VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #2

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2) The followers call themselves unholy disciples.......

These "followers" that called themselves "unholy disciples" were the victims.

H
Am I saying that McC wasn't able to just snap on his own? No, but the involvement of 3 of the 5 players here in this genre deserves more than just a peek at it.

Im sure LE is or has looked into that? Also likely the fact that 2 of the 5 players were boyfriend and girlfriend while the other 3 players very close with the girlfriend.


Am I saying that Shrimm devised a plan down to the letter and told Sam to go do it? No.
Am I saying that Shrimm suggested he kill those particular people? No.
Am I saying that Shrimm should be morally responsible, if not legally responsible, for influencing a sick young man with sick intentions? Yes.

If you start putting legal responsibility on people who have done nothing illegal but have just said or acted in ways that suggest something illegal the prisons will be filled with people from the entertainment world. If somebody is stupid enough to kill somebody with the motive of "sicktanick and his music" than there is a serious problem with that person, and that doesnt happen so why I'm entertaining it is beyond me.

Telling me that he won't get arrested over this is like saying OJ is innocent because a jury said so. There may not be enough to evidence to charge him lawfully, but that doesn't mean we can't or should not examine the same type of concept that may be going on with the modern day twist of the internet. Like I said before the internet is the new Spahn Ranch were they virtually live together calling themselves a family.

Of course theres no evidence to arrest him, he had nothing to do with it. And now comparing this guy to OJ Simpson? wow, just wow. This guy for all you know in his personal life may have never hurt anybody and maybe has even helped people. Now becuase a guy he knew killed his girlfriend, her friend and her family, he's now getting labeled OJ Simpson. Good job coming up with that.

Shrimm seems to have quite an effect on those who encounter him. He has a devout following. Personally I think he needs Richard Simmons more than Satan right now and some sweatin' to the oldies like Black Sabbath, but hey, the chicks at SKR dig him and are even proud to announce that he raped them or molested them (Raz too) by buying the merchandise that says so and wearing it - flaunting it - Hmmm. Sounds kinda mansonesque to me.

You really think all of that is to be taken literal? Unreal.

I am not igonoring the distinguishing factors, just pointing out that we might not want to denounce the possibility that another version of a Manson might, in our lifetime, gather and infect a group of outcast youth. He may not be as charismatic, or he may be (unless you know him it would be hard to tell) but I think he WANTS to be idolized and sees HIMSELF as being a messenger in his music.

Of course its possible anything is, like turtles flying. What makes you think this is a manson like cult that is going around killing people? Because of this crime that Sam McCroskey committed on devoted members of your made up cult?

Putting the spotlight on him might get some parents attention and leave him a little less supernatural - just think if Manson had been publicized and what a joke he would have been??? Why not turn the spotlight on these cockroaches?

Getting some attention and spotlight to parents about the subject matter of the music is fine and one thing, labeling another innocent human being a murderer is quite another. That is a very heavy thing to drop on another persons shoulders, something that could have a lot of negative effect on their life.

If you are looking to argue the point that he won't be arrested, don't bother - I agree he probably won't. That's not the point. Just because the law can't prove something beyond a reasonable doubt doesn't mean it's not real. OJ.

How can you compare OJ Simpson to this guy? That is the most ridiculous and silly thing I have ever heard. Do you realize OJ Simpson was charged and put on trial for murder? Do you realize all of the evidence including DNA evidence there was against OJ? Now do you realize that there is no evidence whatsoever that this dude even knew this crime was going to happen?
 
Nothing to defend...

Right. He just writes music about killing priests, suicide, and Satanism. He says he agrees with Al-Qaeda and oh then there is the bit where he states he fantasizes about killing babies during sex in a recorded interview. I guess he's joking, but umm, yeah he's trying too hard here.

At the very least he's been unprofessional in managing an all ages music event. The STFW event was clearly mismanaged as an all ages event given the violent content and also as documented by the photographed interactions with underage attendees and performers at the event consuming alcohol. Did he obtain a liquor license? And yet it is clear from the videos and photographs that alcohol is being consumed in the venue by both performers and attendees including minors. Not legal.
 
These "followers" that called themselves "unholy disciples" were the victims.



Im sure LE is or has looked into that? Also likely the fact that 2 of the 5 players were boyfriend and girlfriend while the other 3 players very close with the girlfriend.




If you start putting legal responsibility on people who have done nothing illegal but have just said or acted in ways that suggest something illegal the prisons will be filled with people from the entertainment world. If somebody is stupid enough to kill somebody with the motive of "sicktanick and his music" than there is a serious problem with that person, and that doesnt happen so why I'm entertaining it is beyond me.



Of course theres no evidence to arrest him, he had nothing to do with it. And now comparing this guy to OJ Simpson? wow, just wow. This guy for all you know in his personal life may have never hurt anybody and maybe has even helped people. Now becuase a guy he knew killed his girlfriend, her friend and her family, he's now getting labeled OJ Simpson. Good job coming up with that.



You really think all of that is to be taken literal? Unreal.



Of course its possible anything is, like turtles flying. What makes you think this is a manson like cult that is going around killing people? Because of this crime that Sam McCroskey committed on devoted members of your made up cult?



Getting some attention and spotlight to parents about the subject matter of the music is fine and one thing, labeling another innocent human being a murderer is quite another. That is a very heavy thing to drop on another persons shoulders, something that could have a lot of negative effect on their life.



How can you compare OJ Simpson to this guy? That is the most ridiculous and silly thing I have ever heard. Do you realize OJ Simpson was charged and put on trial for murder? Do you realize all of the evidence including DNA evidence there was against OJ? Now do you realize that there is no evidence whatsoever that this dude even knew this crime was going to happen?
In ziggy's defense to your last statements, we really don't know if there's evidence against anyone in this case for that matter. So how do we know what evidence they do or don't have? We don't! There's also no evidence that even Sam knew that this would happen if you talk to people who knew him. Once again this is all speculation. In the end speculation can lead to facts, plain and simple.
 
The so called expert is a writer for Fangoria Magazine. They run ads for horrorcore acts and promote the music in addition to the horror movies themselves.

That first video I posted in my last video post was also Fangoria Magazine piece.
 
One thing that I've found interesting, and have wondered why it hasn't been brought up, is that in all this talk about Satanism, music influences and comparisons to Charles Manson there hasn't been, IIRC, any mention of the Beatles…

http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/manson/mansonbeatles.html

or the Bible.

http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/manson/mansonrevelation.html

Or Led Zeppelin.

They all make an appearance in my unposted Crowley & Music posting. Maybe I'll post it yet.
 
Welcome all new members! Thanks for joining the discussion.
 
I expect they don't want to taint the jury pool. They want this to be tried locally not shipped off to some other town so McCroskey can get a fair trial. The more details that come out to the public, the easier it will be for the defense to argue that he can't get a fair trial in Farmville.

I agree, but there is no way in hell they'll have it here. I just don't see any way he can't get a "fair" trial in this town. If I was his attorney, the first thing I asked for would be a change of venue.
 
That first video I posted in my last video post was also Fangoria Magazine piece.

Actually I was just looking at the tape itself and it says paramount but when I look it up on the net people label it as fangoria and in the movie itself I believe someone states something about Fangoria So I don't know? Let me go and see if I can find some actual information of the movie on the net.
I know this is totally off topic, but I just realized we had all these little emonics this one is adorable.:baby::baby:
Please ignore me.

well here's the definition of fangoria if that helps, for anyone who wants to know.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangoria
 
Actually I was just looking at the tape itself and it says paramount but when I look it up on the net people label it as fangoria and in the movie itself I believe someone states something about Fangoria So I don't know? Let me go and see if I can find some actual information of the movie on the net.
I know this is totally off topic, but I just realized we had all these little emonics this one is adorable.:baby::baby:
Please ignore me.

well here's the definition of fangoria if that helps, for anyone who wants to know.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fangoria

Back when I used to have hair, I used to read Fangoria while waiting to get my hair done. And also Eightball and Hate.

Here's a little story about the place I used to go and the owner who was brutally murdered in her shop: http://www.sfweekly.com/1997-06-18/news/murder-at-the-pink-tarantula/1

tarantula2.jpg
 
Hey, thanks. I will definitely check it out. This has been interesting.
--tap :cool:
 
Hey, thanks. I will definitely check it out. This has been interesting.
--tap :cool:

Carmel isn't really relevant to this topic except that she's another person that was into the occult/horror thing and got herself killed. She was into punk though not hip hop or horrorcore and I never heard any other kind of music in the shop that I remember.

I used to go in about once a month in the mid-nineties when I was up in the city for meetings. She was always cool with me despite the fact that I was one of her "straight" customers. We used to talk about my work in virtual reality a bit and she'd tell me about horror movies and related things, good new music, and some of crazy parties she went to.

I found out she was dead when I showed up at her place about two weeks after the murder to get a hair cut.
 
3. Yes. But also consider this unrelated publication: http://serialkillercalendar.com/

Charming. :sick:

Before someone jumps in and says that folks that read the WebSleuths, InSession and Court TV Crime Library are no different than buyers of these calendars and matching gadgets - not true! There's a huge difference between people that LIKE the stuff and buy it for entertainment versus people interested in it on an intellectual and caring level.
 
On the blog by the guy that unwittingly was involved in the satanic rituals at the filming of one of the videos http://sammccrosky.blogspot.com/2009/09/sam-mccrosky-aka-syko-sam-aka-lil-demon.html, a parent has written in on the comments section about her child being involved with SKR. Please see near the bottom of the comments; her's is dated Sept 27, 10:39pm. Very, very sad to see the human toll this is taking.

On one of Sick's MySpace pages http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=99021159 he notes that he is "out of town." Last sign-in date was Wednesday. Convenient.
 
These "followers" that called themselves "unholy disciples" were the victims.

As are others that still hangers on...

Im sure LE is or has looked into that? Also likely the fact that 2 of the 5 players were boyfriend and girlfriend while the other 3 players very close with the girlfriend.
Thank you Captain Obvious. I'm thinking outside that box.
If you start putting legal responsibility on people who have done nothing illegal but have just said or acted in ways that suggest something illegal the prisons will be filled with people from the entertainment world. If somebody is stupid enough to kill somebody with the motive of "sicktanick and his music" than there is a serious problem with that person, and that doesnt happen so why I'm entertaining it is beyond me.
I would prefer if you would refer back to other posts that all state it is not just the music but the totality of the circumstances which I feel is part of that subculture and they way they operate is part of our changing times. (times do change, and laws do change based upon our technological advances). Just for the record, who did Charles Manson kill again? Did he just "act in ways that suggest something illegal? I'm not saying, and I hope you really get it this time, that Shrimmdiddledog is the same as Charles Manson, but it's the CONCEPT - an ideology is at the heart of the matter where vulnerable and easily influenced young people may be unduly influenced by the entire culture including but not solely, Shrimm. What about inciting violence? Perhaps a civil wrongful death suit? Personally I think it’s negligent to act as they did with these younger adults and teenagers. To me, they did not act as a normal reasonable adult should with Emma in their midst.
Of course theres no evidence to arrest him, he had nothing to do with it. And now comparing this guy to OJ Simpson? wow, just wow. This guy for all you know in his personal life may have never hurt anybody and maybe has even helped people. Now becuase a guy he knew killed his girlfriend, her friend and her family, he's now getting labeled OJ Simpson. Good job coming up with that.

Oh for Pete's sake. (my Mother used to say that and I still don’t know why she thought it was OK to call Peter, Pete, but I digress.) I didn’t come up with that, you did. You missed the point sharpie. I was not comparing a person to a person. Somebody help me out here. The point was more about the fact that just because "the law" or "the system" confirms or DOES NOT confirm something doesn't necessarily mean it is the actual truth. Are you with me yet? Just because the jury said OJ was "not guilty" doesn't mean he's innocent and likewise just because the law cannot prove someone is partially culpable doesn't mean that they are not. It was a comment on your thought process that just because he won't be arrested for culpability in this mess – ever - means he's totally innocent. Did I not mention that we aren't in court, nor will we be?
You really think all of that is to be taken literal? Unreal.

Why don't you give us an education on how we are to take something like that. Perhaps you have some inside knowledge. Are we supposed to just brush it off as nothing, like Emmas' parents did? I find it extremely immature to make light of something so vile. If you can show me how reveling in vulgarity is not a downward spiral into imorality and an unhealthy psychiatric life, great, enlighten me. It's very easy for you to read things into my posts that aren’t there, but you won't read anything into that? Interesting.
Of course it’s possible anything is, like turtles flying. What makes you think this is a manson like cult that is going around killing people? Because of this crime that Sam McCroskey committed on devoted members of your made up cult?

OK, good so you admitted it’s possible. There’s a step toward…oops, now you lost me because the turtles thing should have been “monkeys flying out of my butt”– AND - you framed it inappropriately. It’s not a “manson-like cult going around killing people” its more of a figure who uses the lost and unfortunate vulnerable youth in our society to feel all-powerful with his/their message of supposed wisdom, power and enlightenment. In turn, that influences the people who look to their occult wisdom to go astray and take lives. It’s not my made up cult. If the Mormons can be considered a cult, then this group can come reasonably close and let’s not forget we haven’t scratched the surface because it’s “underground”, pun intended.
Getting some attention and spotlight to parents about the subject matter of the music is fine and one thing, labeling another innocent human being a murderer is quite another. That is a very heavy thing to drop on another persons shoulders, something that could have a lot of negative effect on their life.

First, I do not believe I’ve labeled anyone except OJ as a murderer. Second, I almost – ALMOST – laughed at the thought of me having a negative effect on Shrimm’s life and whether or not that would balance out all the negative impact he’s had on Emma and her parents lives. Anyone see the irony in that? Buehler? He’s a big bad satanist and he has majikal power and I can’t hurt him so why are you worried for him? Just wondering.
How can you compare OJ Simpson to this guy? That is the most ridiculous and silly thing I have ever heard. Do you realize OJ Simpson was charged and put on trial for murder? Do you realize all of the evidence including DNA evidence there was against OJ? Now do you realize that there is no evidence whatsoever that this dude even knew this crime was going to happen?

Dude. Dude. Once again, wrong understanding ey, on the oncept kay. Silly is right unless you get the actual, intended point which was not a person-to-person OJ comparison.
 
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