GUILTY UK - Joanna Yeates, 25, Clifton, Bristol, 17 Dec 2010 #4

[Nausicaa]

This may have more relevance now ...

I'm reporting from thread # 1 about the deposition of Joanne's body by a detective pointing out that placement of the body noted panic and being unplanned:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-st...icked-after-unplanned-murder-115875-22818569/

THE country lane where Jo Yeates was found is without doubt one of the most unusual body deposition sites I’ve ever visited. It will have given police several clues about the circumstances of her death.

It strongly suggests her murder was not planned and the killer panicked afterwards because virtually no thought has gone into concealing the body.

Jo was left on the verge of Longwood Lane – one of the first roads without houses a driver leaving Bristol in this direction will reach. It is 50 yards south of an entrance to a quarry, which would have been a more sensible and less noticeable place to pull over.

This suggests Jo was dumped in the middle of the night when the road was deserted, but the darkness meant the killer missed several better spots nearby to conceal her body properly.
Barely 50 yards from where dog walkers found her there is a gap in the wall leading into woods.

Opposite the floral tributes there is a gap between a wall and a fence at the quarry face. If you are strong enough to get a body into a car it will not take much more effort to get it in the gap. If Jo had been left there it is quite possible she would not have been found for years.

The retired DCI was taking it for granted that the body was dumped where the flowers are. Philb has convincingly demonstrated that it wasn't - it was dumped right at the entrance.

As far as I can see those who are trying to convince us that the body was the other side of the fence are forcing the evidence to fit their theories. The body was dropped on the road side of the fence. This fits much better with all the early statements about the location before the police created the fictitious memorial site.

Let's not forget that the killer could not have known in advance how much it would snow. His priority was putting a few miles pronto between himself and the body and not being seen doing so - not achieving long term concealment.

In my mind's eye I see a killer who on 17th December carried the body to a place of intermediate storage in a place too close for comfort to his home. He may have hoped initially that Jo would remain just another "missing person", that she would not be the subject of a thorough police investigation.

When he saw the police investigation circling around him and the danger that the body might be found in a compromising place, he chose the best moment to get rid of it without being noticed - the early hours of 25th December. Very prudent too. Much more important than long term concealment of the body (once the police had launched a probable murder investigation) was the long term concealment of any connection with himself. He would also realise that carrying bodies over fences or through forests would risk DNA contamination. Much better to keep it wrapped in a pvc tarp in his boot, pour it out by the side of the road and be back home in time to do some innocent web-surfing before church on Christmas morning in order to establish an alibi...

 

[Destroyer]

Phillb - can you emphasise about your own theory whether you think Jo's body was on the roadside of the wire fence or behind the wire fence ?? Because i was going by the idea she was behind the fencing, yet the pics show the Forensics tent well in the road making me think the body must of been on street view ??

 

[Robin Hood]

The retired DCI was taking it for granted that the body was dumped where the flowers are. Philb has convincingly demonstrated that it wasn't - it was dumped right at the entrance.

As far as I can see those who are trying to convince us that the body was the other side of the fence are forcing the evidence to fit their theories. The body was dropped on the road side of the fence. This fits much better with all the early statements about the location before the police created the fictitious memorial site.

Let's not forget that the killer could not have known in advance how much it would snow. His priority was putting a few miles pronto between himself and the body and not being seen doing so - not achieving long term concealment.

In my mind's eye I see a killer who on 17th December carried the body to a place of intermediate storage in a place too close for comfort to his home. He may have hoped initially that Jo would remain just another "missing person", that she would not be the subject of a thorough police investigation.

When he saw the police investigation circling around him and the danger that the body might be found in a compromising place, he chose the best moment to get rid of it without being noticed - the early hours of 25th December. Very prudent too. Much more important than long term concealment of the body (once the police had launched a probable murder investigation) was the long term concealment of any connection with himself. He would also realise that carrying bodies over fences or through forests would risk DNA contamination. Much better to keep it wrapped in a pvc tarp in his boot, pour it out by the side of the road and be back home in time to do some innocent web-surfing before church on Christmas morning in order to establish an alibi...

Agreed. Now if Jo was reported missing by BF on the 19th, early hours 20th what was the police activity from the 20th up to the evening of the 24th ?
Some of us are guessing removal to Longwood lane was the evening/early morn of the 25th, at this point was it just the forensics at the flat being done or had we got ground searches ? I'm trying to build a picture of the activity going on and the possible movements of the tennants IYSWIM.

 

[Destroyer]

I am starting to think the reports of Jo's 'Snow Covered' body may not be totally accurate, maybe she was frozen - but any snow may of been placed over her ?? This of course going with the theory the body was found in less than 24hrs of being dumped there, maybe as little as 6 hrs ??

 

[Phillb]

Phillb - can you emphasise about your own theory whether you think Jo's body was on the roadside of the wire fence or behind the wire fence ?? Because i was going by the idea she was behind the fencing, yet the pics show the Forensics tent well in the road making me think the body must of been on street view ??

Well i'm only going on what I can see/work out. I can't claim to have it 100% accurate as none of us can.
What I think shouldn't be taken for granted, everyone is entitled to their opinion.

But from every photo I see it shows the forensic tent, and the white suit activity at the quarry entrance. The tent is clearly on the road side of the fence, not in the undergrowth behind the mesh fence. I also can't see forensic straddling over the fence every time to get to the body. I do think they would have snipped it to create a walk in, and took the fence away for testing, but it's still in situ.

The Police on their first statement say the body was left on the roadside verge at the entrance to the quarry. And the reports, photos and map (I linked to earlier) were compiled by a reporter who was at the scene when they lifted up the body. All photos and his map back up what I think too. I can find the link if you like.

I can only say that I personally am 100% confident that's where the poor girl was left. I've taken a great interest in this case with the maps and aerial images, really because I do a similar thing for my hobby. Finding and researching old war bunkers, mines and tunnels to photograph e.t.c. So i'm well used to scouring aerial images for clues to things. I love the research aspect of it. A good challenge.

This is a really good set of pics and maps to clarify things.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...assume-shes-dead--lives-gone-say-parents.html

 

[Nausicaa]

I am starting to think the reports of Jo's 'Snow Covered' body may not be totally accurate, maybe she was frozen - but any snow may of been placed over her ?? This of course going with the theory the body was found in less than 24hrs of being dumped there, maybe as little as 6 hrs ??

I thought it was established that there was snowfall in Bristol during the night of 24-25 December ? Which being the case, she would be covered in snow even if she was found very shortly after dumping.

Extraordinary, fiction-like quality about this case, how it snows heavily shortly after the disappearance and then again shortly before discovery of remains - in a place where snow is quite rare.

 

[Destroyer]

I've taken a great interest in this case with the maps and aerial images, really because i do a similar thing for my hobby. Finding and researching old war bunkers, mines and tunnels to photograph e.t.c. So i'm well used to scouring aerial images for clues to things. I love the research aspect of it. A good challenge.

Yes i can see that & impressed by some of the work & efforts you are putting in here :clap:

Then basically we have come to the conclusion - Jo's body was left in street view outside the entrance to the quarry, there is no-way at possible she had been there for more than 24hrs & is unlikely to of been covered in snow as reported.

I think her body probably was frozen, it had more than likely been stored in a freezer somewhere near the perps where it would of been snow covered & frozen.

 

[Destroyer]

This is a really good set of pics and maps to clarify things.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...assume-shes-dead--lives-gone-say-parents.html

Excellent article , & some great pics too -

An overview to where Jo's body was dumped -

& a pic of the crane used to lift the body -

 

[SheDevil]

Just come across this in the comments section of the Daily Mail, purporting to be from MW's stepsister:

To all the people who think the comments made by Matthew's step-mother are insensitive, she was misquoted. She is just as upset about what has happened as everyone is. Matthew is my step-brother and he is being hounded by the press over this text message. He told the Police about it as soon as he heard she had gone missing and was interviewed before Christmas. His phone was charging at his desk and that's why he didn't see her text until an hour later and he was at his Christmas party. He has also been heavily misquoted by the press. The media are just trying to make a big story out of it and Matthew wants to be left alone.

Hang on a minute...charging at his desk? Where? Office parties don't tend to be held in offices any more thanks to good old 'elf and safety', and it has been reported the 'office party' was taking place in pubs/clubs in the Triangle, anyway? If MW was in a pub or a club, why would he leave his phone behind in the office and go back for it at gone 9pm?

So far we have had 3 reports as to why MW did not answer this text:

- asleep
- at office party so didn't notice it
- phone charging 'at his desk'

I wonder if the LE are aware MW's relatives are giving a different story?:waitasec:

Something is not right here.

 

[Destroyer]

Just an interesting pic from outside Lorp's house -

plus a pic from the site where Jo's body was found, note the Policeman circled 'Traffic Cop' what business is this of his ??

 

[slug]

Just looked at the google street view and there are lots of places along longwood lane
where she may not have been discovered. Does this mean someone was in a panic and so just dumped her in a rush at the first place they saw?
Or is it that the person was not familiar with the area?

Thanks to Phillb for the pics i think your right about the location of the body.

 

[Phillb]

Good point to note is the locals of Canynge Road will probably lobby Google Street View to take that part of the street of their mapping service. Most house of past noteriety can't be accessed. They get fed up of the ghouls wanting to look. Not sure if we can be classed the same way perhaps?

 

[Nausicaa]

The following from FB seems extremely important and answers a question that has been tantalising a few of us :

Lawrence
There are no internal doors between the basement flats of number 44. Acess to the second basement flat is at the rear of the building. There is no access to either of the basement flats from inside the main entrance to 44.
... I have intimate knowlage of number 44 after working as a window cleaner there for a number of yrs. I have worked inside and out of all of the flats there.

I think that makes it clear that for all practical purposes, No 42 has better proximity to J + G's flat than the other parts of No 44.

 

[teabreid]

Just looked at the google street view and there are lots of places along longwood lane
where she may not have been discovered. Does this mean someone was in a panic and so just dumped her in a rush at the first place they saw?
Or is it that the person was not familiar with the area?

Thanks to Phillb for the pics i think your right about the location of the body.

The quarry entrance is the only place along that stretch of narrow lane where you could park without blocking the lane, so it's the obvious place to stop and dump a body, especially if you don't have much local knowledge, and you are in a hurry.

 

[Malaconotus]

plus a pic from the site where Jo's body was found, note the Policeman circled 'Traffic Cop' what business is this of his ??

Police closed off the road, traffic would be involved in that. Then he nosed up to find out what was going on.

 

[Malaconotus]

Some of us are guessing removal to Longwood lane was the evening/early morn of the 25th,

I'm confident that can be discounted. Police said that they believed it had been there for several days. Exact words "As a result of the findings of the post mortem we believe that Joanna's body has been in the roadside verge at Longwood Lane, Failand, for several days before being discovered on Christmas morning" They go on to ask for information regarding the period 17th to 19th, which implies they are confident the body was dumped then. You can watch the statement again here... http://www.channel4.com/news/murder-investigation-joanna-yeates-was-strangled

I see no reason for the police to mislead anyone on this, and they must have had good reason to say it. I think we have to conclude that it was 'hiding in plain view' under the snow from the weekend of 17th-19th onwards.

 

[Malaconotus]

The following from FB seems extremely important and answers a question that has been tantalising a few of us.

Can you link or direct us to that Facebook source claiming to be the window cleaner, please?

Thanks.

 

[whitedove]

I'm confident that can be discounted. Police said that they believed it had been there for several days. Exact words "As a result of the findings of the post mortem we believe that Joanna's body has been in the roadside verge at Longwood Lane, Failand, for several days before being discovered on Christmas morning" They go on to ask for information regarding the period 17th to 19th, which implies they are confident the body was dumped then. You can watch the statement again here... http://www.channel4.com/news/murder-investigation-joanna-yeates-was-strangled

I see no reason for the police to mislead anyone on this, and they must have had good reason to say it. I think we have to conclude that it was 'hiding in plain view' under the snow from the weekend of 17th-19th onwards.

Yes, I think the body has been there all the time, with the weather conditions the snow on top would have frozen solid just like it was in my garden, the whole mound would be like rock.

 

[Destroyer]

Police closed off the road, traffic would be involved in that. Then he nosed up to find out what was going on.

I guess that , i just dont like Traffic Cops !!! LoL

 

[mikeymot]

Just an interesting pic from outside Lorp's house -

plus a pic from the site where Jo's body was found, note the Policeman circled 'Traffic Cop' what business is this of his ??

Good pic of lorps house.....notice the wheelie bins?????? mmmm.

Traffic cop probably there because both ends of street were closed off?