UT -Susan Powell, 28, West Valley City, 6 Dec 2009 - #5

[Gin]

From the article:
We sometimes reason that since we pay our tithing, attend the temple regularly and always get our visiting teaching done in the first half of the month we are entitled to a blessing.

What is 'visiting teaching'? Is that when they go door-to-door?

I'm not a mormon, but visiting teaching is where ward members visit each other, (as well as those inactive within the ward) and share scripture, etc. Visiting teachers go in pairs, and are assigned.

(I live in Utah...have been "offered" visiting teaching, and I politely decline.)

 

[lemonmoussetart]

Honestly, you'd probably get lots of different takes on this. Especially about alcohol. Many mormons are OK with having (or a family member having) occasional diet coke. It's kind of funny--diet coke is more accepted than having a coffee. I don't know why, it just is.
Most aren't tolerant at all about a glass of wine, or a beer.

Not LDS here, but has always been my understanding that it's not the beverage---it's what in the drink. Coffee has caffeine, while soft drinks are fine as long as they are decaf.

 

[AlexisFresca]

I'm not a mormon, but visiting teaching is where ward members visit each other, (as well as those inactive within the ward) and share scripture, etc. Visiting teachers go in pairs, and are assigned.

(I live in Utah...have been "offered" visiting teaching, and I politely decline.)

Wow. Very strict church they are.

 

[kiki the parrot]

First of all, and I have been meaning to ask for a while now, what does 'bbm' stand for?

Second, I also noticed on the one interview he did by the car on the street with a reporter, he denied the allegations that Susan as not feeling well, and that indeed she was feeling fine. Did anyone else notice that?

So if Jovanna said Susan said she wasn't feeling well or was sleepy (and which was it? Was she both sleepy and not feeling well, or just sleepy or just not feeling well?), and Josh said that no, she was feeling fine, ???

(bbm bolded by me) I've always believed it's significant that JP downplays the fact his wife was--according to their guest Jovanna--not feeling well. Had Susan simply 'feigned' feeling unwell for the purpose of politely excusing herself from her friend/guest it would not have been necessary to continue the excuse even after Jovanna left. I think it would have been understandable--and any friend would have understood if she was exhausted so she would have just said as much. I don't believe this was for Josh's benefit either--so why insist instead that Susan was perfectly fine and just a tad tired so taking a nap in the middle of the day (5pm) w company still present? His insistence is hinky, methinks he doth protest too much.

arrot:

 

[Gin]

Not LDS here, but has always been my understanding that it's not the beverage---it's what in the drink. Coffee has caffeine, while soft drinks are fine as long as they are decaf.

Yes, and diet coke has plenty of caffeine. I've lived here 7+ years...just my observations.
Some will order sprite when out for a meal, but the vast majority in my experience (that are having something other than water) go with good ole diet coke. :wink:

 

[kiki the parrot]

ETA Woops almost forgot...

Added "Take time to locate and position fans to dry damp carpet" (to Post #1112)
arrot:

 

[Ginnie]

Is garbage pick up in the wee hours, there or surrounding cities? He would not, I believe, put her in an area he claimed he was camping. The ground is too hard....had to be another means of "disposal". IMO

 

[Gin]

N/K this is a No-Brainer. Time to play,

How Many Stranger Abduction, Home invasion, Random Kidnappers Do You Know Who...

1) Bring along their own Bissell Steam Machine (or can locate one on the premises) and stick around to steam clean the carpets after their crimes...?

2) Bring along their own portable fans (or can locate them on the premises) and stick around to position them so as to dry carpets during the night...?

3) Are able to lock the home (it was securely locked w no sign of forced entry) behind them without the keys--left inside the home...?

4) Anticipate an impromptu middle-of-the-night-camping-trip-w-toddlers-in-tow-in-subfreezing-temps-and-snowstorm by the victim's husband...?

5) Anymore....?

arrot:

Excellent points! :thumb: It's a little far fetched to think that some anonymous criminal who suffers from obsessive compulsive cleaning disorder was involved in this disappearance.
Yep, I think we can safely eliminate an evil Mr. Clean.

We're probably going to have to stick with the rather obvious person of interest.

 

[fran]

We all know at first Josh said Susan wasn't feeling well, and then he back-peddled and said 'she wasn't not feeling well.'

IMHO, he ORIGINALLY said she wasn't feeling well because he needed a REASON he left with the boys without her.

When he was later CRITICISED for leaving his 'ill wife' home alone and didn't call her, he changed his tune to she WASN'T NOT FEELING WELL. :croc:

I'm tellin' you, he looks at the criticisms and creates his story from there.

LOL, why do you think he looks like his dog just died?

Because everyone STILL THINKS HE DID IT!

He's SCARED! :loser:

Now he thinks if he runs up to Washington and hides behind his daddy, everyone will forget about him. :chicken:

Fat chance of that though! :snooty:

JMHO
fran

 

[Ginnie]

(snip, bbm) Thanks Dwight. Here's the Other Thing. I'm pretty d*mn sure there's something between being "obligated to get in his face and so much as call him a liar....."

...and rolling up the trucks, the sleeves, the dollys, professional packing cartons, hot chocolate and marshmallows, and the Royal Red Carpet Treatment for this "suffering" POI so HE CAN LEAVE TOWN W/OUT EVER BREAKING A SWEAT WHILE HE IS REFUSING LAW ENFORCEMENT THE INTERVIEW THEY WANT W JOSH.

So they're too skeerd--ALL 20 of these CHURCH MEMBERS and furniture movers--to instead ASK JOSH TO COOPERATE?? He can still refuse, but at least they're not enabling and falling over themselves to ASSIST THE *ONLY* PERSON LE HAS ANY INTEREST IN SPEAKING W. THEY CAN NOT VERIFY ANY OF HIS PATHETIC ALIBIS, AND HERE EVERYONE IS BENDING OVER BACKWARDS TO CODDLE "POOR, HURTING JOSHY."

But that's just *my" thing. To each their own. JMVHO

arrot:

and 20 people trampled the crime scene...

 

[kiki the parrot]

A couple notes on komo articles (bbm),

'Investigators said there were no signs of forced entry at the home and they found Susan Powell's purse and cell phone there.
Gifford said friends and family members weren't surprised authorities named the husband a person of interest "given the events and his reactions to them in the past week."
"We know that Susan is an excellent mother and would not have tolerated her children being taken out of the home after midnight to go camping in dangerously cold conditions," Gifford said.
Meanwhile, police said investigators have discussed conducting a polygraph test of Josh Powell, but no such interview has occurred.
"He is not allowing us the opportunity to interview him at length in order to verify his statements and also to get more specifics," McLachlan said. "His statements are absolutely vague."
Josh Powell's attorney, Scott Williams, disputed allegations made that his client had been uncooperative. Josh Powell has spoken to police and provided a DNA sample this week, as did several other family members. Williams, a defense attorney who often defends high-profile clients, described the DNA testing as routine in such cases.
Police have not sought to restrict Powell's movements by asking him to surrender a passport, because they don't have sufficient information to make that request, McLachlan said.'

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/79563062.html

K great he's still got the passport...

'Detectives visited the spot, Simpson Springs on the historic Pony Express Trail in Utah's west desert. Josh Powell told authorities he kept shelter with his children in a van while camping...'

http://puyallup.komonews.com/content/clues-few-search-puyallup-native-utah-continues

Children as young as 2 and 4 are highly suggestible. When you tell children this young "Woohoo we're going camping," pack up some snacks and drive off w them in a preloaded van into the night, they're not gonna question anything daddy tells them. If he keeps the engine running ie heater on and they're comfortable... and whenever they may happen to awaken, you're way out in the desert, or woods, or mountains, or even stopped along the roadside or a ravine they are gonna believe w/e you tell them--"Daddy's looking for firewood, be right back boys!" Or "darn, daddy couldn't find any don't worry, we're still "camping!" I mean there would've been no problem stowing body in cargo area in rear of van (leaving an entire row of seating btw boys and cargo area) w/out children this age discovering. They are in their beds when she's initially placed there, they're almost surely asleep as they drive thru the nite, and they're still safely secured in their forward facing carseats at all times no matter where daddy stops in the darkness of night. No freakin problem.

arrot:

 

[motappin]

I am a Mormon (yes I live in Utah LOL), and regarding the discussion about ward members helping Josh move, here is my take on it. If it were my family in their ward and he'd asked for help, I think my husband/myself would probably refuse to go over unless Josh had been a personal friend. In that case, I would think one or both of us MIGHT go, but only out of curiosity or to see if Josh would slip, or to see what he was doing with Susan's things. In general I think the ward members are just trying to perform an act of service and trying not to be judgemental, since Josh has not been arrested. BUT, that being said, I'm pretty sure they were also hoping to see how he was acting and hoping for any insights.

About the Coke thing, it's funny how many interpretations there are out there by people who are curious. There is nothing in church doctrine about cola. Personally I love the stuff, both diet and regular.

Also, about the article that mentioned the article that says most Mormons tend to just believe other Mormons...I disagree. I haven't read that article, but EVERYONE I know (and I know a lot of Mormons...LOL) thinks Josh is guilty as sin and wants him to be arrested PRONTO. Everyone I've talked to thinks he has got to be the perp here and thinks he's also got to be a complete jerk, weasel, snake, and so many other things. When an LDS member does something terrible (as people will no matter what church they go to) I think other LDS people (at least the ones I know) tend to be MORE critical, because we know what they claim to believe, and we know that they know better.

I wish the police had taken that Shopvac too! I want this piece of dirt arrested, tried, and PUNISHED TO THE FULLEST EXTENT OF THE LAW.

Though I don't believe religion has anything to do with this case (unless Josh's dad's "literature" and attitude fueled Josh's anger toward Susan, though it was probably more about control than anything else), I thought I'd offer a local LDS perspective on this. I think about Susan constantly. I hope the police have a break TODAY.

 

[wyome]

Does anyone know whether dogs were brought in in the early days since her disappearance? To the house, and also the van? To the campsite he claimed he visited?

Do we know for sure the campsite is approximately a 2 hour drive? If so, why did stay in freezing temperatures ALL DAY Monday until way into the late afternoon? That's a lot of time to be hanging out in a remote location freezing your *advertiser censored** off with small children. I wonder how many times he tried to contact Susan at the house. I can't wait to see the results of the cell phone logs.

 

[lonetraveler]

Just have a question here. This has probably already been discussed. Sorry, I'm trying to catchup. What is the distance between Susan's house and Josh's father's house? I'm wondering if Josh's dad may have met him halfway to help with the disposal of Susan. I hope that LE has thought about this possibility.

 

[kiki the parrot]

Excellent points! :thumb: It's a little far fetched to think that some anonymous criminal who suffers from obsessive compulsive cleaning disorder was involved in this disappearance.
Yep, I think we can safely eliminate an evil Mr. Clean.

We're probably going to have to stick with the rather obvious person of interest.

Yep. Actually JP is known to be pretty OCD. Mr. Obsessing Over Germs on Bare Feet kinda gave himself away a little eh?

arrot:

 

[motappin]

I'm wondering if Josh's dad may have met him halfway to help with the disposal of Susan. I hope that LE has thought about this possibility.

I've wondered about that too. I've wondered if he stashed her somewhere more temporary and then use the rental car to move her, but then, would he be stupid enough to do that since police obviously know which car he rented and have presumably searched it? :waitasec: But I guess that theory is more plausible if he took the body out Sunday night and met daddy somewhere, and let daddy do the rest. Perhaps if dad did help, it's possible he has refused to tell Josh where the body is, so that Josh can claim he really doesn't know where Susan is, and can avoid the information slipping out.

 

[Gin]

I am a Mormon (yes I live in Utah LOL), and regarding the discussion about ward members helping Josh move, here is my take on it. If it were my family in their ward and he'd asked for help, I think my husband/myself would probably refuse to go over unless Josh had been a personal friend. In that case, I would think one or both of us MIGHT go, but only out of curiosity or to see if Josh would slip, or to see what he was doing with Susan's things. In general I think the ward members are just trying to perform an act of service and trying not to be judgemental, since Josh has not been arrested. BUT, that being said, I'm pretty sure they were also hoping to see how he was acting and hoping for any insights.

About the Coke thing, it's funny how many interpretations there are out there by people who are curious. There is nothing in church doctrine about cola. Personally I love the stuff, both diet and regular.

Also, about the article that mentioned the article that says most Mormons tend to just believe other Mormons...I disagree. I haven't read that article, but EVERYONE I know (and I know a lot of Mormons...LOL) thinks Josh is guilty as sin and wants him to be arrested PRONTO. Everyone I've talked to thinks he has got to be the perp here and thinks he's also got to be a complete jerk, weasel, snake, and so many other things. When an LDS member does something terrible (as people will no matter what church they go to) I think other LDS people (at least the ones I know) tend to be MORE critical, because we know what they claim to believe, and we know that they know better.

I wish the police had taken that Shopvac too! I want this piece of dirt arrested, tried, and PUNISHED TO THE FULLEST EXTENT OF THE LAW.

Though I don't believe religion has anything to do with this case (unless Josh's dad's "literature" and attitude fueled Josh's anger toward Susan, though it was probably more about control than anything else), I thought I'd offer a local LDS perspective on this. I think about Susan constantly. I hope the police have a break TODAY.

Appreciate your input. About the diet coke--I'm not curious. I know there are 45mg of caffeine in a can of diet coke. For comparison, one red bull has 80mg. :wink: It's just one of those things that is kinda interesting. Some folks within the LDS community buy into a ban on caffeine (the exact agent that is in coffee), some don't.
I think they should do whatever makes them happy.

And I agree with you that I also hope there is a break in the case soon, today would be great, wouldn't it?

 

[kiki the parrot]

I am a Mormon (yes I live in Utah LOL), and regarding the discussion about ward members helping Josh move, here is my take on it. If it were my family in their ward and he'd asked for help, I think my husband/myself would probably refuse to go over unless Josh had been a personal friend. In that case, I would think one or both of us MIGHT go, but only out of curiosity or to see if Josh would slip, or to see what he was doing with Susan's things. In general I think the ward members are just trying to perform an act of service and trying not to be judgemental, since Josh has not been arrested. BUT, that being said, I'm pretty sure they were also hoping to see how he was acting and hoping for any insights.

About the Coke thing, it's funny how many interpretations there are out there by people who are curious. There is nothing in church doctrine about cola. Personally I love the stuff, both diet and regular.

Also, about the article that mentioned the article that says most Mormons tend to just believe other Mormons...I disagree. I haven't read that article, but EVERYONE I know (and I know a lot of Mormons...LOL) thinks Josh is guilty as sin and wants him to be arrested PRONTO. Everyone I've talked to thinks he has got to be the perp here and thinks he's also got to be a complete jerk, weasel, snake, and so many other things. When an LDS member does something terrible (as people will no matter what church they go to) I think other LDS people (at least the ones I know) tend to be MORE critical, because we know what they claim to believe, and we know that they know better.

I wish the police had taken that Shopvac too! I want this piece of dirt arrested, tried, and PUNISHED TO THE FULLEST EXTENT OF THE LAW.

Though I don't believe religion has anything to do with this case (unless Josh's dad's "literature" and attitude fueled Josh's anger toward Susan, though it was probably more about control than anything else), I thought I'd offer a local LDS perspective on this. I think about Susan constantly. I hope the police have a break TODAY.

(bbm) Thanks for sharing motappin, guess it's good not everyone who shares these beliefs is actually in denial... But w all due respect I know I've personally grown weary of the "nonjudgmental" mantra, this being taken totally out of context... and hearing "curiosity" used as an excuse for enabling a POI to avoid his responsibility to work w LE and find his wife, is getting played out. Especially as a "personal friend," if we know they are as you say guilty as sin, a snake and need to be arrested, then it is critical to take a FIRM stand and hold them accountable for their OWN poor choices by maintaining clear boundaries which require them to own and take responsibility for those really poor choices--ie don't blur the lines between what's right and what's wrong, what's their's and what's our's... as opposed to condoning, enabling or otherwise assisting them in carrying out those plans.

As you can tell, I'm really big on boundaries. :biggrin:

arrot:

 

[fran]

Just have a question here. This has probably already been discussed. Sorry, I'm trying to catchup. What is the distance between Susan's house and Josh's father's house? I'm wondering if Josh's dad may have met him halfway to help with the disposal of Susan. I hope that LE has thought about this possibility.

It's more than 850 miles and over 14 hour drive. This is per mapquest.

HTH
fran

 

[fran]

Does anyone know whether dogs were brought in in the early days since her disappearance? To the house, and also the van? To the campsite he claimed he visited?

Do we know for sure the campsite is approximately a 2 hour drive? If so, why did stay in freezing temperatures ALL DAY Monday until way into the late afternoon? That's a lot of time to be hanging out in a remote location freezing your *advertiser censored** off with small children. I wonder how many times he tried to contact Susan at the house. I can't wait to see the results of the cell phone logs.

It's my understanding that there were dogs used at the ALLEGED campsite, in the early days of the investigation. No sign of Josh and the boys being there could be found. Of course, it had snowed a bit overnight.

I also believe the campsite that was checked may have been more like a three hour drive. Especially in the weather they were having at that time.

JMHO
fran