VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #7

[ksj3]

Maybe they were working together? If so, I think I may know who it is, although I can't be positive of course.

Things to think about if you think you have a TIP.

1. Do NOT second guess yourself.
2. JUST call it in. TRUST me, you are NOT wasting their time.
3. It MAY be something and it may be NOTHING. Doesn't matter.
4. You MAY or may NOT receive a call back.
5. Do it for Hannah.

DEDICATED TIP LINE 434-295-3851

Your call can be anonymous- We do NOT need a name- Just information
434.977.4000 or Crimestoppers@albemarle.org
http://www.albemarle.org/department.asp?department=police&relpage=2721

 

[snarkymalarkey]

I wish we knew what Hannah said to the bouncer at McGrady's. I wish we knew what the assault victims had to say about their attackers (if they've said anything about how it happened or a description). I wonder how, if she had consumed so much alcohol, she hadn't had to use the bathroom. I can't imagine running while needing to go! I think beer is the worst culprit for that, but maybe it was other alcohol.

I can't help but speculate that used the bathroom at the bar she went into. There is also the joke about "breaking the seal." Meaning, one doesn't seem to have to go to the bathroom at all, but once they do, the seal is broken, and now they have to pee constantly.

There is also the remote chance she did something extremely uncharacteristic to most people in a sober state. ...And that is, that she went off somewhere to go to the bathroom and something happened accidentally.

I have seen drunk girls do some pretty dangerous and abhorrent things, including pulling their pants down and peeing in the middle of the road, because they were so drunk.

In the event she left the bar on her own accord, she could have done have something so uncharacteristic that nobody will ever know. She could have climbed into something dangerous to vomit or to sleep.

 

[khare87]

I agree with you absolutely, at least at this point in the investigation while we are still searching. However, the thing about these cases are that right now, she's missing. And we hope and pray she's found alive and if not, then found at all. But I'm sure her parents, friends, family, and others are aware that she might not be coming home, and if she does, maybe not the way they would want. And so they have to think about the fact that if she is gone, then her reputation is what is left. I could imagine that if HG doesn't come home, that it would be painful for those who knew her to know that the public's image or idea of her is different from the amazing girl they know and love. I'm sure they'd want everyone to think of all the good things, her studiousness, her compassion and empathy, her helping others, her athletic ability, her love for friends and family. So I guess I'm just saying that yeah, right now, it doesn't matter. But it might matter to those who love her in the future.

 

[cvillemegan]

I've been trying to keep up with these threads, but they're moving way too fast for me! So I apologize if anything I say or ask is redundant.

I'm local and participated in the searches yesterday. I don't think about how densely wooded even parts of UVA can be until I participate in these searches. Our area was right on the edge of the UVA campus, and between dense ground cover and thick foliage, slopes that were impossible to walk and water, I feel we could easily have missed clues.

We were told to look for Hannah's sequined shirt (which I have heard different descriptions of even from law enforcement, some say it was silver with black mesh cutouts and others say black), black pants, white shoes, and iPhone 5s with a pink case. No jewelry description was given, although I think almost any young woman going out at night is at least wearing earrings. My group talked about the importance of the sequined shirt and looking for sequins catching the light.

I'm very impressed with how organized the search was and LE's response to this in general.

I keep thinking about what Hannah could have been doing on the Downtown Mall. On one hand, I have a really hard time believing she was lost or walked the wrong way for that long. She seems to be moving with so much purpose in the videos, like she is meeting someone and running late. I know a lot of UVA students are unfamiliar with Cville outside of the Corner and the UVA campus, but we know her phone still had some battery at that point, and she could have pulled up a map on her phone at any time. Plus, there's a lot of signage on the mall that IDs where you are, with maps, etc.

On the other hand, if she intended to go to the mall all along, why take such a roundabout way? Why not walk straight up West Main? Was she trying to avoid running into people she knows? Was she looking for someone who she thought might be at McGrady's? Was she texting with someone who first said he/she was at McGrady's, and then when she got there, he/she said, "Oh, I left, I'm on the mall now"?

Finally, has there been any explanation as to why police initially thought they were looking for a guy with short hair who is not in the videos? I know that description came from WG. So is it thought that WG intentionally lied or was actually talking about JM but had a bad memory of his appearance?

 

[otto]

That bothers me too, unless they are just surmising she got into the car because they left the restaurant together and then there is video of him driving away from there.

Her texts are going to hold some clues as to what she was doing - I think she was looking for someone and I think she was either gonna buy drugs or meet someone to go to party with her. Is it possible she didn't WANT to go to the party and was telling her friends she was lost so she could be too late and then not bother and get out of it, in order to meet up with someone?

Someone else posted on another site, Huffington Post, just his opinion that the police were setting this guy up on purpose so the real perp screws up. They know he didn't do anything. If there was ANY evidence that she was in his car, that guy would not be walking around. JMO

From this information I've read, she was heading to a second party, made a wrong turn, got mixed up about Preston and Main, ended up at the mall, told friends that she was lost, asked someone to come and get her, then she met JM, and that's pretty much where the trail ends.

 

[Mensasleuth]

And has short hair.

 

[carbuff]

The description from WG of JG's encounter was that it was a 5'11, 250 pound male in black pants and a white shirt. A stretch from the all-white getup of JM, who is taller and heavier. Maybe they were working together? If so, I think I may know who it is, although I can't be positive of course.

You should call that in to the tip line.

 

[zapped]

Well in the eyes of the law there is no difference between taking and snorting someone else's medication.

Lol agreed...but its not their eyes Im concerned about. At the end of the day I have to look into my own eyes and the eyes of my son. I stopped taking them altogether for that very reason several years ago. Red Bull or a 5 hour energy works almost as well without the stigma attached.

I'm not downing anyone else for ever having snorted it but for me personally thats a little too close to my idea of what someone with a serious drug problem would do.

 

[teeandcee]

Confirming - I've smelled it - you immediately know what it is even if you have never smelled it before. If anything was no longer there though, or was there for a day or less, any scent detectable by humans would probably be gone.

Does it smell like a dead animal? I've heard it's distinctive but nobody ever specifies in what way. For instance, I know a dead animal vs. decaying garbage.

 

[Mensasleuth]

The cops would already know all this I'm sure.

 

[carbuff]

Does it smell like a dead animal? I've heard it's distinctive but nobody ever specifies in what way. For instance, I know a dead animal vs. decaying garbage.

I've been told in no uncertain terms that it's nothing like a dead cow or deer, both of which I've smelled numerous times.

Sarx, are you still around? Can you give us the lowdown yet again? You must be getting tired of explaining this to us naive folk...

 

[Coldngrey]

How I got there. 164 Hessian Hills is a four apartment deal. One of the apartments was rented out to a person with the initials AB. AB's son's name begins with a J and he fits the description of the "second" guy, if he exists.

Call the tip line. Please.

 

[Coldngrey]

The cops would already know all this I'm sure.

Don't assume that,that is how breaks get missed.

Call the tipline.

 

[Zuri]

This is pure speculation, but is prompted by previous posts by others.

What if: HG went to the Mall searching for a person known to her for some reason. That person was not there but JM "knew" HG was coming to see said person, was given her description. When he saw her, he spoke and said he was there to meet her instead. That may have been reassuring to her, hence the seeming familialarity and why she went into the bar with him and also got in the car. There seems to have been some incentive to do so, as most young women would/might have found that pretty creepy and said "no way".

Thinking out loud. Not victim shaming. Looking for plausible explanations. JMV

 

[Stones]

For whatever reason, I just don't get the sense that she was much of a drug user. UVA is probably the best school in Virginia. I know all kinds of kids party in college but it sounds like she was a good student with a lot of extracurricular activities. Plus, she went to a high school that is generally joked about having a lot of well to do kids who do a lot of drugs. If this was her cup of tea, she would have been attracted to it in high-school and then probably not have gotten into UVA.

Anyway, her friends certainly know what she did or didn't take intentionally. If she had a lethal mix of something in her system waiting to kick in, she probably couldn't walk for over an hour. And I don't think she had a fifth of whisky at Tempo so I doubt this was an accidental OD that he is covering up. I think they either have their guy or if he's innocent, he's working with LE right now and has convinced them that he dropped her off somewhere else. However, if he's so innocent and was just a friendly ride that night, he would not have hid from LE for 5 days. He would have been like, holy crap!, that's the girl I drove, I feel like maybe I dropped her off in a bad neighborhood and if I tell the cops ASAP, I might be able to help find her. He didn't do that and didn't come forward to say he saw her that night.

 

[Stones]

Oh also, for those not near VA...It's been pretty warm with no rain since this happened. Super morbid but if she's outside in the area, dogs or people in the search would probably notice before they see her.

 

[monkey222]

Looking at the map posted by Otto (Thx), What stands out to me is that she travelled about 9 blocks in 11 minutes from Shell to.Mall on streets, not as the crow flies, but that it takes a full 2 minutes to go from Sals to jewelry store which appear to be within shouting distance. Maybe she stopped for a break in the mall area, or when she got chatted up by JM. Am I seeing this right?

 

[absentia]

Thank you, this is helpful. It's almost like her internal compass was turned by 180 degrees. She thought she was going slightly North and West when she was going South and East.

and this makes no sense. by the time she got to the Shell station wouldn't she realize she was going the wrong way and turn around? why keep going at a run? ALL the way downtown which was further at that point than just turning around.

 

[Claudia]

I'm hoping today is the day they find HG! I am so addicted to this forum and fb lately. I haven't been this intrigued with a case since Casey Anthony. I'm from New Orleans I can't remember how I heard about HG but watching the video of wg following her is prob what really freaked me out about this whole situation. Hope everyone has a good day!!

O/T
You're from NOLA and didn't follow the Jaren Lockhart case? That one had me sucked in for months!

Sorry for the O/T. [emoji17]

 

[Carieldf]

For whatever reason, I just don't get the sense that she was much of a drug user. UVA is probably the best school in Virginia. I know all kinds of kids party in college but it sounds like she was a good student with a lot of extracurricular activities. Plus, she went to a high school that is generally joked about having a lot of well to do kids who do a lot of drugs. If this was her cup of tea, she would have been attracted to it in high-school and then probably not have gotten into UVA.

Anyway, her friends certainly know what she did or didn't take intentionally. If she had a lethal mix of something in her system waiting to kick in, she probably couldn't walk for over an hour. And I don't think she had a fifth of whisky at Tempo so I doubt this was an accidental OD that he is covering up. I think they either have their guy or if he's innocent, he's working with LE right now and has convinced them that he dropped her off somewhere else. However, if he's so innocent and was just a friendly ride that night, he would not have hid from LE for 5 days. He would have been like, holy crap!, that's the girl I drove, I feel like maybe I dropped her off in a bad neighborhood and if I tell the cops ASAP, I might be able to help find her. He didn't do that and didn't come forward to say he saw her that night.

Does anyone know what the temperature was that night? Not that it is an extreme detail, but I think from many of the videos she was walking with her hands at her sides- I think that could speak to her still being extremely intoxicated. With these fall nights and her outfit and build (thin, not a lot of body fat) you may expect a sober or sobering up person to be chilly and holding themselves with there arms or even arms crossed.

I agreeing don't think she was drugged but something but indefinitely think she was pretty impaired.