Found Deceased WA - Jenise Wright, 6, Bremerton, 2 Aug 2014 - #10 *Arrest*

[MsMarple]

Just in case somebody wants to look up the case you are referring to, it was Jorelys Rivera. Her murderer was Ryan brunn. He plead guilty and then committed suicide.

Thank you for that. I looked into Jorelys' death and while her circumstances were different from Jenise's I noticed some common elements. I also saw that Brunn said he didn't plan to kill Jorelys and downplayed the sexual aspect.

If the details of Jenise's murder are ever released I expect GG will also claim he didn't intend to kill her but was afraid of getting caught. One striking similarity in these and other cases is that the killer was able to get back into their normal routine almost immediately after committing a vicious, gruesome act.

Another similarity is that in many of these cases autopsies found at least two types of injuries. In Jorelys' case she'd been stabbed and beaten, Allana was beaten and suffocated, Jenise was beaten and strangled.

Add all of that to hiding the body and covering their tracks and a picture emerges of a criminal with such little regard for a person's life that it's impossible to accept that murdering their victim was “just” an afterthought. They all had murder on their mind, plain and simple.

I also won't be surprised if more instances of molestation come to light during this investigation.

 

[SCHMAE]

Thank you for that. I looked into Jorelys' death and while her circumstances were different from Jenise's I noticed some common elements. I also saw that Brunn said he didn't plan to kill Jorelys and downplayed the sexual aspect.

If the details of Jenise's murder are ever released I expect GG will also claim he didn't intend to kill her but was afraid of getting caught. One striking similarity in these and other cases is that the killer was able to get back into their normal routine almost immediately after committing a vicious, gruesome act.

Another similarity is that in many of these cases autopsies found at least two types of injuries. In Jorelys' case she'd been stabbed and beaten, Allana was beaten and suffocated, Jenise was beaten and strangled.

Add all of that to hiding the body and covering their tracks and a picture emerges of a criminal with such little regard for a person's life that it's impossible to accept that murdering their victim was “just” an afterthought. They all had murder on their mind, plain and simple.

I also won't be surprised if more instances of molestation come to light during this investigation.

BBM , This makes me a little sick to type , but here goes. The human body is so much stronger than it seems and even a young kid can take quite a beating, as we've seen countless times here . I would imagine in those cases they beat them and then , when there are still signs of life, the strangling or other method came to be sure they were not still alive.
Poor babies .

 

[Bravo]

Truly IMO the death is never an after thought. It's part of the sick plan. Again IMO it's part of what they get off on or sadly and simply whatever works in the moment. I never worked with Offenders who killed yet their crimes ranged from touching to rape with a beating. Astounding how many thought at a simple smile and hello etc. felt a child was open to it. Therefore justifiable. Sickening.

 

[MsMarple]

Truly IMO the death is never an after thought. It's part of the sick plan. Again IMO it's part of what they get off on or sadly and simply whatever works in the moment. I never worked with Offenders who killed yet their crimes ranged from touching to rape with a beating. Astounding how many thought at a simple smile and hello etc. felt a child was open to it. Therefore justifiable. Sickening.

ITA!

Many cases of sexual abuse are long term and often end not in a brutal murder but rather when the child gets older, tells, or the molester is caught in the act. To take sexual assault to the extreme of ending someone's life says (to me personally anyway) that some other or additional element is occurring in the perpetrator's mind.

IOW, if we could see into the fantasies of sexual predators I think we would find some differences in what triggers the sexual response between those who kill and those who don't. I could be way off and I'm open to evidence that refutes my thinking on this. It's just hard to ignore the brutality.

 

[human]

My understanding is that there are different kinds of molesters.

Those that stay strictly in their family.

Those that are sadists.


Those that groom children.

The ones that kill, unless they are sadists, do it to cover up the crime.

 

[blue22]

ITA!

Many cases of sexual abuse are long term and often end not in a brutal murder but rather when the child gets older, tells, or the molester is caught in the act. To take sexual assault to the extreme of ending someone's life says (to me personally anyway) that some other or additional element is occurring in the perpetrator's mind.

IOW, if we could see into the fantasies of sexual predators I think we would find some differences in what triggers the sexual response between those who kill and those who don't. I could be way off and I'm open to evidence that refutes my thinking on this. It's just hard to ignore the brutality.

I think the molesters that kill either kill to not be caught, or kill because it's apart of the sexual gratification. I don't think all molesters who kill are sadists, but I think it would be a little rare.

All of this is JMO.

 

[LuckyCat]

Because he's still a minor and has not yet been formally charged as an adult, he would have been held at KC juvenile facility on Old Clifton Road before he was sent to Western for his mental eval. Once his eval is done there, if what you say is accurate based on the KC site, he'll be sent back to the same facility until December when he turns 18.

Right, that's what I said. I never saw anything in the news that said he was being taken immediately after his first court appearance to Western State, which is why I said it's difficult to say when he got there. If there was such a statement, I apologize for misleading. My understanding is that all we know is that his mental evaluation will be completed before his next court appearance.

Different states have different laws about minors and detention facilities, but I'm glad to say at least mine--Washington--doesn't automatically toss kids into adult jails and prisons. I might be disgusted and horrified by GG (assuming he committed this crime) but further rape and victimization of minors doesn't do anyone any good. There was a caveat on the Kitsap County page that gave an out in case a kid does need to go into an adult facility, but that's supposed to be the exception.

 

[borndem]

ITA!

Many cases of sexual abuse are long term and often end not in a brutal murder but rather when the child gets older, tells, or the molester is caught in the act. To take sexual assault to the extreme of ending someone's life says (to me personally anyway) that some other or additional element is occurring in the perpetrator's mind.

IOW, if we could see into the fantasies of sexual predators I think we would find some differences in what triggers the sexual response between those who kill and those who don't. I could be way off and I'm open to evidence that refutes my thinking on this. It's just hard to ignore the brutality.

ITA, MsMarple. I think in a lot of cases, where the perpetrator has the opportunity to rape more than one victim (on different occasions), the first occurrence of a rape is rape only; then it (gradually or suddenly) often "graduates" to rape and then murder.

I think in a lot of cases, the ultimate reason is control. ---> Ownership. This time, I'm in charge. I'm the boss, etc., etc. I pick who, where, when, and what.

It may be because the perpetrator has felt that he has never had control over anything, etc. And in the cases I've seen & read, they often start with a child -- someone they know they can easily control.

And then there are the ones who are more "practical" -- the murder must take place because of being id'd and caught. I think the murder still gives pleasure to many of them.

Just my thoughts.

 

[MsMarple]

I think the molesters that kill either kill to not be caught, or kill because it's apart of the sexual gratification. I don't think all molesters who kill are sadists, but I think it would be a little rare.

All of this is JMO.

Thank you and human for the additional insight!

It's hard (for me) not to lump together those who kill to avoid getting caught and those who kill for the pleasure of inflicting pain but yes, they probably are separate issues that need to be put into the context of the crime. And the two may even overlap in some cases.

I was looking online for more information on the different kinds of sexual offenders and it seems that there are indeed many different “categories.” There's also some cross pollination among them and some offenders change their MO over time, often becoming more violent. Crazy stuff!

I have a tab open on the court documents for Cristian Fernandez. Such a sad case. When he was 12 he killed his little brother and possibly was molesting him and other kids. At age 3 he killed a kitten. His family history reads like a Stephen King novel. I'm reading his psychiatric assessments in order to get an idea of what tests and methods doctors will use for GG's evaluation. It's informative but oh, that poor little boy!

 

[MsMarple]

ITA, MsMarple. I think in a lot of cases, where the perpetrator has the opportunity to rape more than one victim (on different occasions), the first occurrence of a rape is rape only; then it (gradually or suddenly) often "graduates" to rape and then murder.

I think in a lot of cases, the ultimate reason is control. ---> Ownership. This time, I'm in charge. I'm the boss, etc., etc. I pick who, where, when, and what.

It may be because the perpetrator has felt that he has never had control over anything, etc. And in the cases I've seen & read, they often start with a child -- someone they know they can easily control.

And then there are the ones who are more "practical" -- the murder must take place because of being id'd and caught. I think the murder still gives pleasure to many of them.

Just my thoughts.

Yes, at some point a murderer must have some sort of... I don't know, internal conversation where they give themself "permission" to kill, whether it's for self-protection, sexual pleasure, mercy killing or whatever bizarre reason they use to justify the act.

That's pretty much the ultimate control one can assert over another person.

 

[Bravo]

ITA!

Many cases of sexual abuse are long term and often end not in a brutal murder but rather when the child gets older, tells, or the molester is caught in the act. To take sexual assault to the extreme of ending someone's life says (to me personally anyway) that some other or additional element is occurring in the perpetrator's mind.

IOW, if we could see into the fantasies of sexual predators I think we would find some differences in what triggers the sexual response between those who kill and those who don't. I could be way off and I'm open to evidence that refutes my thinking on this. It's just hard to ignore the brutality.

Agree there are sex offenders and sex offenders who kill. It would be interesting if we could get into the mindset as you say. I can only speak to the Fantasies I have heard. None involved killing.They cover a wide range. From spanking to the full gamut. Including my Family and myself. Which I eluded to in prior posts. It was nothing more than a manipulation to include me and my Family. These folks are masters at manipulation and justifying what and why they do it. Sexual urges are powerful as we all know. I mean no disrespect by making this comparison but if we equate it to an addiction such as drugs/alcohol folks can detach themselves from the substance. Triggers such as friends etc. Sexual urges and Children around are tougher to avoid. No excuse but it is just a sad reality. And yes as you point out why do some kill? There are Sociopaths who just choose to make your life miserable. Then there are those that kill. I wish we had more answers in this day and age. The great debate. Nurture/Nature????? Sigh......

 

[NCsleuther]

Agree there are sex offenders and sex offenders who kill. It would be interesting if we could get into the mindset as you say. I can only speak to the Fantasies I have heard. None involved killing.They cover a wide range. From spanking to the full gamut. Including my Family and myself. Which I eluded to in prior posts. It was nothing more than a manipulation to include me and my Family. These folks are masters at manipulation and justifying what and why they do it. Sexual urges are powerful as we all know. I mean no disrespect by making this comparison but if we equate it to an addiction such as drugs/alcohol folks can detach themselves from the substance. Triggers such as friends etc. Sexual urges and Children around are tougher to avoid. No excuse but it is just a sad reality. And yes as you point out why do some kill? There are Sociopaths who just choose to make your life miserable. Then there are those that kill. I wish we had more answers in this day and age. The great debate. Nurture/Nature????? Sigh......

I think it's a bit of both -- nature AND nurture. Certain folks born with traits that given the right set of circumstances get triggered. JMO. Makes the most sense to me, anyway.

 

[SCHMAE]

OT ( or is it? ) Things that make you go hmmmm.


http://www.kirotv.com/gallery/news/photos-teachers-accused-sex-crimes-wash-state/gCHct/#4552011

 

[Ontario Mom]

Right, that's what I said. I never saw anything in the news that said he was being taken immediately after his first court appearance to Western State, which is why I said it's difficult to say when he got there. If there was such a statement, I apologize for misleading. My understanding is that all we know is that his mental evaluation will be completed before his next court appearance.

Different states have different laws about minors and detention facilities, but I'm glad to say at least mine--Washington--doesn't automatically toss kids into adult jails and prisons. I might be disgusted and horrified by GG (assuming he committed this crime) but further rape and victimization of minors doesn't do anyone any good. There was a caveat on the Kitsap County page that gave an out in case a kid does need to go into an adult facility, but that's supposed to be the exception.

I don't really know how it works when a 17 yr old is charged as an adult, in KC but technically I would assume because he is still legally a minor until December, he'd be detained at the juvenile facility when they're done with his eval at Western. I also totally agree, transferring him to adult jail at this point serves no real purpose but brutal vengeance. Not that I feel sorry for GG at all, but he needs to answer for his crimes according to the law, not according to emotionally charged vigilantism or "jailhouse justice" as it's commonly referred to.

 

[MsMarple]

It took me a while to find this link again - it's the summary of followup research conducted in Washington State on child abduction murder cases (the first study was published back in 1997).

The 5-page summary is worth reading. It's almost like having a blueprint of LE's operation in Jenise's case but what's really eerie is how close the profile is to GG:

http://www.atg.wa.gov/uploadedFiles...uction_Murder_Research/CMIIReport-Summary.pdf

Links to the entire report are on the Washington Attorney General website: http://www.atg.wa.gov/childabductionresearch.aspx#.U_a46vldWSq

From that page:

Now the Attorney General’s Office has released a follow-up study, including 175 additional solved cases. The additional cases generally reflect and support the findings in the original report with several significant and definite differences:

• With more killers identified, researchers found threat that the killer will be a friend or acquaintance is nearly equal to that of a stranger.

• The probability that the killer’s name will come up during the first week of the investigation has decreased.

• The use of *advertiser censored* by killers as a trigger to murder has increased.

 

[human]

It took me a while to find this link again - it's the summary of followup research conducted in Washington State on child abduction murder cases (the first study was published back in 1997).

The 5-page summary is worth reading. It's almost like having a blueprint of LE's operation in Jenise's case but what's really eerie is how close the profile is to GG:

http://www.atg.wa.gov/uploadedFiles...uction_Murder_Research/CMIIReport-Summary.pdf

Links to the entire report are on the Washington Attorney General website: http://www.atg.wa.gov/childabductionresearch.aspx#.U_a46vldWSq

From that page:

Now the Attorney General’s Office has released a follow-up study, including 175 additional solved cases. The additional cases generally reflect and support the findings in the original report with several significant and definite differences:

• With more killers identified, researchers found threat that the killer will be a friend or acquaintance is nearly equal to that of a stranger.

• The probability that the killer’s name will come up during the first week of the investigation has decreased.

• The use of *advertiser censored* by killers as a trigger to murder has increased.

Chilling to read this!

 

[ChuckMaureen]

It took me a while to find this link again - it's the summary of followup research conducted in Washington State on child abduction murder cases (the first study was published back in 1997).

The 5-page summary is worth reading. It's almost like having a blueprint of LE's operation in Jenise's case but what's really eerie is how close the profile is to GG:

http://www.atg.wa.gov/uploadedFiles...uction_Murder_Research/CMIIReport-Summary.pdf

Links to the entire report are on the Washington Attorney General website: http://www.atg.wa.gov/childabductionresearch.aspx#.U_a46vldWSq

From that page:

Now the Attorney General’s Office has released a follow-up study, including 175 additional solved cases. The additional cases generally reflect and support the findings in the original report with several significant and definite differences:

• With more killers identified, researchers found threat that the killer will be a friend or acquaintance is nearly equal to that of a stranger.

• The probability that the killer’s name will come up during the first week of the investigation has decreased.

• The use of *advertiser censored* by killers as a trigger to murder has increased.

This quote from the report seems to describe what in my mind should be a common sense action taken by parents but as evidenced in this case, complacency due to casual comfort of environment and lifestyle can lead to a tragic ending:

bbm

Finally, we need to remind parents that if their child is missing, they must call the police immediately. An immediate response to a missing or abducted child may be the difference between life and death for the child.

 

[Suthrnqt]

I don't really know how it works when a 17 yr old is charged as an adult, in KC but technically I would assume because he is still legally a minor until December, he'd be detained at the juvenile facility when they're done with his eval at Western. I also totally agree, transferring him to adult jail at this point serves no real purpose but brutal vengeance. Not that I feel sorry for GG at all, but he needs to answer for his crimes according to the law, not according to emotionally charged vigilantism or "jailhouse justice" as it's commonly referred to.

I live in NC, and before I became disabled, I worked for 20+ years in the medical units of 2 county jails. Daily occupancy rates varied from 1800 to 2000, depending on the time of year. In these facilities, there were inmates who were under the age of 18. However, they were not housed with the adults. They were in 'segregation', which were single occupant cells.

 

[Ontario Mom]

I live in NC, and before I became disabled, I worked for 20+ years in the medical units of 2 county jails. Daily occupancy rates varied from 1800 to 2000, depending on the time of year. In these facilities, there were inmates who were under the age of 18. However, they were not housed with the adults. They were in 'segregation', which were single occupant cells.

I would assume that would be the way it work in any "adult" jail that also housed juveniles but regulations in different jurisdictions can be really weird sometimes.

 

[Ontario Mom]

I just asked a family member who used to work for the KCSO and he said regardless of the charges, juveniles are held in the juvenile facility until the age of 18. I checked all the other inmates here http://www.kitsapgov.com/sheriff/incustody/incustody.asp that are flagged as being at a different facility and GG is the only juvenile so I assume that means the only reason he's listed there is because he's being charged as an adult.