UK - Constance Marten & Mark Gordon & Newborn (found deceased), Bolton Greater Manchester, 5 Jan 2023 #2 *Arrest*

[Rusty Braincells]

If CM had presented to a midwife then she would have been flagged up to SS due to the prior removal of her children. Hence, she didn't seem antenatal care.

I don't think anyone would have known she'd given birth if it weren't for the car fire to be honest. I think they were trying to go to Ireland though, and would have tried to settle there, where the perception is the authorities are more likely to keep children with parents.

If the other children have been adopted and she wasn't known to be pregnant then I see no reason for proactive SS monitoring.



Here's a thought - what if they've given the baby to a woman who is desperate for a baby of her own but struggles with infertility or neonatal loss. The sort of woman who buys a reborn doll to cope. She's so desperate for a baby that she agrees they can visit whenever.

She could have presented the baby as her own to friends and family - cryptic pregnancy, miracle baby etc. Undoubtedly she would have bonded with the baby, and phoning the police to admit where the baby is would mean telling her entire social circle that she's spun a web of lies to them.

Wild speculation on my part, and to be honest I think the most likely scenario is the baby has died, but if someone was caring for the baby and didn't come forward it would be a possible scenario.

I really hope they have given the baby away to someone kind who was sworn to secrecy or who has their own reasons to keep quiet, as you say. Hell, I even wish someone who had always wanted a child stumbled across the baby, took them home and has said nothing and the baby is safe and warm now.

 

[Alyce]

I just hope its safe & warm with some ‘means well do-gooder’ here & that they come forward today -maybe wishful thinking on my part…but i continue to be hopeful

I just cant imagine , after all the trouble they have gone to, that they would have left their baby on its own at any time. So indeed, do just have to hope that someone else was taking care of baby last night.

 

[Maltesepuppy]

If CM had presented to a midwife then she would have been flagged up to SS due to the prior removal of her children. Hence, she didn't seem antenatal care.

I don't think anyone would have known she'd given birth if it weren't for the car fire to be honest. I think they were trying to go to Ireland though, and would have tried to settle there, where the perception is the authorities are more likely to keep children with parents.

If the other children have been adopted and she wasn't known to be pregnant then I see no reason for proactive SS monitoring.



Here's a thought - what if they've given the baby to a woman who is desperate for a baby of her own but struggles with infertility or neonatal loss. The sort of woman who buys a reborn doll to cope. She's so desperate for a baby that she agrees they can visit whenever.

She could have presented the baby as her own to friends and family - cryptic pregnancy, miracle baby etc. Undoubtedly she would have bonded with the baby, and phoning the police to admit where the baby is would mean telling her entire social circle that she's spun a web of lies to them.

Wild speculation on my part, and to be honest I think the most likely scenario is the baby has died, but if someone was caring for the baby and didn't come forward it would be a possible scenario.

I'm clinging to something like that too. Or someone looking after the baby and being silly enough that CM and MG will be released without any charges and just need to care for the baby for a short while.
The other alternative is too horrible to contemplate.

 

[Nikynoo]

I just cant imagine , after all the trouble they have gone to, that they would have left their baby on its own at any time. So indeed, do just have to hope that someone else was taking care of baby last night.

what troubles me is that they were together and the baby was not with them. Do they aways have to be together?

 

[infinit]

A needle in a haystack. I try to think what I would have done in their situation assuming I didn't have 3rd party help and assuming short on money - that wooded area next to the golf course seems the best bet in the local area. But then there is an Asda superstore to the North which you could access via fields so I don't understand if that was the case what they'd be doing on the road they were caught without the baby.

 

[wizardizzo76]

Presumably the police have not found the tent? Or else they have found the tent and there is evidence of a baby still alive? Haven't seen anything about the tent at all?

 

[BaronessWombat]

IMO, there are many people nationally who think this couple have done nothing wrong. I can imagine that someone from the local homeless (etc) community would also be very sympathetic and would look after the baby on request for a few quid. Fingers crossed they find baby.

 

[Rusty Braincells]

There are many people nationally who think this couple have done nothing wrong. I can imagine that someone from the local homeless (etc) community would also be very sympathetic and would look after the baby on request for a few quid. Fingers crossed they find baby.

Hoping for something like this. Maybe they have a sympathetic friend who has taken the baby to raise him or her “off-grid” somewhere safe? It seems like clutching at straws but I would take it.

 

[Alyce]

there are live updates on the Mail if anyone is interested.

LIVE: Urgent hunt for baby as runaway mother and rapist lover arrested

MAILONLINE LIVEBLOG: Get all the latest updates on the urgent search for the missing newborn baby of Constance Marten and Mark Gordon in Brighton on February 28, 2023.

www.dailymail.co.uk

from the blog….it seems the shouting was when they were arrested and MG had to be restrained..

also a note that pink baby ear muffs have been found, although may not be directly linked

 

[Maltesepuppy]

Constance Marten’s father relief she’s been found - and his fears for missing baby

The father of runaway aristocrat Constance Marten said he was extremely worried about her newborn child

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Davieson]

Presumably the police have not found the tent? Or else they have found the tent and there is evidence of a baby still alive? Haven't seen anything about the tent at all?

Clearly they bought a tent. Is there any evidence that they were ever living in it ?

 

[Furore]

This is very dangerous language. The child wouldn't be 'ripped away from it's parents'. It would be taken into safe keeping away from harm.

The police clearly have good reason to believe the child is not safe with the mother and father, and given they've not been sighted with the child in weeks, they're probably right.

Agree. Even if done out of greatest love imaginable, it’s a seriously neglectful manner of thinking to camp with a newborn in winter. Cold, poor hygiene. The. Parents rights to rear own child are rightfully imo lost when it’s physical safety is compromised. It’s an innocent, entitled to exist and not just at its parents’ whimsy. It’s harder to get a dog that it is a human child. Poor vulnerable little thing.

 

[wizardizzo76]

Clearly they bought a tent. Is there any evidence that they were ever living in it ?

No, but police reports seem to state that they were correct in their assessment that they were living outdoors. The other alternative is sleeping in outbuildings, I guess, but there is more chance of being caught I suppose, in such a scenario.

 

[Alyce]

there are live updates on the Mail if anyone is interested.

LIVE: Urgent hunt for baby as runaway mother and rapist lover arrested

MAILONLINE LIVEBLOG: Get all the latest updates on the urgent search for the missing newborn baby of Constance Marten and Mark Gordon in Brighton on February 28, 2023.

www.dailymail.co.uk

The pair were found and arrested by police on Monday evening near Brighton following a tip-off from a member of the public, who spotted them trying to get out money from a cash point.


But their two-month-old baby boy - who has not been seen for weeks - was not with them when authorities found the pair.

LIVE: Urgent hunt for baby as runaway mother and rapist lover arrested

MAILONLINE LIVEBLOG: Get all the latest updates on the urgent search for the missing newborn baby of Constance Marten and Mark Gordon in Brighton on February 28, 2023.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Nikynoo]

No, but police reports seem to state that they were correct in their assessment that they were living outdoors. The other alternative is sleeping in outbuildings, I guess, but there is more chance of being caught I suppose, in such a scenario.

a tent inside one of those allotment buildings maybe?

 

[Themac101]

I don't feel for them at all. That baby and her other children didn't ask to be born into their reckless lifestyle. If she wants to live like that it's her prerogative but when innocent children are brought into it then the game changes. Contrary to popular belief ss don't just take children away for the fun of it, they obviously have major concerns and if their other children are also not in their care something is obviously very wrong. They have proved themselves to be completely unsuitable parents by doing what they've been doing for the last 54 days!

Amen to that.

 

[CriLondon]

The pair were found and arrested by police on Monday evening near Brighton following a tip-off from a member of the public, who spotted them trying to get out money from a cash point.


But their two-month-old baby boy - who has not been seen for weeks - was not with them when authorities found the pair.

LIVE: Urgent hunt for baby as runaway mother and rapist lover arrested

MAILONLINE LIVEBLOG: Get all the latest updates on the urgent search for the missing newborn baby of Constance Marten and Mark Gordon in Brighton on February 28, 2023.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Money from a cash point ?
Whose money ?
Whose account ??

 

[Amaz0nia]

The baby (if still alive & not with anyone else) has now been on its own overnight, outside for 15hours…last night was freezing here and not much better today. Surely, now that they have been arrested (and that the games up so to speak), CM & MG would have done the right thing & told the police by now where it is? 15hours is a long time outside for a newborn with no food/warmth, im also sure it would be crying too…im now thinking perhaps the baby hasnt survived and maybe died a week or so ago..which is why they arnt saying anything as to the location of where he/she is, as if the infant has perished it changes the nature of this case completly..just my opinion

 

[Telltale]

It's a damn shame they didn't hold off arresting them and instead follow them back to their camp. But then there probably has been so many false sightings they had no idea this was real until they got up close.

Desperately hoping they find the little mite, and these two arn't so stubborn and delusional they would leave him alone somewhere rather than let the authorities take him.

 

[Amaz0nia]

Money from a cash point ?
Whose money ?
Whose account ??

Would imagine her trust fund, her account