TX - Police respond to reports of shooter at Santa Fe High School, 18 May 2018

[KaaBoom]

One got shot, the other took the shot one to safety. The one who got shot was rapidly losing blood. If he didn't get medical attention presumably he would have died.
"He was bleeding out and his blood pressure was very low, so the immediate issue was to resuscitate him and give him enough blood product to get his blood pressure up and take him straight to the OR," said a surgeon with UTMB."
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/santa-...cer-john-barnes-shot-update-today-2018-05-18/

And some of the students who were shot, likely did bleed out. Because nobody helped them, or got them any medical attention. Even after the shooter surrendered, the cops were more interested in protecting themselves by pointing guns at the students, then getting them any medical attention.

 

[Bernina]

Texas Gov.Abbott is still touting shotgun giveaway after shooting on his website.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/20/us/greg-abbott-shotgun-giveaway-trnd/index.html

Vikki Goodwin, a candidate for the State House District 47 in west Travis County, was door-to-door campaigning on Saturday afternoon when she came across a door hanger advertising the giveaway.
"I was just astounded that he was giving away a shotgun," Goodwin told CNN. "The timing of it just seemed really bad."

:gaah:.....no words.

 

[bluesneakers]

It's dangerous to confront the shooter in case you don't realize it, and you being able to stop the shooter without being shot yourself is far from a guarantee.

You didn't answer my questions. Were they able to prevent the shooting? What difference did their presence on campus make? How many students were saved by their actions?

 

[bluesneakers]

BBM. Exactly. Now take that 2nd sentence and what can we deter in some manner: "Angry", "Armed", "Vengeance".
What could be done RIGHT NOW to stifle any of those 3 items? What won't cost us a dime?

Not sure why money is a factor.. ?

 

[Bernina]

Not sure why money is a factor.. ?

Because it ALWAYS is. In the form of taxes, State, and Federal funding.

 

[gitana1]

Well they both could have just stayed outside. There is clearly nothing they could have done to please some people here. Almost dying isn't enough and still all about protecting oneself.

Yeah I'm confused about the debate. They did the right thing here. They risked their lives to save others' lives. Law enforcement is trained to save lives. Including fellow officers who've been hit right next to them.

They did nothing wrong by trying to help out a fellow officer who had been hit rather than abandoning him to get closer to besieged students. You deal with what immediate. And a shot and bleeding fellow officer is immediate.

Sound like heroes to me.

 

[bluesneakers]

Because it ALWAYS is. In the form of taxes, State, and Federal funding.

Then I don't know what answer you want me to give. Schools are funded by our tax dollars and keeping students safe while they're being educated should be included in what we pay for.

 

[KaaBoom]

Well they both could have just stayed outside. There is clearly nothing they could have done to please some people here. Almost dying isn't enough and still all about protecting oneself.

How is it right to save the life of a police officer, but leave students to bleed out for 30 minutes, and other students to still get shot?

 

[jjenny]

You didn't answer my questions. Were they able to prevent the shooting? What difference did their presence on campus make? How many students were saved by their actions?

I presumed your questions were rhetorical. <modsnip>

 

[gitana1]

There's a myriad of posts that basically apply to after "the horse is out of the barn".
Schools are a fairly easy target for shooters, secure them and what prevents the shooters to rain terror on the local McDonalds hangout or such? How about a shopping mall, theater, a community baseball field, or church?
We've all seen those incidents.

So, if a "child" is pissed off, hurt, angry, rejected, bullied, etc. with a firearm, how do you stop that "horse" from getting out of the "barn"?

I believe that is the crux of this issue. Anything else just moves the target to another local, with more deaths and injuries. IMHO.

Agreed. Traffic jams. Playgrounds. The beach. Parades. Etc. The possibilities are endless. We can't secure it all.

 

[jjenny]

... 30 minutes...

Again, where do you get 30 minutes timeline? It hasn't been reported by authorities as far as I can tell.

 

[kimlynn]

Yeah I'm confused about the debate. They did the right thing here. They risked their lives to save others' lives. Law enforcement is trained to save lives. Including fellow officers who've been hit right next to them.

They did nothing wrong by trying to help out a fellow officer who had been hit rather than abandoning him to get closer to besieged students. You deal with what immediate. And a shot and bleeding fellow officer is immediate.

Sound like heroes to me.

I don't know about the heroic part but until any details that would come out to say otherwise...they did the best they could under the circumstances. IMO

 

[gitana1]

Did it do any good? Did they stop the shooter? How many lives did they save?

They could've saved lives though. They tried to. But I think it does illustrate the point that training and arming more staff is not the best solution. Even very trained and fully armed pros can't stop a madman who breaks the routine of the day with sudden, shocking violence.

It's just not was easy as people think.

 

[jjenny]

I don't know about the heroic part but until any details that would come out to say otherwise...they did the best they could under the circumstances. IMO

I'd say confronting the armed shooter and getting shot is heroic. Is that under debate?

 

[kimlynn]

I'd say confronting the armed shooter and getting shot is heroic. Is that under debate?

It is their job and they should and do understand that before becoming LE.

 

[Bey]

Other countries have kids on Ritalin, have bullies, have girls reject them,have co-ed schools with many entrances and play the same violent video games.

Indeed. There's only one major difference between the US and other similar countries, and it's the access to guns.

Not gun ownership per se - I'm in the UK but I'd buy one if I could (as a disabled mother who used to spend a lot of nights alone while the other half worked shifts, I'm quite happy with the idea of people having them for protection!) - but the culture around how they are tied up with being American, iyswim

 

[Bey]

The mother who shared her daughters story mentioned it being 30 minutes - iirc she said 7.31 til 8.02.

 

[Jennifer17]

I'd say confronting the armed shooter and getting shot is heroic. Is that under debate?

That is what they are trained for and are paid for. I don't think that there is anything especially heroic about it. He was doing the job that he was hired for.

This is not a criticism of that officer, but hero gets thrown around too lightly IMO.

 

[gitana1]

I'd say confronting the armed shooter and getting shot is heroic. Is that under debate?

Agreed. They tried. They risked their lives and almost got killed trying to save those kids. I don't give a you know what that this is what they signed up for. Thank God some have the balls to sign up for that. It doesn't make them any less heroic.

Geez its kind of offensive that they are being criticized here or that their heroism is being denied. If I was a parent of kids in that school I would be thanking them. Even if my kid got shot. They tried to the point of risking their own deaths. They are probably destroyed mentally that they couldn't do more.

 

[kimlynn]

That is what they are trained for and are paid for. I don't think that there is anything especially heroic about it. He was doing the job that he was hired for.

This is not a criticism of that officer, but hero gets thrown around too lightly IMO.

They have to expect that they will encounter a bullet at some point while doing their job.
The true hero is the student that tried to stop the shooter from getting in the room and was shot and killed. IMO