VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #16 *ARREST*

[perfectingpink]

Perfect sense. When I was college age we always rolled with a wingman and on the weekends it was in groups of 3's.

1 of us to hit on the hottie, the second for her slightly less attractive bff and the third for what we termed the nottie. As in not attractive and trying to talk her other two friends out of a night of debauchery.

I believe thats where the term 'taking one for team" came from ...at least in that regard :yeahthat:

I thought this kind of db behavior was made up in Hollywood; I had no idea boys like this really existed. I thank God my two boys are respectful men.

 

[MJPeony]

Just wanted to squash it before ppl started speculating that.

Yep.

Ok, so I'm risking my post being deleted. Fine. I'm not allowed to tell others how to post, so I will just share with others how I am going to post: I'm not going to start speculating on specific mental illnesses or special needs JM may or may not have- or attach attributes to certain diagnoses- b/c I don't want to perpetuate mental illness and special needs stigmas in our society. I know that for some of us this issue is near and dear to our heart and it breaks mine to think certain conditions are mis-aligned with dangerous behaviors. Especially in such a serious case as HG's is :seeya:

 

[Kas80]

Some info on GHB

"The drug can take anything from 10 minutes to an hour to take effect, so wait until the first hit kicks in before taking any more. Its strength varies wildly, so always take a small amount first. Because of it's disabling effects, you are exposed to the threat of sexual assault, so be very, very wary of who you're with.

Increasingly, there have been reports of the drug being used as a 'date rape' drug (like Rohypnol), with victims being slipped the drug via alcohol, or in coffee, tea or hot chocolate (it is almost tasteless).

A Home Office report in June 2000 questioned 123 victims of such drug assisted assaults, and found that 70% of the rapists were known to the victim and 12% were given the drug in their home, 10% on a university campus. One in five victims could not remember the assault while around 70% felt physically unable to resist (source: Guardian 22.06.00).



Health risks: unknown at present, although there have been reports of people suffering convulsions and collapsing and a recent fatality in the UK (Oct 97). urban75 has received several reports of users being hospitalised with stomach and breathing problems, although there is almost always other drugs involved.

The drug, which is derived from an American anaesthetic, lowers blood pressure and in some cases people find breathing difficult. Overdosing can lead to a loss of consciousness and coma. It is not recommended that asthmatics or those with any form of respiratory or low blood pressure disorders take this drug. "

More info at link http://www.urban75.com/Drugs/gbh.html

Thanks! So it definitely could have reacted badly with her respiratory illness if that's what he slipped in her drink.

 

[RSC]

Except for the time he got kicked out college for raping someone...

I really think you guys are barking up the wrong tree with the mental illness angle. He used to be a top athlete (cville athlete of the year and then college scholarship). He probably got used to being very popular and well liked without doing much effort wise on his own part. He likely did all the same types of things (overly friendly and touchy) but everyone found it cute and girls ate it up because of his status. He is a guy having a hard time coming to grips with the fact that he is older, no longer in the limelight and doing those behaviors is now creepy.

My new theory is that Hannah was drugged and whatever it was interacted with the drugs she was taking plus alcohol and that killed her. I would be shocked if he is a serial anything.

 

[JudyBolton]

erm ok well he might not have been dressed and styled in your version of chic but in my opinion his behavior was a bit thuggish especially the wrestling. JMO

Yes - I agree - thuggish behavior such as intentionally bumping into people, picking girls up and throwing them over his shoulder (they are strangers - not friends) - and rough-housing with a man he just met moments ago and injuring him pretty badly.

 

[Jmm124567]

Mixing drugs and alcohol typically leads to a synergistic effect which intensifies the experience. Of course, there are other potential drugs. Just because he may have taken molly, doesn't mean he would have chosen the same for her.

 

[zapped]

I've wondered if he has undiagnosed Aspergers Syndrome. It would fit. He doesn't have physical boundaries, awkward in social situations, anger/violent outbursts.

ETA: Or, he's a clever psychopath/sociopath.

Its possible.

Our son was diagnosed with Aspbergers and quite frankly it shocked me. I love him to death and always will but his I.Q scores have always been around 95-100.

When I expressed my doubt to the doctor and told him the reason, he explained that its a misconception that those with Asperbergers are at the upper end of the intelligence scale.

People often are diagnosed with it even though their intelligence is below what is generally accepted as average.

 

[Ursus]

One thing I don't think anyone has mentioned is the fact that he got off work at 3 PM, yet managed to stay out well past 1AM. Seems like he had a full day after work, a great day even. His team Then his great day came to a halt when his energy/excitement was causing him to act in a socially awkward way, causing him to be ditched by a group of 9+ people--twice.

I think bringing her to Tempo was his way of redemption. Having said that, I would have expected him to brag about her to someone.

 

[mpnola]

I would like to add something about the alcohol/ going out thing. I feel that lots of times in these cases, people question things that seem completely usual for that scene, to me. I am from New Orleans, so I was out in bars from the time I was 15 (yes, regularly sitting belly up to a bar drinking shots at 15) until I was 35 and got pregnant. It is not unusual for sweaty guys to be picking up on anything that moves and even putting their arm around them. As you get older, you realize what it is. As a lost young girl, I probably would have trusted him to keep me safe! After all, she was alone and scared and he probably promised her safety and a ride! I would have waited for him to go in and go to the bathroom/ get a drink, too. I don't think she was "held hostage" at that point. I have gotten rides home with lots of people I didn't know. Luckily, I was safe through them all! MOST people you encounter have good intentions for you, so you do not always have "creepy killer" at the front of your mind (although all of us WebSleuthers do!!! We know too much! ) It is not odd for a girl to not warn another girl that a guy hit on them and felt inappropriate. It happens all night long. For real.

Also, it is not uncommon for people to be out by themselves. It happens aaaaallllll the time, especially with males! It is the equivalent of going to the bathroom in pairs. They are ok going out and socializing without a friend traveling with them.

Also, I do not find his bar choice odd. He drank a couple of shots and a couple of beers. The last tab was $14 for 2 drinks. Yeah, he could handle that, especially since it was checked out on a credit card. After all, no college students can afford to go out and they do it all the time, so it is not far fetched that a person with a job gets some drinks at a finer establishment, especially when it is on the list of bars that people hit through the night. Seems totally logical and likely to me.

Lastly, I find it unlikely she died from an overdose of anything. She walked for a loooong time without drinking. The alcohol was steadily wearing off, so she would have been worse off hours before. I do not think it is that solitary, what happened to her. I do not think she was responsible for her demise.

Come on, girl! Show us the way to you!!!

 

[bessie]

MOD NOTE: Please DO NOT speculate about mental illness. To date, we've seen no reports that reveal JLM has been diagnosed with mental illness.

 

[TravelingBug]

Ok, just found this. From Coy Barefoot's f/b page. He just posted this a little while ago- in reference to a question about whether JM changed shirts:


Coy: "in the surveillance videos, colors appear almost to be black and white. so that is the same checked shirt, it just appears to be white."

https://www.facebook.com/coybarefoot

Interesting.

I still wonder how that fits with what WG saw then?

Based on what Coy is saying and the photos, it sure didn't look solid in person in those?

I can see the lighting and the way some surveillance videos look (plus quality) impacting the description, but it sure seems odd that a person who was watching him also missed that.

But maybe that's me?

 

[RSC]

Perfect sense. When I was college age we always rolled with a wingman and on the weekends it was in groups of 3's.

1 of us to hit on the hottie, the second for her slightly less attractive bff and the third for what we termed the nottie. As in not attractive and trying to talk her other two friends out of a night of debauchery.

I believe thats where the term 'taking one for team" came from ...at least in that regard :yeahthat:

 

[Inspector Gidget]

He has a MySpace profile? I bet I still have one out there too.

It's a joke we use to make about UVA and Dave Matthews Band (because they're from c-ville). All these kids smoking weed and listening to Jam bands (we, Richmond, are the, for lack of a better word, the outcasts. Art students/etc). UVA is very prestigious.

Well I like Dave Matthews.One of my favorite bands.What does that say about me lol

 

[formfeed]

But... WG said she was in distress before she even met up with JM... So...who really knows.

Agreed. One could argue that Hannah's behavior (and perceived condition) leading up to Tempo might have been consistent with consumption of something other than alcohol well before arriving on the Downtown Mall. Plus, with the huge music festival just outside of Charlottesville the week before Hannah disappeared, I'd suspect that there were plenty of recreational substances still floating around town. JMO of course.

 

[PresleySyndrome]

Well I like Dave Matthews.One of my favorite bands.What does that say about me lol

So does my, now, husband! I have no issues with them [emoji57]

 

[zapped]

I thought this kind of db behavior was made up in Hollywood; I had no idea boys like this really existed. I thank God my two boys are respectful men.

I was too around my mom.

Not saying anything bad about your boys, just pointing out a fact.

And some of us do grow up and regret the decisions we made as youths.

 

[HFfan1]

I really think you guys are barking up the wrong tree with the mental illness angle. He used to be a top athlete (cville athlete of the year and then college scholarship). He probably got used to being very popular and well liked without doing much effort wise on his own part. He likely did all the same types of things (overly friendly and touchy) but everyone found it cute and girls ate it up because of his status. He is a guy having a hard time coming to grips with the fact that he is older, no longer in the limelight and doing those behaviors is now creepy.

My new theory is that Hannah was drugged and whatever it was interacted with the drugs she was taking plus alcohol and that killed her. I would be shocked if he is a serial anything.

I have intimate knowledge of someone who is/was an athlete and artist and extremely intelligent who suffers from BiPolar. Mental Illness doesn't equal unable to be successful at sports or anything else.

 

[TravelingBug]

Wow. This is interesting. Could this suggest remorse? A first time offender?

Well it's definitely at the top of the list of what LE says to look for in almost every case - in terms of a possible suspect - some sort of noticeable behaviour change in the wake of an event.

So it'd actually be one of the hallmark red flags, at least to LE.

I wonder if he might have been concerned people in the hospital were more apt to have heard of the case and might tie him with the video?

So maybe withdrawing could be hoping they'd forget about him almost and not even consider it as a possibility? :waitasec:

Among neighbors or something, I could see wanting to seem 'normal' and like he had not a care in the world and all was well, to seem like nothing was up at all?

 

[HFfan1]

Just read Mod Note. Sorry. I was not diagnosing him but I do have very personal experience with Bipolar and am semi-offended that someone would say a top athlete wouldn't be afflicted with such things.

 

[Kas80]

Except for the time he got kicked out college for raping someone...

Sorry I should have clarified. I meant serial killer. Many football players rape girls because they assume they can never be turned down. The mentality seems to be quite prevalent. He could very well be a serial rapist, I would believe that. It's the whole cold blooded sociopath (who may be tied to other murders) thing that I am having a hard time grasping. Especially when people are calling his bar night behaviors as proof. I think if he killed Hannah it was a one time thing. Not my saying he is innocent. Of this or other sexual attacks.