VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #1

[gxm]

(respectfully snipped)

I've been trying to decide why he even went back to VA if he and Emma were no longer dating. The easiest answer is that he was low on cash and his ticket was from VA to CA. He probably was unsure of what steps he would have to take to change his travel reservations. Of course, he could have also had hopes that maybe he could get back to VA with Emma and smooth things over and win her back with his glib charm.


When that didn't work.................

I've been wondering about that too. Maybe he thought that once Emma was away from the other guy then he could win her back. Or maybe he was already forming his murderous intent.

Sam had set his mood at "determined" and I think that meant that he was determined to keep Emma no matter what, even if it meant killing her. But it could just as well have meant that he was determined to achieve "fame" as Syko Sam the psycho killer.

 

[majikposhun]

After two weeks of pondering many many thoughts (like most of you on here) – I have some thoughts to share on this story:

I just read that Emma’s mom brought FOOD for the SFWF participants – and that knowledge brings me back to my original thought – Dr. Kelley was researching this genre of people and music. This was why she took off – think about it – this could have been her BIG PROJECT of her career – I don’t know if any other big insider research projects have been conducted (professionally) on the Horrorcore scene, so this very well could have been her shining moment as a Criminal Justice professional. Dr. Kelly in the one photograph I see looks a little slipshod – as if she has some emotional/mental issues as well – which usually goes along with highly intelligent people (I know b/c most of my family have 150 + IQ and extremely high EQ’s and a lot of them have suffered from depression and the like). She may have been quite egocentric as well as her husband. If this is the case, I think her decision was not only imprudent, but quite Machiavellian. This explains why she would allow her daughter to attend this event and why she drove them (in fact I am betting she insisted that was the only way she could go).

I can understand why Pastor Neiderbrock covered up the facts about where he was going that weekend – but it is still self-serving, certainly going against the altruistic values a pastor should uphold. I believe he was deeply afraid for his daughter – but it may have come down to manipulation between father and mother (perhaps) the mother threatened to reveal some things about Mark that would be publicly embarrassing – therefore the Debra gets her way, Emma gets her way and Mark is not humiliated publicly.

Emma gets there and I think the “break-up” was mutual. I have heard he was saying all sorts of cruel things to her and maybe she was like screw you – I don’t need this – look at all the attention I am getting from all these other guys. And maybe he was getting heat from his ex-girlfriend about the “little girl” he was “dating” (I seriously think it’s a joke to call it that – all facts considered). So Emma went off and partied with another group and Sam went solo or chilled with his ex-gf. Then they decided to be “friends” again and go back to VA – or another scenario was Sam was about to snap and perhaps he got rejected by his ex at the show. Too much rejection and embarrassment – perhaps he apologized to Emma about the asinine comments he made and she being a naïve 16-year-old blew it off and was just simply on a cloud from being with her “family” that she just brushed it under the rug and forgave him – all is well – right – NOT SO MUCH!

They get back – he sees the text from the guy she was with at the show and that just sent him over the top. I definitely think Sam was massively disturbed sociopath. He was living his fantasies through this music that the majority of these also disturbed people (sorry but that’s my opinion) used as a form of artistic expression. This is not music IMO and they definitely need to think about how they are influencing these young kids – seems to me these SKR folks were getting what they needed emotionally from these teenagers – love, respect, admiration, trust, devotion, etc. – they are using these confused kids to get what their confused and disturbed asses need.

 

[Heroine]

I wonder if the rest of the family was kept in the dark about what Emma was really into.
http://www.nbc12.com/Global/story.asp?S=11227991
....also I wonder about this comment...
"Bivens says between voice mail messages left on Wells' mom's phone by Mccroskey and not hearing from her daughter sparked enough concern for Wells' mom to call police and Emma's father, Pastor Mark Niederbrock. The calls led to the gruesome discovery september 18th."
http://www.nbc12.com/Global/story.asp?S=11201226

...I mean, what could he have said in those messages?

 

[absynthminded1]

After two weeks of pondering many many thoughts (like most of you on here) – I have some thoughts to share on this story:

I just read that Emma’s mom brought FOOD for the SFWF participants – and that knowledge brings me back to my original thought – Dr. Kelley was researching this genre of people and music. This was why she took off – think about it – this could have been her BIG PROJECT of her career – I don’t know if any other big insider research projects have been conducted (professionally) on the Horrorcore scene, so this very well could have been her shining moment as a Criminal Justice professional. Dr. Kelly in the one photograph I see looks a little slipshod – as if she has some emotional/mental issues as well – which usually goes along with highly intelligent people (I know b/c most of my family have 150 + IQ and extremely high EQ’s and a lot of them have suffered from depression and the like). She may have been quite egocentric as well as her husband. If this is the case, I think her decision was not only imprudent, but quite Machiavellian. This explains why she would allow her daughter to attend this event and why she drove them (in fact I am betting she insisted that was the only way she could go).

I can understand why Pastor Neiderbrock covered up the facts about where he was going that weekend – but it is still self-serving, certainly going against the altruistic values a pastor should uphold. I believe he was deeply afraid for his daughter – but it may have come down to manipulation between father and mother (perhaps) the mother threatened to reveal some things about Mark that would be publicly embarrassing – therefore the Debra gets her way, Emma gets her way and Mark is not humiliated publicly.

Emma gets there and I think the “break-up” was mutual. I have heard he was saying all sorts of cruel things to her and maybe she was like screw you – I don’t need this – look at all the attention I am getting from all these other guys. And maybe he was getting heat from his ex-girlfriend about the “little girl” he was “dating” (I seriously think it’s a joke to call it that – all facts considered). So Emma went off and partied with another group and Sam went solo or chilled with his ex-gf. Then they decided to be “friends” again and go back to VA – or another scenario was Sam was about to snap and perhaps he got rejected by his ex at the show. Too much rejection and embarrassment – perhaps he apologized to Emma about the asinine comments he made and she being a naïve 16-year-old blew it off and was just simply on a cloud from being with her “family” that she just brushed it under the rug and forgave him – all is well – right – NOT SO MUCH!

They get back – he sees the text from the guy she was with at the show and that just sent him over the top. I definitely think Sam was massively disturbed sociopath. He was living his fantasies through this music that the majority of these also disturbed people (sorry but that’s my opinion) used as a form of artistic expression. This is not music IMO and they definitely need to think about how they are influencing these young kids – seems to me these SKR folks were getting what they needed emotionally from these teenagers – love, respect, admiration, trust, devotion, etc. – they are using these confused kids to get what their confused and disturbed asses need.

At this point, I'd be willing to entertain the idea that SickTanick orchestrated the murder(s) to make an example of those who stuck their nose in SKR's business. Think of how a book on his little family might have impacted his little dominion....

 

[tapu]

wow emma was really deep into this crap.. :/

http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/ind...dID=99021159&albumID=2352132&imageID=45392231

Wow. I thought I was kinda bad-*advertiser censored* at 16 but... can you imagine if that were YOUR 16yo daughter in that photo? I cannot.... Please, God, don't let it get like that. Ever.

 

[Heroine]

At this point, I'd be willing to entertain the idea that SickTanick orchestrated the murder(s) to make an example of those who stuck their nose in SKR's business. Think of how a book on his little family might have impacted his little dominion....

This could be very true, I mean after all Sick Tanick does say in the song I posted " I take his flock corrupt his creations invade their minds with unholy persuasions" ...."I am the teacher, call me Jesus Christ"

Also, I feel the word that Raz uses as a description seems somewhat indicative...
"We rap about it, and it "finally" happens," Razakel, 25, who refused to divulge her given name, said by telephone from her home near Albuquerque, N.M. "It should be like a slap in our face, right? Well, no. S--- happens."
http://www.whotv.com/news/nationworld/sns-ap-us-virginia-killings,0,1353783.story




I'm not sure if this has been posted or not, but I found the date that Sam called his friend telling him he had killed them...


Friday, September 18th between 8:00 p.m. – 9:00 p.m. – Shrim (rapper) calls police and tells them that a friend of McCroskey from California said he got a call from McCroskey on Thursday, September 16th in the afternoon saying he had killed one or more people. McCroskey's friend says McCroskey was "upset" on the phone. Farmville police identify McCroskey as their suspect.
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/topic/wtvr-timeline-farmville,0,2184770.story

 

[absynthminded1]

This could be very true, I mean after all Sick Tanick does say in the song I posted " I take his flock corrupt his creations invade their minds with unholy persuasions" ...."I am the teacher, call me Jesus Christ"

Exactly. Every day this looks to be about a lot more than how it appears on the surface.

This was just added to SickTanick's blog....

Way to honor (to be read capitalize on) the dead... assuming it is her, though the hair and eye shadow seem the same.

This one is still the most classy of the classy...

Proof that Emma and Melanie partied with SKR...

(She looks wrecked.)

Located in an album called "Fun Times." (because getting a minor so hammered they puke up a lung is so much fun!)

http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/64/l_0b89c944500347469b51e268cfbdff7a.jpg

Finally, this one's from the SFTW weekend... Can't believe Emma's parents actually allowed this or turned a blind eye to it...

 

[gxm]

(respectfully snipped)

....also I wonder about this comment...
"Bivens says between voice mail messages left on Wells' mom's phone by Mccroskey and not hearing from her daughter sparked enough concern for Wells' mom to call police and Emma's father, Pastor Mark Niederbrock. The calls led to the gruesome discovery september 18th."
http://www.nbc12.com/Global/story.asp?S=11201226

...I mean, what could he have said in those messages?

My first guess would be that his stories were shifting and not adding up. And the fact that Mel hadn't returned any of their calls, the only person they were hearing from was Sam.

 

[MeoW333]

Those Juggalos follow that like it's a religion to them, and i guess it is.. if you google "juggalo religion" you'll see they are trying to petition to get their religion recognized, they follow some "dark carnival" thing..
A lot of them take it seriously or seem to go off the deep end really easy and we end up reading about them killing on here..

 

[majikposhun]

Those Juggalos follow that like it's a religion to them, and i guess it is.. if you google "juggalo religion" you'll see they are trying to petition to get their religion recognized, they follow some "dark carnival" thing..
A lot of them take it seriously or seem to go off the deep end really easy and we end up reading about them killing on here..

I found this on FaceBook - look how many freaking members there are on just FaceBook: http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=21005275106&ref=search&sid=742436557.2584095065..1

 

[ebbie]

It's tough to know what it means that he is "not remorseful" if he isn't talking to the police, which he is not. I'm sure his attorney has told him to say nothing - any expression of remorse would be an acknowledgment that he was involved with the deaths. I guess it's possible he is acting downright jubilant, demonstrating pride in his (accused) crimes, but I find that hard to believe - I would guess he spends his days moping in his cell the way most people would if they knew they were more than likely looking at the needle for committing a terrible crime.

It's not too long since the murders. I imagine he still feels connected to his "family" and as such he still has to play "bada**" and act proud. My guess is he will continue to act this way especially since he knows eyes are on him now. There appears to be nothing in is life to ground him....true family, friends, etc. If he gives in and acts remorseful the horrorcore "family" might call him a phoney.

My suspicion is that he would continue this act even to execution in attempt to become a legend like Ramirez (sp?). Sam's crimes may be just as bad as Ramirez but he will never qualify for similar legendary status. He is just a punk who chose to imitate. I dont think he was naturally evil. I'm talking about the difference between a follower and a leader. Sam was a follower.

With time apart from the "family", however, the chance of him opening up increases. It takes a while for people coming out of cults to come back to reality.

My observations...

 

[Heroine]

My first guess would be that his stories were shifting and not adding up. And the fact that Mel hadn't returned any of their calls, the only person they were hearing from was Sam.

Yeah but if the messages were on her voicemail that means that he called her, right? Why? Was he telling her he was about to kill her daughter?....what was in those messages?

 

[majikposhun]

At this point, I'd be willing to entertain the idea that SickTanick orchestrated the murder(s) to make an example of those who stuck their nose in SKR's business. Think of how a book on his little family might have impacted his little dominion....

Maybe it was the other guy from Wicked Intent Records that he called first - I mean seriously - Why the eff did he call him period! I completely agree there is way more to this story than meets the eye. But then again - I could just a conspiracy theorist!

 

[majikposhun]

Yeah but if the messages were on her voicemail that means that he called her, right? Why? Was he telling her he was about to kill her daughter?....what was in those messages?

Perhaps something along those lines - or just a CYA on his part - calling her back from calling the house so that she would not call the police sooner than it happened - IMO he was buying time by leaving a message for her.

 

[LadyL]

Yeah but if the messages were on her voicemail that means that he called her, right? Why? Was he telling her he was about to kill her daughter?....what was in those messages?

perhaps he was just returning phonecalls from her & giving her excuses (ie) they're at the movies/they're sleeping/they ran to the store/they went to McDonald's etc.

 

[ziggy]

It's odd that they are messages. Wouldn't Mel's mom be worried enough to answer the phone considering she was trying to find her daughter?
Edited to add: it sounds like they were left before the mom got suspicious?

 

[Heroine]

It's odd that they are messages. Wouldn't Mel's mom be worried enough to answer the phone considering she was trying to find her daughter?
Edited to add: it sounds like they were left before the mom got suspicious?

Yeah wtf wouldn't you answer every phone call that came in if it weren't before she became suspicious, but even if it were before then, if my daughter was out of town I think I'd still be sure to catch all my calls if possible. Anything can happen at any time. Also if they were made before the mom became suspicious, then wth could he possibly have had to say to her that wouldn't cause an alarm to go off. I mean I would find it very strange for a guy I've never met to call me and say anything about my daughter, esp. if I hadn't spoken to her.
So if in fact the calls were made before she became suspicious, why would he do that, it seems like that would make him look more guilty of something.

 

[Heroine]

Maybe it was the other guy from Wicked Intent Records that he called first - I mean seriously - Why the eff did he call him period! I completely agree there is way more to this story than meets the eye. But then again - I could just a conspiracy theorist!

From what I've read it was someone from WIR that he called, but why wouldn't you call your family first? That's another reason why I say someone knew what was going to happen, or at least thought they knew. If not, then why would you make it a point to tell them and not someone in your family?

 

[majikposhun]

From what I've read it was someone from WIR that he called, but why wouldn't you call your family first? That's another reason why I say someone knew what was going to happen, or at least thought they knew. If not, then why would you make it a point to tell them and not someone in your family?

I am wondering the same - we are very much on the same page!

 

[ziggy]

From what I've read it was someone from WIR that he called, but why wouldn't you call your family first? That's another reason why I say someone knew what was going to happen, or at least thought they knew. If not, then why would you make it a point to tell them and not someone in your family?

Correct me if I'm wrong, I scrolled back but could not locate the info so off the top of my head:

Sam calls someone at WIR on or around Sept. 16? (I could swear I saw that posted) and says he's killed them etc.

That is before Emma's Dad is killed if so.

Why does that guy wait around for the SKR guy to be calling around trying to get information? Why didn't he call police or track down Mel's mom?

I'm confused how this all went down with the phone calls to SKR guy and who called his girlfriend and when.