WA WA - Shantina Smiley, 29, & Azriel Carver, 8 (fnd deceased), Olympia, Mar 2010 - #6

[redfish]

You know, the more I think, the more this is the kicker for me. And the stop at the Williams....a last ditch call before she planned to either run away or end it all. As if she needed to hear someones voice one last time...to maybe say something, but then she chickened out. It would definitely explain her "nervousness" as explained by the Williams'.

Hi, I've been a daily lurker. Following along with all of the theories here. This is all very puzzling that is the one thing I think we all can agree on! I wonder how long the Williams' lived at this address? and who may have lived there before? There was a reason she was in this town for so long. She seemed to be looking for something or someone. But it was NOT the Interstate! Even high I believe this intelligent woman would have been able to get out of this small town. Without her phone she WAS lost and could not contact this person she planned to meet. And they could not contact her. This appears to be a planned meet that went wrong because they could no longer communicate.

 

[powayparent]

She could have turned back at any time to retrieve the cell phone if she considered it vital. I forget mine all the time, sometimes I come home and retrieve it but other times I'm "off the grid" It was a 2.5 hr drive and an overnight, not a big deal for most people.

 

[sorrell skye]

First, I don't recall him saying he had cancer -- I thought his comment was always that she was "concerned" about his health. Please link to an article/etc. if I am wrong -- I might be...but I don't recall HIM saying that (as in, a quote).

Also, what may seem like "inconsistencies" could simply be a person does not pay attention to times, etc. when things are happening (because we don't ever expect to need to go back to LE and explain our whereabouts. He could have been "trying to hard" to account for every moment (knowing full well he'd be in the first rung of suspects). But, if I try to remember phone calls and times, etc. from just last night -- I can't. It's very difficult to go back and feel like you have to account for yourself and your movements.

I don't believe RS is involved. So far, I don't see a motive. In all the videos, she seems relaxed -- not fearful; we didn't hear she seemed "upset" until she went to the house of the elderly couple.

BBM

I agree, it can be difficult to remember certain things like what time someone called, even in non-stressful situations, more so when one is under stress & worried about a loved one.

Since SS called RS on his cell phone, all he had to do was look @ the "call history" to know what times she called him. IMO,he wouldn't have had to wrack his brain to try to remember - it was all there on his phone. IMO,that could be why he was able to give detailed accounts of when she called.

 

[BeanE]

BBM

I agree, it can be difficult to remember certain things like what time someone called, even in non-stressful situations, more so when one is under stress & worried about a loved one.

Since SS called RS on his cell phone, all he had to do was look @ the "call history" to know what times she called him. He wouldn't have had to wrack his brain to try to remember - it was all there on his phone. That's why he was able to give detailed accounts of when she called.

I didn't see that RS gave times off his phone. I'd like to see which times he states he gave off his phone. Could I have the link for that please?

TIA

 

[LCoastMom]

Good morning.
I don't buy that she plan to kill her self. I don't buy her being so depressed about boyfriend thinking he might have cancer. You go to a doctor and find out what is wrong, You don't just go kill your self and you son. I don't buy the fact that she could have found that tiny steep road on a pitch black night. The amount of time she supposedly drove around Olympia is ridiculous. I do not believe that happened. She could have driven clear to the Oregon border in that time. I don't know what happened to her but I suspect we are not getting the whole story from the boy friend. As far as forgetting your cell phone, the first thing you do when you get in your car is check for the Cell phone especially if you are going on a trip. Was the Williams house easy to see from the road, how did she see that house? I thought I read some where it was not that easy to find and why stop at a house, why not another store? Just my thoughts and Opinion

The DWs house was as easy to find as anywhere else she ended up, it is a small single family home on a large piece of property - the DW's are not the registered owners. The Tax Assessors office has no sales information on the property available.

(According to them she told them she chose them because of the "Christian" sticker on their car's bumper)

Interesting to note, SS drove past a fire station on her way to Zangle Rd (street where van was found) 1/10th of a mile from the Mercantile. It is large, and has a raised, lit sign in front and a street level sign - on Boston Harbor Rd

 

[twzzlrgirl]

In this video: http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/missing-moms-final-hours-puzzle-police-10122485 he commented on his health issues and researching them on the internet. He said it goes from trivial to serious and "I might have a certain amount of time left." He does not say anything about cancer in this video. I thought I had read or seen it somewhere, but don't have the time to search for it right now. In almost all the interviews regarding why she might relapse, he did comment on his potential serious health issue. I apologize if I said something wrong.

Oh, my goodness...no worries Elf69!! I was more or less testing my own memory: I had definitely heard the word cancer going around (news stations, etc.), but couldn't recall RS actually saying it. But my memory is starting to fail me, soooo.....

 

[sorrell skye]

I didn't see that RS gave times off his phone. I'd like to see which times he states he gave off his phone. Could I have the link for that please?

TIA

No link - just simple deduction, that it's likely he was able to recall the times with such accuracy by looking @ the call history on his phone. I suppose I should have said IMO MOO JMHO, etc...

I will edit my post about it so as not to cause rumors or speculation, or mislead in any way.

Oh - BTW - while we're discussing links - does anyone have a link regarding Shantina's health history that would lead to the speculation in various posts about a "brain event"? I don't recall reading that she had a prior health history involving brain events, or that any family members might have feared that was what may have occurred. I do recall reading that her family said she was in good health. I do recall reading about prior alcohol problems. Maybe I missed it. If a link was posted about her health history regarding brain health issues and I missed it, apologies. I would like to read about it.

TIA!

 

[twzzlrgirl]

BBM

I agree, it can be difficult to remember certain things like what time someone called, even in non-stressful situations, more so when one is under stress & worried about a loved one.

Since SS called RS on his cell phone, all he had to do was look @ the "call history" to know what times she called him. He wouldn't have had to wrack his brain to try to remember - it was all there on his phone. That's why he was able to give detailed accounts of when she called.

Well...my Verizon phone (that I am sitting looking at now) does something kind of odd. If I have called, say, my husband four times in a row (over a period of several hours (which I did today by the way), the call history only shows ONE call to him. I am actually verifying this on my cell phone as I type. I know I called him at approximately 11:45, 12:30, 1:30, and 2:30 (I needed to reach him to give him some information about our daughter). Yet my phone only shows one call: 2:30. I can check to find out why this happens, but I didn't delete any calls, and that's all that's showing up.

BTW, the 2:30 call that is shown is not the time i reached him or left a message. I at no point got through or left a message on his phone. I ended up waiting for him to call me back.

 

[sorrell skye]

Well...my Verizon phone (that I am sitting looking at now) does something kind of odd. If I have called, say, my husband four times in a row (over a period of several hours (which I did today by the way), the call history only shows ONE call to him. I am actually verifying this on my cell phone as I type. I know I called him at approximately 11:45, 12:30, 1:30, and 2:30 (I needed to reach him to give him some information about our daughter). Yet my phone only shows one call: 2:30. I can check to find out why this happens, but I didn't delete any calls, and that's all that's showing up.

BTW, the 2:30 call that is shown is not the time i reached him or left a message. I at no point got through or left a message on his phone. I ended up waiting for him to call me back.

I edited my post that you quoted to reflect it was my opinion that he probably looked @ his call history.

IMO, he gave accurate info regarding when she called him.

 

[BeanE]

No link - just simple deduction, that it's likely he was able to recall the times with such accuracy by looking @ the call history on his phone. I suppose I should have said IMO MOO JMHO, etc...

I will edit my post about it so as not to cause rumors or speculation, or mislead in any way.

Oh - BTW - while we're discussing links - does anyone have a link regarding Shantina's health history that would lead to the speculation in various posts about a "brain event"? I don't recall reading that she had a prior health history involving brain events, or that any family members might have feared that was what may have occurred. I do recall reading that her family said she was in good health. I do recall reading about prior alcohol problems. Maybe I missed it. If a link was posted about her health history regarding brain health issues and I missed it, apologies. I would like to read about it.

TIA!

Thank you for your cooperation.

If you saw a post in which someone stated that Shantina had a brain event as if it were a fact, alert that post.

 

[PaulR]

Oh - BTW - while we're discussing links - does anyone have a link regarding Shantina's health history that would lead to the speculation in various posts about a "brain event"? I don't recall reading that she had a prior health history involving brain events, or that any family members might have feared that was what may have occurred. I do recall reading that her family said she was in good health. I do recall reading about prior alcohol problems. Maybe I missed it. If a link was posted about her health history regarding brain health issues and I missed it, apologies. I would like to read about it.

TIA!

I think the source may have been RS posting about a GF who had migraines, and confusion as to whether he was referring to SS or to an ex-GF. I believe we figured out from the timeline that they weren't dating until after his post, so he wasn't talking about SS having migraines.

I would think that if she did have some kind of brain issue, RS would have been forthcoming with it, as it certainly would have been relevant. Whenever we hear of a missing person with either a mental illness or some other brain issue, the family and police generally publicize it.


That being said - if she did fall down in the parking lot of the restaurant, that could have either caused a brain injury or been a symptom of one. It would go towards explaining her bizarre behavior that evening, certainly. But it's speculation at best.

 

[sorrell skye]

I think the source may have been RS posting about a GF who had migraines, and confusion as to whether he was referring to SS or to an ex-GF. I believe we figured out from the timeline that they weren't dating until after his post, so he wasn't talking about SS having migraines.

I would think that if she did have some kind of brain issue, RS would have been forthcoming with it, as it certainly would have been relevant. Whenever we hear of a missing person with either a mental illness or some other brain issue, the family and police generally publicize it.


That being said - if she did fall down in the parking lot of the restaurant, that could have either caused a brain injury or been a symptom of one. It would go towards explaining her bizarre behavior that evening, certainly. But it's speculation at best.

Ah yes - now that you mention it, I do remember reading about the migraines & everyone trying to determine whether or not it was SS who suffered from migraines, or someone else RS was referring to.

Thanks for clearing that up!

And you make a very good point when you say that if she had any history of brain health issues, RS would have likely (IMO) brought it up, since he did mention her history of alcoholism, and since he was forthcoming with the info about her recent relapse.

The fall in the parking lot is mysterious. Either she just simply stumbled & tripped, or something was going on that we're unaware of that caused her to lose her awareness & balance. This was the restaurant where they suddenly left without the corndog. That has never made sense to me. It makes me wonder if she was afraid of something or someone - but who? IDK.

And you're right - it's speculation at best.

 

[RubyRed]

Ah yes - now that you mention it, I do remember reading about the migraines & everyone trying to determine whether or not it was SS who suffered from migraines, or someone else RS was referring to.

Thanks for clearing that up!

And you make a very good point when you say that if she had any history of brain health issues, RS would have likely (IMO) brought it up, since he did mention her history of alcoholism, and since he was forthcoming with the info about her recent relapse.

The fall in the parking lot is mysterious. Either she just simply stumbled & tripped, or something was going on that we're unaware of that caused her to lose her awareness & balance. This was the restaurant where they suddenly left without the corndog. That has never made sense to me. It makes me wonder if she was afraid of something or someone - but who? IDK.

And you're right - it's speculation at best.

bbm

In my opinion the fall was alcohol related. Leaving the corndog could be because she was feeling sick or maybe Azriel changed his mind about wanting it. At that age kids will want something to eat then when you give them food it isn't what they wanted.

 

[yosande]

Ok, inconsistencies ("You may discuss RS's inconsistencies."--Salem)

Have we resolved this this one?

RS's words, according to the timeline originally posted at www.robbsimmons.com (no longer there, however):

"I had Cub Scout Training that was planned to finish at 6:30

Shantina called me twice around 4:15 to let me know she was heading out. I asked her grab my phone charger, since my phone was near dead.

My training wrapped up at 4:30, I figured that she was already on the road heading to Castle Rock, so I proceeds to Castle Rock as well



I stopped in Toldeo-Vader to make quick repair, when she called me at 6:45 from a phone. She asked me if I could grab her phone, because she had left. I let her know where I was at."

Then, the following is from http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/TheLaw/shantina-smiley-suffered-alcoholic-replase-fiance/story?id=10122149

"Simmons said he last talked to Smiley Saturday afternoon before she and her son set out for her stepfather's home, about two hours away.

"She said she's getting ready to hit the road and I said 'Okay I'll see you on the road,'" Simmons said. He expected to catch with them so they could drive down together, but he never saw them again."
===

So--If he indeed told SS in the 4:15 call "Okay, I'll see you on the road", can we conclude from that statement that RS knew the training would likely soon end at the time of this call, and must have informed SS of this fact? Otherwise, why say that and how he would be able to catch up to them on the road if he left much later?

But then, why would SS ask him in the 6:45 call she made to him if he could grab her phone, as if she thought he would still be in Silverdale? For her to ask this leads to the belief that she must have still thought the training was ending at 6:30.

I can't reconcile the statements in a way that make sense to me. Then again, does this have any significance to figuring out what happened to SS? Don't know.

I haven't read further to see if someone commented on this, but, RS states that the last time he talked to her was 4:15, then in another interview states that he talked to her at 6:45? inconsistent, and problematic. your bride is missing and you can't keep straight the last time you heard her voice? I don't understand that. moo

 

[yosande]

No matter how I read it, it says her bag was found. I've never heard anyone in my life say 'her bag was found not'. :waitasec:

True, but stressed out, RS made this flyer on Sunday night iirc, he could have transposed the words found and not, which would make it really mean, her bag was not found in the van. Since there is not a comma where it should be, it is possible.

To my knowledge, LE has not confirmed that the bag was found, but they have confirmed that there was indeed a bag.

moo

sorry beane, already resolved before I commented, just didn't read down far enough. J'm just so eager to put in my two cents worth......

 

[yosande]

(scratches chin)...very interesting. I'm pretty darn eager to know where the bag turned up. Along the coastline somewhere? This also shows that LE is working on this and doesn't want to reveal much.

If it was found but not in the van, then LE must have revealed this info to RS, and by Sunday evening. Is it odd that LE would reveal to RS that they found the bag, but then say, shh, don't tell anyone? If so, b/c LE does often give info to family, and asks them not to share that info with the public, why would LE ask him to not share that info, and why would RS then put it on the flyer? tia

Therefore, to me the logical conclusion to this little mystery is that RS, under overwhelming stress as to where SS and AC were, transposed the words found, and not, and actually meant to say, "The bag was not found in the van." So, imo. it is still missing,

I should have read further down, sorry.

 

[elf69]

If it was found but not in the van, then LE must have revealed this info to RS, and by Sunday evening. Is it odd that LE would reveal to RS that they found the bag, but then say, shh, don't tell anyone? If so, b/c LE does often give info to family, and asks them not to share that info with the public, why would LE ask him to not share that info, and why would RS then put it on the flyer? tia

Therefore, to me the logical conclusion to this little mystery is that RS, under overwhelming stress as to where SS and AC were, transposed the words found, and not, and actually meant to say, "The bag was not found in the van." So, imo. it is still missing,

I believe the words were transposed. I don't believe his grammar is very good judging from his latest post on Facebook. Also, why would they talk about finding the shoes, inhaler, balls, water bottles, wine, etc., and not say anything about the bag?

 

[yosande]

Living near a beach, i will often thro trash up past the high tide line. Local are inclined to clean the beach, but i sometimes don't have a trash bag - as others don't and collections start. The stuff found could easily of come from random times.
I have not seen what meds she was on. Meds are drugs, if you take meds that make you think everything is ok - and you are a self medicator - ooh that can cause a problem.
Azriel acted so free happy not abused, his mom looked at maps - was the road to beach on there? I think they were both exhausted. Wake up cold in panic - figure you parked towards the water- jump out back - theres a drop off there. Also if they got clams there, they need sand or sludge. I watch a child go off drop off once, he was saved but i can see shirt being over head , she would of grabed... then jumped to save or left with the new special person

I have never ever in my whole life ever heard anyone admit to throwing trash in an inlet, ocean, river, or even land, so I must be misunderstanding what you are saying. Are you saying that you throw your garbage into the water when the tide comes in so it will go out and end up somewhere down the beach for somebody else to pick up?

If that is what you are saying then as an Oregonian, and PNWesterner, that is so not allowed here. It is against the law, and against the mindset of the most beautiful place on the planet, not to mention how it could harm the wildlife.

Be afraid, be very afraid, if someone sees you doing that. :furious:

ETA; btw, welcome to websleuths,

ETAA; removed east coast comment, sorry for being rude.

 

[yosande]

Okay I got the overnight bag completely wrong. I thought RS had said she definitely had a bag with her, and the flier said it had definitely been found.

It looks like it actually is that whereas she usually takes a bag, nobody could confirm she had this time, and, no bag has ever been found. (Correct?)

Has RS ever said if he's familiar with all her bags and that one or more was missing, or that all of them were accounted for at the house?

I don't know the answer to your question, but if she didn't have the bag in the back of the van, why would the back hatch be open?

I personally can't think of any other reason for it to be open except that she had something back there she needed to get, unless someone wanted the tide to push the van deeper into the water, so it disappeared altogether, and I don't really believe that. There would have been other easier places to put it to ensure it wouldn't be found. moo

 

[LCoastMom]

Oh, my goodness...no worries Elf69!! I was more or less testing my own memory: I had definitely heard the word cancer going around (news stations, etc.), but couldn't recall RS actually saying it. But my memory is starting to fail me, soooo.....

"She was worried about my health," Simmons said, "but we didn't have an answer yet and my health problems could have been minor. I do think the worry may have caused her to relapse and start drinking again because she thought I could possibly have cancer."

http://www.examiner.com/x-34328-Sea...missing-fiance-holds-out-hope-shell-come-home