UK UK - Ruth Wilson, 16, Dorking, 27 Nov 1995

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jonmarbles said:
id like to where this man was at the time. Gravedigger William Lambert 'raped schoolgirls in Surrey church yard' | Daily Mail Online
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I have considerable doubts that Lambert had anything to do with this case. He operated around Cheam, which is some way from Dorking (by British standards, although I am sure it seems next door by US standards). His modus operandi also seems more within a known environment rather than straying from home. And. of course, Ruth seems to have planned her moves, unlike Lambert's known victims. It also seems likely he may have been part of a wider group within the Sutton and Cheam area as he was linked to the Lee Boxall disappearance in that area (which happened in 1988). In 2012 (after Lambert was convicted in the case quoted) the police arrested 3 men on suspicion of responsibility for killing Boxall. The age and other facts suggest the oldest man arrested was Lambert (he would have been arrested for this offence in the jail where he was serving his sentence). However, it seems the police did not make further progress in 2012.
 
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I just have this strong feeling she has been taken in by a cult of some kind. That to me, could explain why she had been waiting to be picked up in that bridleway, the lack of winter coat because she knew she wouldnt be long. The flowers as a goodbye, maybe a suggestion by a cult member.

Plus the non useage of bank cards, no ID, not sure how they work, but they may have even given her a new identity.
 
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I haven't watched the documentary yet, will do later. Does anyone know how she found out about her mother's suicide? It was mentioned she went to London to get it. How did she begin to realise all was not as it seemed?

IMO l don't find it odd that dad didn't tell the children. They were too young. I wonder if they were planning to reveal the truth at some point but didn't find the right time. They may have been cagey because they didn't want the other daughter to find out. Also as dad was a church goer it might have been a source of shame.

I don't know Betchworth, only driven through it a couple of times. I wonder if it was common knowledge around the village though, if it happened there. Her friends mums would have almost certainly known the truth.

The flowers to her mother only suggest it was dad she had beef with. Go back to his last words to her. He doesn't sound like a particularly pleasant man.

No birth cert for Nesta. Maybe it wasn't an official adoption. Probably happened a lot back then.

Nesta had given birth in the months before her death, she could have had post natal depression. Not as well understood as it is now.

I know Box Hill. Lovely, during the day. Not so much in a dark rainy night though... it would feel pretty unsafe imho.
 
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alb1on said:
I seem to have sparked a bit of debate on one or two issues so thought it may help to clarify my comments.

I know Box Hill very well. I live in Guildford, which is 10 miles from Box Hill and still visit that area (the NT property and Dorking) several times a year. In the past when I had retrievers and a springer we would walk them on Box Hill as a change from time to time. So my comments about the numbers of people in the area are based on my observations from walking there (you can hardly move some weekends for cyclists). The whole area is also riddled with public rights of way (footpaths, bridleways) used by walkers and dog walkers. I know from my dogs that they would head into the undergrowth and trees and would alert (or more likely be stubborn and refuse to move) if they found something of interest. With hundreds of dogs each day (and more at weekends) doing that I cannot believe a body would remain unfound unless in a wholly inaccessible place. And the only such place I can think of would be the slopes of the unused quarry - which I assume were checked. The area where Ruth was dropped is at the back of Box Hill, so is one of the less frequented areas and would be used more by locals than visitors - but there are still plenty of those.

Over the several decades I have lived in Surrey I have seen enough reports of the failings of Surrey Police to be wary of assuming that they will have done a good job. There have been multiple scandals about the personal behaviour of their senior command, but these have rarely been in connection with police business (they have a nasty habit of selecting senior officers who behave oddly). But whatever the personal failings of their senior officers, Surrey Police is a large, well resourced organisation with 2000 officers and specialists in most areas of policing. They also have very close working relationships with the Met Police (due to proximity) enabling them better access to other specialists and facilities than many forces. For all these reasons I find it hard to think they would fail to conduct basic policing not only in the initial enquiry but also in subsequent reviews. I do find their behaviour when interviewing Ruth's friend in Sheffield interesting. That definitely seems to suggest they believed she was still alive. Whether that was a default assumption or had some basis I do not know.

One of the primary sources of assuming failures on the part of Surrey Police is Mark Williams-Thomas. He is a former Surrey police officer and now a journalist, who acted as police liaison officer with the Wilsons. I would be careful in placing reliance on him as a source. He left Surrey Police in unclear circumstances and was charged (and cleared) of blackmail 2 years after leaving the police. I also note that he has commented on the possibility of Ruth still being on Box Hill. He must know the area and its heavy usage and, for me, this statement damages his credibility. He may be quite accurate in his view of the initial investigation, but he may also have an agenda.

In regards to the conditions when the taxi driver dropped Ruth. In November at 4.30 it would have been dark but not yet pitch black. I would have assumed the taxi driver was expecting Ruth to either be going to the pub or to one of the nearby houses. I have driven that road a few times over the years and there are quite a number of houses nearby. So the comment about thinking it was strange is most likely a retrospective view based on what subsequently emerged and his view in the mirror as he drove off. The area is rural (by Surrey standards), but I could take people to 100 more remote spots in Surrey (and there is nowhere which would classify as remote compared with US definitions of remote).

Finally, coming back to the taxi driver. It is because it is such basic policing that I make the default assumption that his story is to be believed. I would also expect that their would be CCTV to confirm his pick up of Ruth (since it was at Dorking station, which would have had coverage even at that time - always assuming it was the main station). If she ordered the taxi by phone there may also be a despatcher record). In all probability the taxi driver would also have gone onto another recorded job, providing a limit to his time window with Ruth. I am not saying it is impossible that he is involved; just that it seems highly improbable given what we know, and that we should be careful about thinking otherwise in these circumstances.

So, in conclusion, I do not know what has happened. I favour the planned disappearance as I see no convincing evidence of suicide, and the coincidence of personal circumstances intersecting with a predator seems unlikely. But all are possible and it is just a matter of opinion which seems most probable.
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Excellent post and very well written. Thankyou for giving such a great description of the layout of the land.

Interestingly, the former officer you mentioned, has been on television quite a bit recently commenting on a myriad of other cases which I’ve always found strange to say the least as that is usually a role that is undertaken by a retired Senior Detective of a rank of DCI or above and not generally by a Detective Constable.
 
I lived in Dorking/Westhumble from 87 to 95 and my brother lived in Box Hill village during the 80s, so I know the area very, very well. In fact the King's Arms was one of my haunts and the Burford Bridge and the garden centre at the foot of Box Hill were where I worked when I was at school. I used the music shop she worked in as I was in a local band at the time. Furthermore, Mark Davison, in the programme, is a personal friend. I say all this as I disagree with the notion that a body would be found. There are a number of hills and valleys running from Box Hill on the A24/5 all the way to Headley Heath. I've camped there, walked there and spent many hours there contemplating life surrounded by nature. The woods are extremely dense, the bracken is thick and it is very easy to hide. I feel it would make a 'suitable' spot to harm one's self as a ten minute walk from the Hand in Hand, as it was called, takes you into the quiet hills and valleys. During the summer it is beautiful there but in the dark on a rainy November late afternoon, it would be lonely and foreboding. Additionally, it would make complete sense in those largely pre-mobile days to walk from the library to the train station to get a taxi. It's where the hackney carriage 'pick-up' types would wait. Also it's a shorter walk than to the town centre. In my opinion, Occam's Razor would suggest a suicide in familiar surroundings after discovering the family secret.
 
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Does anyone know if Box Hill had some sort of meaning to Ruth? Did her and her mother used to go walking there?

I'm stunned at the lack of information out there, about Ruth about the case.
 
These days there are bus stops on Box Hill Road near what is now The Tree pub. The stop on the opposite side of the road to the pub currently heads to Dorking and then to Crawley.

The stop heading in the other direction is a little further up the road, not far from the bridleway entrance. On the modern timetable the buses there head towards Epsom and Leatherhead.

I don't know whether these bus stops were there in 1995, but the taxi driver's account of his last sighting of Ruth suggests she was standing still as if waiting, rather than setting off with purpose. So could it be possible she was waiting for a bus?

On the other hand, if today's timetables were active in 1995, Ruth could have caught the same buses from central Dorking if her intent was to run away in either direction. If she was attempting to cover her tracks, however, changing travel methods from taxi to bus mid-journey would be a method of diversion.
 
I never heard about this case until I saw the programme made in the last few years.

My gut feeling is she totally arranged her disappearance. I wouldn’t be surprised if there was some underlying reason for it - her relationship with her father? And the impact of discovery the her mother’s death. The prearranged flowers for her step mother - sympathy for her, or some other significant message.

Her dad is a local councillor - may be he had contacts at Surrey police who assisted in covering up what was said in those notes. She certainly couldn’t have killed herself with those pills and alcohol - that would be a slow death over a number of says, and she’d have been found.

Maybe she started out going to her friend in Sheffield and who knows where she is not w. She could be resting this thread and even commenting.

I would not be surprised if she got in contact with her sister after her father’s death.

Box Hill is a National Trust area - did they have a tea room there in 1995 and would it have been open at 430pm on a weekday I’m Novrmber? Could she have met someone there? A friend who gave her a lift and was sworn to secrecy, which he has kept all these years?maybe he knew the true story behind her disappearance.
 
I certainly like to think it's a rare example of someone choosing and succeeding in starting a new life elsewhere.
 
In the WS thread about missing teen Andrew Gosden, someone shared this fascinating article about an American runaway named Crystal Haag.

Basically at age 14, Crystal made a split-second decision to board a bus from Baltimore to New York City and never come back. Enduring five years of sexual abuse, which her mother claims not to have been aware of, Crystal took nothing with her, and yet she created a new identity, got a job, new support system, even a family. Just like that. And she has lived here for more than 21 years at this point.

If Crystal could do all that without any planning ahead, then surely Ruth could've too, since Ruth did plan some things ahead, like skipping school, hailing cabs, and sending flowers.

Crystal got a fake ID in New York, but getting pregnant made it easier for her to obtain official government documentation under her assumed new identity. Is it similar in the UK? I know someone mentioned that at 16, UK citizens receive their National Insurance Number, and that you could simply say you never received it and have it mailed elsewhere. But could you change the name on it? Can the government track usage of a NINO?

I just feel that if Crystal could do it with less, then Ruth was definitely in a better position to do it as well. Learning about her mother's suicide could've made her feel like her whole life was a lie, betrayed by the remaining parent she had trusted. In her mind, what did she have left? Why should she stay?

And just like Crystal's mom says she wasn't aware of her daughter's sexual abuse, maybe Ruth's father simply didn't perceive his daughter's change in mood.
 
JSolt1210 said:
In the WS thread about missing teen Andrew Gosden, someone shared this fascinating article about an American runaway named Crystal Haag.

Basically at age 14, Crystal made a split-second decision to board a bus from Baltimore to New York City and never come back. Enduring five years of sexual abuse, which her mother claims not to have been aware of, Crystal took nothing with her, and yet she created a new identity, got a job, new support system, even a family. Just like that. And she has lived here for more than 21 years at this point.

If Crystal could do all that without any planning ahead, then surely Ruth could've too, since Ruth did plan some things ahead, like skipping school, hailing cabs, and sending flowers.

Crystal got a fake ID in New York, but getting pregnant made it easier for her to obtain official government documentation under her assumed new identity. Is it similar in the UK? I know someone mentioned that at 16, UK citizens receive their National Insurance Number, and that you could simply say you never received it and have it mailed elsewhere. But could you change the name on it? Can the government track usage of a NINO?

I just feel that if Crystal could do it with less, then Ruth was definitely in a better position to do it as well. Learning about her mother's suicide could've made her feel like her whole life was a lie, betrayed by the remaining parent she had trusted. In her mind, what did she have left? Why should she stay?

And just like Crystal's mom says she wasn't aware of her daughter's sexual abuse, maybe Ruth's father simply didn't perceive his daughter's change in mood.
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I do believe whatever caused her mum’s suicide also impacted on Ruth. I believe she wanted to escape to a new life. I’m not sure how the system works in uk with a new identity, but someone did say she may have moved on to Canada. And I bet she sends messages to friends who helped her, even once a year.
 
Plod said:
I do believe whatever caused her mum’s suicide also impacted on Ruth. I believe she wanted to escape to a new life. I’m not sure how the system works in uk with a new identity, but someone did say she may have moved on to Canada. And I bet she sends messages to friends who helped her, even once a year.
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BBM.

Totally possible. I saw the new documentary on her case, and I agreed with others who said it looked like the friends were holding something back. Maybe it's because they are in touch with her, albeit barely.

Actually, that may even explain her father's refusal to participate in the documentary. I know people grieve in their own way, but I can't imagine not jumping at any chance to raise awareness for my missing child. Maybe he's ashamed that his lie was the catalyst for her departure. Maybe the letters allegedly found at Box Hill said exactly that. Maybe he knows she's made a new life for herself elsewhere and doesn't want any contact with him.
 
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