WA WA - Shantina Smiley, 29, & Azriel Carver, 8 (fnd deceased), Olympia, Mar 2010 - #6

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From LCoastMom post above :

Did he name the Handy Pantry at the 645 phone call? Because she wasn't at HP til 8PM!!! ( 7:54 )

There was quite a bit about this in one of the earlier threads (cannot quite recall where it is now):
There may have been something with the time change that night (clocks going ahead one hour)---his own watch or cell, the surveillance cam, may have registered one hour ahead ( some go ahead before midnight).
 
LCoastMom said:


Robb said he asked her to bring his phone charger - he later said he went and got a charger. He did not say he went and got a charger while he was at home.... Does this mean the charger is missing? or he got the charger before the van was found?



respectfully snipped <<<BBM>>>

Did he name the Handy Pantry at the 645 phone call? Because she wasn't at HP til 8PM!!! ( 7:54 )
Click to expand...


I had the impression that Handy Pantries were some ubiquitous minute market in the area so could be she stopped at more than one. So perhaps we should be looking for that video as well?

She was on the road and didn't have his charger cause she didn't know he was coming down on his own till then.

I have some thoughts about his phone not having a charge or needing one, but it is pointless to speculate about at this juncture. I just know that is the reason he gives for her calling the grandparents and not him. But, how does he know she even tried? Did he have a missed call? LE has not said this. They have not commented about his communications or lack of them with her since that 6:45 call when she found out he was ALREADY in Olympia area. I could repeat what he said the conversation was about. But, we have no idea the nature of the conversation. We just have ample evidence he was neither invited nor intended to go. Yet, he preciently shows up at her stepfather whom he had never met. Were I the step parent, I would be in a real state of confusion about what was going on there. That could be why no one was in agreement with what happened.
 
Calliope said:
It was posted earlier in the thread that there is only one Handy Pantry in the state of Washington; I didn't search the state, but only one in Olympia:

http://www.yellowpages.com/olympia-wa/handy-pantry?g=Olympia,+WA&q=handy+pantry
Click to expand...

So she didn't call him at 6:45 from a Handy Pantry? I know she said she didn't know where she was according to him one time. But, I personally believe she was being intentionally evasive when she found out where he was and how nearby and had NO intentions of meeting up with him. That was the impression I have.
 
houndstooth said:
I had the impression that Handy Pantries were some ubiquitous minute market in the area so could be she stopped at more than one. So perhaps we should be looking for that video as well?

She was on the road and didn't have his charger cause she didn't know he was coming down on his own till then.

I have some thoughts about his phone not having a charge or needing one, but it is pointless to speculate about at this juncture. I just know that is the reason he gives for her calling the grandparents and not him. But, how does he know she even tried? Did he have a missed call? LE has not said this. They have not commented about his communications or lack of them with her since that 6:45 call when she found out he was ALREADY in Olympia area. I could repeat what he said the conversation was about. But, we have no idea the nature of the conversation. We just have ample evidence he was neither invited nor intended to go. Yet, he preciently shows up at her stepfather whom he had never met. Were I the step parent, I would be in a real state of confusion about what was going on there. That could be why no one was in agreement with what happened.
Click to expand...

Someone posted a lengthy theory on all of this, which tied up all neatly. (He had taken her cellphone, to search it ; she was worried about this and avoiding him, running from him. He followed. There is only one Handy Pantry left in the area, but he confused this with "Plaid Pantry", of which there are dozens and dozens. How would he know she was at the one and only Handy Pantry--she never called from there, surveillance camera says. He must have been tailing her and spotted her. The Grandparents may have tried to call her back on the cell, just to leave a message, about how they could come get her. He has the phone, he answers.) Of course, this was only a theory, but it tied all those questions up, simply.
 
I have not found the pictures we were discussing posting last night, these are my daughter's size 9, the Dansani bottle I believe is smaller than the one in the photo, but the Smart Water may be closer.


0412101441a.jpg 22879043_640X472.jpg​
 
Calliope said:
It was posted earlier in the thread that there is only one Handy Pantry in the state of Washington; I didn't search the state, but only one shows in Olympia:

http://www.yellowpages.com/olympia-wa/handy-pantry?g=Olympia,+WA&q=handy+pantry
Click to expand...
Yes, I did an extensive online search, and that is the only one which comes up in the state of Washington. No others are listed. There are some in Montana, Georgia, Utah, New York, and Florida, and North Carolina. But that is it for WA.
 
houndstooth said:
We just have ample evidence he was neither invited nor intended to go.
Click to expand...

Evidence? I haven't seen a single piece of evidence that he was not invited or intended to go. All evidence I've seen points to him having been invited and intended to go.

I've seen speculation that perhaps he wasn't invited or intended to go.

We really need to be careful to distinguish between the two, because people rely on Websleuths for credible, well sourced, information about the cases we sleuth. It's what sets us above the rest. And if we refer to our speculation as if it's fact, that's how rumors grow legs, and that's never a good thing.
 
Is there anywhere other than The Examiner that says RS called SS from the Handy Pantry? That's the first time I've seen that. Do we have an established news outlet that states that or anything else? Did RS ever say it himself on his website?
 
BeanE said:
Is there anywhere other than The Examiner that says RS called SS from the Handy Pantry? That's the first time I've seen that. Do we have an established news outlet that states that or anything else? Did RS ever say it himself on his website?
Click to expand...
No, I guess I had always gotten it from this Examiner piece:

6:47 p.m. - Simmons said Smiley stopped at a Handy Pantry and called him from a pay phone.ttp://www.examiner.com/x-34328-Seattle-Headlines-Examiner~y2010m3d14-Olympia--Desperate-search-for-mother-and-8year-old-son-fiance-believes-could-be-sinister
She is the Examiner out in that area of WA, and the one who has interviewed him and Deputy Chamberlain via telephone. Reporters are generally very careful to word things as they hear or record them for later writing .
The reason it seemed telling: There was only one in the state, and she was in fact caught on camera at that one, and at the time he states. (if one allows for the hour time change made early -common with cell phones and businesses)--- But she made no move toward the payphone there, as the surveillance will show. Why would he know she was there? It is a reasonable question, which anyone might ask, even casually. Perhaps the Examiner journalist, who is a member here, can clarify that he said this on March 13/14, depending on how she dates her material.
 
BeanE said:
Evidence? I haven't seen a single piece of evidence that he was not invited or intended to go. All evidence I've seen points to him having been invited and intended to go.

I've seen speculation that perhaps he wasn't invited or intended to go.

We really need to be careful to distinguish between the two, because people rely on Websleuths for credible, well sourced, information about the cases we sleuth. It's what sets us above the rest. And if we refer to our speculation as if it's fact, that's how rumors grow legs, and that's never a good thing.
Click to expand...

1) He did not know the address until in route. On a planned visit he would have knowledge of where he was going in advance.

2) The existing e-mails detail what time she and Az would arrive. No mention of his being part of this visit by anyone.

3) Her former step sister was looking forward to getting reacquainted with her, and She and Az were spending the night at her house. No mention again of meeting RS and where he was to stay. Obviously the step sister was not expecting his arrival. Later or otherwise.

4) She did not call the Steps to see if HE found their home even.

5) His meeting got out at 4:30, she left about 5:00. There was no reason for them not to have driven in tandem if travelling "together". He apparantly left and drove straight to Castle Rock without even going home first because he would have known she left after he did.

I do not think it unreasonable at all to conclude that he was not originally intended to go on this trip.
 
SMK said:
No, I guess I had always gotten it from this Examiner piece:

6:47 p.m. - Simmons said Smiley stopped at a Handy Pantry and called him from a pay phone.ttp://www.examiner.com/x-34328-Seattle-Headlines-Examiner~y2010m3d14-Olympia--Desperate-search-for-mother-and-8year-old-son-fiance-believes-could-be-sinister
She is the Examiner out in that area of WA, and the one who has interviewed him and Deputy Chamberlain via telephone. Reporters are generally very careful to word things as they hear or record them for later writing .
The reason it seemed telling: There was only one in the state, and she was in fact caught on camera at that one, and at the time he states. (if one allows for the hour time change made early -common with cell phones and businesses)--- But she made no move toward the payphone there, as the surveillance will show. Why would he know she was there? It is a reasonable question, which anyone might ask, even casually. Perhaps the Examiner journalist, who is a member here, can clarify that he said this on March 13/14, depending on how she dates her material.
Click to expand...
sounds like she got that from the phone interview.
 
Calliope said:
sounds like she got that from the phone interview.
Click to expand...

Yes, she states she interviewed him, and then she says that RS says SS called him from a Handy Pantry. I fail to see why a journalist would embellish. Perhaps she herself can explain. But if she did get it from RS, it is very telepathic of him, to know where she was at that time. She made no call from there. Is it wrong to simply ask what gives, when all these facts are out there, at one's fingertips, and there are holes?

On second thought, as he says his phone was dead, and he had her phone, the call she made to him should show up on records, whether she called his phone or her own.
 
houndstooth said:
1) He did not know the address until in route. On a planned visit he would have knowledge of where he was going in advance.

2) The existing e-mails detail what time she and Az would arrive. No mention of his being part of this visit by anyone.

3) Her former step sister was looking forward to getting reacquainted with her, and She and Az were spending the night at her house. No mention again of meeting RS and where he was to stay. Obviously the step sister was not expecting his arrival. Later or otherwise.

4) She did not call the Steps to see if HE found their home even.

5) His meeting got out at 4:30, she left about 5:00. There was no reason for them not to have driven in tandem if travelling "together". He apparantly left and drove straight to Castle Rock without even going home first because he would have known she left after he did.

I do not think it unreasonable at all to conclude that he was not originally intended to go on this trip.
Click to expand...

I see what you're saying, hounds. And there's nothing at all wrong with examining the situation and the circumstances, putting them together, and drawing conclusions. I do it all the time myself :) We just need to be careful that don't identify it in a way that could lead others to think they're documented facts.

When you used the word evidence, my mind was immediately drawn to the more legal terms, and I was thinking hard facts, court document, LE reports, etc., which I haven't seen in regards to whether RS was going on the trip.

Hope I explained that adequately - I'm beat tonight.
 
SMK said:
From LCoastMom post above :

Did he name the Handy Pantry at the 645 phone call? Because she wasn't at HP til 8PM!!! ( 7:54 )

There was quite a bit about this in one of the earlier threads (cannot quite recall where it is now):
There may have been something with the time change that night (clocks going ahead one hour)---his own watch or cell, the surveillance cam, may have registered one hour ahead ( some go ahead before midnight).
Click to expand...

The clocks don't change til midnight Sat-Sun... he still had 5 hours and 15 minutes at the 645 call.

If he knew she was going to Handy Pantry when she made the 645 call - I call FAIL. (as in not lost) I ran the Google map program from their place, to Castle Rock - getting off in Olympia on BLACK LAKE BVD EXIT with HP as a destination.

There was no end to the small restaurants near the freeway exit - by comparison HP is rather out of the way - without anything "close by" relatively speaking. As soon as you get off the freeway there is a Denny's, there used to be an IHOP a block further (may still be, not sure) - also a small mall with a B&N Books, all of these on the right, on the left there is APPLEBEES, OLIVE GARDEN.

Now I don't know if this was her exit or how she picked HP, if as one interview said she stopped to let Az use the bathroom - she may have used a rest stop and either taken the next exit or some other.
 
The clocks don't change til midnight Sat-Sun... he still had 5 hours and 15 minutes at the 645 call.
Snipped from LCoastMom, above.
A retail manager might have moved the surveillance camera clock ahead early, so a night employee would not have to do it. Or he may have moved his cell up early----it is just a thought........This case is the strangest I have ever pondered.....:waitasec:
 
SMK said:
Yes, she states she interviewed him, and then she says that RS says SS called him from a Handy Pantry. I fail to see why a journalist would embellish. Perhaps she herself can explain. But if she did get it from RS, it is very telepathic of him, to know where she was at that time. She made no call from there. Is it wrong to simply ask what gives, when all these facts are out there, at one's fingertips, and there are holes?

On second thought, as he says his phone was dead, and he had her phone, the call she made to him should show up on records, whether she called his phone or her own.
Click to expand...


I started to go there too, but remember when she called and asked for her phone he was already ahead of her!! He left at 430 and arrived at CR By his statement, when she called at 6:45pm, he was getting his car/bike fixed of a "minor" issue at Toledo-Vader. That's ten miles from Castle Rock.
 
LCoastMom said:
[/B]

I started to go there too, but remember when she called and asked for her phone he was already ahead of her!! He left at 430 and arrived at CR By his statement, when she called at 6:45pm, he was getting his car/bike fixed of a "minor" issue at Toledo-Vader. That's ten miles from Castle Rock.
Click to expand...
Now I am really confused ....:sick:
 
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