Verdict: GUILTY for both Millard and Smich of 1st degree murder #2

[swedie]

And from DM's own accounts Daddy was hiding debts and he needed to make 100k a month to get out of the hole with a 3.7 mil loan for a hanger that generated zero revenue.

And we've learnt DM is a chronic liar and manipulator also. Those are DM's words his father was hiding debt. Apparently DM had no interest in the business and it could very well have been his own ignorance of not knowing what was going on financially. DM could have walked away from WM's business at any time. Prior to allegedly murdering his father, DM seemed to assume there was fun money to be had. Guess he got a huge surprise after he put the gun to dear old dad's eye and pulled the trigger. MOO.

 

[canadiangirl]

And we've learnt DM is a chronic liar and manipulator also. Those are DM's words his father was hiding debt. Apparently DM had no interest in the business and it could very well have been his own ignorance of not knowing what was going on financially. DM could have walked away from WM's business at any time. Prior to allegedly murdering his father, DM seemed to assume there was fun money to be had. Guess he got a huge surprise after he put the gun to dear old dad's eye and pulled the trigger. MOO.

Either way the surprise was, there was no money.

 

[SnooperDuper]

With $12mil in assets, a 3.8 mil lien on riverside and needing to make $100k a month in 2013, something doesn't add up. Although this list shows what he would have liquidated, why in 2013 would he need 100k a month if he had the money from the sales from 2011 onwards plus taking a loan out in 2012 for 3.7mil? So where is this so called 12mil?

I don't think he needed $100k a month any more than he needed to spend $15k a month on his cars.

The money was all tied up in real estate - it wasn't liquid and available to spend - when DM was claiming a need for money.

Some real estate purchases were probably funded by the sale of others.

 

[canadiangirl]

I don't think he needed $100k a month any more than he needed to spend $15k a month on his cars.

The money was all tied up in real estate - it wasn't liquid and available to spend - when DM was claiming a need for money.

Some real estate purchases were probably funded by the sale of others.

By this list he would've had 3.5mil to spend in cash with everything he was selling off between 2011-2013. The list only seems to add up to 9mil though. And no mention of the 3.7 mil loan. Either way, add the lawyers fees and the fact the guy transferred this all to his Mom, it looks like he's about as well off as MS. Still not sure where SB would get $ from DM at this point.

 

[juridicus]

At the very least, I don't think he's declared bankruptcy yet. If it were me I'd take the opportunity to be added to his list of creditors and you might get something out of it eventually. FWIW, wrongful death damages would be a debt owing permanently, which would not be erased even if he declared bankruptcy and were discharged. That means it would include any future inheritance he gets from MB, etc. With all the money floating around his family, there's a chance of getting something. It would probably be easy to recover assets transferred to his mom after his arrest to avoid seizure. As for MS, there's probably just zero chance of ever getting anything at all.

The larger point is that liability for damages is distinct from criminal guilt, and even though both are equally guilty there might be rational reasons to sue one and not the other. I'd just go after the one with the most $$ and let them fight among themselves about whether one guy owes the other a share of the settlement, etc.

Also I took his claim via text to "need $100K a month" to be a bit hyperbolic and not meant literally.

Just MOO


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[canadiangirl]

At the very least, I don't think he's declared bankruptcy yet. If it were me I'd take the opportunity to be added to his list of creditors and you might get something out of it eventually. FWIW, wrongful death damages would be a debt owing permanently, which would not be erased even if he declared bankruptcy and were discharged. That means it would include any future inheritance he gets from MB, etc. With all the money floating around his family, there's a chance of getting something. It would probably be easy to recover assets transferred to his mom after his arrest to avoid seizure. As for MS, there's probably just zero chance of ever getting anything at all.

The larger point is that liability for damages is distinct from criminal guilt, and even though both are equally guilty there might be rational reasons to sue one and not the other. I'd just go after the one with the most $$ and let them fight among themselves about whether one guy owes the other a share of the settlement, etc.

Also I took his claim via text to "need $100K a month" to be a bit hyperbolic and not meant literally.

Just MOO


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Well regardless of how much money is floating around the family, you can't sue them. Otherwise she may as well sue MS family too. As well it's interesting to hear other people's thoughts, as I took the 100k a month comment quite literally. Especially since the string of texts were intact. JMO

 

[SnooperDuper]

By this list he would've had 3.5mil to spend in cash with everything he was selling off between 2011-2013. The list only seems to add up to 9mil though. And no mention of the 3.7 mil loan. Either way, add the lawyers fees and the fact the guy transferred this all to his Mom, it looks like he's about as well off as MS. Still not sure where SB would get $ from DM at this point.

There's values for $9.4M in properties, plus you have to add the proceeds from the sale of the hangar, that while built for $9.5M probably only got the expected build price of $6.4M or thereabouts when it went on the market. So be stingy and add $6.4M and then take off the $3.7M loan. That puts you at about $12M.

 

[canadiangirl]

There's values for $9.4M in properties, plus you have to add the proceeds from the sale of the hangar, that while built for $9.5M probably only got the expected build price of $6.4M or thereabouts when it went on the market. So be stingy and add $6.4M and then take off the $3.7M loan. That puts you at about $12M.

Most of which are no longer in his name. Not sure what else may have been transferred. Maybe all by now?
Lots of interesting information over in the property and ownership thread breaking down assets and actual values.

 

[marymcd]

If money made things all better, we wouldn't have therapy: they'd just hand out cheques.

If anyone owes anyone reparations, it is DM to SB.

Laughed a lot about the idea of handing out cheques, if that was all that was needed.

I have thought about the whole DM making reparations to SB, or as in an award from a civil suit, and for me I think I would rather go barea$$ than accept money from the person responsible for my loved one's death. I also really hate the idea that he has any money to speak of at all, now, when the trials are all done and over, or in the future. I don't know that he will survive his mother, but I would assume that if he does that he will inherit all of her estate. In a perfect world, all of his assets would be turned over to a trustee and he would live as a pauper, both in jail and in the event that he was ever released.

 

[marymcd]

What I wonder is how someone could abandon their kid, yet everyone talks about how upbringings must've factored into why people turn this way, yet in their time of need we abandon them? Not something I could ever do personally but to each their own. I'd be supporting my child(ren) every step of the way however I could. Since the family you're referring to is said to be close, I assume they would do the same. MOO

If I truly felt in my heart that my adult child's behaviour that led to committing this crime was a result of my parenting and actions then I would feel obliged to support them. Otherwise, I believe that I would have to let them face the consequences of their own actions and the choices they made on their own. That is not to say that I would abandon them entirely though. I can't imagine what it would be like to be in either of their mother's shoes or what kind of shift this would cause in my relationship with any of my children. I do know that if my mother was a 3-time cancer survivor that was 68 years old, that I would refuse any financial help offered, and would want to spare her the angst of attending the trial in a show of support.

 

[canadiangirl]

If I truly felt in my heart that my adult child's behaviour that led to committing this crime was a result of my parenting and actions then I would feel obliged to support them. Otherwise, I believe that I would have to let them face the consequences of their own actions and the choices they made on their own. That is not to say that I would abandon them entirely though. I can't imagine what it would be like to be in either of their mother's shoes or what kind of shift this would cause in my relationship with any of my children. I do know that if my mother was a 3-time cancer survivor that was 68 years old, that I would refuse any financial help offered, and would want to spare her the angst of attending the trial in a show of support.

Well it's been said something as simple as divorce and no father figure could lead someone down this path....

I believe that regardless they are my child and although I may not agree with their actions, as a mother I could never see myself abandoning them. I also can see a mother wanting to believe in their child and support them regardless. Although I do recognize everyone is different.
So with that being said, I'd be attending court myself. I'm not sure how a parents love is conditional. Moo

 

[andreww]

Yes but those 3 properties don't add up to the 3.7mil in debt. This would still be outstanding.

Presumably the hangar would have a value of $3.7M. So Millard still had the condo, the riverside property, maple gate, the farm, all his toys, plus any investments (and likely MBs home as well). He had money, don't kid yourself.


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[Inspector_North]

Presumably the hangar would have a value of $3.7M. So Millard still had the condo, the riverside property, maple gate, the farm, all his toys, plus any investments (and likely MBs home as well). He had money, don't kid yourself.


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The problem was that DM does not think about his wealth in an ethical way. He explained his entitlement when he said he would just take it from the source. Any reasonable solution to a financial hiccup is not something DM would consider.

MOO

 

[Errrr]

View attachment 97604

Here's what everything sold for except the hangar. DM liquidated around $12M in properties.

Didn't Millardair go bankrupt in 2009? I don't see how they got to keep 1.4M in assets from those hangars.
When I subtract the purchase from the sale I come up with approximately 4.2 M but that doesn't include mortgages or the 3.7M loan, or MBs house mortgages or sale. Another thing, just because things were paid for in "cash" doesn't mean the money wasn't borrowed.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Didn't Millardair go bankrupt in 2009? I don't see how they got to keep 1.4M in assets from those hangars.
When I subtract the purchase from the sale I come up with approximately 4.2 M but that doesn't include mortgages or the 3.7M loan, or MBs house mortgages or sale. Another thing, just because things were paid for in "cash" doesn't mean the money wasn't borrowed.

Even though MillardAir filed for bankruptcy in 1990, the family continued to operate an aircraft servicing and maintenance company at Toronto's Pearson International Airport for the next two decades.

http://www.cbc.ca/interactives/longform/news/wayward-son-dellen-millard-tim-bosma-trial

The bankruptcy was earlier.

DM held Maplegate, the distillery condo, the Vaughan condo, the farm, and the 6-plex at the time of his arrest. Those properties sold for $6M.

He also had the hangar, and while we don't know what it sold for, it had to be at least $6M.

Then he had a $3.7M bank loan and probably a $1M legal bill.

He's still got lots of coin.

 

[canadiangirl]

http://www.cbc.ca/interactives/longform/news/wayward-son-dellen-millard-tim-bosma-trial

The bankruptcy was earlier.

DM held Maplegate, the distillery condo, the Vaughan condo, the farm, and the 6-plex at the time of his arrest. Those properties sold for $6M.

He also had the hangar, and while we don't know what it sold for, it had to be at least $6M.

Then he had a $3.7M bank loan and probably a $1M legal bill.

He's still got lots of coin.

HE wouldn't have the coin though since the assets he transferred are not in his name.

Speaking of coin, AM is in BC according to Instagram and someone on there asked him if MB is paying since he's unemployed.

 

[Inspector_North]

MrsT

Hopefully this link works.
[video=youtube;nWbBm1dkpG8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWbBm1dkpG8[/video]

 

[Alethea Dice]

http://www.cbc.ca/interactives/longform/news/wayward-son-dellen-millard-tim-bosma-trial

The bankruptcy was earlier.

DM held Maplegate, the distillery condo, the Vaughan condo, the farm, and the 6-plex at the time of his arrest. Those properties sold for $6M.

He also had the hangar, and while we don't know what it sold for, it had to be at least $6M.

Then he had a $3.7M bank loan and probably a $1M legal bill.

He's still got lots of coin.

Less the $710,000 for the Distillery condo (since we know he was scrambling for the short term money to be able to sell it so the sale cancels out the purchase), less the $1.1 million loan on Riverside to his father (which is probably still outstanding since the estate could very well not have settled yet), less any other mortgages still remaining on any properties, less commission fees and taxes. As for the hangar, we have no idea whether it sold for "at least $6M", which is what the cost was valued at for the building permit. (Not sure why the Toronto hangar was included in the original calculations as that was WM's and no doubt went into building the new hangar. Derry Road was also in both WM and DM's names and sold while WM was still alive.)

Regardless, I can't imagine a court accepting a lawsuit on one person because he might have some money left over, while no lawsuit is file on the other party because he has no money, when both parties were responsible for the death.

JMO

 

[Alethea Dice]

HE wouldn't have the coin though since the assets he transferred are not in his name.

Speaking of coin, AM is in BC according to Instagram and someone on there asked him if MB is paying since he's unemployed.

I'm always a little surprised at the people who stalk and harass these people with comments on their Instagram and Facebook pages. It's sad to see the stalked showing more class and maturity than the stalker in these types of situations.

JMO

 

[swedie]

If I had to guess, I would say DM has zilch in regards to money. We do know the hangar was part of WM's estate along with the Maplegate house. There are laws to take into consideration which could have, did have or will have an affect on DM's financial worth. If DM is eventually found guilty of his father's murder, he will not be entitled to any of WM's financial estate. A thorough investigation would determine how DM managed to come up with money to purchase properties he acquired; two condos and the farmland. If it's determined DM made money through proceeds of crime to pay for those properties, I guess DM/MB could wave bye bye to any financial profit made from their sales. There were vehicles and who knows what else was found in the hangar, which DM gained through theft/crime, proof TB's truck was dismantled inside the hangar while his body incinerated right outside the hangar door, later moved inside awaiting cooling off of the incinerator. Ah yes...that long debated and denied by few...that dreaded chop shop that did exist. So given the above, I speculate there is nothing financially to be had for DM/MB from the sale of the hangar at least at this point. It's sitting in limbo until the verdict is in on WM's case in MOO.

So DM plans on representing himself during LB's murder. Is it because he cannot afford legal representation and doesn't want a legal aid lawyer, or he thinks he can do a better job, or he wants to make a total imbecile of himself? At first thought, I considered he might plead guilty to her murder, if he was found guilty of TB's murder, but IMO I think he thoroughly enjoyed the spectacle he made of himself during TB's trial and plans on outdoing himself for LB's trial, plus her case gets him out of his new digs to attend court. All MOO.