Well that covers quite a wide area. It's only 16 miles or so to the border after all
It's a possibility.
GUILTY UK - Joanna Yeates, 25, Clifton, Bristol, 17 Dec 2010 #14
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Well that covers quite a wide area. It's only 16 miles or so to the border after all
It's a possibility.
Trouble007
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the 1st picture i posted of the front door was from january right after the incident, when jo's brother made his emotional statement.
the recent pictures show the intercom panel removed..?
january
recent
also in this video there seems to be some sort of recording equipment wired up to the kitchen window? anyone know what it may be?
the recent pictures show the intercom panel removed..?
january
recent
also in this video there seems to be some sort of recording equipment wired up to the kitchen window? anyone know what it may be?
Robin Hood
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Taken by forensics ?
Trouble007
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no doubt, to find out whether VT had pressed the call button or, if he was already in the flat, hadnt needed to? as you have probably already guessed, its really bugging me to wether he was already in or not!
Robin Hood
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Just seen your question about the microphone in the kitchen window - maybe to play/record sounds - as in the screams heard over the road.
Trouble007
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yes sorry RH i edited the original post rather than clutter things up..
that would make sense if it outputted a scream noise so the jury could hear it, stood at the point where the screams were allegedly heard.
when I first saw it i thought it maybe a camera jo or gregg may have set it up if they had problems with a prowler? but i think that sounds a bit far fetched and my mind is working overtime!
FiestyFairy
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This was an interesting read. It seems the defense QC are to focus on what occurred through the window, mistaken identity?
Those suggesting this could be correct
FiestyFairy
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Microphones record sound while speakers output sound. That looks like a microphone but can anyone see what it's connected to?
Trouble007
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yes thats the thing, is it a mic or a speaker? or even a camera. the leads, which look to be Phono leads can be used for sound or video, the device on the worktop must be some sort of recorder or player?
Kristie
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I think he was already in her flat. She enters, takes off her boots and at some point realizes hes there (maybe hiding in the bathroom). She takes off for front door, opens it, she screams (which is why those at #53 and Percival Court heard) as hes approaching her, he grabs her and covers her mouth (thus, muffled scream as heard by witnesses), then pulls her back into the house. Evidence of struggle possibly on carpeting that was removed? JMO
For whatever reason the defence clearly don't want the time of death to be shortly after JY arrived home. The Asda cctv footage around 9:30 pm may show moshimoshi's post exertion mouth wiping "tic". Allowing his saliva DNA to be passed on to whatever he touched.
If VT was already in JY's flat he must have been well hidden because she was relaxed enough to open one of the ciders. If she had seen movement or suspicious lighting prior to entering and decided to confront the intruder anyway she wouldn't have had time to open the cider.
If VT was already in JY's flat he must have been well hidden because she was relaxed enough to open one of the ciders. If she had seen movement or suspicious lighting prior to entering and decided to confront the intruder anyway she wouldn't have had time to open the cider.
Totally agree, the only one confronted, attacked and strangled here was JY.
She is the victim, she is the one with the defensive wounds, the bruises ,the injuries on her wrists, broken blood vessels in her eyes, due to this big ********holding her throat until every last breath was squeezed out of her.
The man who was capable of this horrible attack, will try and sell this as manslaughter, maybe even try to imply poor Jo is partly to blame.
I am not buying any of it, not a chance!!!
Exactly, her father had said he had seen VT once since Jo moved in, so I'm sure Jo and GR had seen him in passing.
Trouble007
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not to mention the dull thud heard, which could have been the door slamming shut.
although why is the window being so highlighted? did she see him in the kitchen? in which case i would have thought she would have run the other way!
or did he spot her from the kitchen and panicked when she came in and hid before being discovered?
notsure
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It was a bitterly cold evening. VT got home before JY. The cat might be outside, wanting to go in. He's been into VT's flat before. Ok, he wasn't welcome then, but cats aren't easily discouraged. So Bernard miaows outside VT's door. VT is bored; maybe even a bit annoyed at his girlfriend for being at a party (his texts show him to be quite emotionally demanding), so he hatches a plan. Let the cat in, and when JY comes home, take him round, get chatting, maybe get invited in for a drink. It's Christmas; everyone's friendlier than usual; people are going around hugging strangers, going to parties. He's not happy to be there alone that evening. He feels he deserves some fun too.
notsure
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I've been puzzling over the window thing as well, but of course it's VT who says this is where they first saw each other that evening. It's part of his story, and not necessarily true.
It's bugging me too, I expect it's bugging most of us. If the prosecution are correct about VT and Jo seeing each other through the window, it's possible that Jo saw him in her house.
But I can't see Jo going in. The "normal" reaction to this would be to run and call someone for help. Someone said earlier on that perhaps Jo saw signs of life in her flat and thought that Greg had returned home unexpectedly.
Every suggestion seems bizarre in this case.
edgedweller
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It's the defence who are claiming that they saw each other through the window. I am really looking forward to hearing what they say.
"Someone said earlier on that perhaps Jo saw signs of life in her flat and thought that Greg had returned home unexpectedly."
Yes, perhaps she burst in hoping to surprise and greet Greg, and startled VT and he flipped.
"Someone said earlier on that perhaps Jo saw signs of life in her flat and thought that Greg had returned home unexpectedly."
Yes, perhaps she burst in hoping to surprise and greet Greg, and startled VT and he flipped.
Hello...like many people, I have been thinking a lot about Joanna and what happened to her and why.
I gained the impression that Joanna was in the flat and had been disturbed there. Not sure where that came from, though. Perhaps from something that the prosecutor conveyed. Also although she had only been home for a very short time, is there not a suggestion that she had had a drink of the cider she bought in the off licence? That wouldn't have happened had he already been in her flat and she surprised him there and an attack ensued in which he killed her.
It's been mentioned that Joanna and Greg had not lived there long and that Tabak had been away for much of even that short amount of time. Yet there is some evidence of mutual awareness of the respective flats' occupants: an occasion when the cat caused some contact between them. Also, in regard to awareness, I noticed in the Daily Mail photographs posted above, that the Mail caption describes the window next to Joanna's bedroom as being the window of Tabak's bedroom. If this is correct and not just a reporter being inaccurate, his bedroom wasn't the flat's master bedroom which was far away from Joanna's but was his flat's second bedroom which adjoined Joanna and Greg's bedroom. That would mean that there was more potential for awareness of the presence of neighbours, and possibly of noise or everyday comings and goings, on the other side of the wall. The photograph shows that the windows of those two bedrooms are very close together. I wonder also if anyone knows who had lived in the flat before Joanna and Greg and whether there had been any contact or even tension between those neighbours and Tabak.
I lay awake last night thinking about the horror and sadness of this killing in the midst of ordinary life, with a young woman going about her everyday life, meeting friends after work, doing a bit of shopping on the way home, arriving home to the familiar comfort and security of home, kicking off her shoes and enjoying a drink at the end of the working week, with no reason at all to expect anything bad to happen to her, let alone have her life taken from her.
We can only speculate on the senselessness of this until we hear more of the prosecution case but I would hazard a guess that Tabak had more awareness of Joanna and Greg than they had of him, being absorbed in their own life together and their full and busy working, social and family lives. If something was bugging him, is it possible that he was mooching around the building that night because some tension and resentment had been brewing, maybe about cat nuisance, which led to some kind of confrontation? Or was he mooching around because he was some sort of voyeuristic personality, the kind who is psychologically something of an outsider, an observer, nose pressed to windows, looking in on others' lives but who crossed beyond that barrier and actually stepped into someone's life, driven by some demons that we do not know? Whatever it was that led to this violent attack and brutal killing, he was definitely not a normal person going about a normal happy and fulfilling life, as Joanna and Greg were. Something dark was there, which for whatever reason, was unleashed in a bout of extreme rage, fury or cold determined ruthless purpose on that night. And it is a tragedy beyond words for Joanna, her fiance, her parents, brother, wider family and friends, whose nightmare we cannot even imagine. He has no doubt added to their suffering by his lies, covering of his tracks and whatever concoction he has put together for this trial.
I gained the impression that Joanna was in the flat and had been disturbed there. Not sure where that came from, though. Perhaps from something that the prosecutor conveyed. Also although she had only been home for a very short time, is there not a suggestion that she had had a drink of the cider she bought in the off licence? That wouldn't have happened had he already been in her flat and she surprised him there and an attack ensued in which he killed her.
It's been mentioned that Joanna and Greg had not lived there long and that Tabak had been away for much of even that short amount of time. Yet there is some evidence of mutual awareness of the respective flats' occupants: an occasion when the cat caused some contact between them. Also, in regard to awareness, I noticed in the Daily Mail photographs posted above, that the Mail caption describes the window next to Joanna's bedroom as being the window of Tabak's bedroom. If this is correct and not just a reporter being inaccurate, his bedroom wasn't the flat's master bedroom which was far away from Joanna's but was his flat's second bedroom which adjoined Joanna and Greg's bedroom. That would mean that there was more potential for awareness of the presence of neighbours, and possibly of noise or everyday comings and goings, on the other side of the wall. The photograph shows that the windows of those two bedrooms are very close together. I wonder also if anyone knows who had lived in the flat before Joanna and Greg and whether there had been any contact or even tension between those neighbours and Tabak.
I lay awake last night thinking about the horror and sadness of this killing in the midst of ordinary life, with a young woman going about her everyday life, meeting friends after work, doing a bit of shopping on the way home, arriving home to the familiar comfort and security of home, kicking off her shoes and enjoying a drink at the end of the working week, with no reason at all to expect anything bad to happen to her, let alone have her life taken from her.
We can only speculate on the senselessness of this until we hear more of the prosecution case but I would hazard a guess that Tabak had more awareness of Joanna and Greg than they had of him, being absorbed in their own life together and their full and busy working, social and family lives. If something was bugging him, is it possible that he was mooching around the building that night because some tension and resentment had been brewing, maybe about cat nuisance, which led to some kind of confrontation? Or was he mooching around because he was some sort of voyeuristic personality, the kind who is psychologically something of an outsider, an observer, nose pressed to windows, looking in on others' lives but who crossed beyond that barrier and actually stepped into someone's life, driven by some demons that we do not know? Whatever it was that led to this violent attack and brutal killing, he was definitely not a normal person going about a normal happy and fulfilling life, as Joanna and Greg were. Something dark was there, which for whatever reason, was unleashed in a bout of extreme rage, fury or cold determined ruthless purpose on that night. And it is a tragedy beyond words for Joanna, her fiance, her parents, brother, wider family and friends, whose nightmare we cannot even imagine. He has no doubt added to their suffering by his lies, covering of his tracks and whatever concoction he has put together for this trial.
Redgoblin
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I could see that happening, the problem would be to get a jury to believe that and then believe the manslaughter plea. I think if VT and his defence team was honest and lets say that was how it happened I as a juror would be more inclined to believe the defence with a story like that because it goes some way of saying look this is what happened, what the hell was I thinking coming on to her, sort of thing.
If the defence concoct a different story to try and make them seem like it was a mistaken identity situation, or even try and blame JY I wouldn't believe that for a second. IMO.
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