UK UK - Corrie McKeague, 23, Bury St Edmunds, 24 September 2016 #7

[calo44]

Hi all,
Another newbie here! I've been lurking for a while as I have links to the forces (ex-husband served 24 years in the Army) and have also family living in BSE for 40 years... and this has me stumped!
Just wanted to add my bit... drugs are a real 'thing' in the forces. My ex was completely anti-drugs and used to be in charge of the tests (usually done on Monday mornings or after long summer/Christmas leave periods) but when we split up I dated another soldier (different regiment, lower rank) who I caught taking coke, along with all his squadron, every weekend like it was going out of fashion! Call me a goody two shoes but I was AMAZED as I thought it was a dismissable offence, plus you're handling live ammo! Apparently if you were 'in the know' you'd get a tip off when a test was due so you'd know to have a drug free weekend.
Apologies for this not being particularly Corrie related, just wanted to mention it as I wouldn't rule drugs out after having seen it first hand.

Welcome, Pooks, and thanks for the insight!

 

[JamesKing]

Hi all,
Another newbie here! I've been lurking for a while as I have links to the forces (ex-husband served 24 years in the Army) and have also family living in BSE for 40 years... and this has me stumped!
Just wanted to add my bit... drugs are a real 'thing' in the forces. My ex was completely anti-drugs and used to be in charge of the tests (usually done on Monday mornings or after long summer/Christmas leave periods) but when we split up I dated another soldier (different regiment, lower rank) who I caught taking coke, along with all his squadron, every weekend like it was going out of fashion! Call me a goody two shoes but I was AMAZED as I thought it was a dismissable offence, plus you're handling live ammo! Apparently if you were 'in the know' you'd get a tip off when a test was due so you'd know to have a drug free weekend.
Apologies for this not being particularly Corrie related, just wanted to mention it as I wouldn't rule drugs out after having seen it first hand.

I have to agree totally with this poster.

And add. Random drug tests in the military are "rubbish". And it is dependant on your "career"

I have an ex AAC friend (pilot) and an ex RAF pilot (a former Red no less). Both value their careers. Both would have nothing to do with drugs.
Lower ranks (in different areas) would not have these concerns.

Ex Mil myself, I witnesses this "problem" in a more "infantry" role branches and in OR areas (Other Ranks).

I agree with this post.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Would it help if we chronologically laid out our unanswered/un-discussed questions:

1 - why didn't Corrie find his friends in Bury that night? (Conflict? avoidance? Prior party?)
2 - who was Corrie's 3:08 text to and what did it really say? (Is "pic of he and Darroch sent to friend" really accurate?)
3 - when were the other bins in the horseshoe area picked up?
4 - if the "4 min man" was identified, did he/she provide any useful info?
5 - have the operators of the 4 vehicles in area been identified & questioned?
6 - have they identified the car seen going the wrong way in Bury that night?

other:
1 - where was Corrie's American friend that night, the one that he usually goes to Mama Mia's with?

We have discussed 1, 2 & 3 but came to the conclusion that police will already know this but perhaps haven't released it for their own reasons. 4, 5 & 6 may be answered or perhaps clarified in the awaited update. Other 1, we have speculated but I don't think anyone except the takeaway guy has mentioned him so don't know the police/family position but would hope they have checked it out. Older cctv would have shown corrie with this guy at the takeaway if it hasn't already been written over and his other friends could have confirmed that presumably as well. All Important points. I would include one more under other 2. Are we definitely sure with certainty that the upper storeys with access from the bin area are not used for residential or uses other than offices/storage? (Planning permission to change use from office or storage to residential is no longer required and has been permitted development for a few years now so the use could have changed with little fuss or knowledge)

 

[bbyblueeyez]

Welcome Pooks101 there all a friendly bunch here

 

[calo44]

Speaking of updates from family, I'm sure an update has been promised for several days now but nothing as yet.

Anyone got any speculation about why it's been delayed and when there may be one?
We've not heard anything specific since the CCTV was viewed at the pod a week ago.
Any theories about what's going on (or not) in the background?

Maybe the family has to run their written statement past the police for sign off before publishing, in case something is inadvertently leaked that is supposed to be kept quiet?

 

[Shiressleuth]

When they showed the footage in the pod on the Thursday, they explained that it was the original footage and that a number of those shown had already been identified.
So why not show the 4 min lurker?

because they know who it is?

 

[MidsummersDay]

But he wouldn't of known where the bin lorry was heading...

There's only one way in and out of SB Roger as you probably know. To the end of the street is better than walking 1/2 a mile. I still don't believe this theory though as the timings are completely out of sync.

 

[jessie]

Maybe the family has to run their written statement past the police for sign off before publishing, in case something is inadvertently leaked that is supposed to be kept quiet?

Absolutely ! I trust the police keep the family in touch with their investigations but would not expect these to be made public.

I expect little from any family update.

 

[Yorkshirelass]

I still think the answer to all this is in the "the waiting around" why wait ??? He got seperated from friends then went for food then waited .... I assume a lift or a pre arranged meet . If he had been planning on getting back to camp surley a taxi wouldn't of cost that much and although I can only speculate how much money he had on him ( my forces son and his friends only spend their emergency taxi fund if their having a good night or pull or have a lift " .. his words not mine lol ) Even if Corrie hadn't planned on a taxi to get home earlier in the night due to money he surley wouldn't have spent that much with him looking for friends and being expelled from the club .... so why didn't he call it a night after filling his belly ?? He surley waited for a lift IMO

 

[calo44]

http://www.ipswichstar.co.uk/news/s..._where_are_suffolk_s_missing_people_1_3629520

An interesting (if dated) article about missing people in Suffolk. The numbers are crazy! But it mentions being deemed 'missing' vs 'absent'. I wonder if that's what

Corrie is viewed as - absent - which may explain why he's not getting the resources
and attention from the military and no mention on the missing persons websites?

 

[DanceCard]

Absolutely ! I trust the police keep the family in touch with their investigations but would not expect these to be made public.

I expect little from any family update.

Oh just to be very clear here since this was a reply to something I have posted. I wasn't saying at all that the family should be disclosing anything sensitive. I even said that I don't expect updates from them. They're choosing to give updates every so often but of course they don't have to do that! I would far rather be hearing updates from the police themselves anyway!

My post was just wondering - and asking other posters for their thoughts on - why they keep saying there'll be an update from them imminently and then they don't update. If it is the case that they're running stuff by the police first, I understand that absolutely but if that's the reason for the delays it would be better to say they don't HAVE an update. Until they actually do.

 

[Pooks101]

Welcome Pooks101 there all a friendly bunch here

Thank you, pleased to be here after following all the posts from thread 1! Everyone seems very knowledgeable and I'm no expert but something doesn't add up so just wanted to throw my thoughts into the mix!

 

[Shiressleuth]

Page number is no use as we all have different 'posts per page' settings (default is 10, mine is 50, max is 100 I think!), so if you're ever referring to a post please use the # number.

Ehh?????? Sorry don't understand this.

 

[MidsummersDay]

Something that strikes me is how early on in the investigation the bin lorry was identified. I'm inclined to think there was a reason for this, and I do think it is likely that Corrie's phone was in it, though he was not.

So here's one potential scenario which both accommodates that and explains how Corrie might have come to leave the horseshoe area in a vehicle.

Corrie enters the horseshoe area with the intention of having a pee. Already in the area is a parked car and driver. Corrie puts his phone on top of the bin whilst he has a pee. As soon as he has finished, the driver of the car attracts his attention for some purpose; lecturing him on urinating in public/ asking for directions / whatever. They get into a conversation.

The bin lorry arrives whilst they are talking, and takes Corrie's phone away with the bin. He realises what has happened almost immediately, but too late to stop it.

At this point, the driver of the car tells him to hop in; they'll follow the lorry and flag it down. Corrie may even have made the suggestion himself.

From here, there are a number of possibilities:

1) Corrie had the tremendous misfortune to have stumbled upon someone with pre-existing criminal intentions, who took opportunistic advantage of the situation to abduct and kill him. This would be a tremendous coincidence, but it's not impossible.

2) there was no initial malicious intention on the part of the driver, but there was an argument en route; perhaps Corrie was sick in the car, and was ejected, possibly forcibly. This could have happened in the middle of nowhere; Corrie tried to make his way back on foot but met with an accident and has not been found. The driver hasn't come forward because they feel guilty about abandoning him, especially if physical force was involved.

3) nothing untoward took place involving the driver; he dropped Corrie off somewhere, perhaps after Corrie had decided that pursuing the bin lorry was a bit of a wild goose chase and he might as well write the phone off and go home. From here, it's the same scenario as in 2; Corrie met with an accident whilst walking home. The driver hasn't come forward, not for any reasons relating to Corrie, but because they don't want police attention on their activities in the earlier part of the night, for whatever reason.

The only slight snag to this theory is that the conversation between Corrie and the driver would have had to have been a fairly lengthy one, if the bin lorry didn't arrive until around 4am. But I'm not sure if we ever had that time definitely confirmed, did we? I think we know his phone was still pinging a mast in central BSE at 4am, but that would allow the bin lorry to have exited the horseshoe area somewhat earlier.

I very much feel that we've been here before.
According to the information gathered, summising and working out time/speed/distance equations, the bin lorry entered SB around 0405 and proceeded to empty the bins. The driver noticed three teenagers at around 0420 in the area of SB at the same time they were reported by a local resident.
Corrie's mobile phone left the BSE mast area at 0430 and entered the BM mast area at 0458 where the signal remained until either being switched off, the battery dieing or the phone being distorted totally.
All phone information has been established and is factual (according to family and police statements). At the beginning of thread 7 (as well as many other threads) there are some diagramatic images for reference if this helps.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Maybe the family has to run their written statement past the police for sign off before publishing, in case something is inadvertently leaked that is supposed to be kept quiet?

Perhaps the police have not updated the family fully yet if some action is still ongoing?

 

[MidsummersDay]

One would hope they did that in the first week or two into the investigation.

If the cars "departed", then they must have arrived ?
Since the police (via the family) say they have seen cars, then one assumes this is from 0325 onwards.

Why not say if "he arrived and departed" ?

We can only deal in "known facts". And we don't know them all.

1. Corrie appears to be waiting.
2. The strongest suspicion is that he left in a car.
3. His phone transmitted from the Barton area.

Note... there is no "matching" confirmation as to "what time was it in the Barton area". The police said "upto 0800". The family say "it last transmitted at 0420". The calculation of the phone moving is approx 28 minutes. The bin lorry arrived around 0400 ish (give or take).

None of these times match (although "phone data" isn't accurate).
But there are "unclear" discrepancies here.

And "hi everyone".

...and he's back

Corrie's phone was confirmed as entering the BM mast area at 0458.

 

[calo44]

Absent vs. Missing in the UK

http://library.college.police.uk/docs/APPREF/Step-Guide-Missing-Absent.pdf

 

[MidsummersDay]

Hi all,
Another newbie here! I've been lurking for a while as I have links to the forces (ex-husband served 24 years in the Army) and have also family living in BSE for 40 years... and this has me stumped!
Just wanted to add my bit... drugs are a real 'thing' in the forces. My ex was completely anti-drugs and used to be in charge of the tests (usually done on Monday mornings or after long summer/Christmas leave periods) but when we split up I dated another soldier (different regiment, lower rank) who I caught taking coke, along with all his squadron, every weekend like it was going out of fashion! Call me a goody two shoes but I was AMAZED as I thought it was a dismissable offence, plus you're handling live ammo! Apparently if you were 'in the know' you'd get a tip off when a test was due so you'd know to have a drug free weekend.
Apologies for this not being particularly Corrie related, just wanted to mention it as I wouldn't rule drugs out after having seen it first hand.

Please bare in mind that you are referencing the Army. The RAF are a completely different animal and the mentality on drugs is far more respectful. The culture within is 'blacksheep and instant dismissal' in my experience. No 24hr postings just straight to jail and don't pass go.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Ehh?????? Sorry don't understand this.

You asked for a page number, but I'm just saying we don't all have the same number of posts on a page (it can be changed to suit preference). So for example this post #422 is on page 9 for me, it will be on page 42 or page 5 for others, depending how they have their settings, hope that makes sense!

 

[badgersmythe]

Please bare in mind that you are referencing the Army. The RAF are a completely different animal and the mentality on drugs is far more respectful. The culture within is 'blacksheep and instant dismissal' in my experience. No 24hr postings just straight to jail and don't pass go.

I have almost 15 years experience of socialising with RAF and US personnel. As I'm not a big drinker I've been designated driver on most of our nights out so have been aware of everything going on around me. I have never witnessed or even heard of anyone taking drugs.


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