Found Deceased UK - Nicola Bulley Last Seen Walking Dog Near River - St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire) #11

[markoid]

@kittythehare -- I'm confident the police are very aware of the ratty, grubby van, after not less than half a dozen named individuals previously contacted police-- including the tree surgeon that rents the barn where the van was parked. IMO, seems to me somebody's been fueling up on SM Kool-Aid.

I saw red van hunted by Nicola cops, there's no reason for it to be there

A TREE surgeon who uses a ramshackle barn where a “suspicious” red van was spotted near where Nicola Bulley vanished, told The Sun: “There’s no reason to be there, unless you’re up to no good.” Den…

www.thesun.co.uk

The Sun are worse than PF when it comes to speculation and feeding the trolls...

 

[todders]

(in my own words)
Yes, under what must be immense stress, he had described at the start a little of why that morning had been somehow different from usual, under the circumstances it's possible he wasn't able, or did not, relate every single reason. He did describe a typical morning as opposed to that morning, and who normally did what, and he did not say whether he or NB loaded the car that morning, but he had already said it was different and seemed more organised (all under immense stress IMO and in front of the cameras for broadcast).

He might have loaded the car himself and NB opened the boot at some stage? I don't think he was attempting to match his words with the doorbell photos. Also, perhaps one of that mornings 'differences' was that he didn't need to load the car because NB did that herself ?

I don't think him changing into gym clothes is odd (and also he has a way of repeating some statements), he expresses being concerned, and, getting no answers to 3 attempts to phone her, he was about to go and find NB before going to the gym, he was in a state of mind that she was somehow held up (only by about half an hour note) but he was going to go and find her, he expected he would meet her along the way, and possibly, in his wildest dreams had no concept of her as a missing person at that point. Then at that point, having already changed into his gym gear and just leaving, he was phoned by the school and told the dog and phone had been found but not NB, he left and phoned the police on his way to the river.
He did not seem to me to be a well-rehearsed performer with a practiced script, but someone recalling what he could and finding the words to express it as best he could and trying to get it right.

I think the changing into the gym clothing was an attempt to normalise the situation.By stating i was even in my gym clothes that is how relaxed i was about finding NB and it was just a normal day i was going to go the gym.IMO

 

[kittythehare]

@kittythehare -- I'm confident the police are very aware of the ratty, grubby van, after not less than half a dozen named individuals previously contacted police-- including the tree surgeon that rents the barn where the van was parked. IMO, seems to me somebody's been fueling up on SM Kool-Aid.

I saw red van hunted by Nicola cops, there's no reason for it to be there

A TREE surgeon who uses a ramshackle barn where a “suspicious” red van was spotted near where Nicola Bulley vanished, told The Sun: “There’s no reason to be there, unless you’re up to no good.” Den…

www.thesun.co.uk

Outside of the place where pF did his interview for Channel5 was parked a bright red van.
Also interviewed was dude that paid 56k for side scanner and tried using it on river.. his company vans are all bright red.
Internet chose not to add 2 and 2 and arrived at number banana..

Imagine being the family of a missing person when this monster of malice comes after one? There is zero accountability and a thinly veiled anti police theme running through all of it...

For example.
Dr Graham Hill.
Criminologist & Former Senior Detective (SIO). Research Fellow says this and a whole lot more besides. He is watching it

https://twitter.com/x/status/1624081419852042243

 

[Eaglette]

Can I fold ? I'm feeling like a useless sleuth...
I have no idea how this woman has disappeared!
The red van is surely a red-herring !

Have they even taken Willow back to the exact location (to then view the dogs reaction at the site again ?)

Brought in other dog trackers ?

 

[todders]

I see it as perfectly possible that up in the top field, where she was last sighted, NB could have been accosted by someone who had been watching from behind the fence of the Rowanwater site. Bundled her into a vehicle or detained her in that site temporarily and then who knows…

Phone could have been returned to the bench as a decoy.

I don’t know what the CCTV situation is around the back of the Rowanwater site but I haven’t heard it mentioned as being covered. I know LE have said they have searched Rowanwater properties but NB could have easily been whisked away before they got there.

The cttv at the rowanwater site has already been covered by the police in their press conference on the 7th february as quoted below and as per the link. IMO

'She had taken her spaniel Willow out for a walk and CCTV that we've looked at, shows that Nicola did not leave either the allotment lane exit of that riverside area, nor the Rowanwater Caravan Park, which has been discounted, nor any of the other locked or areas covered by CCTV.'

UK - Nicola Bulley, St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire), Jan 27, 2023 *MEDIA, MAPS, & TIMELINES - NO DISCUSSION*

 

[AnalyticalMind]

A fellow WS asked me about motives in an earlier post so I started a list of all those that I've seen be put forward. One that wasn't on the list was an altercation about the dog being off the lead with someone so obsessed and angry about the issue that they could become enraged. Could NB have been involved in an argument, a tussle, with someone local who is obsessed with the issue of people letting their dogs off the lead, and been accidentally fatally struck or pushed over? Discounting the dog being tied up with string at precisely 9.33am (which has always seemed oddly precise to me), there's then a large wedge of time before the abandoned dog and phone are raised with the school. That would be ample time to find help to remove a body, get some string to tie the dog up, and pose the scene. Perhaps even be there in the early stages to point the Police at the river. Plausible IMO.

A close friend of mines aunt was murdered a few years ago over a dog, here in Scotland. Obviously different circumstances, but it has happened in the past.

Cops vow to nail Jean Campbell's killer as former suspect released from hospital

Jean was killed when she was out walking her dog in Glasgow and the only man charged in connection with the crime later left Carstairs having been cleared in 2015.

www.dailyrecord.co.uk

 

[kittythehare]

A close friend of mines aunt was murdered a few years ago over a dog, here in Scotland. Obviously different circumstances, but it has happened in the past.

Cops vow to nail Jean Campbell's killer as former suspect released from hospital

Jean was killed when she was out walking her dog in Glasgow and the only man charged in connection with the crime later left Carstairs having been cleared in 2015.

www.dailyrecord.co.uk

I'm including Willow in the victim friendly ethos.
She gets blamed for a lot and she looks like the sweetest baby ever.

You are correct, it happens but would more likely be local and only if Willow had been interfering with livestock and I imagine there would have been prior complaints..

 

[AnalyticalMind]

iMO "The old house" is a manor house. It comes up in old records online.

"Hornby's big house" is the name given by the anglers club for that fishing spot on their map.

It's on many maps, over a period of 50+ years as "The Vicarage". It changes to "Old house around WW1 time (can't recall exactly and don't have time to go through the all the maps to find when). I studied these maps for quite a while in the hope of finding old mines, tunnels, any anomaly on the landscape.
Link to one map showing "Vicarage"...
St Michaels is centre bottom.

View map: Ordnance Survey, Lancashire XLIV (includes: Kirkland; Nateby; Pilling; Upper Rawcliffe with Tarnacre.) - Ordnance Survey Six-inch England and Wales, 1842-1952

 

[Seattle1]

Can I fold ? I'm feeling like a useless sleuth...
I have no idea how this woman has disappeared!
The red van is surely a red-herring !

Have they even taken Willow back to the exact location (to then view the dogs reaction at the site again ?)

Brought in other dog trackers ?

I don't know about other dog trackers but PA confirmed Willow was taken back to the exact location where NB and Willow have been hundreds of times before w/o reaction.

Nicola Bulley search - all the key evidence and day-by-day timeline

It is nearly two weeks since missing mum Nicola Bulley was last seen - here's what's happened over the last 13 days

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk

 

[AnalyticalMind]

I'm including Willow in the victim friendly ethos.
She gets blamed for a lot and she looks like the sweetest baby ever.

You are correct, it happens but would more likely be local and only if Willow had been interfering with livestock and I imagine there would have been prior complaints..

Oh no, I absolutely don't for one second blame willow. There's no way I'd excuse that, I was merely sharing with the poster that it has happened, and in my friends case the dog hadn't done anything wrong, and I fully believe W hadn't either.

 

[kittythehare]

It's on many maps, over a period of 50+ years as "The Vicarage". It changes to "Old house around WW1 time (can't recall exactly and don't have time to go through the all the maps to find when). I studied these maps for quite a while in the hope of finding old mines, tunnels, any anomaly on the landscape.
Link to one map showing "Vicarage"...
St Michaels is centre bottom.

View map: Ordnance Survey, Lancashire XLIV (includes: Kirkland; Nateby; Pilling; Upper Rawcliffe with Tarnacre.) - Ordnance Survey Six-inch England and Wales, 1842-1952

That's what I was most interested in too.. some old tunnel on the site that only a few people would know about but which still has access..
She entered, she didn't leave.. she is there, somewhere..I think there simply must be a place within that park area..

 

[bringmeacupoft]

Can I fold ? I'm feeling like a useless sleuth...
I have no idea how this woman has disappeared!
The red van is surely a red-herring !

Have they even taken Willow back to the exact location (to then view the dogs reaction at the site again ?)

Brought in other dog trackers ?

Same I’m just watching at this stage really.

PA channel 5 interview he said he took willow the next day and she treated it like a normal walk. I’ve said it before though I don’t think we can pin anything on Willows reactions or lack of reactions.

 

[Seattle1]

Bringin over prior thread- Dog could be vital in helping trace..

Found Deceased - UK - Nicola Bulley Last Seen Walking Dog Near River - St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire) #9

I think it's implied that Willow was wearing the dog collar when only the dog lead was found on the bench. Where it's typical to unhook the lead from the collar on a walk, it doesn't follow to remove both the collar and the lead. Personally, looking around, I can count 4-5 leads around the...

www.websleuths.com

 

[kittythehare]

Bringin over prior thread- Dog could be vital in helping trace..

Found Deceased - UK - Nicola Bulley Last Seen Walking Dog Near River - St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire) #9

I think it's implied that Willow was wearing the dog collar when only the dog lead was found on the bench. Where it's typical to unhook the lead from the collar on a walk, it doesn't follow to remove both the collar and the lead. Personally, looking around, I can count 4-5 leads around the...

www.websleuths.com

No, sadly.
He brought Willow to the park the Saturday morning after N disappeared and she did absolutely nothing out of the ordinary, she didn't react, respond, show fear... he even talked about N to Willow and no reaction at all.. He said she is a very sensitive little dog..
I was surprised because I had a springer and he too was very sensitive but if any bad stuff happened in an area he would react.. subtle but noticeable..

 

[Mr X]

St Michaels is centre bottom.

View map: Ordnance Survey, Lancashire XLIV (includes: Kirkland; Nateby; Pilling; Upper Rawcliffe with Tarnacre.) - Ordnance Survey Six-inch England and Wales, 1842-1952

Yes. A gentleman named Hornby was the vicar. I still think IMO it is a landed gentry house not a church property.

Mods delete if this is off topic or moving towards sleuthing non POI.

Sorry if it looks like that.

The reason I think it could be relevant is that wealthy land owners are known to have added constructions to waterways, some of which may be derelict.

Where my boat is moored at the moment there was a stately home and there are remains of jetties. All that is there is the hand forged iron tie bars. Above and below the water.

 

[Interested_But_Confused]

No, sadly.
He brought Willow to the park the Saturday morning after N disappeared and she did absolutely nothing out of the ordinary, she didn't react, respond, show fear... he even talked about N to Willow and no reaction at all.. He said she is a very sensitive little dog..
I was surprised because I had a springer and he too was very sensitive but if any bad stuff happened in an area he would react.. subtle but noticeable..

My guess based on Nicola's previous Strava data is that she often sat or stood around near the bench at the end of walks. Possibly she let Willow continue to run around the field for a few minutes, and IMO Willow probably didn't even see whatever is was that happened. One minute "mum" was there and the next she had gone. Of course it is only a guess.

 

[LuluR38]

My first assumption if I'd seen a dog and knew the owner was a mother would be that maybe she'd had to rush to the school so it makes sense to me that someone would call the school.

I’m curious as to why did no one think to call the number on the dogs tag, if indeed there was one … particularly given the daughter of the lady who owned this farm / park was very familiar with NB … something doesn’t sit right here either …

Same. Which is why I assumed abduction. But if someone knew she was leaving they could make sure the dog was OK? Hr leaving it off the lead would suggest not going of her own volition.

*modsnip*

 

[Miss_French]

A fellow WS asked me about motives in an earlier post so I started a list of all those that I've seen be put forward. One that wasn't on the list was an altercation about the dog being off the lead with someone so obsessed and angry about the issue that they could become enraged. Could NB have been involved in an argument, a tussle, with someone local who is obsessed with the issue of people letting their dogs off the lead, and been accidentally fatally struck or pushed over? Discounting the dog being tied up with string at precisely 9.33am (which has always seemed oddly precise to me), there's then a large wedge of time before the abandoned dog and phone are raised with the school. That would be ample time to find help to remove a body, get some string to tie the dog up, and pose the scene. Perhaps even be there in the early stages to point the Police at the river. Plausible IMO.

So you go from someone quick-tempered to coldly calculating and knowing where you could hide a body and how to stage a crime scene? I would have thought the former would panic, not think things through. And to make phone calls and involve someone else takes up callable time.

 

[LuluR38]

Welcome.
It's mentioned in here Lancashire Constabulary - Missing Nicola Bulley - latest update

What do you think of the church sighting? Church isn't far and the grounds also overlook the river. It's just past this road sign.

Mentioned in the Sun's latest link:
'A witness came forward after spotting the pair outside the local church.' Two 'suspicious' men spotted by witness near Nicola Bulley's dog-walking route

Is that another path at the Inskip sign too? Google Maps




signView attachment 402264

There’s actually a gate if you look down where the sign is, wide enough for a car but very overgrown on the last street view images …

 

[Mollie123]

With all the speculation re was it a gillet was it a coat, Dan walker describes in the ch5 program it as 'clearly see she is dressed in a heavy outdoor clothing including the knee length quilted coat with the hood'. I would have expected this description to be more accurate considering all the hoo har surrounding it.
Also noted Willow was wearing a collar with an id tag attached.
IMO the program did not show the police in a positive light, much thanks with this is down to MWT comments.
The majority of the time was taken up with PA being interviewed. I would have liked to have seen a more in depth look into the tiny snips of facts we have re the sightings of NB that morning.
I don't know about anyone else, the whole thing left me as confused and baffled as ever.