WA WA - D.B. Cooper hijacking mystery, 24 Nov 1971 - #2

[j2mirish]

ITA J2mirish, and that is why I think a formal letter needs to be sent to the FBI to demand an inquest of H-back. A lawyer would know how to do that in the correct way.

I thought your post about doing that was a great idea- sure couldnt hurt-

 

[j2mirish]

Although anything is possible, I seriously doubt he was in on it. If the plan unraveled at any point his FBI career was done - pretty stiff for a possible split of $200K, especially when your "partner" would be a convicted felon.

good point -

 

[Niner]

I see that our thread got moved... hmmm... I'm 2 pages behind in reading, so hope this hasn't been repeated...

Some one lse , Jrmish, Scandi, etc. Mystic Niner, AS;
What are your thoughts?

okay... I watched your tapes from KOIN, but missed IE (darn :doh: ) - but I believe you DO have Cooper and H'bach just had tunnel vision and was incompent...

anymoe news shows picking up your story, LC?? Anything from the FBI? (Scandi ? - you should call your FBI "friend" back!! LOL!)

There are a couple things going on - on what, specifically? FWIW your whole story works for me.

Me too, LC!!

 

[Anuniaq]

Quote:
However, I do your understand your point in this case. How many FBI agents can afford to own their own airplanes, even today? None.

They either come from money, their wives come from money, or other means.

left

_________________________________________________________________

I have been reading this entire thread for several days. I find it verrrrry fascinating and I think you have done a great job.

I do happen to know several federal agents who own their own planes (they are not FBI agents, but are the same federal series (1811) and are paid on the same GS scale).

As far as H-bach, I'm in the Famous But Incompetent camp. It's not an phenomena that is limited to this one case. Don't get me wrong, with 15,000+ agents there are many very competent investigators, but with all of those agents there are some lazy agents who rely on others (task forces, etc) to solve their cases. Too bad they didn't have the NTSB or others who would be on this case now on a task force back then.

AQ

 

[Old Dominion]

OMG What a small world this is! I knew Harold Campbell, that is if he lived in Lake Oswego. His daughter Ginny was my best friend up thru high school. Graduated in '62. I can see him right now, tall, not a lot of hair, skinny, a really nice guy tho even if he wasn't much to look at. LOL

I've been thinking all day Left when I was working, I think you need to send a registered letter to the head of the FBI office in Portland with an outline of info gathered during your investigation. Part 2 of that is to ask why the case was handled in such an unprofessional way, etc.

Send a copy to the Attorney Gen of the US, receipt requested.

Now I am not a lawyer, so you might have to send the original to the head of the FBI in DC with copies to the AG and Port offices. $30 could forever give testiment to what you have learned, etc.

I'd also include in each package a copy of both the KOIN 3 show tape and the IE tape, Don't give them a link, make sure they have it in hand.

Then write a damn good book. Yes, you have spent money, but it will be peanuts, And you hopefully will get to write a second book about the punishment phase of the crime. Get that man down in Seridan in the RIGHT house!

Actually, my last statement is so funny I almost can't stop laughin'. Sheridan is Mayfields current home town and also the site of the new Federal Penn in Oregon. Hopefully it was Karma working on that one, that he moved to Sheridan. They didn't even build the Fed Penn till the 80's I think. LOLOLOL


PS: Wouldn't that be something if he is convicted! Move from his home across the Hwy that goes to the beach to his new home, the Federal Penn. He would at least do intake there. There are several very famous criminals there, one so famous and rich by his writings that he gets anything he wants. His cell is lined with books, and he can buy anything he wants. Has had an order made never to be moved from that facility till he dies.

Scandi

Scandi,

That's a good idea. I'd also like to see LC send off those tapes/dvd's to Tina and Flo, or maybe you could send them a copy.

OD

 

[leftcoast]

leftcoast: I agree that you have the makings for a book. Not just about your original search and research but also to include going online and joining a forum, the TV station involvement, etc.

The dbcooper case has always been of interest and there hasn't been a book published about it in a long time now.

Your story brings it up to date and also could encompass how the FBI goes about handling cases. And this surely has to be their greatest "unsolved"?

thanks. I agree

Plus, some of the other books were a joke, they never really did explain how Cooper was able to pinpoint his dropzone, or how easy the jump was for a professional.

Plus, when you think this is the only unsolved hijacking in the history of the United States, that alone is remarkable.

thanks for the support

left

 

[leftcoast]

Although anything is possible, I seriously doubt he was in on it. If the plan unraveled at any point his FBI career was done - pretty stiff for a possible split of $200K, especially when your "partner" would be a convicted felon.

I agree. There is just no evidence that I have seen to suggest such a thing. Its' not like H-bach was living on Skid Row, then afterwards, retires from the FBI, and is living in a mansion.

Plus, to pick a partner, who should have been the most likely suspect?

However, I will say, I have not eliminated that possibility. I would be foolish to do so, but I think it is unlikely.

left

 

[leftcoast]

I see that our thread got moved... hmmm... I'm 2 pages behind in reading, so hope this hasn't been repeated...



okay... I watched your tapes from KOIN, but missed IE (darn :doh: ) - but I believe you DO have Cooper and H'bach just had tunnel vision and was incompent...

anymoe news shows picking up your story, LC?? Anything from the FBI? (Scandi ? - you should call your FBI "friend" back!! LOL!)



Me too, LC!!

Ya, the IE show was 100 times better than the KOIN segment. I will try to get it posted to the web, either on IE's website, youtube, or a file. I'll let ya know if and when it happens.

No, no other news organizations that I have a part of. Supposedly, the KOIN piece did run in other markets. Or at least part of it.

we are working to get the story out.

left

 

[leftcoast]

Quote:
However, I do your understand your point in this case. How many FBI agents can afford to own their own airplanes, even today? None.

They either come from money, their wives come from money, or other means.

left

_________________________________________________________________

I have been reading this entire thread for several days. I find it verrrrry fascinating and I think you have done a great job.

I do happen to know several federal agents who own their own planes (they are not FBI agents, but are the same federal series (1811) and are paid on the same GS scale).

As far as H-bach, I'm in the Famous But Incompetent camp. It's not an phenomena that is limited to this one case. Don't get me wrong, with 15,000+ agents there are many very competent investigators, but with all of those agents there are some lazy agents who rely on others (task forces, etc) to solve their cases. Too bad they didn't have the NTSB or others who would be on this case now on a task force back then.

AQ

thanks. Right, there are always exceptions to the rule. But, even today, any agent with his or her own plane, probably doesnt' have a stay at home wife, 4 kids, and a mortgage. Maybe he had money, the wife or husband makes a lot of money, etc. My point was, it is an "upper middle class thing", and still is. Most people just can't afford a plane, the cost of a plane, insurance, annuals, parking the plane, etc, is huge. IT is a huge burden.

I totally agree with your second statement also. There are lazy people in every walk of life, and people who dont' get it.

Plus, this isn't the only unsolved case in FBI history. Think about all the unsolved cases in your local police force. The murders, burglary's, rapes, etc. Do we think those are cops on the take, or simply lazy police, or just lack of effort.

In my opinion, 90% of cold cases are solveable. The reason they weren't solved the first time is probably human error. It is amazing, when you look at something years later, how obvious something looks. But, when you are in the middle of something, you just can't see the "trees through the forest". (I know some people will say I can't see the trees in this case)

thanks for the comments


left

 

[leftcoast]

OD

RE: Swarthy: If you look at the side by sides on IE's website, it does appear a certain individual is somewhat "swarthy".

Sure, cooper probably was wearing 'face makeup", to cover up scars, blemishes, etc, one would be a fool not to. But, looking that and other photo's, he doesn't actually look like he has "IRish, or "english", light colored skin.

PLus, if you think about all the hijackings back in the 70's, many were done related to getting out of, or to Cuba, and or Middle eastern related. Hence, FBi, Flight Attendants, etc., maybe had a biased toward looking for someone with a dark skin.

Also, with the "jet" black hair, dark skin, was Cooper hoping authorities would think he was a Cuban, or other ethnicity, other than white.

If I were Cooper, I would have used a disguise, left false clues, and worked on a phony New York or southern accent. Heck, one agent would have eliminated anyone with a NY accent in a second. Don't ya think?

left

 

[j2mirish]

OD

RE: Swarthy: If you look at the side by sides on IE's website, it does appear a certain individual is somewhat "swarthy".

Sure, cooper probably was wearing 'face makeup", to cover up scars, blemishes, etc, one would be a fool not to. But, looking that and other photo's, he doesn't actually look like he has "IRish, or "english", light colored skin.

PLus, if you think about all the hijackings back in the 70's, many were done related to getting out of, or to Cuba, and or Middle eastern related. Hence, FBi, Flight Attendants, etc., maybe had a biased toward looking for someone with a dark skin.

Also, with the "jet" black hair, dark skin, was Cooper hoping authorities would think he was a Cuban, or other ethnicity, other than white.

If I were Cooper, I would have used a disguise, left false clues, and worked on a phony New York or southern accent. Heck, one agent would have eliminated anyone without a NY accent in a second. Don't ya think?

left

does teddy have any visible face scarring?

 

[leftcoast]

does teddy have any visible face scarring?

Not that i've seen. But we all have little marks, blemishes, on our face. Just about every man I know has a scar on or near his face.

Could be from a childhood fall on the chin, a fight which left stitches, etc. It could be a mole, scar, beard pattern, etc., these are all clues to a witness.

So, why take a chance. You put on stage makeup, and it is all hidden. Plus, the lack of scars, blemishes, moles, is also a clue.

So, why wouldn't someone wear makeup.

Even McCoy wore makeup, and he was an idiot? and looked swarthy because of the makeup.

left

 

[Old Dominion]

OD

RE: Swarthy: If you look at the side by sides on IE's website, it does appear a certain individual is somewhat "swarthy".

Sure, cooper probably was wearing 'face makeup", to cover up scars, blemishes, etc, one would be a fool not to. But, looking that and other photo's, he doesn't actually look like he has "IRish, or "english", light colored skin.

PLus, if you think about all the hijackings back in the 70's, many were done related to getting out of, or to Cuba, and or Middle eastern related. Hence, FBi, Flight Attendants, etc., maybe had a biased toward looking for someone with a dark skin.

Also, with the "jet" black hair, dark skin, was Cooper hoping authorities would think he was a Cuban, or other ethnicity, other than white.

If I were Cooper, I would have used a disguise, left false clues, and worked on a phony New York or southern accent. Heck, one agent would have eliminated anyone with a NY accent in a second. Don't ya think?

left

I've always held out that makeup could be the source of the "swarthy" description. Ted is about as Anglo as you can get, and I never thought a tan would qualify him for "swarthy". What I still can't figure out is why the sketches (especially Dar Bingle**) are so far off. One disginguishing feature of Teddy-boy is that he's got a very thick neck and an almost pelican-like chin. His face is also very broad.

I also found it odd that Flo would find it necessary to have Unsolved Mysteries do another sketch because "neither" of them looked like Cooper.
This means that for about 17 years the two composites floating around don't even resemble him. The Casey Kasem sketch is so "every man" that
any Caucasian male w/ dark short hair and w/o drastic features could fit that sketch. How is it that Flo and Tina actually signed off on these? (I'm assuming they're the sources)

OD


**(What the Germans affectionately call Bing Crosby)

 

[leftcoast]

I've always held out that makeup could be the source of the "swarthy" description. Ted is about as Anglo as you can get, and I never thought a tan would qualify him for "swarthy". What I still can't figure out is why the sketches (especially Dar Bingle**) are so far off. One disginguishing feature of Teddy-boy is that he's got a very thick neck and an almost pelican-like chin. His face is also very broad.

I also found it odd that Flo would find it necessary to have Unsolved Mysteries do another sketch because "neither" of them looked like Cooper.
This means that for about 17 years the two composites floating around don't even resemble him. The Casey Kasem sketch is so "every man" that
any Caucasian male w/ dark short hair and w/o drastic features could fit that sketch. How is it that Flo and Tina actually signed off on these? (I'm assuming they're the sources)

OD


**(What the Germans affectionately call Bing Crosby)

My conclusion is that Cooper was wearing make-up. Its' not an illogical conclusion. Mccoy did it, why not Cooper.

Who knows which sketch was done by which witness. I don't think anybody knows at this stage.

Only the 1988 UM sketch, which was done by flo., 17 years after the fact.

It is odd that she said the sketches never did look like him. Even H-bach admits, sketches are NOT a good method of identification

As for Teddy, I do think he is darker than most. I've seen him in person 6 or 7 times now. Conan O'Brien, know that is white. Teddy is not as white as Conan. Plus, look at IE webisite. Teddy is much darker than the other white guys on that page.

Plus, we don't have pictures of Ted from 1971. Heck, he worked outside, spent a great deal of time oustide in the summer skydiving, etc. lived on a houseboat, its' not a stretch to think he had a tan. Sure, it was November, but how long does a tan last>

In my mind, the swarthy thing is a non-issue. IT could have been one person's description, a mistake, a person assuming someone with black jet hair "must" have dark skin. Could be related to the black suit, black sunglasses. Funny, the BingCrosby sketch has no indication of swarthy.

Regardless, IMO, you can have ten witnesses, and they will have ten different descriptions of a perp. It has been proven in tests, that we stink as a nation in identifying perp.s., for reasons I have outlined a million times.

lef t

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Let me get this straight, as I did not follow the Cooper case...Leftcoast found DB and wrote a book?! Someone please give me a quick rundown on this one.

Oh, Great! Like I didn't have ENOUGH to read now! LOL JK I am quite intrigued.

 

[leftcoast]

Let me get this straight, as I did not follow the Cooper case...Leftcoast found DB and wrote a book?! Someone please give me a quick rundown on this one.

Oh, Great! Like I didn't have ENOUGH to read now! LOL JK I am quite intrigued.

Hey, Don't I know you from somewhere else?

Yes, my buddy and I have spent the last 7 years, and there is a very, high probality that we have solved the case. We were on Inside Edition this past Monday.

No, we havn't written a book yet, but are starting to get nibbles. IT just went public a week and a half ago.

left

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Well, Yes..Yes..I think we have met! Can I have your autograph now?! LOL Make it out to: The girl who thought she could actually match wits with me. hehehe

I am in awe! I never thought that case COULD be solved! Wow! I did follow it from time to time, but it is strange...because I never thought he was dead either!

I am so impressed and I cannot wait to read every word of your book (deal pending soon, I am sure!)! Make certain you lock in not only the book, but any reference...movies, articles, etc. Obtain a great entertainment attorney before you sign anything!

Congratulations!!!!

I am speechless..so you better relish this moment! >wink<

P.S. I got so excited...I forgot to ask who he is and where?! LMAO

 

[Old Dominion]

the guy had an alibi, h-bach checked it out, and eliminated him

left

So he does check out alibis, or maybe just some....or all but ONE?

OD

 

[leftcoast]

Well, Yes..Yes..I think we have met! Can I have your autograph now?! LOL Make it out to: The girl who thought she could actually match wits with me. hehehe

I am in awe! I never thought that case COULD be solved! Wow! I did follow it from time to time, but it is strange...because I never thought he was dead either!

I am so impressed and I cannot wait to read every word of your book (deal pending soon, I am sure!)! Make certain you lock in not only the book, but any reference...movies, articles, etc. Obtain a great entertainment attorney before you sign anything!

Congratulations!!!!

I am speechless..so you better relish this moment! >wink<

P.S. I got so excited...I forgot to ask who he is and where?! LMAO

SS

It is not 100&#37;. He hasn't be arrested or anything. It is just someone the original investigator overlooked? If you go to Inside Edition website, and type in http://www.insideedition.com/ourstories/archives/?showid=443, you will see a picture of him. He is presumed innocent until proven guilty. But, most of the people here, think he is the guy. Judge for yourself.

left

 

[leftcoast]

So he does check out alibis, or maybe just some....or all but ONE?

OD

He only checks alibi's of people he doesn't know. Saves taxpayers money this way. It's more efficient.:banghead: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: .

left