VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #8

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I could imagine that LE knows something big that convinces them JM is their guy and they just can't share that with us--but they know. Like with Randy Taylor and Samantha Clark. LE knew he was the last one with her. Then when Alexis Murphy went missing and RT is the last one with her, too--well they just know, but they need evidence to prove it. So I can imagine that maybe JM popped up in the MH case. What if he did, and LE cant reveal that but they know it? I can imagine this kind of scenario for instance.

The problem is right now Longo is not giving me reason to trust him. In fact, just the opposite, I am finding more and more reasons to doubt him.
I don't find LE's statements to be reliable. They released a description of a POI with a shaved head and goatee. They claimed HG was walking with a reflection. They said JM was "known to police", giving an impression that was worse than his record appears. (Though, maybe he is known informally by way of the MH case). They claim JM fled, but what car was he driving? For instance, LE is clearly walking a very fine ethical line, outing JM but saying "media told you his name". That's not fully honest. There seems to be some fudging with the truth going on-for what purpose I don't know--maybe for very good purpose, but I am not privy to the reasons and so I am just expected to trust LE. I can't really do that in this case.

I've been looking for red flags with JM, but keep finding red flags with LE! The expressions of emotion/anger is over the top and concerns me. Yes, of course he would be emotionally invested--but he is trained to do this job. EMT's and doctors and forensics folks see horrible things everyday, and you could say it was understandable if they were emotional too, but they are trained not to be--for good reason. IMO
 
If JM is such a model citizen, committed Christian, upstanding member of society etc etc then why is he refusing to help police find Hannah?

My point exactly!
 
I too agree however maybe they are so certain that he knows something that they are willing to take that chance.

In that case, he had better hope they find forensics...and Hannah. They have made it so there is no way he is going to help them, Imo.
Jmo
 
Is it known whether the car titled/registered to JM, or to family member/friend?
 
Why I reference a police officer as suspect in both Harrington & Graham cases:

Back during the Morgan Harrington investigation there was internal police discussion of extending the search area for Morgan outside the city limits of Charlottesville. Shortly thereafter, Morgan's "Pantera" t-shirt is discovered draped over a bush outside an apartment complex well within the city limits. Some have speculated that this was done to delay an expanded search and keep the focus within the city limits. Thus it is speculated that whoever planted Morgan's t-shirt MUST have been privy to internal police discussion. Then lo and behold, "Sketch's" DNA is found on Morgan's t-shirt. I have never believed that "Sketch" was responsible for Morgan Harrington. I believe his DNA was planted on Morgan's t-shirt.

Fast forward to Hannah Graham. We have mysterious White Guy and his odd behavior. He lies in wait and follows Hannah. He gives a false description of black guy, even though black guy had to pass right by him to catch up to Hannah! There's nothing on video to suggest WG ever stopped following Hannah.

Now here's the kicker! The RETURN OF SKETCH! Oh yes, after 5 years in hiding we have a "sighting" of "Sketch" prowling the campus of Washington & Lee University! When was this info released? 2 days after Hannah Graham went missing! When was Sketch seen? Two weeks prior. Plenty of time for Sketch to leave that area and begin prowling UVA. It is my belief that Sketch was "reintroduced" back into the mix 2 days after Hannah disappeared to once again throw police off the trail of a killer. Just as he was "introduced" in the Morgan Harrington case. I'll bet you the sighting of Sketch was made anonymously. :)

Who IS WG? What was he doing alone at the Plaza late at night acting like a stalker?
Is Jesse Matthew under Federal protection at the police station? The bizarre story of his fleeing just a ruse? Why didn't police give the public a description of the vehicle Jesse was feeing in? Why weren't there any reporters at the police station who could confirm Jesse showing up there?
Is WG the REAL subject of this investigation?
Are police, under guidance of the FBI, carefully crafting a production to catch a wily, sinister serial killer?
 
If JM is such a model citizen, committed Christian, upstanding member of society etc etc then why is he refusing to help police find Hannah?

Because he is protecting himself. You don't have to have information to want to still protect yourself.
 
I understand what she is getting at, though. If most of us were in his position (and were innocent), we would be screaming it from the rooftops to everyone who would listen. I know I personally would want to say everything that happened (if I know I didn't do it), but I also don't know what my lawyer would be telling me. For example, a lawyer could really give you a scare by telling you that the police will do everything they can to make this fit. I know I would be scared at such a thought. I know many African-Americans think this all the time about the police. Many of them have a strict code not to talk at all to them -- no matter what. You simply don't know what kind of advice he's getting from family members and friends.

In a case like this, a competent defense attorney will tell him to keep his mouth shut. They have NO idea what evidence or witnesses the police have.
 
BBM. The police know that they left together. They confirmed that in the presser and I believe they said they have video of them after the Tempo together that hasn't been released yet. (Might be wrong there but think the detective said that)

He actually said the complete opposite. He said there are no other videos after the Tuel video.
 
JM is a model friend and family member. Everyone hold him in high regards. He is a man of the bible. Serial killers also are in cases model citizens and church going and loved by the community but hold dark secrets. That is why they get away with their crimes for so long.

^^This!! I have kept my mouth shut , but keep thinking of all the "nice guys" who commit kidnappings, rapes, murders, etc ... :gaah:
 
In the press conference, they said that they know for a fact that they left together, so it's possible that there is video surveillance video from after they were at Tempo, but that it hasn't been released. What they seem to desperately want is someone that saw Hannah get into his car.

But if they have video, why do they need an eye-witness?
 
We know they got warrants for his car and apartment before even talking to him, and in the presser after that they were already talking aggressively. That to me is blowing it. They have alienated their POI more than a POI may already be alienated. And now look where we are. IMO that is where it started.


IMO, it says quite a bit that they were able to get a search warrant for his car and apartment without even talking to him. Must be enough evidence out there to get LE at least that far.
I can see how that fact would scare someone, whether they did anything to her or not. I just can't understand refusing to come in and tell the police what happened after they left Tempo together.
JM told his Grandma that they went to Tempo and parted ways right after that. Telling Grandma is not the same as telling LE.
I just don't know what the right approach would be to get him to talk...He knew he'd been with her that night and never called the tipline or came into the police station until after they had enough evidence to get the search warrants. You'd think he'd be like-"Hey, I was with this chick that night. We went to Tempo and then I dropped her off".....or whatever. That should have been done from moment #1 it became known she was missing. JMO of course.
 
One more thing... does Hannah do volunteer work? It says she wants to help people... is this the link... has she met him through somewhere before? What don't we know about Hannah ... and it doesn't even have to be bad... there are parts missing...

Or does he volunteer somewhere? Does he have a second job? Security at University? How was she comfortable with this guy putting his hands on her? I would jump unless I knew the person or knew he was coming up.

And I agree... if I knew something about a crime that could help them find a missing person, I may lawyer up but I would not flee. If he isn't guilty, that was a terribly misguided decision.
 
If it were me, I'd be willing to talk...but with a lawyer. If LE and just shown up and been like "hey, we know you may have met her that night, we just want to know what you saw" then I'd probably be willing to talk without a lawyer. But if they had searched, and taken my car, and then searched my apartment...I would not be saying a word without a lawyer. And if my lawyer said don't talk, well then...

I think the problem is.. either he did this or he was there when a buddy did this. Perhaps the lawyer told him he is just as guilty as the person who actually committed the crime and his best bet is to flip on him. jmo
 
Why I reference a police officer as suspect in both Harrington & Graham cases:

Back during the Morgan Harrington investigation there was internal police discussion of extending the search area for Morgan outside the city limits of Charlottesville. Shortly thereafter, Morgan's "Pantera" t-shirt is discovered draped over a bush outside an apartment complex well within the city limits. Some have speculated that this was done to delay an expanded search and keep the focus within the city limits. Thus it is speculated that whoever planted Morgan's t-shirt MUST have been privy to internal police discussion. Then lo and behold, "Sketch's" DNA is found on Morgan's t-shirt. I have never believed that "Sketch" was responsible for Morgan Harrington. I believe his DNA was planted on Morgan's t-shirt.

Fast forward to Hannah Graham. We have mysterious White Guy and his odd behavior. He lies in wait and follows Hannah. He gives a false description of black guy, even though black guy had to pass right by him to catch up to Hannah! There's nothing on video to suggest WG ever stopped following Hannah.

Now here's the kicker! The RETURN OF SKETCH! Oh yes, after 5 years in hiding we have a "sighting" of "Sketch" prowling the campus of Washington & Lee University! When was this info released? 2 days after Hannah Graham went missing! When was Sketch seen? Two weeks prior. Plenty of time for Sketch to leave that area and begin prowling UVA. It is my belief that Sketch was "reintroduced" back into the mix 2 days after Hannah disappeared to once again throw police off the trail of a killer. Just as he was "introduced" in the Morgan Harrington case. I'll bet you the sighting of Sketch was made anonymously. :)

Who IS WG? What was he doing alone at the Plaza late at night acting like a stalker?
Is Jesse Matthew under Federal protection at the police station? The bizarre story of his fleeing just a ruse? Why didn't police give the public a description of the vehicle Jesse was feeing in?
Is WG the REAL subject of this investigation?
Are police, under guidance of the FBI, carefully crafting a production to catch a wily, sinister serial killer?

Very interesting stuff here. I found the sighting of the sketch to be odd myself. Who out there would see a man and say 'that is the guy I saw in a sketch 9 years ago'? So completely bizarre and unlikely.
 
I'm not going to argue what you interpreted from the press conference, but I got that LE has video of Heather leaving Tempo with JM and they have not found her in a week. JM was the last to see Heather before she vanished from the earth. I think from all of that, Longo has absolute reason to believe she was in the car with him. MOO

If they want a witness to say Graham got into his car, then how can they know for a fact already that she did?
 
Because he is protecting himself. You don't have to have information to want to still protect yourself.

But if he is such a moral person surely he would want to help find Hannah and help the investigation?
 
LE should explain why the white man, who looked pretty shifty to me, has been basically cleared but the black man, of various descriptions, is the one. Jmo. Did they have evidence he left and went home right away? Did they check his pings, or what?
 
Question: Does LE need a warrant to put a tracking device on a vehicle? Just wondering if when JM reportedly went into the police station with "family" members, the car was left unoccupied. Also, if and when he gets his car back will a device or chip surreptitiously have been placed in it? JMO
 
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