Rachel's mother decides to call Thomas at the bowling alley?
Why so late? Have they figured that it makes more sense to call shops and hospitals before calling Thomas? Were they that afraid of interrupting his bowling activities? Or maybe they tried before but couldn't find him and didn't even think about it or even really noticed, assumming that he must be just on the way to the bowling alley?
How on Earth he got cleared as a suspect? How?
Cause Rachel's mother told that she was with him at the store?
Even if so, she clearly wasn't still at the store nor with him after 4pm when Renee's and Julie's parents started to worry.
And where he was between 4 and 8pm? Bowling? If so easy to locate why he wasn't called immediately and asked if Rachel contacted him that afternoon or maybe said something in the morning? Isn't a husband good person to ask?
My guess is that's cause 8:30pm was as soon as they located him.
Just my thoughts, nothing else. But come on. How many red flags could be there and still mean nothing?
I guess that a lot, but in this case, IMO, too many.
