GUILTY UK - Tia Sharp, 12, New Addington, London, 3 Aug 2012 #2

[Dion]

So did the search go something like this ...

PC responsible for searching, finds a chair, stands on chair and removes hatch. Sticks his head through the opening and shines a torch (flashlight) around the loft area, doesn't see anything worth looking in to, so replaces the hatch and calls it a day.

I don't see how it could be otherwise, as it wasn't until they actually decided to get a ladder and do a proper search, that they found the body. It looks like laziness and incompetence played a big part in this. That's just like opening a door to each room without actually going inside, just eyeballing the place and deciding that she is not there.

 

[kaos]

This does seem strange as in other cases people have reported seeing someone when they actually did not . Maxine Carr lied about her whereabouts and was only charged with perverting the course of justice.

That's what's making me curious. There are a variety of charges the police could have used for somebody interfering with an investigation so the assisting an offender is quite specific to knowing that somebody was an actual offender.

 

[Brock_and_Roll]

Returning if I may to the ongoing PM, I believe putrification is likely to have been extensive and is one of the reasons I am so angry at the LE in this case as their failure MAY make it harder to establish precisely what happened and open up avenues for denial or mitigation.

I am very familiar with the form of construction of the house where the body was found. The quality is generally fairly poor, but the roofspace itself is very likely to be insulated. The net effect of this is that the temperature during the day in the summer is usually circa 10c higher than outside. Hence if a pleasant 20c outside, it would be 30c+ in the loft during the day.

The temperature in Croydon during the first few days of August AVERAGED about 18c with peaks of about 24c. By the 9th, things had gotten hot and steamy with peaks of almost 30 degrees and an average of 21c.

The optimum temparature for body putrification is between 21c and 38c - it is likely that this temperature range was achieved for almost the enitre time the body was present.Whilst not every factor for the fastest putrification was present i.e moisture, and clothing/wrapping may have been an inhibitor there would have been air present, insects and of course naturally occuring bateria in the bowel, stomach etc. Frankly I am surpised that if the LE popped his head through the loft hatch during one of the earlier searches, some smell was not noticable. Aside from appearance, in hot countries a body may start to smell within 6 hours of death. In a closed off environment, it may take 2/3 days before the smell penetrates outside of the area concerned.


Sadly the body is likely to have been in a very unpleasant state making a PM more challenging.

 

[Skigh]

http://www.itv.com/news/story/2012-08-04/fears-grow-over-missing-girl/

hope I have linked this correctly.

The stepfather of missing 12-year-old Tia Sharp has revealed details of the last time he saw her.

Tia has not been seen since leaving her grandmother's home in New Addington, south east London, at around midday Friday.

“The last time I saw her was on Thursday morning [at the family home in Mitcham] before going to work.

She had a friend stay over. She was good as gold.

I know I am not her real dad, but I have been there since day dot. I have fed her and bathed her. I just want her home.

When she left the house she shouted 'Bye' and 'See you by six'. She always takes her phone, but it was dead.

– David Niles, Tia's stepfather


This to me reads as if David Niles expected to see her at their home, not Granny's at 6pm on Thursday.

 

[Amster]

What does "day dot" mean?

 

[kaos]

I remember reading too that Tia hadn't been going to her gran's for a few months and had only started going again.

It was through a link I followed on from here I never paid attention to the newspaper it was in.

 

[wfgodot]

What does "day dot" mean?

A long time ago; back in the day; "from the very first day."

 

[Dion]

The step father said NS was not actively searching 'because people follow her '. Strangeness. If my child were missing I either wouldn't know or care that people were following me, or I'd utilize those people to further the search

Step father deferred to SH, saying SH would be making a statement later or words to that effect. Same step father reportedly cried, 'Bring my little girl back' and ' I've been there since year dot '. So why defer to SH ? Why make a convicted crim and small time drug user/seller the family spokesperson. Not as if SH is more eloquent or photogenic etc. than the step father. The step father also 'insisted' according to some media reports that SH was 'hoovering' when the child left the house and had not been the last to see her. The mother claimed there existed 'an independent witness', reportedly and it now appears this was Meehan. Why did all of them support SH's claims ? Who is he, Svengali of the Lindens ?

I believe that NS either knew or suspected that something bad had happened to Tia. This is probably not a family that is used to cooperating with the police.

In my opinion, she was in all likelihood, devastated, and the others thought she might stray from the agreed upon scenario, and that is why they kept her public statements to the minimum.

 

[graceholl]

I think that her plans changed on Thursday. She was initially going to be home (in Mitcham) at 6pm, and then decided to stay with her Gran. Then on Friday, Hazell used the same time, 6pm, to say that's when she was expected back at Gran's place.

What we don't know is if Tia even knew that her Gran wasn't going to be home all night? Unless her home life was pure hell, I can't see why she'd choose to spend the night at Gran's house without her there. Although, according to Gran, Tia used the house as her 'refuge' which doesn't say anything positive about her life with her mum and stepdad, not to me anyway.

No idea why Hazell met Tia at the tram stop. Perhaps Hazell thought he'd pick her up when he did the shopping? I don't think we're ever going to know the truth about what happened. Hazell's quite the liar, and there's no way he's going to go into any detail about the real facts, because they're probably too awful to air - and he knows that. So I expect another pack of lies from him when the time comes.

Just an alternative theory and one that I myself am quite convinced by:

I get the impression that SH and Tia were close. He was probably the "cool" step grandfather figure, letting her eat junk, playing playstation with her, etc. etc. The reports of him crying and buying alcohol asking people if they'd seen her on the day he was arrested seem to back this up. I believe he killed her, but I do also believe he loved her. Hence perhaps why her body was not dumped as is often the case with murder victims. Perhaps he knew his time was up, but he couldn't bring himself to accept her death himself, let alone confess to being responsible. Thus he hid the body and tried to forget about it - backed up by his lengthy interview which we know many were quite taken in by.

I think it was a horrible accident and an argument gone terribly wrong. I imagine SH had been drinking, and perhaps Tia was playing up. But I don't see this as a pre-meditated act of evil imposed on a child he hated, but the opposite. I'm not excusing him in the slightest and I believe he should pay for his actions, but as dysfunctional as the family may be, I - at this stage - believe SH and Tia were close and that it was an accident that he is deeply upset about.

Re reading this I sound like I'm excusing him - please don't think that's the case!

 

[wfgodot]

Well-put, graceholl.

 

[Dion]

What does "day dot" mean?

I've heard of "year dot" and "day one" but not them both combined

I take it as being a long time.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

What does "day dot" mean?

To me it has always meant from the beginning or from day one.

Maybe he has known Tia from birth, but I thought he didn't get with NS until Tia was 6 or 7 years old?

Just another odd thing reportedly said in this case.

 

[Clio]

http://www.itv.com/news/story/2012-08-04/fears-grow-over-missing-girl/

hope I have linked this correctly.

The stepfather of missing 12-year-old Tia Sharp has revealed details of the last time he saw her.

Tia has not been seen since leaving her grandmother's home in New Addington, south east London, at around midday Friday.

“The last time I saw her was on Thursday morning [at the family home in Mitcham] before going to work.

She had a friend stay over. She was good as gold.

I know I am not her real dad, but I have been there since day dot. I have fed her and bathed her. I just want her home.

When she left the house she shouted 'Bye' and 'See you by six'. She always takes her phone, but it was dead.

– David Niles, Tia's stepfather


This to me reads as if David Niles expected to see her at their home, not Granny's at 6pm on Thursday.

All but the last line refers to the last time DN saw her at his home in Mitcham. In the final line, he is talking about the last time she was seen i.e. leaving Granny's house.

It's poorly written.

 

[graceholl]

Well-put, graceholl.

Thank you I'm glad it makes sense and I don't sound like I'm excusing the guy!

 

[Dion]

http://www.itv.com/news/story/2012-08-04/fears-grow-over-missing-girl/

hope I have linked this correctly.

The stepfather of missing 12-year-old Tia Sharp has revealed details of the last time he saw her.

Tia has not been seen since leaving her grandmother's home in New Addington, south east London, at around midday Friday.

“The last time I saw her was on Thursday morning [at the family home in Mitcham] before going to work.

She had a friend stay over. She was good as gold.

I know I am not her real dad, but I have been there since day dot. I have fed her and bathed her. I just want her home.

When she left the house she shouted 'Bye' and 'See you by six'. She always takes her phone, but it was dead.

– David Niles, Tia's stepfather


This to me reads as if David Niles expected to see her at their home, not Granny's at 6pm on Thursday.

BBM. Yes, and that's almost the same line that SH later used. Except that SH said "be back by six" and mentioned that she didn't take her phone.

Sounds to me like there was some rehearsal going on (but probably Tia's mum didn't want to participate).

I don't think that she had planned on staying overnight.

 

[Brock_and_Roll]

I would not get carried away trying to over-interpret the "day dot" comment.

It is a typical British "throw away" expression that just means a very long time, often used in a one-upmanship context. You might say "I have supported Manchester United since day dot where as you lot are jonny come latelies" - it means many many years but obviously not since birth!

 

[Dion]

All but the last line refers to the last time DN saw her at his home in Mitcham. In the final line, he is talking about the last time she was seen i.e. leaving Granny's house.

It's poorly written.

Maybe it's not poorly written, and that is what he said.

 

[Skigh]

All but the last line refers to the last time DN saw her at his home in Mitcham. In the final line, he is talking about the last time she was seen i.e. leaving Granny's house.

It's poorly written.

I do not read it like that as he adds the bit about the phone being dead.
Tia took her mother's phone when she left Mitcham because hers was dead.

 

[TykeyTrouble]

Just an alternative theory and one that I myself am quite convinced by:

I get the impression that SH and Tia were close. He was probably the "cool" step grandfather figure, letting her eat junk, playing playstation with her, etc. etc. The reports of him crying and buying alcohol asking people if they'd seen her on the day he was arrested seem to back this up. I believe he killed her, but I do also believe he loved her. Hence perhaps why her body was not dumped as is often the case with murder victims. Perhaps he knew his time was up, but he couldn't bring himself to accept her death himself, let alone confess to being responsible. Thus he hid the body and tried to forget about it - backed up by his lengthy interview which we know many were quite taken in by.

I think it was a horrible accident and an argument gone terribly wrong. I imagine SH had been drinking, and perhaps Tia was playing up. But I don't see this as a pre-meditated act of evil imposed on a child he hated, but the opposite. I'm not excusing him in the slightest and I believe he should pay for his actions, but as dysfunctional as the family may be, I - at this stage - believe SH and Tia were close and that it was an accident that he is deeply upset about.

Re reading this I sound like I'm excusing him - please don't think that's the case!

Your theory is plausible. Personally, I don't think he either loved or hated her. I think the feeble and unsuccessful attempt to cry in the interview demonstrates that he did not love her. When he was crying before being arrested he was a man under incredible stress and was fearing that the jig was up in my opinion. I think he went to hand out leaflets as a) an excuse to get access to alcohol and b) as an attempt to convince the public that he must be innocent.

However, I don't detect any premeditated hatred towards her either. I think I have made my opinion clear in previous post about the reason for her untimely end.

 

[Clio]

I do not read it like that as he adds the bit about the phone being dead.
Tia took her mother's phone when she left Mitcham because hers was dead.

I've seen people on here say that but haven't seen it in the media. Do you have a link please?