TX - Terri 'Missy' Bevers,45, murdered in church/person in SWAT gear,18 Apr 2016 #33

[Scout]

It doesn't say whether or not they have a firearm in custody or not. The warrant either specified a serial number in a search warrant for a specific firearm or a firearm was found during a search (for any number of items) and it is listed on the returned items for the given warrant. So, it is my opinion that either way, at some point, they obtained a specific firearm. In the case of a warrant that identified a specific weapon to search for whomever it was served on would have to explain where that weapon went if it were not found. If the weapon were determined to not be related to the crime it would have been returned to the owner. They I believe they could have redacted the serial number and released the warrant (though maybe Texas law doesn't allow redactions). In my opinion, there must be something else in that warrant that they don't want out.

There would be no real risk of the serial number being used fraudulently if the firearm were in police custody.

 

[Jethro4WS]

Snipped by me Thank you. I agree.

I read 'somewhere, a few weeks ago,' that LE had considered that the saran wrap box might be a pipe bomb. MOO, this ties in a bit with your theory that the perp took extra efforts to disguise their real mission.

But, the simple notion of diverting an investigation away from a targeted murder, to one of a crazed swat wannabe, only served to bring in extra agencies!

Oops, why did they do that?

Well, I don't think it was their intent that all the other agencies would be brought in - though with BB, RB, VB out of state that would have probably happened anyway for some agencies.

It is my belief that it wouldn't be clear to investigators whether the burglary was staged were it not for the last sequence that was seen in the 2 minute plus video MPD released. I believe that SP did not think the camera that was just above and to the left of the door (if you were looking at that door) to Room 12 would see them based on where it was positioned. But it did. And not just see them but see them breaking that window on the door in such a way that the glass was ending up in the hall they were standing in. We saw them break a similar window on a door (to Room 4) in the main hall way and they didn't do anything but just smash it in. No shenanigans. I believe this was a key mistake, being seen on that camera. I also believe MPD releasing that was a message to SP that they know.

That is the way I have viewed it. I could be wrong.

 

[YouWho]

Rodee & janesmith, in case no one has answered yet, MB had a breast augmentation. But although one poster suggested it was 10 months ago, I don't think it was done that recently. But that's only my assumption from sleuthing their photos. MOO.

 

[lilyk]

These green eyes have a teensy bit of difficulty reading this glass areas on this diagram so would you please be so kind as to inform me where the glass areas would be in the SW corner?

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...T-gear-18-Apr-2016-32&p=12692621#post12692621

Do we know if any of these bathrooms are unisex or multigender/family friendly? Or are they all designated to be specific to one gender, Men's and Women's? I've seen a few times theories of MB and SP meeting in a SW bathroom (planned/intent to murder or accidental/B&E interrupted). I would assume MB would enter a Womens or Unisex bathroom to use it, but perhaps would only unlock a men's bathroom. Even given a free choice "no one will ever know" scenario I would think SP would instinctively/subconsciously or perhaps out of necessity enter their gender correct bathroom to urinate or adjust disguise or whatever else they wanted to do in a bathroom (though I highly doubt they risk unzipping and leaving DNA). And unless they were hiding and laying in wait thinking MB might enter a particular bathroom, why else would SP be in an opposite gender bathroom? Would they have met accidentally in a bathroom if SP was a male and there were no unisex bathrooms? Also, every unisex or family friendly bathroom I've used has had a lockable door, and is a single stall. Just thoughts I am pondering, no idea if they have any value.

 

[Scout]

Well, I don't think it was their intent that all the other agencies would be brought in - though with BB, RB, VB out of state that would have probably happened anyway for some agencies.

It is my belief that it wouldn't be clear to investigators whether the burglary was staged were it not for the last sequence that was seen in the 2 minute plus video MPD released. I believe that SP did not think the camera that was just above and to the left of the door (if you were looking at that door) to Room 12 would see them based on where it was positioned. But it did. And not just see them but see them breaking that window on the door in such a way that the glass was ending up in the hall they were standing in. We saw them break a similar window on a door (to Room 4) in the main hall way and they didn't do anything but just smash it in. No shenanigans. I believe this was a key mistake, being seen on that camera. I also believe MPD releasing that was a message to SP that they know.

That is the way I have viewed it. I could be wrong.

There is no video of the killer smashing any windows in the main corridor.

 

[Jackeee]

I didn't see anywhere it was speculated to be one-size-fits all. You'll know how different we all are when you put on something form-fitting like a vest (for example a life vest).

A side bar conversation would be that if you took someone like RB (a husky guy) and put a vest like that on him (adding a couple inches all around) he'd look much larger than the SP we see on the video (remember, the camera also puts on additional "weight".

I was simply saying what 'one size fits all' means to me. I didn't imply it was speculated anywhere. This was just something that came to mind about how someone's size can be altered. IMO. I didn't mention RB or anyone else. It was just a thought.

 

[Jethro4WS]

There would be no real risk of the serial number being used fraudulently if the firearm were in police custody.

I have a particular theory how that firearm serial number came to end up in a warrant. I have expressed that belief. I believe that MPD used a loop hole to prevent the release of information from that warrant (other than the serial number). I have expressed that. Beyond that I don't know what else to tell you.

 

[Deleted member 172065]

I'm just slightly in the B&E camp (51 to 49 lol).
Because if it was a hit, I wouldn't expect the perp to BARELY make it into the church on time. The clock was running out.
I would also think he would have made sure he COULD GET IN. It looks like he just about didn't. The kitchen door being the only one he could breach.
Then his breaking glass, making noise, and leaving a door open before missy's arrival could have alerted her.
So to recap...
A perp who barely makes it into the church on time; in fact, almost doesn't get in, makes lots of noise, and leaves a door open to alert the victim, are all signs he wasn't expecting a 4:15 visitor. JMO

 

[Scout]

I have a particular theory how that firearm serial number came to end up in a warrant. I have expressed that belief. I believe that MPD used a loop hole to prevent the release of information from that warrant (other than the serial number). I have expressed that. Beyond that I don't know what else to tell you.

Ok. I'm not trying to pick a fight with you. It's simply my belief that the wording in that request to keep documents under seal indicates that a firearm known by serial number is associated with Missy's murder and is unaccounted for.

 

[Jethro4WS]

Do we know if any of these bathrooms are unisex or multigender/family friendly? Or are they all designated to be specific to one gender, Men's and Women's? I've seen a few times theories of MB and SP meeting in a SW bathroom (planned/intent to murder or accidental/B&E interrupted). I would assume MB would enter a Womens or Unisex bathroom to use it, but perhaps would only unlock a men's bathroom. Even given a free choice "no one will ever know" scenario I would think SP would instinctively/subconsciously or perhaps out of necessity enter their gender correct bathroom to urinate or adjust disguise or whatever else they wanted to do in a bathroom (though I highly doubt they risk unzipping and leaving DNA). And unless they were hiding and laying in wait thinking MB might enter a particular bathroom, why else would SP be in an opposite gender bathroom? Would they have met accidentally in a bathroom if SP was a male and there were no unisex bathrooms? Also, every unisex or family friendly bathroom I've used has had a lockable door, and is a single stall. Just thoughts I am pondering, no idea if they have any value.

I don't know much about the bathrooms that exist in the church. And I only know of where they are located by the plumbing stacks that can be seen on the roof of the building. The dimensions are approximate. The women's room may be larger than the men's room, for example. They are depicted the same size on the map as I have no photos from inside them to estimate dimensions. The ones in the South and the North are probably gender specific since this is a place that gets around 300 people a service. In the offices, I expect the bathrooms there would look more like a bathroom at home rather than what you would find elsewhere in the church. There are two other plumbing stacks that indicate a need for plumbing and I believe one is a bathroom that may be in the room labelled SS (Red, to the right of the stage if looking at it) and that too would look more like a bathroom at home - though I have not depicted them on the map as I have not spent enough time investigating it.

 

[bluevioletfour]

Understood and appreciate your point of view.


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GRAPHIC THOUGHTS: Do we know if the church had to hire a company that specializes in crime scene/bloody deaths to come in and clean the church? IMO, if it was a messy scene, you'd hire something trained to clean. If not too messy, you might do it yourself. IIRC, the church seemed to be back to their normal schedule fairly soon after the murder. Did anyone local notice a specialized cleaning company? Thanks

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

It doesn't say whether or not they have a firearm in custody or not. The warrant either specified a serial number in a search warrant for a specific firearm or a firearm was found during a search (for any number of items) and it is listed on the returned items for the given warrant. So, it is my opinion that either way, at some point, they obtained a specific firearm. In the case of a warrant that identified a specific weapon to search for whomever it was served on would have to explain where that weapon went if it were not found. If the weapon were determined to not be related to the crime it would have been returned to the owner. They I believe they could have redacted the serial number and released the warrant (though maybe Texas law doesn't allow redactions). In my opinion, there must be something else in that warrant that they don't want out.

I believe that MPD has executed some search warrants for people's homes or other locations. Somewhere in those searches they found a firearm. Because the search warrant probably allowed them to seize any such item, they may have done so and recorded its serial number. However, I do not believe that the firearm alluded to in the search warrant that is sealed is the weapon that may have been used. Someone would have lawyered up and word would travel and someone's name would have popped by now. But what I do believe is that if they released that warrant with only the serial number redacted it would reveal exactly what calibre of weapon they are looking to find. The make and model of the weapon would be largely immaterial so long as it is capable of firing whatever might have been used to kill Missy.

Remember, I believe a firearm was used. I could very well be wrong..

I also believe a firearm was used. But here's another scenario to consider (because I don't think the gun has yet been found):

Suppose the ME extracted a bullet from MB that Tuesday morning, and upon examination, the striations on the sides of that bullet trace that bullet back to a gun once in the possession of the Ellis County Sheriff's Office. One of the stolen guns (not yet recovered) that the bad cops took and sold. LE would have that particular gun's serial # on file, because of its being connected with a case, and so they would have the serial number but NOT the gun. They could enter that serial number of the gun of interest in the search warrant that was hushed up. But for the district atty's office to release that serial number to NBC would've compromised their investigation as it would be tied into an already ongoing investigation (the bad cop gun- and drug-running scheme still being investigated by the Texas Rangers).

That's the scenario I'm envisioning. No one lawyering up, because no one (yet) connected to the gun or its serial number due to its being stolen from the ECSO evidence room and sold privately. (Many of the pawned guns did turn up due to the system in place working in that regard; it's the privately sold ones which have not.)

(Link about identifying weapons by the individual striation patterns left on bullets for those interested or unfamiliar):
https://www.bcps.org/offices/science/secondary/forensic/Firearms and Ballistics.pdf

 

[1&2&3]

Absolutely NOT saying LE was lying or incompetent.......However, we do not know the means/methods of the "verification" of alibi. We are at LE mercy with regards to their proof/method of verification. We do not know who verified and by what means. Phone records, motel receipts, etc., are circumstantial.

It amazes me why there is any question over the verification of the alibis. To me, the question is, do the verifications match what each person told? LE is certainly NOT going to say anything different until they have a person arrested and it may not come out until trial.

We have to remember how many agencies were immediately involved in this case. With a few exceptions, there would be taped video to back up receipts. Whether the employee would actually recall checking a person in at a hotel or airport, is questionable. If the person checking in does or says something to call attention to themselves, then the employee has a better chance of remembering them. Some hotels require a driver's license for identification, therefore, Joe Jones could not check in as Bill Wilson on Bill's reservation. On car rental, a driver's license is always a requirement and a copy is made of it.

These receipts have paper trails on the computer. It is amazing what information can be gathered. I am confident that each receipt has been verified to the maximum!

My opinions only.

 

[GA_Peach]

Ok. I'm not trying to pick a fight with you. It's simply my belief that the wording in that request to keep documents under seal indicates that a firearm known by serial number is associated with Missy's murder and is unaccounted for.

Isn't it also possible that LE has in their possession an unregistered gun with a known serial number, but they have no idea who the owner of said gun is? It's not the only option, but isn't it one possible explanation? Maybe I am missing something. :thinking:

I also believe a firearm was used. But here's another scenario to consider (because I don't think the gun has yet been found):

Suppose the ME extracted a bullet from MB that Tuesday morning, and upon examination, the striations on the sides of that bullet trace that bullet back to a gun once in the possession of the Ellis County Sheriff's Office. One of the stolen guns (not yet recovered) that the bad cops took and sold. LE would have that particular gun's serial # on file, because of its being connected with a case, and so they would have the serial number but NOT the gun. They could enter that serial number of the gun of interest in the search warrant that was hushed up. But for the district atty's office to release that serial number to NBC would've compromised their investigation as it would be tied into an already ongoing investigation (the bad cop gun- and drug-running scheme still being investigated by the Texas Rangers).

That's the scenario I'm envisioning. No one lawyering up, because no one (yet) connected to the gun or its serial number due to its being stolen from the ECSO evidence room and sold privately. (Many of the pawned guns did turn up due to the system in place working in that regard; it's the privately sold ones which have not.)

(Link about identifying weapons by the individual striation patterns left on bullets for those interested or unfamiliar):
https://www.bcps.org/offices/science/secondary/forensic/Firearms and Ballistics.pdf

This scenario is definitely on my short list. I am still leaning in another direction, but I would not be shocked to find out this is exactly what happened.

 

[Jethro4WS]

Ok. I'm not trying to pick a fight with you. It's simply my belief that the wording in that request to keep documents under seal indicates that a firearm known by serial number is associated with Missy's murder and is unaccounted for.

Okay. Now I see where you are going with this. That is an interesting way of reading it. One I hadn't considered. Do you think they already had a strong POI or suspect at the time of the warrant? Or do you think that they were just going various POIs and when it came time for the warrant to be executed no firearm was found and they now may have a POI or suspect? Something else?

 

[Jethro4WS]

There is no video of the killer smashing any windows in the main corridor.

Absolutely right. I definitely have that wrong about the main hall.

 

[Jethro4WS]

Refresh my memory CB.. I don't recall reading that MB had surgery. (I'm not challenging you... I just plain ol' don't remember.) Thank you in advance.

It was a hysterectomy.

 

[SteveS]

Absolutely. Having a partner as a lookout would aid the killer on this point. Are there other possibilities?

Being ready for MB's arrival isn't really a challenging issue, if we believe that the perp knew about what time she was going to arrive and had some inkling of her routine on arrival. All the movement in the video we were given could have ended as early as a few minutes after 4. That gives more than abundant time for the perp to go to any appropriate window or door, be there by a few minutes after 4, and watch the drive for car lights entering, to trigger his last preparatory movement to a final lurking point and await her entry. (And he always had the possible "bail out" if he timed it wrong and she got there too early for him, to simply slip out the kitchen door unseen and leave without incident.)

 

[YouWho]

I'm just slightly in the B&E camp (51 to 49 lol).
Because if it was a hit, I wouldn't expect the perp to BARELY make it into the church on time. The clock was running out.
I would also think he would have made sure he COULD GET IN. It looks like he just about didn't. The kitchen door being the only one he could breach.
Then his breaking glass, making noise, and leaving a door open before missy's arrival could have alerted her.
So to recap...
A perp who barely makes it into the church on time; in fact, almost doesn't get in, makes lots of noise, and leaves a door open to alert the victim, are all signs he wasn't expecting a 4:15 visitor. JMO

Perp arrived 25 mins before MB, and to me that seems like ample time especially if you have cased the place yourself or had inside info. I think the whole thing was deeply planned. IMO.
He probably did case it or have inside info to know the most likely successful ways to get in.
I believe he had to break the glass as staging. But I'm unfamiliar with him leaving a door open that MB would have seen? I don't know anything about that.
Oh snap I told myself not to debate the B n E scenarios anymore. But it's been too quite in here these last couple of nights.

 

[SteveS]

I'm just slightly in the B&E camp (51 to 49 lol).
Because if it was a hit, I wouldn't expect the perp to BARELY make it into the church on time. The clock was running out.
I would also think he would have made sure he COULD GET IN. It looks like he just about didn't. The kitchen door being the only one he could breach.
Then his breaking glass, making noise, and leaving a door open before missy's arrival could have alerted her.
So to recap...
A perp who barely makes it into the church on time; in fact, almost doesn't get in, makes lots of noise, and leaves a door open to alert the victim, are all signs he wasn't expecting a 4:15 visitor. JMO

Actually, we have no idea what time perp may have first arrived at the property. Since all we have is LE's statement of what time he was first seen inside, his arrival up the driveway may have been at 3:00, who knows, with it taking him 45 minutes to breach a door and get inside.