WA WA - Shantina Smiley, 29, & Azriel Carver, 8 (fnd deceased), Olympia, Mar 2010 - #2

[crocus]

It's very sobering to see Azriel's photo, such a sweet looking little boy....and now knowing that he met the end of his life in what is surely a heartbreaking way. I hope that the story can be pieced together of what happened and that his Mom will be found too.

God Bless and keep you in his arms..............

 

[revampz]

oh wow....I have just come home and straight away got on the computer to see if they had found them and have just read thru 10 pages of posts to read the sad news....

There have been lots of heartbreaking cases on here...I have only been on since Oct last year....and I always get upset but this one I cant stop thinking about.....

Hiim and his mum were alone for a couple of years, so would have been close and him mum his life and vice versa.......

we dont know what happened but either way it must have been terrifying for him if his beloved mum wouldnt wake up or fell somehow in the water......

and of course vice versa for mum if her beloved little boy had gone into the water......

I have 4 year and 5 year old boys who are my life and I just think how horrible if must have been for both of them when whatever it is happened......

so sad

 

[Solstice Canyon]

Perhaps a bit OT, but I hope not entirely. Since it's been mentioned a couple of times that some of you would like to help in some way, I wanted to say that a friend of mine used to provide "respite care" for a non-profit, children's services agency. Basically, she babysat on a fairly regular basis for free.

Some of her assignments were regular, and others were one-time deals. I believe most of them were pre-planned, and the families in need of these services were pre-screened by the agency. I remember that one family had two children, the older of whom was disabled and had significant care needs. Watching this child a couple of times a week allowed her mother to spend time with the younger sibling, run errands, etc.

Some of her assignments included newborns, and I believe some involved respite for foster families.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that if you really feel called to help in this way, I would check it out! There can be some degree of abuse of the system, I think, but the screening helps, and my friend's attitude was along the lines of "so what?" -- if the parents wanted to unload their kids, for whatever reason -- she felt it was better to take them than to question if the parents were upfront about their reasons for requesting it.

 

[EgyptNug]

I'd like to know more about the banging on the side of the house that Rachel Grimmer heard. Did they go outside to check on things?

 

[alsmom]

I've notice a lot of people do not look especially drunk and they are actually blacked out. My late husband did this. I knew he was plastered but other people did not. He would appear quite normal, but made decisions that were not normal. The next day he didn't remember anything. I know he didn't because I told him stuff he had done that he hadn't and he believed me. I'm wondering if she was blacked out.

Also, there are people that do not understand that alcoholics cannot drink any alcoholic beverages. They may drink one drink a few times but before you know it they will be coming home after having those infamous "two" drinks when they've actually downed a case. I still remember saying to people when we were planning something that my husband didn't drink, and they would answer with something like, oh no, it's only beer or oh no, it's only a few glasses of wine. :crazy: Given the fact that her boyfriend had not been with her when she was drinking excessively, I'm not sure he truly understood what was acceptable and what was not with an alcoholic. I think he was just getting a taste of it at the end.

I feel absolutely terrible for this little boy. I also feel bad for the mother. :truce: She seemed to be trying to be a good parent and girlfriend to a guy with kids. Her facebook and myspace portrayed a seemingly mature, intelligent person. She seemed to be very into her child, her boyfriend, and his children. Her pages were so different from the normal weird hand signs or poochy lipped, self-taken "oh look at me I'm so hot" pics.

When the alcohol demon perches itself on an addict's shoulder and starts calling their name, it seems as though, more often than not, all rationale goes out the window. Sadly, Shantina isn't the first, nor will she be the last that answered the demon's voice and lost everything. So sad for the kids of the boyfriend too. They seemed to be very close to her and her son, especially the girl.

This is certainly a cautionary tale.

RIP little Az

 

[yosande]

The reason the doors of the van were all open is coming clearer.

I hope they do a tox on Az.

I also hope her pc is checked to see if she found out when low tide, and high tide, were that night, and morning.


moo

 

[LogicalMinds]

I can see that some of you have been there and done that and KNOW the depths of this problem

I really agree with Alsmom...I think the fiancee just had NO idea that this wonderful woman he loved could and would drive while drinking...he probably didn't really realize that any drink is too much for a true alcoholic...one beer, one glass of wine

It is not about self control....all self control goes with the first drink

Some things are truly just tragedies...how/what/why all went out the window with the first sip of wine.

 

[yosande]

Children sizes come from 0 to 13, then they start 1,2,3,... and on.

So, a 13 would be a childrens size.

Both shoes in the picture oxfords, black, and with laces. Not sure of the brand but both look extremely alike.

Odd to see a mom and son wearing the same shoes.

The video of Az dancing in the store shows he is wearing grayish sneakers, and the mom appeared to be wearing dark leather shoes, like what was found.

moo.

 

[EgyptNug]

Possible? Is it possible that when the van got stuck either Shantina or Azriel got out of the van and tried to push it out? Maybe they opened the back hatch and was throwing items out of the van in order to lighten the load to make it easier to push? Then whomever was doing the pushing started to go under and the other one jumped in to try to help them out and they both drowned?

Although if this was the case, the keys likely would have been in the ignition (I think LE found them onthe dash), or the car would have been left on (dead battery or out of gas), if they jumped out super quick.

I apologize if this has been posted previously, but I think this may be important

Evidently there is another possible witness; at the end of this video report a woman who lives by the beach where the van was found had awoken at 1 am to pounding on the side of her house

http://www.kgw.com/news/local/Disappearance-of-Wash-family-vexes-police-87828912.html

I am hoping to hear more about her. Did they go outside to investigate the sounds?

Maybe they did all asleep on the beach in the van, and she woke up to her missing son

Yes this was posted and iirc the police had dogs there and did not pick up their scent.

One thought I had is that Mom could have left Az in the van alone sleeping so she could go somewhere for help and the tide came in and took him. But where is Mom? I guess time will tell.

Someone said that no tracks were found leading away from the vehicle, when it was found.

These are great photos. I particularly like the photo that shows the tire tracks. It definitely looks like she was heading towards the water (probably too dark to see), attempted to turn back and got stuck.

It's just so hard to understand.

If they were able to leave tire tracks showing a uturn then they were probably only at the shore when they arrived. I think they realized before they went into the water and turned around - hit a bit of the water and got stuck. Then likely stayed there to sleep until the morning which would make sense if she didn't know anything about tides.

Sadly, she may not have gone for help immediately (instead deciding to sleep there) because she had been drinking and didn't want the police to get involved. I can see that happening.

In that pic that shows the 3 point turnaround attempt, which direction is the water in (top, right, bottom or left of the picture)? I can't tell.

 

[yosande]

I'm happy for everyone who can pass the responisible of this child's life off on alcohol, and/or alcoholism, but imo, she isn't any different than KC.

I think she drugged her son, waited for him to fall asleep, and opened every door, so they would both wash away in the tide, and I think she did it on purpose.

If she wanted to take her own life, no one can stop her, but to take her son with her is no different than someone who gets a gun.

Next we'll probably be putting the blame on the prescription drugs she was alledgedly taking.

But she drove around town, stalling for time, waiting for low tide.

She then opened every door, and if I'm correct Az's body will have her prescription drugs in it.

This post will probably disappear too, but I don't care.

It's the only reasonable explanation for the doors all being wide open.


moo

 

[Lipin One]

The video of Az dancing in the store shows he is wearing grayish sneakers, and the mom appeared to be wearing dark leather shoes, like what was found.
moo.

Yeah, I see her wearing dark hiking shoes in this pic, which I got from his page. I cropped it, and used dark dash over the eyes, for privacy reasons. He also wears hiking dark shoes.

 

[justme96]

I really think everyone is overlooking the shoes. I cant find the picture but they said one was a size 9 and on SS's my space she answers a blog she wears that size.

http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.ListAll&friendId=243140172&page=2

The other was a size 13 one local paper said it was a mens shoe and this is what ABC said


Thurston County Sheriff's Lt. Chris Mealy told ABC News that Robb Simmons, Smiley's fiance, told investigators that Smiley's son had asthma and used an inhaler. Simmons also identified the smaller of the two shoes

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/TheLaw/sh...ewes-evidence-washes-ashore/story?id=10134521

I know everyone is thinking the size 13 was a child size but its not.

 

[Lipin One]

Someone said that no tracks were found leading away from the vehicle, when it was found.

One of the persons she spoke with that night described her as having been "crying."

Was she crying because of the alcohol in her system, or because she was lost, or something else?

 

[Lipin One]

I really think everyone is overlooking the shoes. I cant find the picture but they said one was a size 9 and on SS's my space she answers a blog she wears that size.

http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.ListAll&friendId=243140172&page=2

The other was a size 13 one local paper said it was a mens shoe and this is what ABC said


Thurston County Sheriff's Lt. Chris Mealy told ABC News that Robb Simmons, Smiley's fiance, told investigators that Smiley's son had asthma and used an inhaler. Simmons also identified the smaller of the two shoes

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/TheLaw/sh...ewes-evidence-washes-ashore/story?id=10134521

I know everyone is thinking the size 13 was a child size but its not.

I've been reading in some posts that the sizes were 9W and 13, the 13 should be the child's shoe. I think the three of them had similar shoes.

 

[justme96]

look over the picture and the articles RS
identifeies the smaller shoe as SS's shoe.

http://www.theolympian.com/2010/03/18/1176732/belongings-of-missing-mom-son.html

 

[justme96]

http://www.kgw.com/news/local/Disappearance-of-Wash-family-vexes-police-87828912.html

Scroll to the bottom and ther is the picture. If the smaller of the shoes was identified by RS to belong to SS Who the Heck does the bigger shoe belong too? I know everyone is stuck on the size 13 being a child shoe but I doubt it.

 

[Calliope]

http://www.kgw.com/news/local/Disappearance-of-Wash-family-vexes-police-87828912.html

Scroll to the bottom and ther is the picture. If the smaller of the shoes was identified by RS to belong to SS Who the Heck does the bigger shoe belong too? I know everyone is stuck on the size 13 being a child shoe but I doubt it.

It's obviously not compared to the other items in the picture.

I'd also like to say there is a difference between someone who drinks (even at inappropriate times) and an alcoholic, and that you don't have to be an alcoholic to get a DUI. When did she complete her schooling? I've read interviews from others that she did very well in college and had a high GPA. Also, other comments about her don't mesh with being a full-blown alcoholic. Perhaps she was, but I'd like to remind people that the one calling her an alcoholic is the same person who diagnosed himself using the Google.

Regardless, drinking while driving with her child (or even if she did so after they got stuck) was an incredibly stupid and irresponsible thing to do.

Does anyone know if autopsy can determine if she was drinking / drunk?

 

[polevaultpower]

I was following this pretty closely before I headed out of the country on vacation...

Simmons was on the Ron and Don show a few days ago and there were some things from that interview that I haven't seen posted on here. You can listen to the interview here, they were nice enough to post it as a standalone clip: http://www.mynorthwest.com/?nid=108&sid=298515


The big thing that I haven't seen posted on this site, is that, based on that interview and the other stuff I have read, I _think_ that Shantina's mom was the only witness to her ex's abuse of Azriel. I am not sure that the seriousness of it was outlined here, I think his arm was broken and he was choked and he ended up in the hospital. Anyway, sometime after that happened, the grandmother committed suicide, and since she was the only witness, the charges were dropped. Thinking about it later, that doesn't make a ton of sense, Shantina must have chosen not to pursue charges, but that's pretty common in abusive relationships.


I don't necessarily think Simmons has anything to do with her disappearance, but I don't know that I buy his story. Googling your health problem and seeing that it is potentially serious is concerning, but who takes that so seriously that they supposedly have their first drink in two years? And that doesn't match up with the Facebook photo of her having a beer with pizza.

My guess is that she is an alcoholic, and has been having problems for awhile, and he has been trying to hide it for some reason. Maybe he felt like if people thought she was drunk they wouldn't look so hard?



I am sure 97.3 KIRO fm will be covering this off and on all day on their talk shows. You can listen live at http://www.mynorthwest.com/


My hunch is that there is foul play involving Azriel, probably by his mom. Maybe she was suicidal. Simmons said she recently got in touch with an ex to tell him she forgave him. She also got in touch with step-relatives for the first time in years. Azriel was out of touch with his biological dad for years, and it sounds like they were only relatively recently put back in touch. Maybe she was trying to say goodbye.



Oh! The other thing I have heard is speculation that her lightning bolt tattoos on her back are a white power symbol. Which seems completely unrelated to anything, but since people on this site like to analyze every detail, I thought I would throw it out there.

 

[that78]

I keep going back to the banging on the garage door. The homeowners said they activated the alarm system when they heard it. Shouldn't some kind of alarm gone off at that point, or maybe turned on an outside light? I keep thinking that if it was her banging and a light or some noise was made wouldn't she go toward it? She didn't seem to have a problem stopping at a strangers house to use the phone so I don't think she would have not stuck around to get help. I would be frantically trying to wake the homeowners. I really don't think what they heard could have been her.

 

[alsmom]

I keep going back to the banging on the garage door. The homeowners said they activated the alarm system when they heard it. Shouldn't some kind of alarm gone off at that point, or maybe turned on an outside light? I keep thinking that if it was her banging and a light or some noise was made wouldn't she go toward it? She didn't seem to have a problem stopping at a strangers house to use the phone so I don't think she would have not stuck around to get help. I would be frantically trying to wake the homeowners. I really don't think what they heard could have been her.

I don't think it was them either. The only scenario that I can come up with is if it was one of them is that mom passed out and it was Azriel. The homeowner possibly spoke gruffly and scared the child who surely would have already been frightened and he ran back to the van??? I think the dogs would have picked up his scent though.