Deceased/Not Found UK - April Jones, 5, Machynlleth, Wales, 1 Oct 2012 #3 *M. Bridger guilty*

[veggiefan]

Would that be possible with the original roadblocks in place from the night before? Especially if they were looking out for him and his vehicle?

As I understand it, the roadblocks on the Monday night were just in Machynlleth - the A417 was not closed until the Tuesday morning.

My guess is that the police closed it because they had only a vague idea of where MB had recently moved - something like "somewhere in the Corris valley" - so they sealed off the north end at Dollgelau and the south end close to the Dyfi bridge. Dafydd-Powis is a very small police force, and I doubt that they had the personnel to block all the side roads off the 12-mile stretch that they closed. This may, in fact, be how MB was able to get his car to the garage without being stopped, by following the back route to Machynlleth that one of the locals described earlier in this forum.

 

[Insp.Dots]

I was surprised that they charged him with abduction and murder at the same time. They didn't need to do that. They could have just charged him with abduction, as you say that would have kept him in custody. It would also have allowed them to gather more evidence of murder and to continue to question him about the new evidence. They didn't do that which has to point to them being pretty confident in the evidence they already have.

Clio I agree, I wasn't expecting the Murder Charge as they seemed so pressed for time with what we thought was little, but as you say they must have been very confident with what they had.

I also noted that at the same time or just before there was a massive shift in 'atmosphere' (not sure that's the right word sorry) the Public Searchers were stood down immediately and it seemed to turn much more structured.

Was that just down to it now being a Murder Charge or could it be that they had 'the golden nugget' of information/evidence that completely changed their thinking?

 

[Cendlaetholwr]

This could be anyone, lots of people were out searching, Camouflage is very common now & they could quite easily be dark jeans the man was wearing, not black waterproof trousers.
The day MB first appeared in court there was a man grabbed by police for throwing stones or something at the van, he had very short hair like MB's and a camouflage jacket on (not that i'm saying it was him in the video).

Anyone wearing camouflage clothing and waterproofs in the Machynlleth area would most definitely not be suspicious - I'd certainly not notice it as unusual if I was in the area. Ditto my area of east Powys. While rifles are less prevalent, somebody owning one and having a licence for one is quite normal for that area. Especially if they're into clay pigeon shooting.

You see, the Mach area is a haven for outdoor activity - most of its economy is based around things to do in the countryside. I'm sure that some of the people on here from the southern US states will identify with the outdoor way of life there. There's a huge area of excellent and wild countryside around Mach that is widely enjoyed. MB sounds like he thoroughly enjoys living in such an area.

 

[Clio]

Apologies, Bad mistake to make. I think someone has done it for me. I do apologise my heads not quite with it today lease:

No need to apologise to me. I just didn't want you to get in any trouble. We fixed it before it got propagated by people quoting it though

 

[Clutchbag]

I wonder if police can tell when the last time a gun was fired? It was reported his collection was made safe whatever that means/deactivated, just thinking could this be the evidence police have? this is relating to Rutland Girl's post earlier.

 

[veggiefan]

The black bag woman or her father iirc said she knew who the man was, if she didnt know MB then it was someone else?

I'm sure they will have told the police who it was if they knew the man.

It is worth noting that the major police effort today has been concentrated on the River Dulas behind MB's house:

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/2012/10/11/april-jones-latest-police-firearms-marine-unit-scours-river-dyfi-91466-32012993/

The report also mentions that a police firearms marine unit has been called in to scour the swollen River Dyfi. This is, I think, the first hint that a gun may have been involved. It is always possible that that black bag contained fireams that MB wished to dispose of for some reason.

Eta Veggiefan, can I ask do you think he is probably the right man and if so what do you think strongly points to this

On the balance of probabilities, I think he is but, from our point of view, such evidence as there is seems purely circumstantial. I have no doubt that the police know very much more than they have revealed in public. The CPS will know what this is, and it is they that advised that a prosecution could succeed on the basis of that evidence. They are not always right, of course.

 

[cluciano63]

I wonder if police can tell when the last time a gun was fired? It was reported his collection was made safe whatever that means/deactivated, just thinking could this be the evidence police have? this is relating to Rutland Girl's post earlier.

Even if he had a gun that had been fired recently, that would never be something to make police declare someone dead.

 

[veggiefan]

Anyone wearing camouflage clothing and waterproofs in the Machynlleth area would most definitely not be suspicious

So it was a good choice of clothing for someone who did not want to arouse suspicion?

 

[Clutchbag]

I'm sure they will have told the police who it was if they knew the man.

It is worth noting that the major police effort today has been concentrated on the River Dulas behind MB's house:

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/2012/10/11/april-jones-latest-police-firearms-marine-unit-scours-river-dyfi-91466-32012993/

The report also mentions that a police firearms marine unit has been called in to scour the swollen River Dyfi. This is, I think, the first hint that a gun may have been involved. It is always possible that that black bag contained fireams that MB wished to dispose of for some reason.



On the balance of probabilities, I think he is but, from our point of view, such evidence as there is seems purely circumstantial. I have no doubt that the police know very much more than they have revealed in public. The CPS will know what this is, and it is they that advised that a prosecution could succeed on the basis of that evidence. They are not always right, of course.

yes of course they would have told the police who the man was, I was pointing out that as you suggested in the other post these women did not know MB, then them knowing the man seen logically points to it not being MB

Thanks for the rest of the post. i do hope they have the right man, as you say it has happened before that they havent which is a double tragedy.

 

[veggiefan]

Even if he had a gun that had been fired recently, that would never be something to make police declare someone dead.

Depends what else might have been found. Substanital blood stains identifiable by DNA, mixed with the discharge from such a firearm could be pretty damning.

 

[Clio]

Clio I agree, I wasn't expecting the Murder Charge as they seemed so pressed for time with what we thought was little, but as you say they must have been very confident with what they had.

I also noted that at the same time or just before there was a massive shift in 'atmosphere' (not sure that's the right word sorry) the Public Searchers were stood down immediately and it seemed to turn much more structured.

Was that just down to it now being a Murder Charge or could it be that they had 'the golden nugget' of information/evidence that completely changed their thinking?

Clearly they must have had enough evidence to convince the CPS to let them charge him. Initially I thought that with no body having been found, this evidence must be absolutely conclusive. Now I'm not so sure. They seem to be upping the search and showing no signs of stopping in the near future.

I'm not sure, but maybe they aren't doing this just to find her remains so her family can lay her to rest. Not meaning to sound unfeeling, but this must be costing a lot of money. I am beginning to suspect that they are worried about getting a jury to convict on whatever evidence they currently have and that, together with wanting to return April to her family is what is driving the huge amount of resource and efforts.

As for the change in focus of the searching - I would guess that it was because they no longer thought she would be found alive. They probably didn't want the public finding a body and they wouldn't want forensic evidence to be destroyed JMO

 

[Cendlaetholwr]

April's parents visit search headquarters

The parents of April Jones have met with officers searching for their daughter's body to thank them for their efforts, according to Machynlleth police.



http://www.itv.com/news/story/2012-10-07/mark-bridger-april-jones-aberystwyth-machynlleth/

The Coastguard is searching the river from Borth to Towyn every day and the underwater search teams are at the estuary daily. We are all working through a detailed search plan.

Factual error by ITV. It should be "Borth to Tywyn". Towyn is on the North Wales Coast near Rhyl, probably 150 miles or so away from the Dyfi estuary. Also, "The Coastguard is searching the river" should read "The Coastguard is searching the coastline". It's the Cardigan Bay Coast. The river joins the sea at Aberdyfi, which is where the coastline proper starts.

 

[Clutchbag]

Even if he had a gun that had been fired recently, that would never be something to make police declare someone dead.

If there was no given provable, logical, reason for or a denial it had been used recently and a gun was discovered that had been, then I think they might suspect this

 

[Cendlaetholwr]

As I understand it, the roadblocks on the Monday night were just in Machynlleth - the A417 was not closed until the Tuesday morning.

My guess is that the police closed it because they had only a vague idea of where MB had recently moved - something like "somewhere in the Corris valley" - so they sealed off the north end at Dollgelau and the south end close to the Dyfi bridge. Dafydd-Powis is a very small police force, and I doubt that they had the personnel to block all the side roads off the 12-mile stretch that they closed. This may, in fact, be how MB was able to get his car to the garage without being stopped, by following the back route to Machynlleth that one of the locals described earlier in this forum.

All these references to the A417 should read A487.

 

[Insp.Dots]

Do we know that this is true and that it wasn't MB who wanted nothing to do with JW?

Well it was SW that spoke about this so yes I'd say that is true. As I said there has been nothing said whether MB wanted different or made any effort through the courts or however but that will no doubt come out in due course.

 

[Cherwell]

So it was a good choice of clothing for someone who did not want to arouse suspicion?

Definitely. Most people searching would have got out their wet weather gear anyway. And anyone who fished for a hobby would have waterproof trousers and probably waders. (My old neighbour used to go on fishing holidays to Mach every year)

 

[cluciano63]

If there was no given provable, logical, reason for or a denial it had been used recently and a gun was discovered that had been, then I think they might suspect this

They might suspect it, but would not get a charge for murder without a body on that basis alone.

 

[jigzy]

Aprils father has major health issues, he is going blind and I cant see how he would have helped in the search. Perhaps he has his own personal reasons for not attending the press conference, everybody feels grief in different ways and we shouldnt judge him. I believe he has been a very much needed support to his wife at this terrible time, I bet that is more of a relief to her.

Major health issues? Does he have other health issues too besides his eye disease? He is seen here at the Olympic torch event walking carrying the child without a white cane so is not housebound. Not judging him, but just wondering if there's any other reason he didn't attend the press conference with his wife.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/10/02/article-2211516-154E3265000005DC-512_306x423.jpg

Jmo

 

[Insp.Dots]

No need to apologise to me. I just didn't want you to get in any trouble. We fixed it before it got propagated by people quoting it though

Thanks, I appreciate why the rules are there and it is right that names are not given for very obvious reasons!

 

[webnut]

I'm not finding the link, can you bump that up for me, please?

Thanks,

Salem

This is the link I was referring to

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...ies-between-Mark-Bridger-and-April-Jones.html