UK UK - Corrie McKeague, 23, Bury St Edmunds, 24 September 2016 #12

[earthspirit]

I find it more odd that in the Look East reconstruction video every indication from those interviewed at each venue talked about him as if he was alone. None mention/refer to his friends. The Flex manager even says in his interview that it was like Corrie was approaching people in Flex like he was looking for someone. I just can't think of a reason why it would be stated he was with his mates if he wasn't, though. With his mates being completely silent I guess we'll never know.

i do not know who any of corrie's friends are - i know nothing about any of them - so its probably wrong to make assumptions. their commander said they did not feel guilty about his demise? they know he goes off doing his own thing - that to me does not sound much like good mates - dont you share the fun times with your mates? he did not go into the club with them and seems to have spent the whole evening on his own - possibly forcing his company on others - random stangers? i find this all incredibly sad and quite upsetting. its even worse that he has vanished. as a living person, it would be a sad lonely soul, but now someone had taken and hurt him and there is not too much being said from anyone other than his mum and uncle - cant people just see that this is really utterly tragic?

 

[Shiressleuth]

I agree. Also, he wasn't reported missing until the Monday afternoon. I didn't know that he had spoken to his brother four times that day. So from Saturday night until the Monday PM none of his family had tried to contact him? I also agree that there is more to this than meets the eye.

No from Friday night till Monday. The only thing that could explain the lack of calls would be if you knew that person was going to be busy so perhaps they knew what his plans were or if you were meeting them and being with them yourself . That's the only explanations I can think of. Not even we tried to contact him all weekend?Obviously this is all my speculation and JMO.

 

[earthspirit]

OK, so if we know that Grindr requires GPS and that GPS was disabled on Corrie's phone .... and that the family have said all along that he didn't have Grindr installed anyway ... can we now rule out a Grindr hookup?

I'm aware there are other ways to arrange a hookup, but can we discount Grindr specifically now? Or is there some bit of information I'm overlooking?

the more info that comes out the most im thinking that this is a random chance meeting in the horseshoe. he was a state after sleeping in the shop doorway - bedraggled and crumpled. the bin area is an place of contention for me - <modsnip> i dont think he stumbled on a drug deal - so that leaves just random pickups or someone who did not like corrie having a chance meeting with him in that area? perhaps another drunk? someone looking out for him due to earlier or other day issues? maybe he was known to frequent that area? where was he going and why? we dont have a clue do we?

 

[mrseeker]

i do not know who any of corrie's friends are - i know nothing about any of them - so its probably wrong to make assumptions. their commander said they did not feel guilty about his demise? they know he goes off doing his own thing - that to me does not sound much like good mates - dont you share the fun times with your mates? he did not go into the club with them and seems to have spent the whole evening on his own - possibly forcing his company on others - random stangers? i find this all incredibly sad and quite upsetting. its even worse that he has vanished. as a living person, it would be a sad lonely soul, but now someone had taken and hurt him and there is not too much being said from anyone other than his mum and uncle - cant people just see that this is really utterly tragic?

I just don't understand anything the friends did. He is asked to leave the club and his friends do nothing. Wouldn't the first response of his pals be to talk to the bouncer and say, we will watch after him and not let him drink? I tended bar in my younger days, and the last step is to bounce you, unless to prevent a fight. So if he is annoying people, why not just say..go sit with your friends and you are cut off, or we will kick you out. Maybe its a crowded club, but the articles I have read was the bouncer knew him. So how bad was his behavior? It almost seems he had no real friends in this group. He was a hanger on and they tried to ditch him once already. Their commander said his friends were "aware of his lifestyle" but did not feel guilty. Well if they were really friends they would feel guilty. Feeling guilty is often not rational. They might be guiltless but if they cared about him they would still feel guilty. Perhaps the commander was inserting his own opinion. But this whole night out is very strange to me. Even at 23, I never was so drunk I was sleeping on a sidewalk. I know the friends I had would never allow it. If one of them was a real friend we would have never heard of Corrie.

 

[Northern Light]

He sounds like a spontaneous and possibly impulsive character. One way to solve the problem of needing somewhere comfortable to sleep and ensure his night is worthwhile is to arrange a hook-up with someone who lives close by.


What I can't understand is that if he was as much of a ladies' man and social animal as we are led to believe, there must have been a chance that other people in his phone's contacts would have been out on the town that evening - we learn from MSM interviews that he was a distinctive personality around town.

If I were in his predicament, I would have been trying to establish who nearby had a sofa I could crash on until the morning.

Your last paragraph, he may very well have done that and was collected by someone. The arrangements may have been made earlier in the evening befòre he got asked to leave Flex. The pick up time máy have been 3.30am. That collection area chosen as he always went to the same takeaway, so that night he was there earlier than he possibly planned to be and waited. MOO

 

[mrazda71]

I think there remains a possibility of the phone in the bin that was emptied that morning and went on to its next pick-up in Mildenhall. We've been told there's a sort of correlation but not that it was a perfect correlation.

But, the actual bin that was emptied, and possibly contained the phone, was weighed at 11kg and was apparently recycling material. So it seems doubtful to me that Corrie was in that bin.

What are the chances of Corrie being in one bin and his phone in another? (An honest question, not a put-down.)

I think it's more likely that he put his phone down on top of a bin (maybe while having a pee?) and then gone on his way either by foot or by vehicle, in its black leather case it would've been difficult to see and wouldn't necessarily fall off as the bin was pushed TO the lorry but in it goes as the bin is tipped.

 

[earthspirit]

I just don't understand anything the friends did. He is asked to leave the club and his friends do nothing. Wouldn't the first response of his pals be to talk to the bouncer and say, we will watch after him and not let him drink? I tended bar in my younger days, and the last step is to bounce you, unless to prevent a fight. So if he is annoying people, why not just say..go sit with your friends and you are cut off, or we will kick you out. Maybe its a crowded club, but the articles I have read was the bouncer knew him. So how bad was his behavior? It almost seems he had no real friends in this group. He was a hanger on and they tried to ditch him once already. Their commander said his friends were "aware of his lifestyle" but did not feel guilty. Well if they were really friends they would feel guilty. Feeling guilty is often not rational. They might be guiltless but if they cared about him they would still feel guilty. Perhaps the commander was inserting his own opinion. But this whole night out is very strange to me. Even at 23, I never was so drunk I was sleeping on a sidewalk. I know the friends I had would never allow it. If one of them was a real friend we would have never heard of Corrie.

- i am irrationaly probably not liking his so called friends. did not one single one of them try to contact him about louell the dog? surely if they had then the camp commander might have said this. who let his family know he was missing? was it a call from police?

 

[trefrew2016]

https://www.suffolk.police.uk/sites/suffolk/files/page/gallery/corriecctvimage10.jpg

I've worked this one out (possibility of figure in background) - it isn't a person and it isn't the statue on the roundabout. It's a short black and white bollard marking the edge of the pavement and cycle lane, combined with a bit of CCTV image pixellation! Just goes to show how your mind can play tricks on you when you really hope to see something...

 

[MissTerious]

Do we know for certain that the family didn't try to contact him until the Monday when he was reported missing after being absent for parade? If so I've never seen this anywhere, I would have thought there would be unanswered texts on his phone but just not gone long enough to particularly alert anyone.

With regards to being inside the bin and tipped into lorry. I know that this has happened before to others but as this was just one collection of recycling material (apart from it being weighed), wouldn't the driver actually be quite focussed on this collection and stood next the lorry operating the tipping of bin into the lorry and seeing as though he would have only been there about 1hr, he surely would have woken upon movement of bin - he didn't seem to be so drunk he would fall totally unconscious. Could he have climbed in hidden from view for a lift, I do still think its possible.

My thoughts are currently around the Focus 12 entrance, I think you could possibly assault someone here out of sight and quite possibly unheard. Although this would make 4 minute man of great interest who must have seen Corrie but not come forward that we know of.

Also, in the Q&A Nicola says that despite asking constantly and being promised she still hasn't viewed the CCTV footage of Corrie in that shop doorway and she has been told that this is down to resources and police not finding the time to download a disc for her. Do we believe this to be the real reason, or is there maybe activity on this footage that police do not want even the family to see?

I also believe that Corrie was a character that might not have been everyone's cup of tea, a bit in your face at times I imagine. For me though, if Nicola says her son was not gay then I believe her. She hasn't just said no she has categorically said no. He would be out and proud and why wouldn't he be, yes I know that there can be military stigma but we are living in more tolerant times thank goodness.

 

[MidsummersDay]

We've also not really discussed (to my recollection) whether the phone would even have signal in the back of a bin lorry to be able to ping a mast.

Spoke to a bin lorry driver today at great lengths. He said that there were many variants on bin lorry but the all essentially lift, compact, contain, drop. He also said that there was EVERY CHANCE a person could climb into the containment area if it weren't for the driver watching the vehicles safety camera. In 18 years he has never come across an issue of 'lift and crush' as part of the bin men's checks is to lift the bin lids prior to lift, then then driver observes using the CCTV camera with his hand on the emergency stop button. That aside, we've been told that Corrie would have been found in the processing system anyway.

With regards to the phone; I'll point this out again and would welcome debate on this;
There are several blue paper bins around the 'Horseshoe' ranging in size from small crocodile lid boxes, through to household domestic, up to commercial 1100ltr sized. How is it possible for a single Biffa (confirmed) bin lorry to lift the very same bin that Corrie dropped his phone in with contents weighing 11kgs? The chances are (number of bins) to one??!
Discuss!


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[cottonweaver]

https://www.suffolk.police.uk/sites/suffolk/files/page/gallery/corriecctvimage10.jpg

I've worked this one out (possibility of figure in background) - it isn't a person and it isn't the statue on the roundabout. It's a short black and white bollard marking the edge of the pavement and cycle lane, combined with a bit of CCTV image pixellation! Just goes to show how your mind can play tricks on you when you really hope to see something...

Thank goodness for that That's Grindr out and the pink statue. ( Think we need an "eliminated" thread!)

 

[Northern Light]

Spoke to a bin lorry driver today at great lengths. He said that there were many variants on bin lorry but the all essentially lift, compact, contain, drop. He also said that there was EVERY CHANCE a person could climb into the containment area if it weren't for the driver watching the vehicles safety camera. In 18 years he has never come across an issue of 'lift and crush' as part of the bin men's checks is to lift the bin lids prior to lift, then then driver observes using the CCTV camera with his hand on the emergency stop button. That aside, we've been told that Corrie would have been found in the processing system anyway.

With regards to the phone; I'll point this out again and would welcome debate on this;
There are several blue paper bins around the 'Horseshoe' ranging in size from small crocodile lid boxes, through to household domestic, up to commercial 1100ltr sized. How is it possible for a single Biffa (confirmed) bin lorry to lift the very same bin that Corrie dropped his phone in with contents weighing 11kgs? The chances are (number of bins) to one??!
Discuss!


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Excellent work AGAIN.

 

[JamesKing]

The police say the phone took 28 mins to ping in BM

Nicola said the bin lorry was in the HS at 0420

Corrie enters the HS at 0325

The police and Nicola say that the "phone movements correlate approximately to that of the bin lorry's movements", whether or not it was in that vehicle.

So...

From 0325 to 0420 the phone pings in BSE ?
That's 55 minutes.

I sometimes feel the investigation is making itself "overly complicated" and is failing to look at explaining those 55 minutes.

What vehicles and people were in that area...at that time ?
That information seems to be "muddled".

 

[Ironside]

Spoke to a bin lorry driver today at great lengths. He said that there were many variants on bin lorry but the all essentially lift, compact, contain, drop. He also said that there was EVERY CHANCE a person could climb into the containment area if it weren't for the driver watching the vehicles safety camera. In 18 years he has never come across an issue of 'lift and crush' as part of the bin men's checks is to lift the bin lids prior to lift, then then driver observes using the CCTV camera with his hand on the emergency stop button. That aside, we've been told that Corrie would have been found in the processing system anyway.

With regards to the phone; I'll point this out again and would welcome debate on this;
There are several blue paper bins around the 'Horseshoe' ranging in size from small crocodile lid boxes, through to household domestic, up to commercial 1100ltr sized. How is it possible for a single Biffa (confirmed) bin lorry to lift the very same bin that Corrie dropped his phone in with contents weighing 11kgs? The chances are (number of bins) to one??!
Discuss!


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Perhaps someone familiar with the bin collections (maybe they resided very close by? ) knew which bin would be collected that morning and chucked the phone in there to put people off the scent.

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[trefrew2016]

How is it possible for a single Biffa (confirmed) bin lorry to lift the very same bin that Corrie dropped his phone in with contents weighing 11kgs? The chances are (number of bins) to one??!

Extraordinarily slim, unless you are familiar with that area at that time of the morning and know where to put it. Or unless you're in the horseshoe at the time that the bin lorry arrives and take the opportunity to dispose of the phone, perhaps without the knowledge of the driver.

All of which is far fetched!

 

[Shiressleuth]

Do we know for certain that the family didn't try to contact him until the Monday when he was reported missing after being absent for parade? If so I've never seen this anywhere, I would have thought there would be unanswered texts on his phone but just not gone long enough to particularly alert anyone.

With regards to being inside the bin and tipped into lorry. I know that this has happened before to others but as this was just one collection of recycling material (apart from it being weighed), wouldn't the driver actually be quite focussed on this collection and stood next the lorry operating the tipping of bin into the lorry and seeing as though he would have only been there about 1hr, he surely would have woken upon movement of bin - he didn't seem to be so drunk he would fall totally unconscious. Could he have climbed in hidden from view for a lift, I do still think its possible.

My thoughts are currently around the Focus 12 entrance, I think you could possibly assault someone here out of sight and quite possibly unheard. Although this would make 4 minute man of great interest who must have seen Corrie but not come forward that we know of.

Also, in the Q&A Nicola says that despite asking constantly and being promised she still hasn't viewed the CCTV footage of Corrie in that shop doorway and she has been told that this is down to resources and police not finding the time to download a disc for her. Do we believe this to be the real reason, or is there maybe activity on this footage that police do not want even the family to see?

I also believe that Corrie was a character that might not have been everyone's cup of tea, a bit in your face at times I imagine. For me though, if Nicola says her son was not gay then I believe her. She hasn't just said no she has categorically said no. He would be out and proud and why wouldn't he be, yes I know that there can be military stigma but we are living in more tolerant times thank goodness.

Your last but one para has maybe got an important point in it. Of course they should be able to see it. Who checked on him? Maybe they arranged a lift for him? Or said they would come back for him later and told him where and what time? If it was the last footage of my son I would break into the police station if necessary. How ridiculous?

 

[MidsummersDay]

This is a speculative timetable. It's designed to flesh out the moments before Corrie's disappearance.
There are still timings that are contentious and still areas up for debate. On the whole though it's fairly firm. If it has a link then it's nearly a 'given' that it happened. If no link is listed against a time, please respond with the 'time and a link' to make it easier for me. TIA
For some reason, I am not seeing everyone's messages so my apologies. Not sure why?!

0300: Shift start time & vehicle checked
0352: Vehicle departs for SB (8 minute journey from site to 'Horseshoe').
0400: Bin man enters SB
0405: Driver fills in collection paperwork.
0415: Bin man starts collection procedure
0420: Bin man sees three teenagers in SB
0425: Bin man finishes collection procedure
0430: Bin man departs SB for BM (31 minute journey from 'Horseshoe' to BM roundabout).
0501: Bin lorry arrives at BM roundabout/Mildenhall.


21(15): Corrie feeds the dog and locks him in the bathroom.
21(30): Two cars with Corrie's workmates depart Hon.
2200: Corrie departs Hon in his own car (with a passenger?).
http://www.findcorrie.co.uk/2016/11/11/what-time-did-corrie-leave-raf-honington/
2221: Corrie parks in disabled bay in Robert Roby Way.
2221-2250: Corrie drinks in his car whilst making a phone call to Darroch.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/71...-McKeague-awol-regiment-cared-puppy-Honington
2305: Corrie walks to SoBar pub and meets up with work colleagues.
2320: Corrie walks to Weatherspoons.
0001: Corrie leaves Weatherspoons around midnight for Flex.
Source- BBC Look East Evening News 12122016
0015: Corrie enters Flex night club.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=v9IR-qslpEw
0110: Corrie is 'ejected' from the nightclub.
0120: Corrie enters kebab shop & plays rock, paper, scissors with a customer and sits with a group whilst his order is ready. He leaves with a black man in a black t shirt with the numbers 78 in Roman numerals written on it.
http://www.eadt.co.uk/news/police_s..._takeaway_on_night_of_disappearance_1_4744362
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=v9IR-qslpEw
0130: Corrie leaves kebab shop with kebab, chips and two burgers.
http://www.findcorrie.co.uk/2016/11/11/isnt-it-weird-to-sleep-in-a-doorway/
Corrie seen walking purposefully towards The Grapes pub.
http://www.findcorrie.co.uk/2016/11/11/what-time-is-the-1st-cctv-that-we-see-him-on/
0300: Shift start time for bin man. Vehicle checked. Corrie’s mobile phone records show he sent a picture to a friend at 3am.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/71...-McKeague-awol-regiment-cared-puppy-Honington
0308: Corrie forwards a photo image to a friend from Hughes shop doorway.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=v9IR-qslpEw
http://www.findcorrie.co.uk/2016/11/11/has-the-text-message-corrie-sent-at-0308-been-looked-in-to/
0319: Two persons seen walking from Market Square towards McDonalds.
https://www.suffolk.police.uk/news/missing-persons/corrie-mckeague
0321: White Tshirt man and two figures walking past Cornhill Walk towards Loom Street.
https://www.suffolk.police.uk/news/missing-persons/corrie-mckeague
0324: Last CCTV sighting of Corrie.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=46UD0lk-c2g
http://www.findcorrie.co.uk/2016/11/11/when-and-where-was-corrie-last-seen/
0326: Two people with light clothing seen outside Cornhill Walk.
https://www.suffolk.police.uk/news/missing-persons/corrie-mckeague
0335: Dark clothing1 man walking past Cornhill Walk towards Loom Street.
https://www.suffolk.police.uk/news/missing-persons/corrie-mckeague
0340: Running man, Lurker & Legs man seen in 'Horseshoe'.
0352: Bin lorry departs (Hollow Lane) for BSE.
0356: Bicycle man, cycling around Cornhill area.
https://www.suffolk.police.uk/news/missing-persons/corrie-mckeague
0400: Bin lorry enters SB.
0405: Bin lorry driver fills in collection paperwork.
0410: Bins lorry driver starts collection procedure of ONE BIN with 11kgs of material in it.
0415: Bin man starts collection procedure.
0420: Bin man finishes collection procedure in SB. Three teenagers seen at the rear of Cornwalk Shopping Centre by bin man.
0425: Bin man finishes collection procedure.
0430: Corrie's phone left the BSE mast area. Phone takes 28 minutes to reach the BM area. Link at 9 minute 9 seconds point. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=v9IR-qslpEw
Bin lorry heads towards Mildenhall for a collection, along A1101 via the BM roundabout.
0455: (Bin lorry is at Barton Mills roundabout.)
0458: Corrie's phone enters the BM mast area (if the 0430 quote is extrapolated).
http://www.findcorrie.co.uk/2016/11/11/has-corries-phone-been-checked/
0501: Dark clothing2 man seen walking past Cornhill Walk towards Loom Street.
https://www.suffolk.police.uk/news/missing-persons/corrie-mckeague
0501: (Bin lorry is at BM roundabout/Mildenhall).
0503: (Corrie's phone would be at BM roundabout at this time if the 0430 quote is extrapolated.)
0518: Dark clothing3 man seen walking around Cornhill Walk.
https://www.suffolk.police.uk/news/missing-persons/corrie-mckeague
0520: Dark backpack man seen in Cornhill Market Square area.
https://www.suffolk.police.uk/news/missing-persons/corrie-mckeague
0800: Corrie's phone is last active within the BM mast area.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ouZCCnULs34


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[WhereIsJohnnyGosch]

To me it seems like if there was foul play involved then it would be an opportunistic crime. I can't believe that the sequence of events leading up to that moment he stepped out of sight of the CCTV in the horseshoe could be preplanned. If it was a 3rd party they must of saw an opportunity and took it. If that was the case then I don't believe the intention was to kill anyone, if they did kill Corrie then i think it would have been an accident/after a struggle. Killers don't generally pick people at random, from my experience it would seem the victims usually fit some kind of profile.

I know this is a long shot but this happened at the time when there was a trend of clowns standing in random places and scaring people. Do you think he saw someone dressed as a clown and approached them? Maybe he wasn't scared so they tried to scare him and a struggle ensued? But then I suppose they'd have to get out of the area dressed as a clown.


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[Diane188&]

Hi guys, been on here as a guest, first post but read most of the posts on all the different threads so far.... I have a few points that I want to get off my chest but one question first that I don't know if it has been asked/answered yet (apologies if it has) ok .. the police know he sent a text message at 3.08 because the phone provider can provide this information and the person who received it came forward. I used to work for a phone company and I know we could see a list of who people had called, when , length and cost of call, how many texts they had sent, and when they had used mobile data, but does anyone know if u send messages on whatsapp or another messaging service if this shows up or would you need the phone ? I'm asking because I know if I was on a night out then ended up out the club for whatever reason my only 2 thoughts would be food and home .. ok corrie does the first then he sits / sleeps in a door (his mum says this is normal so ok no problem) . The things that bother me are - apparently the guy in the kebab shop offers him a lift and he says no - only reason I would do that would be if I had arranged to meet someone.
2: when he wakes up in the door way and sends that picture he doesn't get up and go he hangs about there till almost half past. The time he leaves from the door suggests time for a pee then a meeting for 3:30( which would be his pre arranged meeting time because he wouldn't know before hand he was going to get kicked out the club). Those 2 things make it impossible (almost) for me to believe he didn't have plans. I have a loose theory for after that but that's plenty rambling for a first post . D

 

[WhereIsJohnnyGosch]

Hi guys, been on here as a guest, first post but read most of the posts on all the different threads so far.... I have a few points that I want to get off my chest but one question first that I don't know if it has been asked/answered yet (apologies if it has) ok .. the police know he sent a text message at 3.08 because the phone provider can provide this information and the person who received it came forward. I used to work for a phone company and I know we could see a list of who people had called, when , length and cost of call, how many texts they had sent, and when they had used mobile data, but does anyone know if u send messages on whatsapp or another messaging service if this shows up or would you need the phone ? I'm asking because I know if I was on a night out then ended up out the club for whatever reason my only 2 thoughts would be food and home .. ok corrie does the first then he sits / sleeps in a door (his mum says this is normal so ok no problem) . The things that bother me are - apparently the guy in the kebab shop offers him a lift and he says no - only reason I would do that would be if I had arranged to meet someone.

Whatsapp is end to end encrypted so the only people who would see the messages are the sender and the receiver. However it would use data so I suppose you could tell when he used data but I guess it would be hard to know what it was for as depending on the data your sending would depend on the size.


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