GUILTY UK - Tia Sharp, 12, New Addington, London, 3 Aug 2012 #1

[wfgodot]

Hi everyone. I have been lurking for ages and feel compelled to post as this hits close to home - literally.
I read the whole thread and you guys have me some great insight into what might have happened to poor Tia.
I do believe the police could have handled things much better. They halted garbage collection at the beginning of the week but only searched through the bins on Thursday if I remember correctly - even if evidence was discarded in bins it could have easily been retrieved once SH found out the police would search the bins.
Also - why not search the house on day 1? Just from watching crime shows you would know to start in a small circle (family, family home) then extend it as people/places are cleared.
One last thing I found dodgy were the step father's statements - ‘His father… has it wrong. Stuart wasn’t walking with her. That girl left this house alone.’ . How can you be so sure when you were not there? Also, why the distancing language 'that girl'.

RIP Tia.

Excellent first post, Fishzilla. I join soozieqtips and the rest in saying Welcome to WS.

 

[Yellow Rose]

In addition, most sentences are an insult to the victim and victims' families, imo. Sentencing of say 14 years, released after 8 or even fewer years? Yet the victims and their families are condemned by killers to literally, life-sentences

Tia, for example: a young girl of 12. She doubtless had hopes, dreams and who knows what opportunities and happiness may have come her way had she been permitted to live a full life. Gone now. All murdered victims are gone and along with them goes the life-force of those who loved them, in most instances. All so the killer can spend a few years in jail, ministered to by rafts of psychologists, psychiatrists and conveniently anonymous members of parole boards who have NOT suffered, who do NOT relive the loss and pain of a murdered loved-one on daily, hourly basis

Then, having served what passes for a 'sentence', the killers are released from prison. Their teeth have been repaired. Many have learned marketable skills, degrees, etc. Their health has been attended to, along with free board and keep. They've formed friendships in many instances. Well-meaning individuals often find work for them or provide them with new identities. And off they go to enjoy another 30, 40, 50 years of life -- life in the sun, in the fresh air, watching tv, playing sport, forming new relationships, all of which they denied on permanent basis to their victims who are beneath the ground, decomposing, turning to a pile of bones as the public moves on, the world moves on and grass grows over victims' graves and their loved ones finally die too

If SH killed Tia, I would choose for him to lose his life in the same way he denied Tia her life. In fact, I'd choose for him to be thrashed within an inch of his life before he exits this planet, in order he might understand as he takes his last breath what fear and pain feel like just before death. Then God can have him and 'rehabilitate' him, whatever. Imo, it is a gross injustice and insult to the victim for killers to enjoy what they stole from someone else. For killers to be released and for it to be proclaimed they've 'paid for their crime' is, to my mind, and insult to the victim. But of course, the victims get no say, do they. Victims don't get 'a second chance' in the way their killers do

By all means, if science finds a way to bring victims back to life and give them a 'second chance', then I might be a bit more open to the idea of killers being granted a second chance too, with conditions

I feel exactly the same way and I could never have phrased it quite as well so the thanks button was definitely not enough. I just hope they find this suspect and find him quickly!

 

[Clio]

Hi and welcome Fishzilla.
I'm also surprised they didn't search the house earlier. For all they knew, Tia could have been hiding in it somewhere as a joke. I figured they'd at least rule that out as a possibility first before starting on the bins and nearby woodland.

Lead police officer just been on BBC News stating that there had been several searches of the house.

Tia's bedroom was searched when she was first reported missing.
The whole house was searched in the early hours of Sunday morning
Specialist dogs searched the whole house on Wednesday lunchtime

He said they need to concentrate on identifying the body and establishing how long it has been where it was found

 

[KR1]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/aug/10/tia-sharp-body-stuart-hazell?newsfeed=true

The week-long hunt for missing 12-year-old schoolgirl Tia Sharp has become a murder investigation after police discovered a body during a search of her grandmother's house.
Less than four hours after a Metropolitan police forensic team went into the property on the New Addington estate in south-east London, Scotland Yard revealed they had found a body. It is understood that it was discovered inside the house, not in the garden or an outbuilding.
The body has yet to be formally identified, but there is little doubt that it is that of the schoolgirl, a pupil at Raynes Park high school in the nearby borough of Merton. A postmortem is due to be carried out.
Tia's mother Natalie has been informed of the discovery.
A manhunt is now under way for Stuart Hazell, 37, who lived at the property with Tia's grandmother, Christine Sharp, 46. The public were warned not to approach Hazell, who has several convictions, including drugs offences and possession of an offensive weapon, but to phone 999 if he was seen.

Hope I posted this link correctly.....

 

[Madelaine]

Sky News just reporting police suggesting that they searched the house 4 times before finding Tia and we should not jump to conclusions that the body was there all this time.

Are they expecting us to believe that someone in the family went out and collected a dead 12 year old from somewhere else and carried her into the house and hid her while the house is surrounded by Press, FLOs and the rest of the family are all sitting there? Presumably someone who had previously been involved in her death- why would they bring her back?

That house is very small- no cellars, the only hiding place will be the loft. I grew up in a house very like it. I would be surprised if it even has floorboards, more likely chipboard floors.

 

[Crazy Mama]

So, here we are. A body is found, we assume it is Tia's. The police are saying that they don't know how long the body has been there, they could mean that they don't know how long a 'dead' body has been there. She could have been there and tied up and gagged for a few days. This would have put the dogs off.

As for SH, well we all know in our hearts that he is not the kind of person we would leave a dependent with. He is shady, no doubt and I said it before.

<modsnip>

 

[laserdisc10]

Sky News just reporting police suggesting that they searched the house 4 times before finding Tia and we should not jump to conclusions that the body was there all this time.

Are they expecting us to believe that someone in the family went out and collected a dead 12 year old from somewhere else and carried into the house and hid her while the house is surrounded by Press, FLOs and the rest of the family are all sitting there? Presumably someone who had previously been involved in her death- why would they bring her back?

That house is very small- no cellars, the only hiding place will be the loft. I grew up in a house very like it. I would be surprised if it even has floorboards, more likely chipboard floors.

In an ideal world, you would be a Sky News journalist, making precisely the comment you've posted here

 

[Louvie]

From my view the thing that infuriates me most is when a convicted criminal is released from prison and granted a new identity, financial assistance and relocation on the government tuppence due to fear of vigilantism or social reprisal.

Agreed. I'm completely against the death penalty, but if you take a life, you should spend the entirety of the rest of yours locked up. There are of course very rare exceptions but this probably isn't the place to get into those. Incidentally probably the most famous of British killers given new identities was until relatively recently living and working quite close to me (I didn't know this until after his re-arrest) which kinda made me realise how frightening it is if you subscribe to the mentality that certain types of criminals can't be rehabilitated.

I also think the prison system itself needs some re-thinking. An 18 year old from a troubled background with no former, commits a relatively minor non-violent crime but something which requires him to spend say one or two years in prison. Yes it's a punishment and no it shouldn't be fun, but I am okay with my tax money being used to rehabilitate that kid. Educate him, give him skills to improve his life so that when he comes out, he gets a fresh start and is given support to make sure he turns it around and NEVER re-offends. If post-prison support is given, this can be successful. Murderers and sex-offenders, especially those with a history of other serious offences... Whilst I don't support the death penalty, I would like the rest of their lives to be lonely and miserable with NO books, computers, job-training, entertainment of any kind. That's what I hope for Hazell if he is indeed apprehended and found guilty. Don't waste my hard-earned tax money attempting to rehabilitate murderers and sex-offenders so that you can release them a couple of decades later please.

 

[soozieqtips]

My own mother was murdered when I was 19 and the murderer got the minimum sentence of 15 months for manslaughter because of 'who' he was. I can't say more than that without going into detail. The fact that the murder was 100% premeditated didn't count for anything because of his position and the people who protected him and his ilk.

At the time I wished he would die by exactly the same method that he killed my mum, but no - he was out by the following summer and even wrote to me to 'apologise' for his crime and his light sentence.

Today, I still feel nothing but hatred for him and for the way his actions have impacted so profoundly on the rest of my life. Time doesn't heal in all situations. Sometimes it just reminds you of what/who was taken from you and the fact you'll never again be able to share anything with them.

In an ideal world (my ideal world) I wish he could suffer the same death he inflicted on my mum. So while prison sentences aren't always the best places for scum like him, killing himself wouldn't have made me feel any better either. The only real punishment, vindictive though it sounds - is for the perpetrator to suffer in the same way.

As for Hazell, unless he goes to a hard prison with no privileges and treated like the animal he is - then he'll never suffer for what he did. And even then, I doubt he'll suffer. I don't know what the answer is.

 

[ScotsPaddy]

I doubt if SH would even be able to go to his dealers now,in saying that theres usually always somene who will help,r doesnt know whats going on,i wonder if the ext few days will be like when police were after Raoul Moat?

 

[Crazy Mama]

<modsnip>
Just because a man is<modsnip>a woman in the family does not mean that he considers and treats everyone else in the family as his family.

Don't forget that SH is supposed to be a builder/decorator and would possibly know how to build up a wall cavity etc, although based on his tv interview I cannot imagine him being capable of handling a hoover.

 

[brit1981]

Poor little girl, her last momets must have been horrendous.

Obviously we all know who it looks like is responsible, but we should be careful posting speculation etc. If he gets a good defence lawyer then they could argue the trial is prejudiced. Might not make it possible to deny he killed her, but could get the verdict bumped down from murder to manslaughter. Its not worth the risk.
, why give the creature any help

 

[laserdisc10]

My own mother was murdered when I was 19 and the murderer got the minimum sentence of 15 months for manslaughter because of 'who' he was. I can't say more than that without going into detail. The fact that the murder was 100% premeditated didn't count for anything because of his position and the people who protected him and his ilk.

At the time I wished he would die by exactly the same method that he killed my mum, but no - he was out by the following summer and even wrote to me to 'apologise' for his crime and his light sentence.

Today, I still feel nothing but hatred for him and for the way his actions have impacted so profoundly on the rest of my life. Time doesn't heal in all situations. Sometimes it just reminds you of what/who was taken from you and the fact you'll never again be able to share anything with them.

In an ideal world (my ideal world) I wish he could suffer the same death he inflicted on my mum. So while prison sentences aren't always the best places for scum like him, killing himself wouldn't have made me feel any better either. The only real punishment, vindictive though it sounds - is for the perpetrator to suffer in the same way.

As for Hazell, unless he goes to a hard prison with no privileges and treated like the animal he is - then he'll never suffer for what he did. And even then, I doubt he'll suffer. I don't know what the answer is.

I'm very sorry, Suzie. Please accept my sympathies

 

[Yellow Rose]

So I guess after reading the above articles I will need one of our dog people. Because of those were cadaver dogs that went in earlier and they didn't hit on anything, either she was not dead at the time or her body was not there earlier. The problem with that is that I cannot believe for the life of me why anyone would move a dead body into a house that people were subsiding in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Destroyer]

I think its quite possible TS's body may of been moved around as the week went on, because i find it hard to believe after several police searches of the house it wasnt found earlier ?? SH's disappearance during the night proves they wasnt being watched that closely, he could easily of took off with the body & no-one would of seen him.

 

[Lottie]

I'd like to echo what Clio has said as SKY has confirmed the same regarding the searches of the house.

The police are also hinting that the body might not have been there since last Thursday. So if this is the case, this might be why she wasn't found.
If it has been there, then yes the specialist search team were not looking hard enough if they didn't check the loft - but the police are saying full and thorough searches were done.

More questions....

**Why on earth has Hazell not been put under surveillance and followed. I cannot believe he's been allowed to get away.

**If Tia wasn't there all the time how on earth did they either move the body, or if she wasnt' dead, move her - because the press have been camped out 24/7.

And now....it could get more horrible...I'm trying to think of why the family might want Tia dead and the only thing I can come up with is if Tia was found to be pregnant/abused by SH then it would bring into question Tia's mother's ability to be a mum and so her children would be taken into care and it's unlikely they would be returned - especially if there are more dark things to be revealed about this family.

Is this why there's been a cover up by the Uncle/Grandmother/Mother?
Is there also a drugs/pimping out/satanistic link.

I dread to think to be honest, anything's possible now.

 

[Destroyer]

I think its quite possible TS's body may of been moved around as the week went on, because i find it hard to believe after several police searches of the house it wasnt found earlier ?? SH's disappearance during the night proves they wasnt being watched that closely, he could easily of took off with the body & no-one would of seen him.

You would of thought in most common cases CID would of kept a closer eye on things & the families movements.

 

[wfgodot]

This Is Croydon Today, update: Police had searched grandmother's house three times before today

---
Commander Neil Basu said this evening that Tia's grandmother's home, in The Lindens, New Addington, was searched by officers on Sunday and again on Wednesday lunchtime, on the latter occasion with the help of sniffer dogs.

Police also searched Tia's bedroom last weekend when she was first reported missing, said Commander Basu.
---

 

[laserdisc10]

So I guess after reading the above articles I will need one of our dog people. Because of those were cadaver dogs that went in earlier and they didn't hit on anything, either she was not dead at the time or her body was not there earlier. The problem with that is that I cannot believe for the life of me why anyone would move a dead body into a house that people were subsiding in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cadaver dogs are in short supply so I doubt the dogs shown in the media several days ago were cadaver dogs. What remains now is for the police brass to present their case. There are probably high level emergency conferences taking place at headquarters after which their public relations experts will attempt to craft a statement designed around desperate damage control. Is the public getting what they pay for from the police? This case suggests to me at least that the answer is 'no'. An average bobby of several decades ago would have grabbed a ladder from somewhere and investigated the loft as part of his basic search

This case - until further details emerge - seems reminiscent of the case in the UK a few decades ago where a woman was murdered yet a large team of 'forensic experts' did not discover her body beneath the bath during the several days they spent in that small flat

 

[Lottie]

My own mother was murdered when I was 19 and the murderer got the minimum sentence of 15 months for manslaughter because of 'who' he was. I can't say more than that without going into detail.

OMG SuzieQ I don't know what to say....how awful....I feel so desperately sorry for you. My mum might have her faults and I might moan, but she's always been there at the end of the phone and in person when I have needed her.