VA - Nicole Lovell, 13, Blacksburg, 27 January 2016 #4 *Arrests*

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Also, on NL's instagram, I only saw one comment from "David A" that said lg. Many said that's short for little girl. Other posters have said they've seen another text from David. Can someone share this or the gist of it?

That was actually a screenshot of Nicole's Kik account of a reply from Nicole TO David A, and the first letter is a capital i, not a lowercase l. It's mostly used as I Guess or it could refer to Instagram, or a whole slew of other things, but those two are the most used.
 
I googled my own brain question (! the power of technology) and according to the University of Rochester Medical Center, the rational part of the brain is not fully developed until one is 25 years old. This explains most of the stupid stuff I've done, and more importantly, why these two thought they could get away with it.
 
Thanks for the heads up. Yes, this documentary looks very good and the story of Leopold & Loeb is very similar to Nicole's murder.

Here's a link to the PBS web site, with previews and other background info about this historic case and trial.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/films/perfectcrime/player/

I read a book about this murder last year, a recent book with a great deal of research on the case. It was as baffling to the public then as this case is now - how do young adults of great backgrounds, with great educations commit such a horrible crime just for the thrill of it?

Thanks! It does look good! RHOBH will have to wait
 
That was actually a screenshot of Nicole's Kik account of a reply from Nicole TO David A, and the first letter is a capital i, not a lowercase l. It's mostly used as I Guess or it could refer to Instagram, or a whole slew of other things, but those two are the most used.

Oh, wow that was Nicole replying TO David A. Thank you!
 
I seem to recall explanation in the media after NK's charges were upgraded that VA codes do not distinguish between an being an accessory before the fact of a murder, and a murder itself. The code itself and sentencing guidelines are the same. Minimum 20 years.

I just peeked at the inmate lookup tool, the dates given are supposed to represent the dates of the offense. For the specific charge we are talking about, NK's says 1/4. But DE's says 1/31. So, possibly, that is their way of representing for documentation purposes she's an accessory before the fact, with the 1/4 being the date she allegedly may have started planning. Just guessing though.

So, I don't think the 1/4 charge overrides anything. My understanding is NK has 3 charges currently against her (accessory after the fact, concealment of a dead body and murder/accessory after the fact), and DE has 2 (abduction and murder). It is, though, the most serious of her charges.

I'm curious though that if they believe NK and DE planned together, why doesn't the date on DE's correspond to NK's? Maybe I'm reading too much into this, as possibly in the end it doesn't matter. As this is probably only a paperwork thing. If he's found guilty and they can prove he was in on the planning, maybe that is simply taken into consideration during the sentencing phase for this charge.

And, I think the 2 in the degree column after her charges is just that this particular charge is just indicating it is a 2nd degree felony. His is a 2nd degree felony too. It just wasn't detailed as such on the paperwork.

That's my understanding. Hope I clarified, rather than muddied things up! Lookup tool again for reference:

http://67.211.128.37:8081/IML

You helped.

I keep trying to find the 1/4 date within the charging documents previously posted.

It doesn't really matter... it's just me, being persnickety. I'll get over it ;)
 
Thanks! It does look good! RHOBH will have to wait

O/t

I'm going to watch this too.....I love period pieces.......just finished binge watching Christine ricci's " Lizzie Borden chronicles".....great sound track......never boring.
 
Well, that answers quite a few questions, I think. If he met her in person, there's no question about NK being behind their online relationship, or about DE being a pedophile, IMO. Poor Nicole. My heart breaks for her all over again.

I'm not quite so quick to give up my theory that NK was the mastermind. The meeting in the park could have been part of their plan, though I'm not sure why or how.

I'm not sure of anything, actually. :)
 
My opinion, and only my opinion based on what we know, is this:
DE was looking for young girls, probably not for the first time. But being away from home for the first time, he was getting more and more brave, making connections with girls/GIRL near his actual address. NL is obtainable. She's only a few miles away, and he grooms her, calling her his girlfriend, promising her roses, giving her tons of attention in exchange for (????) pics? at first?
I don't think NL was ever threatening to expose their relationship in an obvious exposure type way, like going to the authorities or police. I believe she was delusional that he was her boyfriend, and she was talking about how she was telling her friends, showing them his pic, and couldn't wait to introduce him to friends/family. She was SO public about her affections with all these other guys, I think she was just bursting to start posting public "I'm taken" info with DE's pic or name. She likely told him, "I showed your pic to friends today! They all think you're too old for me" I think before Christmas break, he started to realize he was screwed.
The planning that must have begun 1/4/16 (according to charges) could have been chat or text. They did NOT have to be on campus for this. They could have been anywhere with their families, using tablets, laptops, phones. I believe that NK was numb, she had been holding off on self-harm, trying to learn to 'love herself' (her therapists words she's parroting now in court). I think that for some reason (this I'm unclear) DE confided in NK that he was in big trouble.
I can see either DE proposing the murder and NK agreeing/encouraging, OR NK suggesting the murder and DE finally saying, yes this is the only way.
His comments upon his arrest (I believe the truth can set me free) may be his thoughts, well, it was originally NK's idea. He knew LE were going to be able to look at their chat logs with the planning. I don't think the Cook-Out meet-up happened 1/4. I believe the seed was planted through chat/text on 1/4, and the meet-up happened later.

I think the police had DE cornered, telling him they KNEW he was outside of NLs house due to texts, SM, cell phone pings etc. The 'side hug' comment was made as a defensive statement. I'm thinking of the many times as a child/teen/young adult, when involved in something bad, somebody would always say "Well I was there but I didn't do anything." "I saw the booze but I didn't drink it". I think he was STILL obsessed with his pedophilia being exposed, even when being questioned by the cops.

I think NK was there during the murder, maybe in the car. I think she kept the blanket as a trophy, and something to look at to remind her that it was all real. I think she is likely numb, with impairments at processing feelings. I personally know about self-harm, and it's numbness, the desire to feel something you can CONTROL to distract from the internal pain you cannot control. She wanted to feel something when she looked at that blanket, something she wanted to drag out and experience again and again when she looked at it.

I think once they arrested/had appropriate search warrants for DE, that's when they found the extreme contact between DE and NK, which is why she was arrested 2 days after DE. Then, she began talking and filling in some blanks, supported to evidence such as Wal-Mart transactions, cameras, witness statements etc. Her statements likely filled in a few blanks for LE, leading them to upgrade her charges after further investigation.

JMO :) thanks for listening
 
looking back, DE could of lied and said he had no idea that NL was so young. Broke it off.........after all he could of quit KIK, changed his code name, NL didn't have her phone during Christmas vacation............why murder?
It was mentioned that there were no classes at VT Jan 4th.........did DE and NK go home for Christmas and come back early?
 
O/t

I'm going to watch this too.....I love period pieces.......just finished binge watching Christine ricci's " Lizzie Borden chronicles".....great sound track......never boring.

:ditto: She is one of my favorite actresses since the Adams Family!
 
Also, on NL's instagram, I only saw one comment from "David A" that said lg. Many said that's short for little girl. Other posters have said they've seen another text from David. Can someone share this or the gist of it?
It was a screenshot of a Kik conversation. I'm pretty sure ig was for Instagram. He was probably asking for her Instagram username.
 
My opinion, and only my opinion based on what we know, is this:
DE was looking for young girls, probably not for the first time. But being away from home for the first time, he was getting more and more brave, making connections with girls/GIRL near his actual address. NL is obtainable. She's only a few miles away, and he grooms her, calling her his girlfriend, promising her roses, giving her tons of attention in exchange for (????) pics? at first?
I don't think NL was ever threatening to expose their relationship in an obvious exposure type way, like going to the authorities or police. I believe she was delusional that he was her boyfriend, and she was talking about how she was telling her friends, showing them his pic, and couldn't wait to introduce him to friends/family. She was SO public about her affections with all these other guys, I think she was just bursting to start posting public "I'm taken" info with DE's pic or name. She likely told him, "I showed your pic to friends today! They all think you're too old for me" I think before Christmas break, he started to realize he was screwed.
The planning that must have begun 1/4/16 (according to charges) could have been chat or text. They did NOT have to be on campus for this. They could have been anywhere with their families, using tablets, laptops, phones. I believe that NK was numb, she had been holding off on self-harm, trying to learn to 'love herself' (her therapists words she's parroting now in court). I think that for some reason (this I'm unclear) DE confided in NK that he was in big trouble.
I can see either DE proposing the murder and NK agreeing/encouraging, OR NK suggesting the murder and DE finally saying, yes this is the only way.
His comments upon his arrest (I believe the truth can set me free) may be his thoughts, well, it was originally NK's idea. He knew LE were going to be able to look at their chat logs with the planning. I don't think the Cook-Out meet-up happened 1/4. I believe the seed was planted through chat/text on 1/4, and the meet-up happened later.

I think the police had DE cornered, telling him they KNEW he was outside of NLs house due to texts, SM, cell phone pings etc. The 'side hug' comment was made as a defensive statement. I'm thinking of the many times as a child/teen/young adult, when involved in something bad, somebody would always say "Well I was there but I didn't do anything." "I saw the booze but I didn't drink it". I think he was STILL obsessed with his pedophilia being exposed, even when being questioned by the cops.

I think NK was there during the murder, maybe in the car. I think she kept the blanket as a trophy, and something to look at to remind her that it was all real. I think she is likely numb, with impairments at processing feelings. I personally know about self-harm, and it's numbness, the desire to feel something you can CONTROL to distract from the internal pain you cannot control. She wanted to feel something when she looked at that blanket, something she wanted to drag out and experience again and again when she looked at it.

I think once they arrested/had appropriate search warrants for DE, that's when they found the extreme contact between DE and NK, which is why she was arrested 2 days after DE. Then, she began talking and filling in some blanks, supported to evidence such as Wal-Mart transactions, cameras, witness statements etc. Her statements likely filled in a few blanks for LE, leading them to upgrade her charges after further investigation.

JMO :) thanks for listening

Thanks for posting! I'm glad you addressed NK's self-harm issues. I admit I'm intrigued by her "story" and why the need to cut one's self. Do you think NK gave LE the location of Nicole's body? It's hard to imagine anyone willingly plotting with another to kill a young 13 y/o child.
 
I think it would be more "NO, no, no, this is not how this was supposed to go down!"
I can't picture them caring at all how it goes down. It's almost like they wanted to get caught:

Let me toy with this girl on social media, and text. Leave lots of *Footprints* there;

Then I'll go right to her house and watch her climb out the window. (Where we may, or may not be seen. Who cares.);

Commit the crime in an area where I could be seen.

Go to Walmart, where the security cameras are sure to record me buying the shovel and crime scene clean-up products.;

Toss body carelessly of to the side of the road;

Go back to dorm and immediately tell others what we just did. (NK).

Great "plan" there guys... I can't help but wonder if they knew they were going to be caught, and for whatever reason that's what they wanted, or at least didn't care. At all.
 
Somehow, I had forgotten about the other murder case at VT.

i have the weird feeling sometimes that Cho unleashed something evil that has continue to infect the environment. I know that is fanciful and I'm. Or at all superstitious, but I find it so hard to reconcile all the extreme bad things that have occurred since the shootings with the peaceful place I love so much. It seems to be a yearly thing now.

They need to sage the dorms and campus.
 
Thanks for posting! I'm glad you addressed NK's self-harm issues. I admit I'm intrigued by her "story" and why the need to cut one's self. Do you think NK gave LE the location of Nicole's body? It's hard to imagine anyone willingly plotting with another to kill a young 13 y/o child.


I never cut myself....but I have memories of sitting in the bathroom at 15ish....stabbing a sewing needle ever so lightly, but enough for some pain.........only did it like twice.....but.....it was after a quarrel with my mom/ dad.......I just needed to for some reason.....id never heard of it before.
 
Thanks for posting! I'm glad you addressed NK's self-harm issues. I admit I'm intrigued by her "story" and why the need to cut one's self. Do you think NK gave LE the location of Nicole's body? It's hard to imagine anyone willingly plotting with another to kill a young 13 y/o child.

I do think she told them. I think she's disturbed but absolutely knew right from wrong. I think she knew the next morning that they would be caught. The news hype, the arrest of DE, all had to be very stimulating for her, and I mean that in the literal meaning, I doubt she ate or slept at all during those days. Half in expectation, half in disbelief in what she did. By the time she was arrested, I am guessing she had convinced herself that talking and revealing details and location of the body was her only chance to get relief. I think her facial expressions and courtroom behavior stem from actually believing that LE would take it easy on her.


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Respectfully snipped by me:

Great "plan" there guys... I can't help but wonder if they knew they were going to be caught, and for whatever reason that's what they wanted, or at least didn't care. At all.

I would be most interested in knowing what their grades were for the semester. Maybe they decided to kill Nicole and take the attention off their grades? Just like you describe it, just eff it!
 
Yes. In the video (posted previously) the LE said she was found clothed.

Hmm. I wonder what the part I bolded in the quote below refers to...? Perhaps NK just described the clothing Nicole wore (thus proving that she was indeed involved).

• During questioning, police felt she was holding back. Keepers became emotional and told police, "I don't want to go to jail," waived her rights and began cooperating. Nicole's "Minions" blanket and the cleaning supplies Keepers and Eisenhauer had bought were found in a suitcase in Keepers' dorm room.

• Keepers also provided information on the murder weapon, Nicole's remains and Nicole's clothing.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/02/08/us/blacksburg-virginia-natalie-keepers-profile-nicole-lovell/
 
I do think she told them. I think she's disturbed but absolutely knew right from wrong. I think she knew the next morning that they would be caught. The news hype, the arrest of DE, all had to be very stimulating for her, and I mean that in the literal meaning, I doubt she ate or slept at all during those days. Half in expectation, half in disbelief in what she did. By the time she was arrested, I am guessing she had convinced herself that talking and revealing details and location of the body was her only chance to get relief. I think her facial expressions and courtroom behavior stem from actually believing that LE would take it easy on her.


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I think you're right - she expected LE to be easy on her and that didn't happen.
 
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