TX - Terri 'Missy' Bevers,45, murdered in church/person in SWAT gear,18 Apr 2016 #33

[TeaTime]

Scout, couldn't the video be used as direct evidence if they could show the height and gait matched (along with other evidence as to why they believed a specific person was SP of course)?

If the perp is ID'd on the video, then it is direct evidence that the perp was present. Unless the ID'd perp is on video committing the murder, the video is not direct evidence of murder.

 

[rodee34]

I think the conversation about direct vs circumstantial evidence is an interesting one. In the past couple decades, eyewitness accounts have been largely debunked as unreliable, while circumstantial evidence in the form of forensic science has become the gold standard for prosecution. Whenever I hear defense attorneys go on about how a prosecutors case is "merely circumstantial", I know that's wordplay used to sound dismissive of what's probably a mountain of forensic evidence. Juries expect the science these days and probably give as much or more weight to it than much of what's legally defined as direct evidence. I've seen so many cases that without circumstantial evidence the wrong person would have been convicted or the case would never have been tried at all.

(BBM) I couldn't agree more.

 

[Scout]

Evidence is always subject to cross-examination to try to discover errors in witness identification and scientific methodology. Post conviction, when new methods or testimony is discovered, the issue can be raised again. Eye witness testimony can be wrong, but is still, by its nature, direct evidence.

Cross examination is only as effective as the competency of the cross-examining attorney. If they don't have enough understanding of the significance of the evidence, they won't be able to ask the right questions.

 

[YouWho]

Your theory is that BB hired a hit?
Or had a close family help?

Well, I could use a few words to describe his statements: Conflicting. Trying to lead/steer the narrative. Over-sharing. But less than truthful? I don't know that for sure. Body language tells me yes - he's hiding some things, trying to stick to a story. I think he's gone off script a few times and that's why he's no longer speaking publicly (that I know of.) Yes, IMO he has something to do with it. But I have the same set of information you all have. Just speculation.

 

[Deleted member 172065]

IIRC, 4:20 was a rounded estimate. I've read that she entered the building at 4:18. Maybe she spent a minute or so in her truck before unlocking the building and starting to unload equipment before entering the building.

Yeah, I think some of her stuff was out of the truck when LE showed.

 

[janesmith787]

Regardless of circumstantial vs. concrete evidence, I don't think the DA will try a case unless it's a slam dunk. They've got 1 shot to get this creep, so they want to make sure it's going to get true billed by the grand jury. JMO

 

[ocgrad]

Local LE suspect LE.

Thanks for your post. I've always felt this is why other LE agencies (FBI, Rangers) jumped on this so quickly.

 

[TeaTime]

FWIW:

"Direct evidence supports the truth of an assertion (in criminal law, an assertion of guilt or of innocence) directly, i.e., without an intervening inference.[SUP][1][/SUP]Circumstantial evidence, by contrast, consists of a fact or set of facts which, if proven, will support the creation of an inference that the matter asserted is true.[SUP][2][/SUP]
For example: a witness who testifies that he saw the defendant shoot the victim gives direct evidence. A witness who testifies that he saw the defendant fleeing the scene of the crime, or a forensics expert who says that ballistics proves that the defendant’s gun shot the bullet that killed the victim both give circumstantial evidence from which the defendant’s guilt may be inferred.
In direct evidence a witness relates what he or she directly experienced. (Usually the experience is by sight or hearing, though it may come through any sense, including [smell,] touch or pain. State v Famber, 358 Mo 288, 214 SW2d 40.)"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_evidence"


"Circumstantial evidence
Circumstantial evidence is indirect evidence that implies the existence of the main fact in question, but does not in itself prove it. The existence of the main fact is deduced from the indirect or circumstantial evidence by a process of probable reasoning. The introduction of a defendant's fingerprints or DNA sample are examples of circumstantial evidence. The fact that a defendant had a motive to commit a crime is also circumstantial evidence. In an important sense, however, all evidence is merely circumstantial because no evidence can prove a fact in the absence of one or more inferences."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evidence_(law)

I have never used Wikipedia as a source but this is as good an explanation of direct and circumstantial (indirect) evidence as one could ask for. Black's can be difficult as the intended audience are lawyers, Wikipedia speaks to the lay person and does a much better job of explaining it. Thanks.

 

[TeaTime]

Cross examination is only as effective as the competency of the cross-examining attorney. If they don't have enough understanding of the significance of the evidence, they won't be able to ask the right questions.

That is a given. But it doesn't change the fact that evidence is subject to cross-examination.

 

[x_files]

Well, I could use a few words to describe his statements: Conflicting. Trying to lead/steer the narrative. Over-sharing. But less than truthful? I don't know that for sure. Body language tells me yes - he's hiding some things, trying to stick to a story. I think he's gone off script a few times and that's why he's no longer speaking publicly (that I know of.) Yes, IMO he has something to do with it. But I have the same set of information you all have. Just speculation.

Same. Since, he is the husband I choose to look there first then family, but I am keeping an open minded.

 

[YouWho]

Your theory is that BB hired a hit?
Or had a close family help?

I also think MB may have seen or heard something that made her a target. Maybe steroids or other illegal drug dealings (coke, H) at gym locations or in the "hyper fitness" circle. I'm not implying AT ALL that any one of the gym members of CG members participated in any illegal drugs but I will say that if you are "addicted" to fitness just like anything else, you may be "addicted" to other things. I know I'll probably get backlash for these comments but quite frankly these drugs are everywhere and very mainstream in small towns. Totally MOO. It may have been a pretty wide net. That could compromise marriages, jobs, businesses, etc. Totally MOO

The reason I have trouble getting behind the 'she knew something' scenario, is because like you say, drug use is common. Drug abuse is a problem in all communities. It's not big enough of a deal to me - IMO. But folks have killed for less. I don't think the perps knew this would blow up like it has, capturing so much interest. People Magazine!?
I just have trouble going to the place that says, I'm going to commit a much more heinous crime in order to prevent the knowledge of my lesser crime from going public. Too risky.

 

[x_files]

The reason I have trouble getting behind the 'she knew something' scenario, is because like you say, drug use is common. Drug abuse is a problem in all communities. It's not big enough of a deal to me - IMO. But folks have killed for less. I don't think the perps knew this would blow up like it has, capturing so much interest. People Magazine!?
I just have trouble going to the place that says, I'm going to commit a much more heinous crime in order to prevent the knowledge of my lesser crime from going public. Too risky.

The very thing the perp did to conceal his/her identity is what caused national attention-the SWAT perp outfit on video footage.

 

[Deleted member 172065]

My thought is if this was carried out by a 'professional' hit man that is would go down something like:

Case the place
Know MB's schedule and routine before the planned day of the crime
Hide out side in the dark or just in side the doors you know she will come in
Shoot her in the head as she exits her truck or starts to enter the building
The whole crime is done with the hit man showing up probably 15 min or less before her arrival, leaving one minute after her arrival.

Now, I suppose the hit man could be a first timer, but to convince someone to murder for you (even if you pay them) and then to murder by using a hammer to the head and chest (even if they shot her first we know she was hit with the tools) rules out the detached hit man in my head. This sort of hit man to me would still likely be someone who also had a personal motive of their own - either to want MB dead or impress the person hiring them.

Maybe. But there was a robbery in my town for a tv. (I knew the parents of the adult victim from a church I once attended). And the two perps over-killed. Both the male perp AND his girlfriend stabbed victim multiple times. Can you believe the mom HUGGED the female perp after the trial?! I don't think I'd be that forgiving of a Christian, even though I am one.
But, anyways, I agree that there's 'holes' in every scenario.

 

[YouWho]

Thanks for your post. I've always felt this is why other LE agencies (FBI, Rangers) jumped on this so quickly.

AND why they're so tight-lipped as well.

 

[YouWho]

The very thing the perp did to conceal his/her identity is what caused national attention-the SWAT perp outfit on video footage.

Indeed. If covering up a lesser crime was the intention, they super failed.

 

[Deleted member 172065]

I know this has been discussed, but I just watched again the BB interview with the media on 4/19. At the 10:35 mark, he says, "The police estimate that this person is about 6 ft tall."

Anyone want to weigh in as to how the LE can be so off on their height estimate from viewing the video - the day after the murder - when that information is so critical? Especially when experts came in later and determine the height to be 5'2 - 5'7? HUGE DIFFERENCE!

[video=youtube;lnBJ17dtx48]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnBJ17dtx48[/video]

It would seem that LE have a lot of experience viewing surveillance video and able to estimate height more accurately than they did.

Yeah! Very strange. LE would make a terrible witness in a trial if they don't know height...Their credibility feels ify, although I'm sure they're doing their best!

 

[ocgrad]

Interesting.

BB himself stated: "I was in Biloxi, Mississippi, about to go on a fishing trip down on the Chandeleur Islands. I heard about it this morning. I received a phonecall from a couple of (MB)'s campers, and had I been out on that ship, I would have had no contact for a few days."

The charter services to the Chandeleur Islands are typically "mother ship trips". The boats are big, basically floating inns, where passengers launch smaller skiffs off the main boat to fish, then sleep and take meals on the main ship over the course of the days-long island cruise. From what I gather, these "mother ships" vary from spartan to very comfortable. In addition to private rooms, some have lounges with TV, game tables, etc. Passengers may be out of cell phone range, but every single one of my boating friends tell me that you are not "out of contact" with the shore while you're on a boat - especially a chartered passenger vessel. They also tell me this is common knowledge. While it's possible he would have assumed it, BB would certainly not have gone days without learning of MB's death.

My point about bringing this up again is that several people have suggested he could have just been down there fishing with a few buddies on one of their private boats that had no set departure schedule. However, the fact that BB himself calls it a "ship", coupled with his comment about having "no contact for a few days" (meaning a vessel large enough to accommodate passengers for multiple days and nights) tells me that this wasn't likely a private boat owned by friends but rather a chartered fishing cruise. While I guess it's possible BB was not going to be boarding that ship until later in the day or midnight on the 19th (some 10-20 hours later), I was only able to find one report of weather for that day in the area. It was FAIR weather for 48 hours surrounding his scheduled departure time. If the ship's departure was actually delayed that long, then why comment on the near missed phonecalls saying he was about to get on the ship? What was going through his head that he felt the need to point out this to reporters?

The weather system that caused his flight to be delayed did not affect weather on the MS coast that day. BB's mother was the only person who said the departure was delayed. I thought it seemed odd that when BB was stating that he was waiting to go and would have been out of touch he didn't remark on the random coincidence of the departure being delayed. Seems like that would have been remarkable to comment on. Actually an act of God! That would have been the basis for the whole comment of nearly being out of touch. Like, "if the departure had not been delayed, I would have been out on the boat and not able to be reached." Unless there was never a plan to go on a 12 am charter in the first place. I wonder if LE called the charter to confirm the delay.

 

[KayCherry]

I did hear here on Websleuths that Midlothian is going through a corrupt gun theft thing by some cops. Not great. What a mess! I need to read up on that more.

I read up a bit on it, and I know maybe a naive question, but did they pawn the guns for "monies" sake? For the money? seems so odd to me. Lose all credibility for greed. MOO

 

[SweetCaroline]

Okay, you guys are gonna think I'm crazy and maybe I am. :ufo:

BUT...have you noticed all the similarities between this case and the Baton Rouge shooter? The balaclava (I'd never even heard that word before this case), the silver Nissan with Texas plates, the fact that GL was known to be in Dallas recently, his fascination with fitness and nutrition (called himself a lifestyle coach).

Obviously, GL is not SP. The skin tone and body type don't match. But...what if he rented the car in Dallas and found the balaclava in it? :thinking:

 

[ocgrad]

I only did a quick search, so nothing I say can be considered fact, but there are chartered trips that don't have a "set" time...ie. you set the time you leave and return. Although I am far from what one would call a fisherman, I do know dusk is a prime fishing time. I admit maybe you know more about exactly what type of charter he took, but going off of only knowing he took a chartered fishing trip, leaving at that time, or really anytime from 3 am until 7 am, not only would I not consider fishy (no pun intended ) but I would actually consider that time as actually the most logical time for the trip.

1 last quick thing...was it actually stated/confirmed by someone that he chartered a boat? Or is this just based on our sleuthing?

I looked at 8 charters to Chandeleur Island and all departed at 12 midnight. I did not see one that allowed you to set your own time of departure. None of the "ship" charters allow you to set your own departure schedule.