Upcoming Trial - 2012

[Just the Fax]

Yea, what are the odds another male from the hotel would follow Jay's lead and prop open the same fire door in the wee hours?

To even consider such a notion is stupid.
Of course BH never drove many key points home, so the jury just dismissed.

 

[Cammy]

DNA matching is all about odds and statistics. The results can include or exclude a person from being a contributor.

3 alliels matched JY. That is not a scientific match to exclude all others, but it does narrow a potential pool of donors down. JY cannot be excluded from a potential pool of contributors.

Tarheel's numbers are very interesting. What are the odds that someone else with 3 alliels that match JY propped open that door on the same night that JY admitted he propped open that door...and did so with a landscaping pebble/rock after JY did?

What are the odds that the very camera covering that door had been unplugged on the same night that JY's wife is brutally murdered about 3 hrs later after JY is seen in a different pullover top heading toward that very exit at midnight?

And what are the odds that after that camera was plugged back in and reset at 5:50am that 45 min later a camera would be pushed up to the ceiling, again removing possible video coverage of that doorway/staircase, all on the same day JY's wife was brutally murdered, and an hour after a tall man with light hair angrily cusses out a gas station attendant, throws down a $20, pumps only $15 and hurredly gets back on the road...which is coincidentally 1 hr away from the Hillsville H.I.?

A whole lot of coincidences in a short amount of time that when looked at together don't appear to be just random occurrences.

If you are counting on Gracie to get a conviction, you may need to count again.

Gracie's description of Jason changed many times over the years.
Gracie's regular customer who witnessed Jason's outburst has never been found.
Gracie did not tell her boss a customer yelled or cursed at her.
Gracie did not fill out an incident report.
Gracie did not tell the next clerk coming on duty what happened.
Gracie had customers at:
5:26 am
5:27 am (supposedly Jason)
5:28 am'
5:31 am
One of them had to see the angry customer or brush shoulders with him.
Sounds like there was a lot of people in line that early in the am waiting to be waited on.
Makes no sense Jason would cause a scene with that many people around and a regular customer standing in the store.
Besides, pay for gas first, or after, either way he had to pay.
Gracie, then added, at another date, there was a newspaper man there as well.
That man has since died.
Gracie said Jason had on jeans, I would imagine just about everyone there that am had on jeans.
Gracie never ID'ed Jason's SUV by herself , it was only after she was asked , she never said it first or volunteered it on her own.
Gracie, imo, is very confused.

 

[otto]

Thanks, Otto.
I did and nowhere does he give specific times for leaving his room, other than the one we see him on the video at close to midnite.

Something else ,one of his friends, Demetrius Barrett, called him after he arrived at the hotel to tell him about a home warranty plan for the Young's upstair heat pump, which had gone out.

I want to know what time he called him.. it was unclear at trial.

The day before in Raleigh it was 77 degrees, but the nights were dropping low in the 30's, which I don't understand how anyone
could think the hose was a method of cleaning up after the crime........

IMO

The theory about the hose is pretty wild. He had two bathrooms, anything found in his own trap would be evidence of nothing more than: he lived there. There was absolutely no reason for him to shower in the garden in the middle of the night in November.

I`m wondering if the woman that was so distraught about her infidelities will testify and how she`ll be feeling now, after having revealed the truth to her spouse. I don`t think there`s any reason to post her name, unless she testifies again ... assuming everyone knows who I mean.

 

[Madeleine74]

Had the investigators done more in-depth work at that particular HI, I would have expected to see testimony as to not only how many rooms were occupied, but which rooms had people entering/exiting between 11pm and 6:30am the next morning. Those people would have used key cards which is how their movements in/out of their rooms would be known, as well as anyone else who went outside and then came back in (assuming they had and used their key card to do so). If they had their card with them to get back in their room, then they would have used it to get back into the hotel IF they walked out.

So, of the 40-something rooms occupied that fateful night, I wonder what was the pattern. Who was up late leaving their room after midnight? Anyone? I mean, anyone else other than JY? Did the HI video cameras capture anyone up and about that night between midnight and 6am? Anyone else use a staircase that night?

 

[Just the Fax]

I have read here that Jason testified that he left his room twice: once to get his computer charger and once to smoke a cigar ... but I `don`t remember what he said. Maybe listen to his testimony again, as that would be the only source.

Yes, the only source and we now know the details were untruthful.
He stated he went down to get the computer charger when he hung up his call with MM at 11:45PM.
(Demietrius called at 10:58 PM)

Well, we now know he lied because he was on the computer at 11:38 -11:53PM. So, he was on the computer the entire time he was chatting up his girl.

Yep, he went down around 11:20PM to unplug the camera.

 

[Just the Fax]

The theory about the hose is pretty wild. He had two bathrooms, anything found in his own trap would be evidence of nothing more than: he lived there. There was absolutely no reason for him to shower in the garden in the middle of the night in November.

I`m wondering if the woman that was so distraught about her infidelities will testify and how she`ll be feeling now, after having revealed the truth to her spouse. I don`t think there`s any reason to post her name, unless she testifies again ... assuming everyone knows who I mean.

A hose, unwound and left trickling on a walkway in November?
Yea I agree, that is wild.

 

[Madeleine74]

He was on a computer, connected to the Internet at the HI, yet he didn't bother to check sports scores right then? One click to ESPN would have given him every sports score he could possibly want.

He had to grab a USA Today newspaper from the front desk, with older sports scores, to take outside to read in the dark?

Does that sound reasonable? It does not to me.

 

[otto]

That was from the state expert witness.

So, if you take all the physical evidence it goes like this:

1) Karen Morrow, expert shoe witness, could not make a match without the exact shoes. When asked by the defense, if she was saying the shoes were a match, she said No.

2) David Freeman, SBI agent, testified that Jason's DNA was on the sheetrock, but no way to tell how long it had been there.

3)Shawn Weiss, the DNA on rock, 1-79 Caucasians, when asked by the defense it he was saying it was a match, he said it was NOWHERE near a match....

4)David Freeman also testified an unidentified fingerprint was lifted from the medicine cap/top/dropper/
State's theory is that Jason and Michelle's daughter was drugged.

Jurors want physical evidence and that is what the last Jury said as well.

We are going to hear that Jason was unfaithful, and that he swallowed a ring and drew a magic marker face on a woman.

Both of those happened on hit sitcoms, (Friends and According to Jim)
and does not excuse Jason for all his immature selfish behavior.

Also, does not make him a murderer..

IMO

Shoes don't have to be a match.

If the expert could say that the shoe prints at the scene are consistent with or are similar to shoes that Jason had at one time owned, that's enough to add to other, more substantial evidence; not enough on its own. Shoes are never a match, but wear patterns are relevant. If the wear pattern on the print also match Jason's wear pattern, that makes a stronger argument. If wear pattern wasn't even mentioned, then the prosecution couldn't get a wear pattern from the print. Certainly the old shoe, the size 10, would have a wear pattern.

 

[tarheel8600]

One in 42 is worse than one in 79, one in a few million is good in terms of identifying one single person. One in 42 or 79 doesn`t really mean much when you have to go to the milions to isolate the DNA. If there`s one chance in a few millions that it`s anyone else ... okay, I`ll buy it. If there`s one chance in 42 that it`s anyone else, I don`t accept that as meaning anything in terms of identifying one single person.

It could mean that there are 42 men in the room that share the same 3 alleles - that might be true of a place in the mountains.

There is no chain of custody between the rock in the door and the rock in court.

I'm not understanding this post. How is 1 in 42 worse than 1 in 79?

Using a pool of 500 Caucasian males:
1 in 42 would mean that 11.9 men could be potential donors of the 3 DNA markers on the rock.
1 in 79 would mean that 6.3 men could be potential donors of the 3 DNA markers on the rock.

I also do not understand the comment that there could be 42 men in the room that share the same 3 alleles and that could be true in the mountains. That has nothing at all to do with 1 in 79 Caucasian males sharing the same 3 DNA markers that were found on the rock.

How do you know that there is not a chain of custody of the rock that LE found right outside the propped open exit door and the rock that was tested?

 

[ohiogirl]

This is going to be very interesting to see what happens this time. My vote is with the prosecution. I wonder if JY will take the stand this time.

 

[otto]

1 in 42, instead of 1-79 could make it a LOT worse though.
The number given was 1-79.

One in 79 works for me. DNA gives results like: there is a one in 3 million chance that it matches a particular person. If the results are one in 42 that it matches one person, meaning the results are a match to millions, that's meaningless. Three alleles could be mixed DNA (often seen with 3 alleles - no link) or it could be that caucasian men often share those alleles.

 

[Just the Fax]

Had the investigators done more in-depth work at that particular HI, I would have expected to see testimony as to not only how many rooms were occupied, but which rooms had people entering/exiting between 11pm and 6:30am the next morning. Those people would have used key cards which is how their movements in/out of their rooms would be known, as well as anyone else who went outside and then came back in (assuming they had and used their key card to do so). If they had their card with them to get back in their room, then they would have used it to get back into the hotel IF they walked out.

So, of the 40-something rooms occupied that fateful night, I wonder what was the pattern. Who was up late leaving their room after midnight? Anyone? I mean, anyone else other than JY? Did the HI video cameras capture anyone up and about that night between midnight and 6am? Anyone else use a staircase that night?

40 rooms on a Thursday in early November is a light crowd...majority probably had business in the area. Business travelers are not usually out of their rooms in a HI type hotel much after 9PM.

if JLY was not seem on video at 11:20 unplugging the camera, someone else from the hotel should be, right?

 

[Madeleine74]

It's true that only by DNA testing every single Caucasian male who stayed at the HI that night could a more definitive result be found wrt the rock/pebble. Imagine if the state had done that. People would be screaming how it was such a waste to test all those people...how disgusting that was...how desperate. Bad enough they tested one lowly pebble that had been removed from the fire exit.

 

[NCEast]

This is going to be very interesting to see what happens this time. My vote is with the prosecution. I wonder if JY will take the stand this time.

I sure hope he testifies as that will ultimately be his undoing. He is living with a false sense of security now and a good ADA will find a way to trip him up. I feel good about the second trial, but I'm still nervous as heck.

 

[otto]

I went over his testimony a few times, other than some little discrepancies, or if the twig experiment doesn't work, he is good to go.

Jason can't be expected to remember things from 5+years ago since he never talked.
He can't be asked to compare his statements that he gave police back then, like other witnesses.

But, they can use what he testified to in the next trial, which is set to begin in less than 48 hours.

I don't know which I am more excited about , the Superbowl or the 2nd trial of Jason Young....

I guess since my Eagles will be on the couch with 30 other losing teams, I'll make it.

PS, I was told that Becky Holt has been given second chair, and that Howard Cummings will take over the lead
this time around. I hope I am right.

I was standing outside a bank of doors today, holding one door open while I checked the others to see if they were locked. I looked around and wondered what I would have put in the door to prop it open while I grabbed a rock or a stick ...

A change of strategy on behalf of the prosecution is probably a good idea, especially if the defense team hasn't changed. If the teams don't change, everything remains the same.

 

[Just the Fax]

The cops didn't even bother to get Elmer's DNA to prove this was his handprint.
The mistake allowed Collins to use the "unknown DNA" crap again.
Betcha it won't happen next time <<wink>>

 

[Madeleine74]

if JLY was not seem on video at 11:20 unplugging the camera, so someone else from the hotel should be, right?

Well theoretically, yes. But I'm talking broader than camera unplugging. HI has additional video cameras on their property. I'm curious how many people were up, out of their rooms, somewhere downstairs or in any stairwell of that HI. There are 2 stairways? East and West? One stairwell's camera was unplugged at 11:20pm Apparently no one looked or found any images of who did that unplugging.

But what other HI customers exited and re-entered their rooms that night after midnight? Who else was awake? I know there's no additional record of JY using the card key system after his initial checkin because he latched his door so it didn't lock and he propped open the fire exit door to the parking lot.

I'm talking about anyone else in that entire hotel that night...up, walking anywhere near a camera? Or entering back into their hotel room where they used their key card?

 

[gracielee]

:laughcry:

The phantom of the HI

:great:

:rollercoaster:

:slap:

illowfight2:

:slapfight:

:bigfight:

 

[Just the Fax]

Well theoretically, yes. But I'm talking broader than camera unplugging. HI has additional video cameras on their property. I'm curious how many people were up, out of their rooms, somewhere downstairs or in any stairwell of that HI. There are 2 stairways? East and West? One stairwell's camera was unplugged at 11:20pm Apparently no one looked or found any images of who did that unplugging.

But what other HI customers exited and re-entered their rooms that night after midnight? Who else was awake? I know there's no additional record of JY using the card key system after his initial checkin because he latched his door so it didn't lock and he propped open the fire exit door to the parking lot.

I'm talking about anyone else in that entire hotel that night...up, walking anywhere near a camera? Or entering back into their hotel room where they used their key card?

I'm quite sure if there was video of another male on video in the west stairwell, say after 11, the defense would have presented his image as the man that more likely tampered with the camera.

My guess is all 39 room occupants were in their locked rooms after 11PM.

 

[otto]

DNA matching is all about odds and statistics. The results can include or exclude a person from being a contributor.

3 alliels matched JY. That is not a scientific match to exclude all others, but it does narrow a potential pool of donors down. JY cannot be excluded from a potential pool of contributors.

Tarheel's numbers are very interesting. What are the odds that someone else with 3 alliels that match JY propped open that door on the same night that JY admitted he propped open that door...and did so with a landscaping pebble/rock after JY did?

What are the odds that the very camera covering that door had been unplugged on the same night that JY's wife is brutally murdered about 3 hrs later after JY is seen in a different pullover top heading toward that very exit at midnight?

And what are the odds that after that camera was plugged back in and reset at 5:50am that 45 min later a camera would be pushed up to the ceiling, again removing possible video coverage of that doorway/staircase, all on the same day JY's wife was brutally murdered, and an hour after a tall man with light hair angrily cusses out a gas station attendant, throws down a $20, pumps only $15 and hurredly gets back on the road...which is coincidentally 1 hr away from the Hillsville H.I.?

A whole lot of coincidences in a short amount of time that when looked at together don't appear to be just random occurrences.

Half the men in the hotel may have shared those alleles. Maybe they were "caucasian men with big feet" alleles. I don't know enough about it, but I'm pretty sure that if the probability of being match is 1/79 it means that nothing can be concluded one way or the other about any suspect.

There are only coincidences (apparently a lot of them) if one views the lack of evidence as meaning Jason was lucky and filled with coincidence. What a coincidence that he happened to use the one gas station on the entire route without working surveillance cameras. What a coincidence that the door he supposedly entered had a broken lock - and we know it wasn't left unlocked all night. What a coincidence that gas attendant recognized the photo of Jason but could not describe him. We could go on ... sure, there are a lot of coincidences. The absence of solid evidence, thus far, may not be a big coincidence or luck. It might just be how it is ... a lack of solid evidence.