UK UK - Claudia Lawrence, 35, Chef, York University, 18 March 2009 #8

[Yozzer]

I agree that PH might have been handsome, albeit in a very roguish sort of way, in the 2000's (and had a distinctive, not-so-stylish fringe), but he definitely looked less so when he was arrested IMO. I've not seen photo of him since and I can't wait for the pubs to reopen so that I can 'drop in my local' for a drink... As for responsibilities, he and his wife have 5 children between them, plus a big pub to run and who knows what else

The family home is quite an upgrade from their previous one too.

 

[moonsafari]

Hello ACB Murder,

So if you believe Claudia was taken to Acomb initially then she must have been separated from her phone, which stayed within the nine mile radius that included her house, the university, and extended out as far as Tockwith, also that more than one person was involved?

Why Acomb and why without her phone? Do you think the sightings on her regular route to work were staged or that it was her and her phone was passed to someone during whatever altercation took place, after which as you believe she was transported without it to Acomb?

Have you heard your own local rumours in Acomb? I recently was told something about people who may know what happened but weren't involved, which I passed onto the Find Claudia email address.

 

[moonsafari]

Moonsafari .... The Limes complex housed Uni students. Was the NH frequented by students regularly?

Not while I worked there, no drinks deals etc it was mostly tradesmen in the sports bar and a mixture of Heworth locals in the main one. Many retirees and middleaged, husband and wives, people who knew George etc

 

[cortina]

I don't know for sure if there was a police boyfriend or girlfriend or just a friend...I don't think the police would have covered up a gay relationship in particular....if there is a police person, they probably don't know what happened, they were friends with c but I don't think they really know what happened

no need for them to release. the identity if. they don't know anything significant

with c being a. bit naive, she may not have noticed if a. police person was subtly trying to get information out of her

 

[keep-it-real]

Not while I worked there, no drinks deals etc it was mostly tradesmen in the sports bar and a mixture of Heworth locals in the main one. Many retirees and middleaged, husband and wives, people who knew George etc

Thanks for confirming that .. so do you think students socialised more in York centre ie pubs and clubs offering student night deals

 

[AcbMurders]

Thank you for the welcome and all the issues raised. Please bear with me, as I am a bit of a plodder

@AcbMurders Good to have a local on board. I'm sure that it's not only me that is intrigued by your deliberate spelling of Acomb as A_comb? (3 times presented in this way) Perhaps you could elaborate?

@MajorLang Nothing implied. I just thought that by writing it that way, the posts would be less likely to come up in Google searches, but I can see now that it's confusing and I aim at transparency, so I'll avoid it from now on and just use the abbreviation 'Ac', given that AC is used for one of the POIs.

Regarding money to improve the pub and rebrand it to Clockhouse. Perhaps this was drug money as to attract the "right" clientele that would be a more condusive ambiance to purchase a pack of "chalky".
@MajorLang That's been on my mind as well. Word around here is that, not so much the pub itself, but Kinsway West area (see pub address) is the place to go if you're looking for weed. Not sure about 'chalky'. I understand much has been done to clean up the pub image over the years, the clientele is still mostly local, working class (or not working), very white, families (bouncy castles and all that), certainly not affluent ... So, what would draw the likes of PR & co there after hours, as mentioned by @moonsafari in her blog? (more on that on my reply to your post in a short while, @moonsafari) And, why would CL go there, apart from getting in with the wrong crowd? A middle class girl like her in her Next clothes and maybe a fairly posh accent would stand up like a sore thumb in The Ac. And maybe even in the NH when she first arrived, hence all the male attention, although I cannot say because I don't know the NH. (Do we know about CL's accent btw?)

As for all the money spent on The Ac, if the funds had come from where you're suggesting, then it would have been indirectly IMO, or the police would have surely sussed that out. Some wealthy investors maybe, local to York but not Ac itself. I was looking at the Street View images of The Ac in Oct 2015 when the pub was in scaffolding, half expecting to see a Transcore sign or van somewhere, I can't see anything. Maybe some of you who is more observant can spot something. I also wonder whether changing the name as part of the refurb (and the revamp as well taking place when it did, Autumn 2015) had anything to do with making up for the bad publicity in 2014.

The third point I would like to make about Acomb (correct spelling) The police station was evacuated a short while before Claudia disappearance due to an alarm going off. Whilst the station was vacated, who was checking out what the "Local" police had in their files and did some surveillance evidence or notes go astray. Did someone discover what Claudias Part was?

@MajorLang I didn't know about the alarm going off at that time! In any case, I doubt there will have been confidential paper files lying around - just IMO . Personally, I don't buy into the secret policeman boyfriend lead, unless there is some kind of evidence or substantiated rumour, other than hearsay. But I'd be happy to change my mind on that.

 

[AcbMurders]

Sorry, still coming to grips with the site. I expanded on the Major's points but as part of me quoting him, so my answers could have been missed. I'm pasting them below:

Nothing implied by A_comb. I just thought that by writing it that way, the posts would be less likely to come up in Google searches, but I can see now that it's confusing and I aim at transparency, so I'll avoid it from now on and just use the abbreviation 'Ac', given that AC is used for one of the POIs.

Drug money have been on my mind as well. Word around here is that, not so much the pub itself, but Kinsway West area (see pub address) is the place to go if you're looking for weed. Not sure about 'chalky'. I understand much has been done to clean up the pub image over the years, the clientele is still mostly local, working class (or not working), very white, families (bouncy castles and all that), certainly not affluent ... So, what would draw the likes of PR & co there after hours, as mentioned by @moonsafari in her blog? (more on that on my reply to your post in a short while, @moonsafari) And, why would CL go there, apart from getting in with the wrong crowd? A middle class girl like her in her Next clothes and maybe a fairly posh accent would stand up like a sore thumb in The Ac. And maybe even in the NH when she first arrived, hence all the male attention, although I cannot say because I don't know the NH. (Do we know about CL's accent btw?)

As for all the money spent on The Ac, if the funds had come from where you're suggesting, then it would have been indirectly IMO, or the police would have surely sussed that out. Some wealthy investors maybe, local to York but not Ac itself. I was looking at the Street View images of The Ac in Oct 2015 when the pub was in scaffolding, half expecting to see a Transcore sign or van somewhere, I can't see anything. Maybe some of you who is more observant can spot something. I also wonder whether changing the name as part of the refurb (and the revamp as well taking place when it did, Autumn 2015) had anything to do with making up for the bad publicity in 2014.

 

[curiosity2]

Hi Acb Murders, a few reporters stated they were warned off/threatened, some twice. Can you think of a reason why that was?

 

[Popejohn3]

Hello ACB Murder,

So if you believe Claudia was taken to Acomb initially then she must have been separated from her phone, which stayed within the nine mile radius that included her house, the university, and extended out as far as Tockwith, also that more than one person was involved?

Why Acomb and why without her phone? Do you think the sightings on her regular route to work were staged or that it was her and her phone was passed to someone during whatever altercation took place, after which as you believe she was transported without it to Acomb?

Have you heard your own local rumours in Acomb? I recently was told something about people who may know what happened but weren't involved, which I passed onto the Find Claudia email address.

In spite of the phone staying within 9 miles radius, the police still dug up the cellar didn’t ?
I think the police put too much emphasis in phone whereabouts ...the networks were evolving on a daily basis I would think .Always IMO

 

[keep-it-real]

Sorry, still coming to grips with the site. I expanded on the Major's points but as part of me quoting him, so my answers could have been missed. I'm pasting them below:

Nothing implied by A_comb. I just thought that by writing it that way, the posts would be less likely to come up in Google searches, but I can see now that it's confusing and I aim at transparency, so I'll avoid it from now on and just use the abbreviation 'Ac', given that AC is used for one of the POIs.

Drug money have been on my mind as well. Word around here is that, not so much the pub itself, but Kinsway West area (see pub address) is the place to go if you're looking for weed. Not sure about 'chalky'. I understand much has been done to clean up the pub image over the years, the clientele is still mostly local, working class (or not working), very white, families (bouncy castles and all that), certainly not affluent ... So, what would draw the likes of PR & co there after hours, as mentioned by @moonsafari in her blog? (more on that on my reply to your post in a short while, @moonsafari) And, why would CL go there, apart from getting in with the wrong crowd? A middle class girl like her in her Next clothes and maybe a fairly posh accent would stand up like a sore thumb in The Ac. And maybe even in the NH when she first arrived, hence all the male attention, although I cannot say because I don't know the NH. (Do we know about CL's accent btw?)

As for all the money spent on The Ac, if the funds had come from where you're suggesting, then it would have been indirectly IMO, or the police would have surely sussed that out. Some wealthy investors maybe, local to York but not Ac itself. I was looking at the Street View images of The Ac in Oct 2015 when the pub was in scaffolding, half expecting to see a Transcore sign or van somewhere, I can't see anything. Maybe some of you who is more observant can spot something. I also wonder whether changing the name as part of the refurb (and the revamp as well taking place when it did, Autumn 2015) had anything to do with making up for the bad publicity in 2014.

(Do we know about CL's accent btw?)
I think if you watch/listen to how Claudia's sister Ali speaks you would get a fair idea
Ali speaks from 2.22

 

[AcbMurders]

What makes you think Claudia was taken to the Acomb area after the 18 th March?
Is it because her phone was there weeks before ? And because the police searched the pub ? Or do you suspect something else ?

When NYP arrested PH, they also digged up the pub cellar. So, either they'd received what they thought was a genuine tip off or they knew CL's body wouldn't be in the pub, but they thought they might find something else incriminating stashed somewhere (eg drugs), so searching the cellar for CL's remains was just an excuse. I'd be interested in your views on that, sleuths.

The idea that CL might have been taken to the Ac area is because of NYP emphasising its relevance and the fact that, if she was abducted that evening in the black SUV (maybe lured into it by someone she trusted), the perps would have got out of Heworth asap and taken her to a less suspect part of town to do whatever they did to her. I stress that this is all hypothetical and only informed by tenuous indications, or I would have contacted the cold case team by now. I am sure that they will have considered this sort of scenario and speculations per se are no use to them at this stage.

 

[Popejohn3]

Hi Acb Murders, a few reporters stated they were warned off/threatened, some twice. Can you think of a reason why that was?

I think we should ignore these reporters unless they are willing to elaborate!
Was their life threatened? Watch what you say or we’ll sue ? Her father is a solicitor ... he MIGHT sue ... they need to elaborate !

 

[Andyboy]

Claudia's sister is pretty much accent less, which in fairness you tend to get with people that are privately educated

 

[Andyboy]

I think we should ignore these reporters unless they are willing to elaborate!
Was their life threatened? Watch what you say or we’ll sue ? Her father is a solicitor ... he MIGHT sue ... they need to elaborate !

Didnt the sky reporter say he was threatened, Gérard tubb I believe is his name, said it hadn't happened in a case this big before

 

[AcbMurders]

(Do we know about CL's accent btw?)
I think if you watch/listen to how Claudia's sister Ali speaks you would get a fair idea
Ali speaks from 2.22

Good point @keep-it-real! While Ali might have further refined her accent whilst at uni and in her job, CL's was probably similar, certainly not a thick York accent.

 

[Popejohn3]

When NYP arrested PH, they also digged up the pub cellar. So, either they'd received what they thought was a genuine tip off or they knew CL's body wouldn't be in the pub, but they thought they might find something else incriminating stashed somewhere (eg drugs), so searching the cellar for CL's remains was just an excuse. I'd be interested in your views on that, sleuths.

The idea that CL might have been taken to the Ac area is because of NYP emphasising its relevance and the fact that, if she was abducted that evening in the black SUV (maybe lured into it by someone she trusted), the perps would have got out of Heworth asap and taken her to a less suspect part of town to do whatever they did to her. I stress that this is all hypothetical and only informed by tenuous indications, or I would have contacted the cold case team by now. I am sure that they will have considered this sort of scenario and speculations per se are no use to them at this stage.

Are you implying CL was interrogated for her knowledge and ... more important...who did she inform ?

 

[AcbMurders]

The family home is quite an upgrade from their previous one too.

@Yozzer Do we know their new home address? (better to PM me if you know) I only know it's local and a detached house. I'd like to go and take a look.

 

[MajorLang]

slightly further back, major raised a point I've been thinking about in a slightly different way....whether alley man wanted to be on camera.
if were talking about locals, wouldn't they have known where the cameras were.

ie, its possible he planted himself there in the knowledge he would be a big distraction ....perhaps didn't live anywhere around there, so couldn't easily. be identified.

if the alley was used as a regular drugs run, or even an occasional one, wouldn't there be more cctv or how often was it wiped.

was there any kind of protection or amnesty given to local drug users if they had information about the local drugs scene.

wasn't a comb ....my computer refuses to write it as a joined up word....relevant in terms of cs alleged policeman boyfriend

I would say that whoever walked the alley did for the following reasons:

innocent act of someone going about their everyday business
A stupid perp / dealer
A deliberate distraction

we are told that it was busy for parking that night.
What if the person was looking for a parking space as that had parked on main road and there was no space at Nags ?

 

[curiosity2]

Tubb said "the only missing person case where I've been warned off or threatened - not once, but twice"

 

[Popejohn3]

Didnt the sky reporter say he was threatened, Gérard tubb I believe is his name, said it hadn't happened in a case this big before

Threatened could mean a lot of things to different people