VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #4

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Although the prosecution probably has all they need, I'm thinking they will want to introduce Sam's music and his alter ego to go to state of mind or something. I analogize it to finding borderline child *advertiser censored* (as introduced in the Michael Jackson case) in mass quantity in the home of an alleged child sex offender. It could come in.

There is no insanity defense that will hold up, so I don't see how making Sam look like a lust-for-murder satanist can hurt - the jury will despise him. And they won't find it so hard to believe he would use a hammer and maul and do the hideous deed.

I holding out on the belief that Sam did something extra there with the bodies for all those days. When I think of Sharpie, I think of writing on people; on skin, or on walls. Have you never sharpied someone who passed out? Ok, you are a nicer person than I am. Why collect only sharpies? There was writing in the spiral notebook - they collected sketch books or something from a chest in Emma's room...I won't be shocked if Sam wrote weird stuff on the walls or on the bodies.

SW #1 lists 3 paper towels with writing. IMO, the easiest thing to use to write on a paper towel would be a Sharpie. It's pretty easy to write on almost anything with a Sharpie.

I notice in SW #7 that "Airport address" is listed, which makes me think that Sam was trying to figure out a route to the airport. If he planned on taking a cab then he wouldn't need the address; he'd just tell the cabbie to take him to Richmond Airport.
 
Welcome to Websleuths, Wes, and to this conversation. It is a most interesting one!
 
True. Sharpie would be the pen of choice for a paper towel. Why would you write on a paper towel? I need to think about that.

Airport directions: I noticed that too and thought maybe they were left over from when they went to pick Sam up, then again, who needs directions if you live there? I know how to get to SFO and OAK without them and this is a large area. So with all his rides to the airport dead, Sam needed to figure out how to get there. Still don't know how Poorhouse road figured in. Frustrating.

Sam also had the page from a phone book on him. That was curious.
 
Ack. Like they couldn't put what page.
 
Ack. Like they couldn't put what page.

Sorry tapu!

SW #7:

#97, drawing, airport address (page 10)

Also interesting to note there was a handwritten letter found in Emma's room:

#46, page 7, handwritten letter found on the dresser

ETA: oops. I see you're referring to the phone book page. I'll leave this up anyway for ease of reference.
 
SW #1 lists 3 paper towels with writing. IMO, the easiest thing to use to write on a paper towel would be a Sharpie. It's pretty easy to write on almost anything with a Sharpie.

I notice in SW #7 that "Airport address" is listed, which makes me think that Sam was trying to figure out a route to the airport. If he planned on taking a cab then he wouldn't need the address; he'd just tell the cabbie to take him to Richmond Airport.

Maybe he wrote notes to caption the pics he sent out to his SKR buddies.

But why use papertowels, surely there was writing paper somewhere in that house.

Another example of nothing making sense in this case.
 
Sorry tapu!

SW #7:

#97, drawing, airport address (page 10)

Also interesting to note there was a handwritten letter found in Emma's room:

#46, page 7, handwritten letter found on the dresser

ETA: oops. I see you're referring to the phone book page. I'll leave this up anyway for ease of reference.


After the trial we can get access to all these juicy letters one way or another or they will come out during trial, these letters will let us know what was going on in that house the days leading up to the murders.
 
Does anyone else think it's odd that a 20-year old was carrying around a High School ID card? (And a photocopy of it.) I think that's very strange. Sam had a CA ID card so he didn't need the high school one. I wonder if he ever tried to pass himself off as younger than he was. With his baby face he could pull it off easily.

(SW #1, items 13 & 14)
 
Maybe he wrote notes to caption the pics he sent out to his SKR buddies.

But why use papertowels, surely there was writing paper somewhere in that house.

Another example of nothing making sense in this case.

And those 3 paper towels are from SW #1 which contains what was found with Sam, so he carrying them when he was picked up. Very very strange. I've used napkins to write on when nothing else was handy, but paper towels is a stretch.
 
Does anyone else think it's odd that a 20-year old was carrying around a High School ID card? (And a photocopy of it.) I think that's very strange. Sam had a CA ID card so he didn't need the high school one. I wonder if he ever tried to pass himself off as younger than he was. With his baby face he could pull it off easily.

(SW #1, items 13 & 14)

I bet he and Emma worked out the High School ID thing, he still had it from when he was in school and Emma said bring it because she didnt tell mom and dad he was 20. Maybe?
 
And those 3 paper towels are from SW #1 which contains what was found with Sam, so he carrying them when he was picked up. Very very strange. I've used napkins to write on when nothing else was handy, but paper towels is a stretch.

Oh if he was carrying them I would guess they were maps/directions, probably grabbed whatever was handy when he was writing down directions to wherever.
 
Wes: I think the criticism is that Rimer groups into the "occult" teachings which don't fit along the lines of satanism or dark magick, such as his yin/yang symbol gouped in with 666.

Fundamentalist Christians, while I love em, are very narrow in their thinking. I would say I'm a Christian but Chritians would say I am not!!! I mentioned to my FC sister that I really liked Joel Osteen even though I've been sickened by televangelists in the past, period. His messages seem very enlightened and, I guess, generic, like they could come from Tony Robbins or The Secret (I didn't mention those two things to her though) and her response was that he wasn't Christian enough, he was bordering on "new agey stuff"! FC are even critical of this guy. Amazing.

So that's why the FC angle is frustrating. While trying to do a good thing, they are just a bit overboard on what they want to lump into the "occult" and perhaps ignorant of bigger fish they should be trying to fry.

People go overboard in this same way on the occult side too. If you ever spend an evening with someone that is deep into Wicca for example, well, it can get to be a bit cliche that is all I am saying I guess.

And people also go to far with Buddhism, science, ice cream, and well just about anything that it is possible to go overboard with. I mentioned studying in the Gelug tradition of Tibetan Buddhism...well this is sort of like the fundamentalists Christians of Tibetan Buddhism. They are purists focused in large part on ensuring that the teachings do not get diluted or altered in any way. For example, they don't encourage reading texts outside of the Gelug tradition at all something which I personally had some heartburn with.
 
I bet he and Emma worked out the High School ID thing, he still had it from when he was in school and Emma said bring it because she didnt tell mom and dad he was 20. Maybe?

I've wondered all along if Emma's parents knew how old Sam was. He could easily be mistaken for a high school kid. It would have been an easy ruse for Emma and Sam to pull off.
 
Oh if he was carrying them I would guess they were maps/directions, probably grabbed whatever was handy when he was writing down directions to wherever.

Yeah, and paper towels are bigger than napkins so there's more space to draw a map. (But why not print out the mapquest directions?)
 
Ha ha, yes, gxm, I meant, Damn, like they couldn't have said, "phone book page, Pa-Ph." They're just torturing us.... :mad:
 
Thinking about papertowels with writing... Sharpies....

Would Sam have wanted to write signs for something? Something larger that could be seen in a window or in a photo?
 
I am pretty sure he's just going to give the presentation (or one very similar to it) that I linked earlier in this thread. Still it would be interesting to have someone on the ground there. Or maybe we can arrange to phone in some questions for him? lol probably not.
I plan to attend with my daughter...questions anyone?
 
I have a family member that in some ways reminds me of Sam. I am going to be careful of what I say.

He is and was always very intelligent, in turn was ridiculed for his "so called" stupid talk. He has very few real life friends, but lots on line. He also will spend most of his time alone on his computer. He is not into horror core, but spends a lot of time studying old cold case murders and playing online games.

He also very seldom takes a shower, changes clothes, shaves or gets a hair cut.

He is comfortable online but not with real people, he also has a hard time driving a car.

He also met someone online out of state and flew to visit. He was excited and planned. He then got a haircut, new clothes, showered and shaved.

He had very low RL social skills and if he would have been ridiculed, it would have hurt him deeply.

I think Sam had showered and was looking forward to possibly starting a new life. Probably why he spent so much at the concert.

His RL social skills were lacking big time, spending to much time alone on his PC. The girls sound as thou they were very outgoing social young ladies having fun.
 
There's been interesting discussion regarding the murder weapon. I'd like to address some of your theories with some of my own questions:

Most of the speculation against using the maul is our questioning Sam's degree of fitness. However, based on his appearance (which is what we're all judging him on), I see no reason to think that he is below average fitness. So the question is: could an average male swing a maul enough times to kill three people?

I think yes. Based on my knowledge of mauls, they tend to be about 8 pounds. Furthermore, my boyscout troop used mauls to split wood (although you had to do it under adult supervision). If a 12-14 year old boy can wield a maul with sufficient precision to split wood, an average adult male probably could also.

Sam's weight also makes me believe he is probably stronger than a below-average fitness male.

Another question I have regarding the ball peen hammer vs. maul preference is as from a death blow standpoint. A maul would probably only need one swing to be a death blow to a teenage girl. So, in reality, the murders could have theoretically be completed with 2 swings, then a swing when the mother entered.

A ball peen hammer also deliver a death blow, but I think it's less certain than a maul. A failed first strike would certainly awake the other person (people) in the room and cause the problem where the other people murdered would have defense wounds.

Also, the hammer is a more closed quarters weapon than the maul. The hammer is probably around a foot long, which would mean Sam would have to get close enough to the victims where, again, presumably a struggle would occur.

My speculation is against the maul as the first round weapon is based on anyone's ability to swing one in rapid fire sequence. My speculation regarding Sam's fitness is based on my suspicion based on watching him move in the airport video, and the one of him walking into the courthouse. He has droopy shoulders, pronated feet, knock knees, and a shuffling walk that causes his mid-section from his thighs through his torso to rotate excessively as he moves. I doubt that an experienced maul wielder who is fit could repeatedly swing, recover and swing again. I think Sam would be even less able.

I've got a maul right outside stuck in a locust log. I've been swinging it a fair amount lately. My first use of one was about 31 years ago. I've also spent 20 plus years using hammers, axes, mattocks. pick axes, carving mallets, etc. on every thing from rock to sheet metal to nails to wood to leather as those jobs demand. A quick mental rundown gives me 25-30 tools like that in my basement right now. If I were to choose one for running around a house to kill more than one person quickly, I would probably choose my mid-sized wooden carving mallet based on its ease of swing. It's weight is sufficient to do the job, but it's not too difficult to swing in a different direction quickly and the angle of the head means the wrist is not too far off of its natural 19+-degree angle with the forearm, which allows for a harder blow to be delivered. If I had a maul and wanted to kill one person, I may well choose the maul, but in close quarters combat or with more than one intended victims, it's among the last I would reach for and I've made my living for years by matching the right hand tools to jobs I need to accomplish efficiently and effectively.

Enough of this for now, I'm going to go out and get some sun... wait, where did the sun go, it isn't even 6 yet?
 
People go overboard in this same way on the occult side too. If you ever spend an evening with someone that is deep into Wicca for example, well, it can get to be a bit cliche that is all I am saying I guess.

And people also go to far with Buddhism, science, ice cream, and well just about anything that it is possible to go overboard with. I mentioned studying in the Gelug tradition of Tibetan Buddhism...well this is sort of like the fundamentalists Christians of Tibetan Buddhism. They are purists focused in large part on ensuring that the teachings do not get diluted or altered in any way. For example, they don't encourage reading texts outside of the Gelug tradition at all something which I personally had some heartburn with.

Thats how the Theravadian Buddhist Monks are also, they do not read anything but the original Tripitaka in Pali. They are also considered to be the fundamentalist wing of Buddhism, very morally strict.
 

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