GUILTY UK - Helen Bailey, 51, Royston, 11 April 2016 #6

[Joely 123]

Thanks to both of you providing that info, Squamous and Joely.

I can see how much fun he would have had, suggesting it and pressing that button. He may as well have said mind if I alienate a few of your friends?

That is BRILLIANT, Tortoise .. I hadn't thought of anything beyond him 'showing off' his prize lady - and telling other men ..'hands off' - and announcing 'we are a couple now'. Many swords for him to cut with, the hideous deceiver.

 

[Squamous]

Thanks to both of you providing that info, Squamous and Joely.

I can see how much fun he would have had, suggesting it and pressing that button. He may as well have said mind if I alienate a few of your friends?

Yeah, ole IS's fragile ego at work again. No supporting Helen to keep their relationship private until she was ready, no taking her lead, no understanding that if things didn't work out she would be in a lot of pain and making it public would make that worse. No.

The bit about how she found it so hard to get home and back to "widow life" and GGHW said he felt just the same... he would, wouldn't he. Ugh.

 

[Duchy]

I've just had a quick look at Helen's private Facebook page and a couple of things really stand out to me. On April 1 she asked if anyone local knew of a "really good and quick conveyancing solicitor". Her last post was on Sunday April 10, about Aston Martin vintage cars. The last thing she wrote was a comment on Monday April 11 at 10.09am. A friend wrote a comment at 11.41am which Helen neither replied to, nor "liked", which is most out of character for her. The chat was definitely Helen's style, I cannot see IS being able to impersonate her.

Thanks so much for sharing that Pips.

 

[Annad]

In a FB photo of HB and IS taken at her old house there's a comment by a friend that IS is spitting image of woody woodpecker. HB then comments with a link to woody woodpecker villain wiki. IS comments "do I have the same motivation". This is what the wiki page has on WW. Pretty good description I think.



.... supplied Woody with more clearly defined traits so that we could understand why he was going about causing trouble — specifically, by estasblishing that he is a selfish, ignorant being who only stands for himself and will not stop at nothing to achieve his goals, regardless of whoever gets in his way. He also helped firmly establish Woody's trait of being a Big Eater (which did pop up in early cartoons, but wasn't a central part of the character) which served as the basis for many of his cartoons. However, Culhane's direction, for all of his improvements, made Woody a bit too unlikable, taking him from being a screwy bird to sometimes being flat out malaciousin some episodes (i.e. The Barber of Seville).

If only HB had realised sooner.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is this the photo? The first time I saw this photo my impression was that IS was a lazy slob. The hair is obvious but notice how his shirt buttons are not all done up, the collar is not ironed. He looks like he just got out of bed and threw on clothes that had been lying on the floor. Some one mentioned that towards the end that Helen felt she was living through "Men Behaving Badly".

I have always thought of IS as a covert narcissist, but I may be convinced he is more a psychopath as mentioned by others. He does seem well aware that that he does not operate like a normal human with the full range of emotions and drives. A covert narcissist would not have that self awareness.

And now to try and attached this photo - first time trying this so apologies if I stuff it up!

 

[Duchy]

I think I've done this right. I thought you would like to see the pencil that John Bailey and Fraser Dyer left for everyone at Helen's Memorial service in November so that we could write individual thoughts for her parents as they are too frail to travel.

That reminds me of the John Lennon's quote:

 

[Tortoise]

I think he has revealed his motive -

[FONT=&amp]“Helen wanted the will, it was nice and flexible, but there were two things she didn’t like about it in hindsight.

[/FONT][FONT=&amp]“She knew that Tony Hurley (her financial advisor) could do what he likes. She couldn’t understand why she ended up with this sort of will.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]
“If Tony died, I still don’t know what would have happened [to her will].[/FONT]

This explains why it had to be disappearance, given his understanding of the power of attorney, rather than a discovered death.

 

[Duchy]

There was a comment on his testimony somewhere about buying an automatic to make it easier for H to drive, but in the end she only drove a BMW a couple of times or WTTE. I'll try to fish it out and edit it in here if no one has picked this up already.

ETA:

12:13 (8th Feb)
"She was quite scared of driving in Royston"

“Helen got a Fiat 500 car. She was quite scared of driving in Royston.

“She was scared stiff of coming to see me in Bassingbourn.

“We got an automatic car, but in the end Helen only drove the BMW twice.”

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...yston-11-April-2016-5&p=13127853#post13127853

No mention of who bought it but he makes it sound like it was a joint decision. I'm guessing a lease/hire purchase from the joint account but it is just a guess.

It's at the 12:13 update on that day's live feed: http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/helen-bailey-trial-partner-ian-12573132

Bit of a jump from Fiat 500 to BMW. He probably aimed to have it for himself. He wouldn't need to put so much effort into driving an automatic, lazy fat slob.

 

[flightpath]

It's struck me how polite Joe and Nick are throughout. Unusual for abductors who assault and murder people surely? Constantly apologising : as they kidnap HB and B and take them away, and also when they call IS in jail to apologise for what they did. And he had HB apologising to him when her abductors allow her to speak to IS by phone - she says sorry for all this fuss to IS and he graciously accepts her apology. ??!!! How likely is it that she's been abducted and the first chance she gets to talk to IS all she does is apologise for how inconvenient the fuss is for him!? Truly bizarre. Everyone is always saying sorry to IS. And then he uses the "all this fuss" line himself when the police are searching the house. So he's really very limited in his vocabulary. I notice Nick started off bald and is now sporting short black hair. Presumably IS will say it's grown between his two statements. And what I want to know is why they killed HB - surely that's unnecessary if she's the key to these important papers. Once she's dead they aren't getting them are they. And if IS was scared J and N would harm his sons why go on 2 week holiday leaving sons unprotected and unaware of danger they are in? While he saunters around in the sun, I hope the jury follow all the loose threads and hang on to them. When I was on a jury half of us were convinced of a defendants guilt but could not persuade the others and it was so frustrating that they couldn't see it the way we could. You'd be surprised how many jurors do not follow the case in enough detail and simply can't make up their minds. So err on side of caution by a not guilty just in case. I'm worried the complexity of IS story of intrigue will bamboozle some of them!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ColourPurple]

Indeed, it was a rare, if unwitting, moment of honesty. He doesn't have a heart, he has a swinging brick.

I'd be amazed if at least one major documentary wasn't being produced on the murder. I'm a journalist and former TV producer and from that perspective, I can see it has all the ingredients necessary for a gripping one hour documentary. I hope anything produced will be done with sensitivity and the full blessing of her family and that Helen the human being will be at the forefront of the telling. But sadly there are no such guarantees. Helen's brother John will already been bombarded with interview requests from broadcast and print media. At the conclusion of a high profile trial like this one, media intrusion can be a huge burden to a murder victim's loved ones.

I can imagine Olivia Colman playing Helen.The number of times I've gone to write Broadchurch instead of Broadstairs on here.

 

[Duchy]

He's mentioned cancer several times, I do hope Trimmer will call him on it.

Pips I think you've been very good here, it must be hard to hear all the drivel IS is coming out with. The only comfort anyone can give is that it is SO unbelievable he looks foolish in the extreme and he will be going to prison for a very long time.

Also I think it's fabulous that Helen's friends are not going to contribute to any ghoulish documentary about her murder. Helen was about so much more than the way she died. Her website is still a beacon and I will continue recommending it when I need to.

I can no longer read her book because it's so happy and so positive about her GGHW. It is heartbreaking to see Helen refer to him in those loving terms while he was plotting against her.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I bought the book about 3 weeks ago but put it down after the first couple of chapters because....I can't find the right words to describe this but it was the knowing that Helen was being overlooked by evil at the time of writing. To know how vulnerable she was......to know what evil existed......and to know how oblivious she was. The bond that existed between Helen and Boris is a bond that any of us here will have experience of. I feel I would have given my life to protect my little dog from such an end. Daft that - I know. I feel Helen would have felt the same way, and that she couldn't protect Boris is so heart wrenching. I hope IS didn't mistreat Boris when left in charge of him. IS is a psychopath after all. Rambling now so I'll put a sock in it.

 

[Duchy]

On Thursday there was a woman there who said she was a documentary maker.

Inevitable I suppose :facepalm:
I hope it is handled sensitively.
The Sadie Hartley one was very good.

 

[L2L]

I can imagine Olivia Colman playing Helen.The number of times I've gone to write Broadchurch instead of Broadstairs on here.

Yes! An excellent choice and even resembles Helen! I wonder if a documentary will be made?

 

[ZaZara]

http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/helen-bailey-murder-trial-ian-12578906


12.48
Trimmer: “Your conclusion is that they must have put her in there, the dog as well, and the dog’s toy, and the pillowcase, and a couple of bin bags.”

Stewart: “I never put anything in that pit.”

Trimmer: “The logical conclusion is it’s either them or you.”

Stewart: “That is my conclusion I guess.”

14.41
Trimmer: “Killing a woman like Helen Bailey and disposing of her body is a pretty evil thing”

Stewart: “Sick and disgusting.”

Trimmer: “Only a very limited class of people might be responsible for that in that case. It comes down to you, or Nick or Joe.”

Stewart: “Yes”



BBM


I've taken another look at the transcript of Thursday and I'd say that even without images or the voices of prosecutor Trimmer and IS, the cross-examination is a chilling read.

Trimmer states that it's either them or you and IS agrees. Agrees!
Trimmer repeats that 2 hours later, in a slightly different wording It comes down to you, or Nick or Joe and IS agrees again.

It beggars belief. But there he goes, stepping straight into the prosecutor's frame.
No doubt Trimmer will come back to this a few times, and rub it in that the prosecutor and the defendant agree that there was no involvement of a third party, that both IS and J & N can be considered as perpetrators, and the choice is between IS or J & N.

This is so odd. IS claims to be innocent and that J & N are the culprits, yet he agrees that it could have been him as well. :facepalm: hoh:

Not that I mind, far from that, but personally, I hope to remain the law abiding person that I pretend to be and never ever be cross-examined by Mr Trimmer.

 

[Cherwell]

It just shows how thick he is.

I nearly bust a gut laughing when he forgot the names of his invented gangsters.

I just can't understand what Helen saw in this stupid uncultured arsehole.

 

[L2L]

It just shows how thick he is.

I nearly bust a gut laughing when he forgot the names of his invented gangsters.

I just can't understand what Helen saw in this stupid uncultured arsehole.

Keep thinking the same thing, over & over; what could she have seen in this "stupid, uncultured arsehole"!

 

[Cherwell]

I'm sure Mr Trimmer will be making good use of the three days. Looking forward to the show on Monday.

 

[L2L]

Is this the photo? The first time I saw this photo my impression was that IS was a lazy slob. The hair is obvious but notice how his shirt buttons are not all done up, the collar is not ironed. He looks like he just got out of bed and threw on clothes that had been lying on the floor. Some one mentioned that towards the end that Helen felt she was living through "Men Behaving Badly".

I have always thought of IS as a covert narcissist, but I may be convinced he is more a psychopath as mentioned by others. He does seem well aware that that he does not operate like a normal human with the full range of emotions and drives. A covert narcissist would not have that self awareness.

And now to try and attached this photo - first time trying this so apologies if I stuff it up!

I can't look at this photo of IS! He looks dirty and smelly ... disgusting! You didn't stuff up, Annad!

 

[cottonweaver]

I was just reading about the Brighton time a couple of nights ago, Tortoise - hang on a moment and I shall find it. OK it is within the Chapter, titled 'Brighton Belle'. Page 252/253

Cutting to the moment where Helen writes about their time away.
.... Which is why having two nights and three days in Brighton with GGHW was so lovely. It was (in memory terms) neutral ground, the weather was great, the hotel lovely. We went wild, spending 50p each on the push 2p machines and won a pencil; we ate fresh doughnuts and drank champagne; we lay fully clothed on the nudist beach and felt the early spring sunshine warm our faces. But most of all we laughed and laughed.

At one point, sitting on Brighton Pier, GGHW announced that he was going to 'Check In' on Facebook on his phone. 'Shall I put who I am with?' he teased.

...... etc

Throwing caution to the wind and in holiday mood, i urged GGHW to go ahead and tag me on FB.

The button got pressed. We giggled like teenagers at our recklessness. I then posted a picture on my FB page.
And that is how the group of online friends reacted (as Helen explains in widowhood groups - it is upsetting when others 'move on' after such grief - and she had many angry messages - and her FB friend count dwindled).

Hi Joely,

Is the underlined part yours or part of a direct quote from her own book?

have you got a direct quote where she talks of angry messages.

HB: "Throwing caution to the wind and in holiday mood, i urged GGHW to go ahead and tag me on FB"
I'm not 100% that this was a pre-meditated manipulation by IS as such ( ie. to divide and rule/isolate) , there's a bit of fun, heady excitement and "to hell with it " on HB's part, let's shock them all etc.

ETA It's Ok , I have since found Squamous's reply which links to the blog page and part of the explanation etc. in HB's words .

A few hours after Facebooking, the first of a succession of disapproving (and angry) messages started coming through on my phone. My Facebook friend count also dwindled. It was the social media equivalent of my throwing those books down in disgust. Widows who had identified with me through this blog, who had charted their pain and grief alongside mine felt betrayed, that I was a fraud, that I had let them down. To be honest, the reaction of this small group didn’t surprise me, and not just because I had experienced similar feelings in the past, but because I had been on the receiving end of such behaviour before, at a time when only a few widows knew about GGHW. Most (all widowed around the same time) were fine, one even confessed that she had been seeing someone too, but from other quarters there were barbed comments about dishonour and disrespect, and one particularly vicious (and unfounded) side-swipe inferring that whether in a bar or online (both were mentioned), I have always been on the look-out for a man.

I’ve spoken to other widows (who have dated) about this reaction. Their feeling was that this behaviour is driven by jealousy.

Perhaps I need more time and experience to reflect on their diagnosis, but I’m not sure that I agree with them........

She proceeds to explain,I'm not pasting it all , as it would be too long .

http://planetgrief.com/2012/03/26/brighton-belle/ blog entry March 26, 2012

ETA 2:
this bit's interesting though
....."But coming home was unsettling.......the weight of widowhood quickly settled back on my bony shoulders."

as is this where she is musing on JS's life after his own bereavement : "Looking at these personal certificates and pieces of paper charting JS’s career.... it occurred to me that despite (or possibly because of) such a terrible early loss, my husband went on to carve out a full and rich life. He was a man who wasn’t afraid to take risks (and yes, I get the irony) or change direction if something wasn’t working for him .....JS could have given up on love and become bitter about loss, retreated to live a quiet life free of drama and angst, but he didn’t. He embraced life and seized opportunities"

thanks squamous for this link as I hadn't come across this page, it hasn't been linked here before and really helps me u'stand the context of all this.

 

[snoopydog]

That Guardian article makes it crashingly obvious that the police suspected IS from very early on, doesn't it? As did I (like many here)- I found it puzzling and strange that the Facebook group set up to find Helen seemed very reluctant to raise the obvious question, or at least press IS to do a public appeal and/or reconstruction. I realise now that it must have been purely caution to avoid prejudicing the possibility of a trial.

I thought the post he put on the FB widow page was dodgy from the start and I'm assuming the fact it didn't get hundreds of replies and likes that others thought the same. Considering the circumstances it should have but him complaining about media intrusion was just glaringly inappropriate. He also said he was on the page in case she posted there. Doesn't exactly fit in with the joe and nick story either.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[snoopydog]

Is this all true does anyone know?[/FONT][/COLOR]

I very much doubt this is true. She certainly wasn't kicked from the widow fb group. You do sometimes get a bit of 'oh that's quick I couldn't do it that quick' judging on the messages people post about dating but that's all. I doubt she ever got any messages she couldn't handle and I very much doubt anyone would have blocked or unfriended her for dating someone so soon.

I think it is unfortunate with such a horrible thing happening to Helen it shows that one can be too vulnerable to date so soon. Obviously only very few people are evil sick money grabbing bar stewards but I suppose it's definitely something widows need to be aware of, just because of what a fragile mental state you're in at that time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk