GUILTY UK - Rebecca Watts, 16, Bristol, 19 Feb 2015 #15

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YidArmyRach said:
If he got murder, and SH got manslaughter, I'm wondering if (like so many of us wondered) SH did the smothering to keep Becky quiet, whilst NM was strangling her?

I can't work out any other reason why he got murder but she got manslaughter, especially when both were found guilty of the conspiring to kidnap charge. Anyone?
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Bit late with reply. I was very glad when we heard SH's charges included manslaughter, since I'd thought the only option was murder if found guilty on the kidnapping and I doubted she'd be found guilty on murder.

I don't think we were clear on the charges until the judge's very helpful list (well I wasn't).

Quite knocked back by the speed of the verdicts. I think they have to deliberate for 2 hours minimum, and it took 4 days on Tabak, but "obviously" there was no doubt in the jury's mind.

From my sofa in front of the fire the verdicts given are spot on, absolutely correct.

As SH pleaded not guilty to all charges I expect the judge to come down hard on her with sentencing.

Don't know about all of you here, but my stomach turned when I saw the jury was back so fast and I'm still a bit in shock (and rambling now :blushing:).
 
I still wonder why the jury went for manslaughter for SH. Still, it was unanimous.

As long as she gets life I won't be overly bothered.
 
I was looking at pictures of the family outside the courthouse. I could cry seeing AG in her wheelchair. You can just see how this is slowly killing her. What do you do? He is still her son no matter what he did, do you stop loving him? I'm trying to figure this out, and what would I do if this was one of my children?
 
leah said:
I agree with that. I have been wondering if there were signs for years that NM was evil, and capable of such crimes? I'm sure people saw things, but like most of us, probably just that, he is strange, but didn't think he would be capable of doing such horrible things? There had to be things that bothered people. I feel like I'm a forgiving person, and no matter how logical I would try to put things in perspective, how hard it must be for Becky's father to be married to NM mother. She helped raise Becky, and she certainly appears to be a nice woman, and the two of them have been married for awhile. But, human nature, somewhere in the back of dad's mind there must be anger or some feelings about the situation. I mean no harm by this statement, and I feel horrible for AG. She is a sickly woman, and this must be so unbearable, to think your child could do this to another human being.
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I know exactly what you're saying. Even in couples who are very together, when their child is murdered more often than not the resulting fallout ('you should've been there to protect them!' type thing) can lead to their break up. It would take a bigger person than me to not feel some resentment towards the mother of the man who murdered my child - even if she was my wife. I imagine AG must have to keep a lot of her innermost thoughts - like her maternal feelings towards her son - to herself. It's so sad, the inner turmoil must be tearing her apart.
 
jessie said:
Bit late with reply. I was very glad when we heard SH's charges included manslaughter, since I'd thought the only option was murder if found guilty on the kidnapping and I doubted she'd be found guilty on murder.

I don't think we were clear on the charges until the judge's very helpful list (well I wasn't).

Quite knocked back by the speed of the verdicts. I think they have to deliberate for 2 hours minimum, and it took 4 days on Tabak, but "obviously" there was no doubt in the jury's mind.

From my sofa in front of the fire the verdicts given are spot on, absolutely correct.

As SH pleaded not guilty to all charges I expect the judge to come down hard on her with sentencing.

Don't know about all of you here, but my stomach turned when I saw the jury was back so fast and I'm still a bit in shock (and rambling now :blushing:).
Click to expand...

I was so shocked, I had to read Clio's post twice ...

I thought she had posted a comment, saying I wonder when the verdicts will be in, and then I realised it was a tweet saying they were in !
 
Tortoise said:
I remember that being reported in the trial, but I didn't know before the bit about SH sharing content with him.
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We were told about 236 images and 21 videos relating to teens? Gosh, I don't remember that. I thought they mentioned only the one video about kidnapping and raping a teen. I guess I missed that. If I'd been aware of this info, it would have been even more clear in my mind what they were up to.
 
Callista said:
I know exactly what you're saying. Even in couples who are very together, when their child is murdered more often than not the resulting fallout ('you should've been there to protect them!' type thing) can lead to their break up. It would take a bigger person than me to not feel some resentment towards the mother of the man who murdered my child - even if she was my wife. I imagine AG must have to keep a lot of her innermost thoughts - like her maternal feelings towards her son - to herself. It's so sad, the inner turmoil must be tearing her apart.
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You can see on her face how it is killing her. And then as a mother you would keep wondering over and over, what did I do wrong? I would drive myself insane wondering if I could have done something different. The guilt would eat me alive, and it must be doing the same to her.
 
pappa rob said:
No clue, and I really don't want to know.
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Apparently it was taken by some friends during his army days - laddy stuff. The way the DM have put it into the article though, they're trying to imply it is 'proof' of his sexual deviance :shame:
 
leah said:
I was looking at pictures of the family outside the courthouse. I could cry seeing AG in her wheelchair. You can just see how this is slowly killing her. What do you do? He is still her son no matter what he did, do you stop loving him? I'm trying to figure this out, and what would I do if this was one of my children?
Click to expand...

Love is a warm feeling, it is all embracing. Yes it is unconditional, but I think in a situation where the person you love commits such a heinous calculated act of pure evil, then I don't think love can embrace or overcome that. I think there will be grieving for losing him as a son, for surely she will have to disconnect in some way. Not from the little boy she knew and loved, but from the monster and stranger he became.

Maybe, she will find it possible to accept if he is given a psychiatric diagnosis, but if he isn't, I think if it were my son, I would have to end up treating it as a loss, and a tragedy that no-one, myself included, had spotted his deterioration earlier.
 
pappa rob said:
No clue, and I really don't want to know.
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In any event, no matter what he has done, NM should remain safe in prison & free from inmate abuse...I have no tolerance for that no matter how vile the inmate/prisoner may be
 
epiphany said:
In any event, no matter what he has done, NM should remain safe in prison & free from inmate abuse...I have no tolerance for that no matter how vile the inmate/prisoner may be
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I agree.
 
leah said:
You can see on her face how it is killing her. And then as a mother you would keep wondering over and over, what did I do wrong? I would drive myself insane wondering if I could have done something different. The guilt would eat me alive, and it must be doing the same to her.
Click to expand...

Now that the verdicts are in and there is some form of justice for Becky, I am beginning to feel sorry for the children than MN and SH were. I'm not excusing them for what they did, or saying I feel sorry for them now, because I don't. There is no excuse and nobody else to blame. I mean, if we had heard about them when they were little children and knew the situation they were in, I think we would all be very sad for them.

What 7 year old boy being given to his grandmother to look after, then seeing his own mother take on someone else's children (who call her 'mum') isn't going to have some kind of issues.

And what young girl, shifted from foster home to foster home, isn't going to be affected by her mother having more children who stay with her? What 14 girl isn't going to have some issues when her own mother, rather than guide and protects her, encourages a sexual relationship with a full grown man. Encourages an illegal sexual relationship?

I think there will be - and should be - a lot of soul searching.
 
YidArmyRach said:
Now that the verdicts are in and there is some form of justice for Becky, I am beginning to feel sorry for the children than MN and SH were. I'm not excusing them for what they did, or saying I feel sorry for them now, because I don't. There is no excuse and nobody else to blame. I mean, if we had heard about them when they were little children and knew the situation they were in, I think we would all be very sad for them.

What 7 year old boy being given to his grandmother to look after, then seeing his own mother take on someone else's children (who call her 'mum') isn't going to have some kind of issues.

And what young girl, shifted from foster home to foster home, isn't going to be affected by her mother having more children who stay with her? What 14 girl isn't going to have some issues when her own mother, rather than guide and protects her, encourages a sexual relationship with a full grown man. Encourages an illegal sexual relationship?

I think there will be - and should be - a lot of soul searching.
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I feel the exact same way. Hope the little girl finds a good home, with people who love her the way she should be loved.
 
YidArmyRach said:
Perhaps this explains the comment about listening to children if they are scared:



http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...auna-hoare-becky-watts-dark-fantasies-reality
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I wonder who she reported him touching her leg to?
Found this aprt interesting:

David Wilson, professor of criminology at Birmingham City University, who has followed the case, suggested the couple were gripped by a mental condition known as “folie à deux” – a madness shared by two people. A fantasy that developed from suggestive texts to an actual threesome – and ended with a sexually motivated attack.
 
YidArmyRach said:
Now that the verdicts are in and there is some form of justice for Becky, I am beginning to feel sorry for the children than MN and SH were. I'm not excusing them for what they did, or saying I feel sorry for them now, because I don't. There is no excuse and nobody else to blame. I mean, if we had heard about them when they were little children and knew the situation they were in, I think we would all be very sad for them.

What 7 year old boy being given to his grandmother to look after, then seeing his own mother take on someone else's children (who call her 'mum') isn't going to have some kind of issues.

And what young girl, shifted from foster home to foster home, isn't going to be affected by her mother having more children who stay with her? What 14 girl isn't going to have some issues when her own mother, rather than guide and protects her, encourages a sexual relationship with a full grown man. Encourages an illegal sexual relationship?

I think there will be - and should be - a lot of soul searching.
Click to expand...

We never did hear any more about SH ringing the children in care team did we. I wonder was she going to repeat the cycle and put the little girl into care?
 
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